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Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 2:08:49 AM   
Level


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Status: offline 		CBS) It was a scene that shocked battle-hardened soldiers, captured in photographs obtained exclusively by CBS News.

On a daytime patrol in central Baghdad just over than a week ago, a U.S. military advisory team and Iraqi soldiers happened to look over a wall and found something horrific.

"They saw multiple bodies laying on the floor of the facility," Staff Sgt. Mitchell Gibson of the 82nd Airborne Division told CBS News chief foreign correspondent Lara Logan. "They thought they were all dead, so they threw a basketball (to) try and get some attention, and actually one of the kids lifted up their head, tilted it over and just looked and then went back down. And they said, 'oh, they're alive' and so they went into the building."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/06/18/eveningnews/main2946007.shtml

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 4:33:35 AM   
Stephann


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Status: offline 		I was moved to tears this morning.

Stephan


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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 4:55:31 AM   
acissej


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Status: offline 		I am sitting here fuming mad after reading that article and looking at those pictures.  Maybe I'm getting too worked up because I'm currently waiting to bring home a child from an orphanage, but I am appalled.  The delays children can have in even the best orphanages are frightening enough, but in a situation like that, I can't even imagine. 

Thank you for sharing this, Level.

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 5:06:45 AM   
LadyEllen


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Status: offline 		Reminds me of Romania; a whole country found to be full of such orphanages, holding hundreds of children each in very similar (and in many cases much worse) conditions, on the execution of Ceaucescu.

What amazes me is that it would cost around USD 20,000-00 and take 3-5 years if I wanted to adopt one of those boys here in the UK, because UK social services want to make checks about health and safety etc of the boy in my home before granting permission. I'd likely be declined because I smoke. Clearly better for such orphans to live in squalor and be ill treated than to live with a smoker.

I hope that those responsible will be well punished. Mind you, even crucifixion though out of style, would be merciful compared to what I'd do with them.

E

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 5:15:34 AM   
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quote:

ORIGINAL: acissej

I am sitting here fuming mad after reading that article and looking at those pictures.  Maybe I'm getting too worked up because I'm currently waiting to bring home a child from an orphanage, but I am appalled.  The delays children can have in even the best orphanages are frightening enough, but in a situation like that, I can't even imagine. 

Thank you for sharing this, Level.



j, I can't quit picturing one of the kids, after being moved to another facility and being treated well, holding one of the soldiers hands, and stroking it with his cheek, over and over, smiling. At least they got them out of there.

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 5:45:11 AM   
acissej


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Status: offline 		I'm away from home and don't have my reference in front of me, but there was a study on the long term effects of institutionalization on children who'd been in Romanian orphanages, and something like 30% had severe delays and associated psychological problems that were considered irreversible.  I think there were about an equal number who were able to nearly fully recover and thrive, and the rest made improvements, but continued to have some delays. 

I wonder how long the boys have been there in those conditions.  The pictures of the children once they had food and juice in them were promising, and I hope they only continue to improve now that they're out of that place. 

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 5:57:20 AM   
Stephann


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Status: offline 		The part in the article about the boy...covered in flies....  No, not all made it out.

Stephan


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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 6:05:42 AM   
acissej


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

The part in the article about the boy...covered in flies....  No, not all made it out.



That was disgusting.  I think the article said that they didn't think the boy was going to make it, but a week later, he was able to sit up on his own and had made improvements.


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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 6:22:47 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		Do you know where the 'story' originates from? I know the source you quote is CBS, but who did the initial reporting?

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 7:48:57 AM   
Stephann


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Status: offline 		I stand corrected.  Honestly, I lost the will to keep reading to where it said he survived.  All I could do was imagine if I had been killed, and it was my son.

My apologies.

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 8:11:28 AM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		What makes these children different from the 100,000 others?

Because the film crew was permitted to take pictures?

Because CBS was permitted to show them?

With all the death and tragedy, what OTHER STORIES is this story intended to distract us from?

Perhaps the investigation launched into Karl Rove? Or the continued fallout of Alberto Gonzales?

Perhaps the RAPE MOVIES from Abu Grahib?



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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 8:27:38 AM   
SubmissiveLinda


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Status: offline 		you just have to wonder about the long term memories & effects that this will have on the children

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 8:50:55 AM   
philosophy


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Status: offline 		.......in a war such as this, where air power was used to pound residential areas before troops moved in, you have to expect a lot of orphans and a concommitant breakdown in the social systems that would usually support them.......'shock and awe', eh?

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:04:20 AM   
Stephann


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Status: offline 		Fargle,

Size defeats us.  We deal much more effectively when pictures or stories of one or three people strike home, vice statitics of thousands of nameless, faceless casualties.

Stephan


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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:23:07 AM   
sleazybutterfly


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Status: offline 		fargle: I have people in the family that say the same thing if they hear of someone with cancer, or something tragic..they always bring into it something about themselves or someone else that is sick and wonder why this person is such a big damn deal.  They aren't more important, but they are just as important.  Why shouldn't we hear about them?  Give me one great reason for that, and I will think about why we don't hear about all of the other things mentioned.

Us being over there doesn't make much sense to me, but I am glad that if we had to be anyway, we could do some good.  Perhaps it's for the moments like this as part of a bigger plan, regardless, it was a very moving story. 

It's good to hear of something good coming out of this war for a change, rather than something horrific.  If it bothers you so much, just stay tuned, there is always tomorrow.

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:49:49 AM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		Does saving two dozen children absolve us from the blood of 100,000?



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ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:54:37 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		Yes, and my worry is: in times of war, propaganda is almighty. I can't help but wonder who will benefit from this story, ultimately.

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:56:21 AM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		Karl Rove? As attention is deflected from the CRIMES committed by the White House, in their violation of the Executive Records Act.

My money is on the story of us having film of Uniformed US Soldiers raping Female Prisoners.

Think about that. These kids *might* be orphans because their mothers were raped to death by our soldiers, while prisoners.



< Message edited by farglebargle -- 6/19/2007 9:57:15 AM >

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It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:57:27 AM   
Stephann


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Status: offline 		How many children have you saved from death, Fargle?  Talk is cheap.

Look, it's an emotional issue, period.  It's not a question of absolution.  Relentless demonification of the government does a disservice.  There is no quick or easy solution.  The killing in Iraq isn't US forces hunting down children in the street; the infighting isn't the result of Bush's master plan to exterminate Iraq and Iran.

It's easy to point fingers and blame.  Harder to do it in the mirror.  Besides daily ranting, what exactly do you do to help make this world a better place?

Stephan


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RE: Horror story from Iraq - 6/19/2007 9:59:31 AM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Stephann

Look, it's an emotional issue, period. It's not a question of absolution. Relentless demonification of the government does a disservice.



Evil *IS* as Evil *DOES*.

quote:



There is no quick or easy solution.


Don't do evil.

quote:


The killing in Iraq isn't US forces hunting down children in the street


You're right. Children are being raped in their homes, after their parents are murdered BY US TROOPS. So they're not being hunted in the street. They don't get the chance to escape into the street.

Or did y'all hang that animal Steven Green yet as a lesson to the Troops?

Didn't think so.

< Message edited by farglebargle -- 6/19/2007 10:00:38 AM >

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It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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