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The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:06:07 PM   
strikingamatch


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This is my first post to these forums. A few words about myself. My interest in bdsm has evolved from being subliminal at puberty towards a conscious awarenes in my late teens. I have been actively involved in the lifestyle to some degree for about ten years.

I am still searching for that elusive perfect relationship. Part of that search requires that I articulate what it is I am looking for. To that end, I have spoken to numerous people involved in the bdsm lifestyle. I have attempted to listen to them and understand the psychological underpinnings of their drives. This essay is the product of those discussions.

I must note, that my focus has always been only female submissives, and thus pretentious though I may be (and I beg those here to indulge my pretentions), I lay no claim however on how this series of classifications pertains to male submissives, if at all.

I think all submissives can be classified under a series of seven classifications. This is not to say, that any particular submissive fits precisely into one of these classes, rather, that any one or possibly all of these classes combine to comprise her submissive personality. Thus, a submissive may be 100% class 1, or 20% class one, 30% class 4 and 50% class 5. For those who dislike being pigeon-holed, I suggest that this essay be viewed in terms of what makes a submissive what she is, and not in terms of classifying the submissive.

I would be very grateful for any feedback: Specifically, whether or not it is possible to classify submissives in this manner and further whether this series of classifications is correct.

Class 1:
A pain slut. This woman is not a submissive at all, but simply enjoys sensation play.

Class 2:
The abused woman. This woman associates pain (emotional or physical) with those closest to her. Thus, when a dom hurts her, she feels loved and secure.

Class 3:
The deprived woman. This woman is one who was raised without the love and support she deserved. She wishes to regress back to childhood and relive it positively. Discipline, punishment, structure and heaps of love are what this woman is looking for.

Class 4:
The desperate woman. This is a woman who is desperately needy of a stable relationship. For one reason or another she has not managed to create such a relationship. She then believes, that if she will give a man her all, she will find the relationship she craves. This woman is not a submissive at all. She is simply doing the math. If the relationship works out, she will be happy. However, if the relationship collapses, she will be furious at what her dom did to her. Not only was she hurt in all sorts of ways, but she also did not get her just returns. She may claim that she was manipulated into the relationship, and from her point of view, that will indeed be the truth.

Class 5:
The overwhelmed woman. This is a woman who finds that life's demands are too much for her and is looking for someone she can rely on. Frequently, women who are in demanding jobs in the corporate world seek to be submissive at home. They find it extremely difficult to be constantly on the go and long to come home to an environment where someone else is responsible for their happiness and success.

Class 6:
The troublemaker: This is a woman who finds that she cannot control her life. Whether, it is trouble with her diet, her job, her friends or anything else, she finds that she frequently acts in a manner that brings her grief. Thus, she desires a dom who will keep her in place, discipline her when he has to, punish her when she deserves, and reward her when she has been good. Sometimes, she needs a dom in order to be able to safely express her rebellious streak, as she knows that if noone is watching her, she may take things too far. This sort of woman, has a tendency to test her limits just to see how much it is she can get away with and still be safe.

Class 7:
The giver: This is a woman who finds that her truest expression of self is by giving to others. She finds pleasure by putting other people's needs before her own. She seeks to submit so as to be able to be true to her intrinsic nature.

I think that if one evaluates a potential submissive on the basis of these classifications, one can also decide whether submission is the path that will bring her fulfilment. Perhaps therapy or similar is the ideal way of ensuring her happiness. Further, a potential dom should ask himself, can he provide the needs of this specific submissive? For examply, if his submissive is a class 6, can he be an effective policeman? Or, if his submissive is a class 3, can he give her the masses of love she needs?
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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:20:30 PM   
stormsfate


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Geez, I don't appear to fit into any of those categories.



f

*Edited to add...

I was going to leave it at that, but I couldn't. If these are the categories that most females in this lifestyle fall into, then they should seek emotional help from a psychiatrist instead of someone to try to "fix" them. Wow...just wow.

< Message edited by stormsfate -- 6/4/2005 1:23:40 PM >


_____________________________

Vision? What do you know about MY vision? My vision would turn your world upside down, tear asunder your illusions and the sanctuary of your own ignorance crashing down around you! Now ask yourself, are you really ready to see that vision? [/size

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:26:00 PM   
sweetone36


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I see a little of me in each class, i'm sure many others do also

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:26:36 PM   
MsIncognito


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*sigh*

I hate cleaning up vomit on a beautiful Saturday afternoon.

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:30:43 PM   
QnofH3arts


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I think you're way off base here. As fate said, "Wow... just wow"... these women need therapy, not a dominant.

Now, there is a book out there called "The Q Letters", I believe, that more accurately defines the seven levels of submission. Those levels are not described as reactions to psychological issues, but rather as the depth of a woman's ability to submit.

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:34:06 PM   
SteelBondager


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quote:

I am still searching for that elusive perfect relationship.


Sorry, no such thing. We're all human and, therefore, imperfect.

It's like looking for the neon green poison dart bat. They don't exist. You could write about the species, even claim to be an expert. That wouldn't make the bat any more real. You'll never find one.

< Message edited by SteelBondager -- 6/4/2005 1:42:23 PM >

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 1:51:40 PM   
perverseangelic


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Nope, I'm none of those.

I might call those classes "the seven classes of troubled people who tend to find their way into BDSM" because I -do- see those problems with some sort of frequency.

Still, I don't think those categories translate well to the world at large. Of the individuals I know, maybe one or two fit into any of them.

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 2:08:36 PM   
cheekybottom


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I don’t believe this has anything to do with submissiveness, simply put this is human behavior.

Submissiveness is something spiritual what you’ve outlined is caustic and shadows the unfurling beauty of submission in all it’s patterned splendor.

~d~

Edited to add: This is not a reply to SteelBondager but to the OP, how does one just simply reply without adding another’s name, I’m more than capable of doing so manually.


< Message edited by cheekybottom -- 6/4/2005 3:29:59 PM >


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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 3:00:40 PM   
wetsub000


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I'm concerned that your classifications seem mostly negative and seem to reflect on the experiences of the woman rather than her motivations. I'm sure you could find women with those experiences as submissives, as Dommes and out in the vanilla world. I hate to say it, but it's almost a predators list. Here ... go out and look for women with these problems and give them (or pretend to give them) these solutions and you'll be able to do what you like with them.

However, I'll be honest and say I probably have experience of at least three of those 'categories', but to what extent that makes me submissive and why I'm not sure you've covered. It also pre-supposes that it is for the most part a function of environment that makes a submissive and not nature and I think nature plays a very big part. Have you thought that maybe it isn't so much the experience, but the way they handled or interpreted it that clues you in to their submissive qualities. One of my favourite Doms led a very deprived childhood but it didn't turn him into a sub.

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 3:25:35 PM   
onceburned


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Welcome to Collarme, Strikingamatch. You seem to be an articulate and reasonably together fellow, so I hope you will stick around despite the largely negative reactions your post seems to be generating. We are an opinionated bunch, but friendly too, once you get to know us.

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 3:51:31 PM   
CelticPrince


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I found myself reading your seven acouple of times to insure that I did not miss any subliminal content there.

Simply put, I believe that you have attempted to boil the complexities down to a very hot pot / ie, the essenence of the message/ observation is gone.

The complexities of either side of the slash cannot be defined with one line descriptions. I have mentored dozens in the lifestyle on a hands offf basis to insure objectivity, and friend not one could I put into any of your seven types.

CP

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 4:13:55 PM   
sanita


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welcome, strikingamatch.

i understand that you are trying to understand, trying to create some sort of framework for something so amazingly individual.

if i may say so, i think the error in this study, is the classification in the first place. as a human, as a woman with a mind, as a sub that is a toy sometimes- a slut, a pet, a slave others- but always a sub, i do not like to be pigeonholed.

all but the last of your classes are somewhat negative, and the analysis involves something lacking in that person's psyche. the last one could also be the class of a stalker or a martyr.

yes, most people will have a little of each of these characteristics. does that make them a sub? i don't think so.

in particular, class 2... we already have to deal with the vanillas in our world assuming we are asking to be abused. we carry the stigma of a victim that does not realise we are being abused. we are told our lifestyle is sick, and that we need help. *slow nod* i am loathe to ask any sub to classify herself as abused.

many of us have abuse in our past (some, in our present), and many abused people do not find BDSM.

anyway, there are dynamics that can arise from your classifications. however, each dynamic is different. each one depends on what the individuals bring into the relationship.

i just don't think you are going to find too many people that are receptive to being analyzed and pigeonholed.

it is apparent, though, that you are sincere, and trying to apply your own experiences. instead of taking preconceived labels and applying them to the people you meet here, consider being able to flesh out your knowlege of each person by learning their individual stories, traits, and tendencies.

good luck to you.




_____________________________

Sometimes, He calls me "subbie." Sometimes, i call me "subbie." And if someone wants to call me a BBW, its flattering. Just don't call me false.

"Please do not show me your ass and expect me to read your mind." -Opencollar

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 4:29:02 PM   
Lordandmaster


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OK, I can't resist:

U R DEFINATELY RITE THERE ARE 7 KNIDS OF SUB BITCHS AND IF UR GONNA BE AN EXPRET U NEED TO KNOW ALL 7 KINDS. BUT SOMETIEMS ONE OF THEM IS HARD TO FIND LIKE WHEN YOU HAVE ALLMOST ALL THE YANKES BASEBAL CARDS BUT FREAKIN HIDECKI MASTUI YOU JUST CANT GET HIM ANYWHERE

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 4:52:25 PM   
cltcdrd


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quote:

Class 1:
A pain slut. This woman is not a submissive at all, but simply enjoys sensation play.


I disagree totally with this. Just because a person enjoys and craves the "high" that pain brings, does not mean that they are not submissive.

quote:

I am still searching for that elusive perfect relationship


From what you yourself have said right here, you already know that you will never find "that perfect relationship"...the word elusive means just that...always out of reach.

One thing you seemed to have missed in all your discussions with others is that true submission requires extraoridinary reserves of strength. It takes a VERY strong person to completly give up control of every aspect of their being. This may sound contradictory in and of itself, but most Dom/Domme 's would probably agree. They are not looking for a "weak minded" sub/slave, they want someone who is strong enough mentally, and emotionally to give complete submission.

< Message edited by cltcdrd -- 6/4/2005 4:53:34 PM >

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 5:12:15 PM   
BeachMystress


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I'm not surprised the perfect relationship is eluding you. When you approach a human relationship as a chance to psychoanalyze someone, people tend to shy away from you.

Also, your view of what makes a woman who she is, seems rather superficial and misogynistic. I have many submissive female friends, and none of them fit your classifications. Does this mean they're not really submissive because they don't fit into your idea of what defines submissive women? You are trivializing submissives, submission and women in general. That is very unattractive.

If you're unaware of them, you may want to read the 9 Levels of Submission, published in 1984 by Diane Vera in the Lesbian S/M Safety Manual. http://www.fetishalliance.net/Stories/Sub_bottom/9_levels_of_submission.htm That actually deals with types of submission rather than psychological problems.

_____________________________

Beach Mystress
*Do not threaten the weak. Intimidate the strong. ~ Stevenson*
http://beachmystress.jigsy.com
http://www.flickr.com/photos/beachmystress/

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 5:16:21 PM   
Tempestspet


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Those seven classifications are not the seven classifications of a submissive. They are however seven disturbing types of women... who really need some help.

Though as someone else pointed out, I feel I should reiterate, a pain slut ..can... be a submissive. A pain slut, male or female, is called a masochist. Whether or not that person is submissive, is another story.

As for the rest of them... as I have already said, they just need help.

I love sensation play. But sensation play is not just about pain.... far from it actually... but that's a side note.

It seems this list is short sighted, have you perhaps run into these types of women frequently? Not only do none of these categories fit me, they don't fit most, not all, women / submissives I know.


Tempest's pet
jennifer


Edited to add the following:
The reason what you are seeking in a relationship is elusive.... is because there is no such thing as a perfect relationship. There are good, great, and fantastic and stable relationships.... but nothing is ever perfect.

< Message edited by Tempestspet -- 6/4/2005 5:18:00 PM >

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 5:37:24 PM   
perverseangelic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cltcdrd

quote:

Class 1:
A pain slut. This woman is not a submissive at all, but simply enjoys sensation play.


I disagree totally with this. Just because a person enjoys and craves the "high" that pain brings, does not mean that they are not submissive.


I don't think he was saying that all pain sluts are like this. I read it as that one type of person is a pain slut who has no desire to submit.

_____________________________

~in the begining it is always dark~

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 5:47:36 PM   
roughleather


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Oh, please. Don't make it so complicated.

Some women just like to be tied up and forced to do things because they get intense orgasms that way.

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 6:05:21 PM   
synrgy33


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I would have to say I totally disagree with this. I tend to lead towards enjoying pain and I think I'm a pretty submissive woman. I have found over the years of being in the lifestyle that many people involved within the scene have been abused either physically or emotionaly but I don't think that hinders them within this chosen lifestyle, but enhances what they seek, and what they offer.

Going through your list.. Class 3, the deprvaved woman.. Hmm's. I was raised in a very loving family environment. My parents know about my likes well heck so do my siblings. I'm the youngest of four and I would say we're all very close. I think being submissive sometimes it's natural for us to seek punishment if we do something wrong. I won't speak for all submissives but I myself seek that in my Dominant if I do something wrong, I want Him to be confidant enough in Himself to take me to hand and say "MY GOODNESS what were you thinking!" Not only making me aware of my error, but hopefully helping me to work it out and become a better person.

I don't have much to say about Class 4 so I'll skip right onto class 5. I know some pretty successful women who are submissives. Yes they have very demanding jobs and I would think the Dominant would find it a treasure to come home and find that His woman wants Him to take control for awhile, giving her the freedom and the space for enjoyment seeing His needs, and fullfilling something within her. I think this goes for male submissives to with pretty powerful jobs. I don't think it has ANYTHING to do with they can't keep up with the high stress of their postions to want to be submissive.

I agree with stormsfate.. I don't fit into ANY of these categories.. *gasp* I wonder if that means I'm not submissive????? *smiles sweetlie*

syn~SD~

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RE: The Seven Classes of Submissives - 6/4/2005 6:49:57 PM   
DesertRat


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Hmmmmm.....

For what it's worth, my former slave fits all those categories, except for Class 1 and Class 7. Fits them very well. But I don't know if that means much. Kind of interesting. But then, if someone else came up with a completely different classification scheme, I would probably find that vaguely interesting, too. I have too much time on my hands...LOL

Bob

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