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RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:16:09 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline 		Never mind

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to cjenny)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:17:11 PM   
kyraofMists


Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie

I guess what I don't follow is if you live absolutely under the authority of another person, if you completely subservient to his/her dominating influence, then how exactly are you not being submissive? The motivation behind it doesn't define it as submission, the act of submitting does.


Completely agree.... but then I am someone who thinks that submission exists regardless of a person's feelings about it.  I think our motivation for submission will show us where we get our satisfaction and pleasure out of submitting.  Just this week alandra and I had a talk about this...

My post to Magik's was just to point out that it is rather taboo to tell someone they are not submissive.  To me, if you follow the will of another person over your own, then you are submitting.

Knight's kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to BeingChewsie)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:30:47 PM   
ennaozzie


Posts: 201
Joined: 5/9/2007
Status: offline 		Well there is another side to D/s and BDSM there are the Daddy Dom/baby girl side of things which most think it has to do with incest which it does not, but there are many variances in that side of things also.
 
Then again some men are very protective of their subs/slaves then again you get men that are paranoid of what a sub/slave might do while they are not there, those that are control freaks that have nothing to do with BDSM or D/s, who are just fucked in the head.
 
Or you just might have a Dom that has always been like that and does not know different.
 
Just a few other reasons why this is so and i am sure there are many more.

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Never make someone your priority when you are only their option

If coffee hurts your eye's take the spoon out of the mug

(in reply to thetammyjo)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:32:19 PM   
dawntreader


Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
Status: offline 		Greetings szobras,
 i would agree with your thoughts on this. i know because of this dynamic, regardless of the Dominants age that i am with, i always "feel" younger than them.
     p

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It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to szobras)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:35:28 PM   
earthycouple


Posts: 4462
Joined: 2/19/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Well when reading your post it is pretty hard NOT to see you as a child. Is English your first language? If not then it's okay.. if English is your language would you at least try to use punctuation?
Spell check?
Proofread?
I've been reading here for months & you have yet to make a post even close to the basic rules of written communication.
You say you have dyslexia? You write more like someone DD.

So yeah it can be pretty easy to see you as totally immature and needy. Using several exclamation marks or question marks isn't the way adults type!!!! It looks hyper-active and I can almost hear your voice rising in pitch as I read.

You are treated the way you present yourself. Why don't you work on improving that instead of just whining about crap?

*Sliver, out.


Ditto

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D~

Seeking, searching, hoping, living, loving, jumping. So what's new with you?

(in reply to cjenny)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:39:07 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline 		Oh, thank Karana!  I was just writing a response to her, saying she seemed rather childish to me, trying to word it in a way that wouldn't start an argument, just to be honest.  Since I was afraid she'd throw a fit, I cancelled it and started reading other responses.. just glad I'm not the only one that saw it this way.

(in reply to earthycouple)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:44:16 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

Please fully read. The first post under cjenny was not me. Please read? I also Cmailed you.


((hugs)) its ok hon I understand what happend.


Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


-Rodney Atkins-



(in reply to cjenny)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:45:48 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline 		A parent guides a child, teaching it, shaping it and helping it grow to the parent's desires.  A parent also rewards and punishes a child.

This is similar to a Dom and a sub.  Does this make it a problem?

Interestingly enough, many subs seem quite bratty.  Many are vastly immature.  (Many, but I'm not saying any particular sub who reads this is.. not trying to insult anyone, just an observation.)  Doms, by contrast, seem more reserved, certain, and responsible.

This is particularly exmplified in stronger versions of the D/s aspect, such as in the Gorgean end, where Masters discuss things among eachother, slaves are to act as a Master deems them to, more often than not bid to respect other Masters.  Hell, there's a "girlie time" thread on that board last time I checked, and it's more than just a little popular.

(in reply to MagiksSlave)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:47:55 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mstrjx

I'm not certain that this was the point of the thread (d-types treating their own s-types like children), and if so that probably wouldn't apply to me.

What I've seen a lot of, though, and it has stuck out in my mind, is that novice submissives get treated as children 'here' in the forums.  Sure, newbies need to have the appropriate time and space to learn and grow, granted.  But when we inadvertantly (or not) give relationship advice to a 40+ year-old submissive as if they have never been in a relationship with anyone before is absurd.

Just one opinion, amongst many.

Jeff


this is more of what I was refering to Jeff.

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


-Rodney Atkins-



(in reply to mstrjx)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:52:02 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline 		I love how this went from me stateing I didnt think compareing subs to children was right to me beeing called a child from the other "adults" here. I dont know how it became time to flame me and call me childish or poke fun at my spelling but this wasnt why I opend the thread and I didnt attack anyone. I am very hurt and insulted and will now take my leave of these boards. No need for me to be where Im not wanted and since so many think Im so childish and cant understand that I have  a learning dissability that makes it very hard for me to spell and such, they arent people i want to be around.

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


-Rodney Atkins-



(in reply to MagiksSlave)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 4:54:21 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline 		I don't know if everyone calling you childish is out to insult you.. it can be good to have a inner kid alive in you.  If that's an ascept of your personality, alright.   So.. why not just see it's how others perceive you?

If you don't like it, you can try to change it, but what's wrong with it?

(in reply to MagiksSlave)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 5:05:56 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline 		Second class citizens would be, what I view, as the best way to describe it.

People constantly preach about "consenting ADULTS" but time and time again, not just on the Net, but in real time communities, I cant help but notice the input and opinions of a self labeled slave or sub being almost disregarded in comparsion to that of a self labeled dominant or Master.

Amazingly though, I have yet to see this in any of the homosexual couples I've made friends with, either real time or online. Its more of a hetero thing.


< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 5/25/2007 5:09:08 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to MagiksSlave)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 5:14:02 PM   
tricia


Posts: 231
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

there are people who say they are subs because they dont want responsability and want to be taken care of that doesnt make them a sub makes them irresponsable and looking for an easy way out


I would imagine pretending to be submissive is a hell of alot of work compared to just finding some  "vanilla" guy ready and willing to 'take care of' someone.  So definitely add stupid to the list that already includes irresponsible and immature and helpless.
 
I would also imagine there are as many women pretending to be submissive in order to find love.  Or acceptence.  Or a husband.  Or kinky sex. 
 
I'm a fairly intelligent, single hardworking mother who managed to live the first 36 years of my life without a Master.  I'm also a bad decision maker.  I have trouble saying no.  I like being looked after.  I like feeling protected.  My relationship includes discipline and punishment.   So what?
 
I'd be more curious to know how all these women, pretending to be submissive, survived before they found the man of their dreams.


(in reply to hereyesruponyou)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 5:18:30 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Second class citizens would be, what I view, as the best way to describe it.

People constantly preach about "consenting ADULTS" but time and time again, not just on the Net, but in real time communities, I cant help but notice the input and opinions of a self labeled slave or sub being almost disregarded in comparsion to that of a self labeled dominant or Master.

Amazingly though, I have yet to see this in any of the homosexual couples I've made friends with, either real time or online. Its more of a hetero thing.



Ultimately, don't most subs wish to be guided?  Don't most Doms wish to guide?  In guiding, does the guide's opinion not take precidence before the one being led?

To this end, I both agree with your observations and find them to be reasonable.

Well, outside the homosexual bit.  I'm rather oblivious to who's gay and not, so I can't say I notice a difference.

(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 5:23:04 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave

I love how this went from me stateing I didnt think compareing subs to children was right to me beeing called a child from the other "adults" here. I dont know how it became time to flame me and call me childish or poke fun at my spelling but this wasnt why I opend the thread and I didnt attack anyone. I am very hurt and insulted and will now take my leave of these boards. No need for me to be where Im not wanted and since so many think Im so childish and cant understand that I have  a learning dissability that makes it very hard for me to spell and such, they arent people i want to be around.

Magik's slave


1. People suck.
2. People suck more on the Internet because they can express their opinions about one another that they wont express in a face to face situation. Everyone's guility of it. Me and you.
3. We're all only friends and enemies during the time we post and completely forgotten when we log off.
4. You could be dieing of cancer and someone will come by and flame you for being stupid enough to smoke one cigarette at the age of 17, thus making your cancer your fault. Dont expect people to understand about your learning disability.



_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to MagiksSlave)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 5:34:32 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline 		Sure, in an intimate relationship where one has agreed to guide and one has agreed to be guided.

Someone's wish to guide doesnt necessarily mean they are capable of guiding.

Nor does a desire to be guided mean that one is incapable of guiding.

When you place precendence with someone who has a wish to guide, your blurring out the notion of "consent".

As far as the homosexual part, I am not drawing a distinct difference between a homosexual person and a heterosexual persons values, but rather the Scene itself. The scene and its history has been divided up into two different groups, heterosexuals and homosexuals (Three, if you count the professionals. Some people dont). Each group has had different values and influences.

As someone who has interacted with both the primarily gay community in my home city and the primarily hetero ones also in my home city and a neighboring city, I noticed that the primarily homosexual group treated slaves and submissives with equality while the heterosexual group had a kind of unspoken condescension about them in their views and values.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to CuriousLord)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 5:59:34 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline 		I'd agree that consent can be more confusing when not everything is done by peers.  Still, people tend to guide eachother, and consent isn't something that's always given so much as assumed.  I don't see a problem with it over typical society.

The gay thing- it strikes me as odd.  Perhaps we'll have to ask for some other opinions on the subject.

Curiousity, though.  Most females I know are bisexual- what would the split be like for them?  Like, what scenes would they go to?  Kind of a split, or lean towards one or another?  (On average, I mean- individuals are going to vary.)

(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 6:27:59 PM   
PeggyO


Posts: 129
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

As someone who has interacted with both the primarily gay community in my home city and the primarily hetero ones also in my home city and a neighboring city, I noticed that the primarily homosexual group treated slaves and submissives with equality while the heterosexual group had a kind of unspoken condescension about them in their views and values.


Hello,

I have observed the same thing.   A submissive or slave can put forward an idea and it won't be given the same weight than if a dominant puts it forward.  I have seen this in action; a sub will say something - it is more or less ignored.  A dominant then says the exact same thing and everyone takes notice.  I have also noticed the differences between the gay and het communitites.  Part of this is due to the fact that there were submissives, slaves and boys in the gay community who were very outspoken about not accepting being second class citizens.  As a result, there has been a shift in attitudes.

Also, there is a lot of application of diminutives towards subs/slaves and no one seems to mind.  In fact some people seem to like it.  I know personally it irritates me when someone I don't know thinks it's ok to call me "girl", "little one", "pet" or calls me a "subbie". 

I've also had dominants who have tried to step in and tell me what to do because, so they have said, as a submissive I need a dominant in my life to make sure that I manage my affairs.  I feel that is condescending and constitutes viewing me as a child, not as a fully functionning adult.

I own my own business and have managed to support myself nicely with it.  I just bought a house, so obviously I have managed my finances adequately.  But apparently preferring to be submissive in a romantic relationship makes me incompetent to manage my own affairs.

Although I don't put up with this attitude and behavior when I encounter it, I encounter it far too often.  The fact is I don't feel I should be encountering it at all.

Take care,

Peggy

(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 6:44:25 PM   
aldompdx


Posts: 538
Joined: 10/24/2004
Status: offline 		The "alternative lifestyle" is a microcosm of the world. There, you will find many fully grown children, subconsciously trying to perpetuate their childhood. In the case of a co-dependent, they continue repeating the negative aspects of their past in order to get it right the next time around.

(in reply to hereyesruponyou)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Sub/slave=child - 5/25/2007 6:49:19 PM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		My quick 2 cents. Some subs or slaves desire to be treated lke children. Or pets. To be trained and disciplined.  Its part of the learning process for most submissives ho are trying to please the dominant that has them. The terminology never implied childishness to me. Only the wilingness to learn (training) and the acceptance of consequences for not behaving properly.

Angel is treated like a child, with me, becasue that is how we interact. Not all are, and I dont assume all subs would need to be or want to be.

DV

_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

(in reply to aldompdx)
Profile   Post #: 40
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