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Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 1:14:06 PM   
StudentDomUK


Posts: 1
Joined: 6/18/2007
Status: offline 		Both being young (19) I didnt expect My girlfriend to be ready to kneel down collared for Me as soon as W/we begun dating however, now I would like some advice. she knows nothing of this lifestyle but does have a very "submissive" general attitude and will often do as shes told so to speak. I have also playfully spanked her a bit and also used the promise of spanking to make her behave/do something.

So My question would be along the lines of how do I introduce her to this lifestyle (despite being adventourous in a vanilla sense thats all she knows of) and train her properly into a good little submissive.

Any help with training/this problem will be much appreciated
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 1:18:51 PM   
dincubus


Posts: 231
Joined: 10/22/2005
From: South Dakota
Status: offline 		While i am relatively new to the life myself, i would suggest slowly introducing new things to her. not all at once mind you but like one thing at a time. maybe try some light bondage for a period of time, then move to incorporate something else. go slowly and be open to questions and discussion about what it is you wish to try.

(in reply to StudentDomUK)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 1:21:58 PM   
SirMIkeSD


Posts: 613
Joined: 3/16/2007
From: San Diego, Ca
Status: offline 		Talk to her, open communciation is the key here.  Keep in mind that just because she likes a "little spank" does not make her a submissive.  Attend groups/munches etc in your area with her and see if it developes.   Maybe it will, maybe it won't.  She could be a natural dom, after finding out about the life style and just playing a little submissive to you since that is what she thinks is expected.  Anything is possiable, but without the communication you will not know.

Mike


(in reply to StudentDomUK)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 1:26:45 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: StudentDomUK

Both being young (19) I didnt expect My girlfriend to be ready to kneel down collared for Me as soon as W/we begun dating however, now I would like some advice. she knows nothing of this lifestyle but does have a very "submissive" general attitude and will often do as shes told so to speak. I have also playfully spanked her a bit and also used the promise of spanking to make her behave/do something.

So My question would be along the lines of how do I introduce her to this lifestyle (despite being adventourous in a vanilla sense thats all she knows of) and train her properly into a good little submissive.

Any help with training/this problem will be much appreciated


Talk to her. Be blunt and be honest on your expections. Tell her very honestly if you expect her to change much or not. Be ready for her to tell you "It's over". Don't give her a hard time if she does. And don't pull the "If you loved me, you'd do this" line of BS.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to StudentDomUK)
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RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 1:45:15 PM   
JerryInTampa


Posts: 138
Joined: 2/19/2004
Status: offline 		I agree communicate. I agree be honest.
I'll add the suggestion to ease in. You've already started. Start adding more play of the type you like.

If you know that there's something that's a potential deal-breaker for you; then don't wait too long to find out if she's onboard. Otherwise just take your time and enjoy the journey. It goes where it goes and either the package she offers is something you want or it isn't.

(in reply to AquaticSub)
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RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 1:57:13 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline 		How bout first start by ASKING if she is even interested in beeing a sub,dont just assume she wants to remember enjoying a light spanking and doing what is asked of you does not a sub make!! So ask her and then go from there, if she isnt interested let it go, remeber consent is a must, if she is interested take it slowly make sure she knows what she is getting into. Be clear on what you expect but dont dive in head first expecting to much all at once is a bit overwhelming.


Magik's slave

< Message edited by MagiksSlave -- 6/18/2007 1:59:05 PM >

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


-Rodney Atkins-



(in reply to JerryInTampa)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 2:12:19 PM   
sambamanslilgirl


Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: StudentDomUK

Both being young (19) I didnt expect My girlfriend to be ready to kneel down collared for Me as soon as W/we begun dating however, now I would like some advice. she knows nothing of this lifestyle but does have a very "submissive" general attitude and will often do as shes told so to speak. I have also playfully spanked her a bit and also used the promise of spanking to make her behave/do something.

So My question would be along the lines of how do I introduce her to this lifestyle (despite being adventourous in a vanilla sense thats all she knows of) and train her properly into a good little submissive.

Any help with training/this problem will be much appreciated

i have a couple problems with your op - first, i'm concerned if you're serious about the lifestyle or see this as a sexual kink of the month.  collaring someone who doesn't really know and/or understand the lifestyle to me is completely immature on your part since you haven't communicated your expectations to her. it seems that you're new in this lifestyle as well - first you have to "master" yourself before handling a someone as your submissive.  second, the promise of spanking of to make her behave - imho, i don't see what you're trying to accomplish here with that. the more you use that, the likely she's going to manipulate you into giving her spanking whatever she's misbehaving to get your attention.

my advice to you is find an older Dom to mentor  you or join a community in the UK so you can be "trained" and also what others have said, honestly talk to her about this. what you might realize she may be in it for the kinkiness only and nothing else.  i agree with Aqua, don't pull that line on her either if she decides to leave you.it


_____________________________

...2011 - year of the fabulous rock star life ...and i do it so well...


...announcing Mr. & Mrs. British Petrol ...yeah, marrying into oil is slick business...

(in reply to StudentDomUK)
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RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 2:30:19 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: StudentDomUK

Both being young (19) I didnt expect My girlfriend to be ready to kneel down collared for Me as soon as W/we begun dating however, now I would like some advice. she knows nothing of this lifestyle but does have a very "submissive" general attitude and will often do as shes told so to speak. I have also playfully spanked her a bit and also used the promise of spanking to make her behave/do something.

So My question would be along the lines of how do I introduce her to this lifestyle (despite being adventourous in a vanilla sense thats all she knows of) and train her properly into a good little submissive.

Any help with training/this problem will be much appreciated


Goeing back and re reading the sentence that I have highlighted brings me some concern. You say you didnt go into the relationship expecting to collar her soon. But you says she is vanilla, why would you expect to collar her at all. The entire thing just seems to manipulative for my comfert. Seems you picked a vanilla girl with the idea of converting her and I always had a problem with those that do this, it just seems so I dont know dishonest!!!

Magik's slave

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


-Rodney Atkins-



(in reply to StudentDomUK)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 2:30:53 PM   
slaverosebeauty


Posts: 1941
Joined: 12/12/2004
From: Cali
Status: offline 		Ditto above. Communicate with her. Get a few books on BDSM {my personal favs "Screw The Roses, Send Me the Thorns..." "The Topping Book" "The Bottoming Book" "SM 101" - those are great books to get you started, "Screw The Roses" is written more like a friend talking, so it might be a bit less intimidating} and go through them as a couple, if thats kinda scarry, then just bring things up, slowly and not in an manner where she may become defenseive. You are only 19, so take your time, this stuff takes time, its not just a quick thing you can learn, so embrace the time it takes you to learn.

_____________________________

http://slaverosebeauty.livejournal.com/

"Friends live on in our hearts, regardless if they are here or not."

(in reply to sambamanslilgirl)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 2:43:04 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		Don't tell her a damn think about S&M would be my opinion.  Many young women are terrified of anything kinky, but you can spank them, tie them up and blindfold them, fuck them in the ass but if you say you are into S&M and want to spank them, tie them up and blindfold them, or fuck them in the ass they will freak out.

Before the PC police try and cut my head off, please not that isn't the same as lying.  Be clear about what you are doing, just don't let on its kinky or related to S&M.  Worry a bit less about introducing new things and build trust with her.  Problem with young girls is their brains don't work yet and what motivates them is vastly different than a mature woman (of course there are exceptions people, some girls like girls too) and so I can't give specifics on what to do to build trust or a healthy relationship.

You guys are both young, don't worry so much about if you are "doing it right" just do it all night long.  Don't worry if you are "just being kinky" it is as valid and as beautiful as anything else.

(in reply to slaverosebeauty)
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RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 3:54:01 PM   
HypnoticDan


Posts: 463
Joined: 5/23/2007
Status: offline 		I find myself in the difficult position of agreeing with both approaches.  Certainly talk to her, but leave out the mention of S&M.  Don't introduce any big surprises, would be my advice.  A blindfold in bed is a nice place to start.  Afterwards, don't ask if she liked it (she may feel the need to say 'yes' to make you happy).  Instead remark on her reaction or ask her how she felt.  If it sounds positive, maybe next time try holding her wrists above her head while the blindfold is on.  The time after that, maybe pull her hair from behind.  Of course take it slow - don't make every session a kinky session unless she's totally red hot into it.  As for introducing toys, the easiest way I know of is to first get her to show you her toys and how she uses them (which can be an evening unto itself).  Maybe later try "spontaneously" popping into a couples-friendly adult store while out on a date ("just for a laugh", you say) but take a while to look over all the various toys and jokingly menace each other with them.  Again, if she doesn't play along take that as a hint that it's not her thing.  Don't buy anything unless she picks it off the shelf herself.  In fact maybe don't get the thing she's interested in, but talk dirty about it in bed later.  If she's keen, go back and get it yourself, then present it on some special occaision.

Hmm... how do I cross post this to "Dom Tricks?" :)

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 5:11:10 PM   
MagiksSlave


Posts: 2768
Joined: 9/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HypnoticDan

I find myself in the difficult position of agreeing with both approaches.  Certainly talk to her, but leave out the mention of S&M.  Don't introduce any big surprises, would be my advice.  A blindfold in bed is a nice place to start.  Afterwards, don't ask if she liked it (she may feel the need to say 'yes' to make you happy).  Instead remark on her reaction or ask her how she felt.  If it sounds positive, maybe next time try holding her wrists above her head while the blindfold is on.  The time after that, maybe pull her hair from behind.  Of course take it slow - don't make every session a kinky session unless she's totally red hot into it.  As for introducing toys, the easiest way I know of is to first get her to show you her toys and how she uses them (which can be an evening unto itself).  Maybe later try "spontaneously" popping into a couples-friendly adult store while out on a date ("just for a laugh", you say) but take a while to look over all the various toys and jokingly menace each other with them.  Again, if she doesn't play along take that as a hint that it's not her thing.  Don't buy anything unless she picks it off the shelf herself.  In fact maybe don't get the thing she's interested in, but talk dirty about it in bed later.  If she's keen, go back and get it yourself, then present it on some special occaision.

Hmm... how do I cross post this to "Dom Tricks?" :)



You dont want to just DO anything, weather or not you mention S & M or D/s or M/s you still should talk to her about everything you want to do befor you just go ahead and do it, I said it befor a Ill say it again consent is a must!! Dont just pull out a blind fold and blindfold her that is a sure way to scare her you want to make her a consenting part of this and that includes makeing sure she wants any of it befor its done.

This isnt the same as if she was your sub or slave. if she was your sub or slave then by consenting to be such she as consentend to anything you within the paramater of your relationship within the limits you set, but since she isnt your sub or slave she is just your girlfriend she has given NO consent for anything to do with the lifestyle and there for you need to ask her befor you do anything so she can give you her consent to do it.

Magik's slave

< Message edited by MagiksSlave -- 6/18/2007 5:17:08 PM >

_____________________________

If you’re going through hell keep on moving
don't slow down
if you’re scared dont show it
you might get out
before the devil even knows your there.


-Rodney Atkins-



(in reply to HypnoticDan)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 5:18:16 PM   
Aileen68


Posts: 6091
Joined: 8/2/2005
Status: offline 		I think if you like each other then you might as well just enjoy the relationship.  If it naturally morphs into a nice bdsm relationship then that's even better.  If she's not submissive, no amount of coercion on your part will magically turn her into one.  If she does have submissive tendencies then she most likely will respond in positive ways to things like a spanking or certain words and actions you may drop here and there.  If that's the case then enjoy and explore together.

edited to add...personally I wouldn't sit down and talk to her about specifics.  To me that's sterile and really more like a job interview.  Dating in bdsm is no different in dating vanilla.  Would you sit down and discuss with her all the things you'd like to do to her in a vanilla sense or just go with the flow?  Bdsm is no different.  My opinion, of course.

< Message edited by Aileen68 -- 6/18/2007 5:21:33 PM >

(in reply to StudentDomUK)
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RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 6:37:27 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

you still should talk to her about everything you want to do before you just go ahead and do it,


quote:

personally I wouldn't sit down and talk to her about specifics 


And viola, we have the opposing spectrum one right after the other!  Some want to discuss it all, some don't.  I don't, I just reach out and yank them to their knees.  Sometimes I call it right and am richly rewarded, other times she turns around with an 8 inch chefs knife and tells me to slowly back away.  Either way I know if there is any interest on my part in pursuing anything further.

With a vanilla girl, especially one so young, let her think she is leading you astray, that she is being bad, and you can probably have your way with her.


(in reply to Aileen68)
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RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 7:13:55 PM   
Faramir


Posts: 1043
Joined: 2/12/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
Many young women are terrified of anything kinky, but you can spank them, tie them up and blindfold them, fuck them in the ass but if you say you are into S&M and want to spank them, tie them up and blindfold them, or fuck them in the ass they will freak out.


I think that's well said.  The langauge of BDSM has powerful connotations in the broader discourse that have nothing to with their specific denotation in our discourse.  BDSM words can serve as markers or warning signs for hazards that speak to the broader discourses issues on sexuality, intimacy and gender roles within both.

_____________________________

True masters, true subs and slaves, X many years in the lifestyle, Old Guard this and High Protocol that--it's like a convention of D&D nerds were allowed to have sex once, and they decided to make a religion out of it.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 8:41:35 PM   
HypnoticDan


Posts: 463
Joined: 5/23/2007
Status: offline 		MagikSlave - While I have agreed with many things you have written in the past this is going a bit too far, imho. Can you imagine what a mood kill it would be if your man had said "can I touch you here? how about here? is this good? can I keep going?" Basically, that's what you're suggesting. Talking about it before hand would be even more of a bore - I'm thinking I'd like to do this, this, both of these, and a little of this (reversed) with a side order of that. As I said, I'm all for communication and he shouldn't just whip it out and hogtie her before she knows what's going on. Maybe that works for SimplyMichael but we don't all get our kicks from risking a Bobbit. I'm saying if you really are a dom then take the lead. However, if you are a dom then you have to take the whole package: be considerate and respectful by going at a speed she can be comfortable with."

End of the day, there's really only two ways to go about it: 

  F S
------
Y|1|2|
------
N|3|4|
------

F = Fast
S = Slow
Y = She loves it
N = She hates it
you have very little control over wether it's 1,2,3, or 4. All you can decide is if it'll be odds or evens. There's a good chance that 3 will net a more aggressive reaction than 4 so you have to decide for yourself which one you want.
Of course this is a highly simplified example but you get the idea.

(in reply to Faramir)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/18/2007 9:42:16 PM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		I'm with Michael on this one. 

Contrary to what others have told you, your best off 'doing first and asking questions later.'  This isn't to say ignore her; it means take it slow, and 'surprise' her with some of the more tame activities.  Tell her to close her eyes... blindfold her.. then try tying her before you spank her.  Nothing elaborate, nothing from a hard core porno or S&M flick.  The time you spend tying her is time she's wondring "What the FUCK is he doing???"  So be quick; it needn't hold down shipping containers.  In fact, at first making knots loose enough so she can easily escape is a good start.

After a month of this, you'll find she enjoys it more and more.  That's when you should sit her down, and give her 'the talk.'  Start by asking her what she thinks of what you two have been doing.  (actually, sitting down isn't as good as laying in bed next to her after a great session.)  Ask her how she feels about it, does it scare her, what does she like about it.  Let her put a voice to feelings she hasn't really analyzed yet.  Then tell her you've noticed certain things in her personality; how she looks away, or always tries to get things for you.  Praise her for these things (as well as every time you two play, tell her how proud and pleased you are with what she does.)  Make her feel good about doing things that she'd normally think are 'weird' or 'bad.' 

Then, once you get these feelings out, lay it on her.  Tell her you love it too, and that other people do these things also.  That there are hundreds of books and millions of people involved in it.  Don't launch into "I'm a Dom, you're a sub" - the acronyms can be intimidating.  Instead tell her you'd like to take it a little further... little rules.  That's when you first teach her how to kneel.  Show her exactly how you want it, where her hands go, where her head rests, how her knees are, everything.  Tell her how beautiful she looks there on her knees.  Stroke her hair, her cheek, make her feel loved.

From there... it's downhill.  Don't rush her, don't push her, and leave her always wanting 'more.'  Overwhelming her too much, too soon is a good way to make her afraid.  Take the fear of the unknown completely out of the equation; you can always add fear later on, once she has developed a lot more trust.

Just my two cents; good luck!

Stephan

_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to HypnoticDan)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/19/2007 7:48:21 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HypnoticDan

MagikSlave - While I have agreed with many things you have written in the past this is going a bit too far, imho. Can you imagine what a mood kill it would be if your man had said "can I touch you here? how about here? is this good? can I keep going?" Basically, that's what you're suggesting. Talking about it before hand would be even more of a bore - I'm thinking I'd like to do this, this, both of these, and a little of this (reversed) with a side order of that. As I said, I'm all for communication and he shouldn't just whip it out and hogtie her before she knows what's going on. Maybe that works for SimplyMichael but we don't all get our kicks from risking a Bobbit. I'm saying if you really are a dom then take the lead. However, if you are a dom then you have to take the whole package: be considerate and respectful by going at a speed she can be comfortable with."

End of the day, there's really only two ways to go about it: 

  F S
------
Y|1|2|
------
N|3|4|
------

F = Fast
S = Slow
Y = She loves it
N = She hates it
you have very little control over wether it's 1,2,3, or 4. All you can decide is if it'll be odds or evens. There's a good chance that 3 will net a more aggressive reaction than 4 so you have to decide for yourself which one you want.
Of course this is a highly simplified example but you get the idea.



When you were talking about turning her into a good little submissive, I assumed you were talking about non-sexual service and actually introducing her into the lifestyle.

However, if you are seeking to introduce her into kinkier sex, you've got a lot of good, sound advice on how to do it.

But if you want to get her to serve you outside of the bedroom, you need to talk to her. You need to be upfront about your expectations. If you intend to collar her, you should talk her about the lifestyle and have her do research on her own first. In the opinion of a female submissive, that is the most important part. A woman can always dismiss rope bondage, candle play, even needles as "Well, he's just really kinky and it gets me going so whatever!". It's very different when you start wanting a power exchange.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to HypnoticDan)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/19/2007 7:52:45 AM   
Stephann


Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline 		I would strongly suggest against any use of checklists with a vanilla girl, until enough time to develop a genuine sense of trust and intimacy has been established.  That may take a week, it may take six months.  Sex doesn't equal intimacy; I slapped gretchen the first time we had sex (a week after we met), and she loved it. I didn't explain what it really meant for almost a month into the relationship.  Good judgement is crucial when you're both inexperienced.

Stephan


_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to AquaticSub)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Advice on a vanilla girlfriend - 6/19/2007 7:58:26 AM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

 Good judgement is crucial when you're both inexperienced.



 
This is very true. But if he starts training her outside of the bedroom without telling her, that could (and I would say probably will) blow up in his face nicely when she finds out.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to Stephann)
Profile   Post #: 20
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