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RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 7:08:22 PM   
ExSteelAgain


Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lighthearted

quote:


Shooting nights and weekends with crews willing to work for expenses is not unheard of.



sure, it's not unheard of, but it's nothing you'd want to do on a regular basis.  having worked on both really big budget films and really low budget films, union vs non-union, etc etc, it's my opinion that you are more likely going to have a crew that shows up, on time, all the time, properly prepared with all the proper resources in place if you have more money to spend.

don't get me wrong, I think today's movie budgets are vastly inflated, but to expect crew members, casts, etc to work exclusively on movies made for $7K is totally unrealistic.

edited to add the quote (!)


Yeah, to be blunt here, I also wonder about the idea of giving him your script. He says he will find a way to make a movie out of it for about $7,000. I hope he has the money for that, at least. I really don't mean to sound distrustful, but if you are going to give your hard earned work away, be careful. There have been far too many new writers who end up in deals where they pay for their work to be published and then more. If it sounds too good to be true....

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to lighthearted)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 7:34:41 PM   
bladedom


Posts: 39
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Yeah, to be blunt here, I also wonder about the idea of giving him your script. He says he will find a way to make a movie out of it for about $7,000. I hope he has the money for that, at least. I really don't mean to sound distrustful, but if you are going to give your hard earned work away, be careful. There have been far too many new writers who end up in deals where they pay for their work to be published and then more. If it sounds too good to be true....


I register all my scripts with the Writers Guild of America. Costs $20:

http://www.wga.org/

Suggest you do the same.

And yes, it is quite possible to make a movie for low budgets. Primer is one example. Here's some additional info:

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http://www.nextwavefilms.com/ulbp/ss.html
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http://digitalcontentproducer.com/mag/video_films_fraction_part/

How to Post and Distribute a "Micro-Budget," Shot-On-Video Feature Film This is the second part of a two-part article which appeared in the March, 1997 Millimeter and described how independent filmmakers are shooting, posting, and distributing feature films on "prosumer" format videotape-for budgets of $5,000 and less. This segment explains the postproduction and distribution process for this "micro-budget" genre.
---------

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogme_95

Dogme 95 (in English: Dogma 95) is an avant-garde filmmaking movement started in 1995 by the Danish directors Lars von Trier, Thomas Vinterberg, Kristian Levring, and Søren Kragh-Jacobsen. This movement is sometimes known as the Dogme 95 Collective or the Dogme Brethren.
---------


And no I didn't say I'd make your film if you get me a script, I said by working together we can get low budget movies made instead of complaining about all the movies we'd like to see but don't. I'd like to collaborate on makeing movies about this life style, but don't wait for me, go write your own story and shoot it then tell us about it.

I suggested you get a copy of the Final Draft demo software and try writing, I'd like to see the results which you should register with the Writers Guild of America.









< Message edited by bladedom -- 6/26/2007 7:36:21 PM >

(in reply to ExSteelAgain)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 8:00:53 PM   
ExSteelAgain


Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline 		I'm happy for you that you have scripts registered with the Writers Guild.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to bladedom)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 8:11:22 PM   
bladedom


Posts: 39
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

I'm happy for you that you have scripts registered with the Writers Guild.


Impune my motives, then snark. Nice.

But that's show business.

On another subject, anyone have any experience using Linux or OSX based Open Source movie editing tools?

There are two that I know of.

Lives:
http://lives.sourceforge.net/

It's multitrack like Premiere with a pretty decent feature set. I'm downloading now to try on my Mac.

Cinelerra:
http://cvs.cinelerra.org/

I've exchanged email with the author and he seems to think it's a pretty powerful implementation.

I work with Final Cut and Premiere using Mac & PC. I am on the road at the moment but I may try Cinelerra on one of my Linux boxes when I get back home.







(in reply to ExSteelAgain)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 9:49:20 PM   
bipolarber


Posts: 2792
Joined: 9/25/2004
Status: offline 		The underlying conceit here is that you are assuming there IS a "norm" of a healthy, mainstream BDSM relationship. Sorry, Sir, but having been on the board of a PEP chapter for several years, and being in the scene now for close to 25 years, I've seen the vast diversity within our ranks, and I think trying to depict a standard for "relationships" is going to meet with failure. Sure, you'll be able to write a perfectly good, romantic story about a BDSM relationship. You'll even be able to pull of the notion that BDSM is as wholesome as apple pie and Disney. But it won't be representative of the whole. It can't be. Because this standard you want to portray doesn't exist. It never did. But then, neither did the perfect nuke family, a la Ozzie and Harriet. They were a producer/script writer's imagination too. Will your film be representative of triads, or other poly relationships? Will bisexuals have any part in the story at all? How about gay and lesbian leathermen and leatherwomen? Will your film give a fair shake to "true" SM, or is it going to focus on more sensual bondage, so as not to alienate a wider audiance? If your characters are depicted as being white collar, are you saying that working class people who are in the lifestyle are less "valid?" Or vice versa? Crossdressers? Are there to be crossdressers in your storyline? Pony players? Pro Dommes?

I do agree with you that BDSM should be protrayed more fairly in the media. We're pretty much where gays were back in the 1950's. We get stuck either being the weirdos, or the heavies. Usually, in films and TV shows, we end up in the asylum, or dead. (because we somehow "deserve it") But things are changing slowly.  We are moving forward.

Good luck in your project, I wish you much success. Just don't call whatever you lens a portrayal of what "it's really like." I gaurantee that it won't be. Not for the majority. Maybe not even for a recognizable minority.

(in reply to bladedom)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 10:32:34 PM   
bladedom


Posts: 39
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Good luck in your project, I wish you much success. Just don't call whatever you lens a portrayal of what "it's really like." I gaurantee that it won't be. Not for the majority. Maybe not even for a recognizable minority.


In my 10 years or so in BDSM, I have been at a munch in a pie shop, attended a number weddings, heard of a few funerals, and seen people fall in and out of love. There, I just described the original script of 'Devoted'.

Is Woody Allen's Manhattan what it's really like for me when I visit the Big Apple? Surely not, and no one expects it to be real for anyone other than the film maker.

I am not doing the movies to tell the vanilla world we're not scary monsters. I am doing them because I want to see a movie that reflects my experiences and hope other will enjoy the portrayal. Since the movie is aimed at people already in the scene I don't need to explain every damn thing. For instance my characters will be at a munch, I doubt seriously I need exposition explaining what a munch is and if the scene is compelling you won't care.

I am re-writing 'Devoted' because the dialog needs to be better and some of the motivations of the characters were not clear, and being a movie, that needs to be rectified.

Thanks for the good wishes.




< Message edited by bladedom -- 6/26/2007 10:34:15 PM >

(in reply to bipolarber)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 10:53:36 PM   
DarkDreams123


Posts: 74
Joined: 1/25/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sapphirepleasure
What I'd really like to see is the story of a strong, intelligent woman who is unfulfilled because she has spent her life trying to live according to society's norms when at her core she truly has a slave's heart.  Perhaps this doesn't come easy to her, even the initial steps into the lifestyle, and of course there are missteps as she learns who she can trust to lead her to that place of surrender.  And though there are incredibly erotic moment, there's also inner turmoil, and friends/family who just don't get it.  But as she embraces her path, even and especially the painful parts of it, she finds that she becomes truly free for the first time in her life.  Of course it will take a loving, strong and wise Master to lead her there.


I like this story idea. I would like to add the dramatic device of their relationship being "discovered" by someone in the vanilla world who thinks it is abusive and reports them to the police. You can then use the "device" of a trial to bring out the core "beliefs" of our lifestyle: consent.

Also, bladedom, I disagree with you about not wanting to tell our story to the vanilla world. I think we need to tell our story to the vanilla world and show them that we aren't just a bunch of freaks. This is why the above story idea would work so well. It is not too removed from the vanilla world for most of the mainstream audience to be able to identify with it.

-DarkDreams

(in reply to sapphirepleasure)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/26/2007 11:52:52 PM   
sapphirepleasure


Posts: 411
Joined: 4/27/2006
From: Land of Enchantment
Status: offline 		Thank you, LadyJaye and DarkDreams for your kind acknowledgement of the story idea I offered.  It came from my heart, and of course is influenced by my own personal journey.  When I shared it and it initially seemed to be thought unsuitable by most, I questioned myself and felt embarrassed for putting it out there. 

Of course, I also enjoy films with multiple viewpoints and vignettes that are ensemble pieces but maybe my own 'vein of gold' is honestly and authentically telling a story, a journey of transformation, and I believe, if done well, it will find its audience.

< Message edited by sapphirepleasure -- 6/26/2007 11:54:48 PM >

(in reply to DarkDreams123)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/27/2007 12:20:50 AM   
bladedom


Posts: 39
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Also, bladedom, I disagree with you about not wanting to tell our story to the vanilla world.


No problem, I may not have been clear.

While mmotivation isn't to reach vanilla people with my films, I don't discount them as an eventual audience. If I reach those inside the scene, ensuring the storytelling is good and the characters as real as I can make them, then vanilla folks who do see the movies will see true portraits of the many types of people in this lifestyle.

By being true to good film making I will make that opportunity for a connection to those who are uninitiated more likely to succeed than not.



(in reply to DarkDreams123)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/27/2007 4:19:28 AM   
ExSteelAgain


Posts: 1803
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Georgia
Status: offline 		Blade, perhaps that was being snarky with you, but you did list that as a reference more or less. I also found your early comment that you could “make it happen” to be boisterous, although you have opened up down the thread and appear basically trying to get started in film. So let me explain my point and it may even protect you down the line. I am simply telling people to be careful.

I have written a text book that has done very well. (By the way, there are many published authors on these boards) I’ve also written a novel, among other fiction that has not been picked up by a major publisher to my chagrin. I have also found some of my work, vignettes, published under someone else’s name in a book of poetry. This was after I had sent some work to a fly-by night company in Colorado after chatting (okay, I cybered with her) with one of their editors online. Heh. All this, the success and otherwise has been an education.

New writers need to be very careful with their scripts and also careful getting involved with things that want them to put up money. Writers want to see their work in print/film, etc. so much that they will often agree to deals that give someone else money when in essence all that person is doing is making the writer pay for everything and making a tidy profit off the writer. The way to do it right is to find an agent who will represent you for nothing because he believes in your script. Realize finding such an agent is a long, tedious process where you will be rejected many times.

You desire to do it differently it appears and I wish you well. Sure independent films can make money and I don’t want to discourage you. Whether someone should send you a story or script is another matter. I hope if you think about it, you, too, will realize that would be a gamble for anyone. Ditto if there is any hint at investing money to see your story in print or film.

_____________________________

You can paint a cinder block bright pastel pink, but it's still a cinder block. (By Me.)

(in reply to bladedom)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/27/2007 5:45:40 AM   
bladedom


Posts: 39
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

You desire to do it differently it appears and I wish you well.


Thank you for the extended comments.

Yes, I believe Web 2.0 has changed the equation considerably and that the gatekeeprs place is lessened in the process, not eliminated.

The ability to stream full screen Flash at a very high quality means bypassing the theater or television entirely is a possibility. The economics are different if your objective is to cover costs, not make a living. Thus a $7,000 movie that makes $8,000 is a success as far as I am concerned and I have distribution possibilities available to make at least that type of scenario possible.

I know I seem to have to state it in every post, I don't want your money. I am not even hinting i want your money, or using reverse psychology to get your money, or asking for your money. I don't want your money. I already have backers thank you very much.

What I do want is collaboration and encouragement. Sapphirepleasure and others have opened up about what they'd like to see and I've encouraged them to worry less about what people with think and to write about what they feel. If you are an accomplished enough writer that your ideas are ripe for stealing you proably don't need my assistance to break into the business.

I am a Linux & Sun systems administrator, graphic designer with skills in Illustrator, Photoshop, 3D Studio Max & Lightwave. I code in PHP, Perl, Python, Jython, Java, CSS, HTML, Jsp, Ajax, 'C', Flex, manage Drupal module development, EJB creation in Eclipse, manage PayPal ecommerce implemntations, as well as edit with Premiere, After Effects, & Final Cut, score, title, and shoot video. I can adapt media for deliver from video iPod to Flash streams, to MPEG2 for televison broadcast, prep for DVD burning, and various flavors of Quicktime or Windows media.

Oh, I can score using Sonar, Fruityloops, and Gigastudio too.

In short, my take on the economics of bypassing the traditional system of media delivery is based mainly on my abilty to do everything but act out all the parts in my movies and since I am an a SAG eligible actor, I guess I can do some of that too.

But I don't want to do it alone. That's no fun.

So step up, or do it elsewhere and let us know the results. Either way we all benefit.



< Message edited by bladedom -- 6/27/2007 5:47:10 AM >

(in reply to ExSteelAgain)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/27/2007 7:20:25 AM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		Ever seen the movie "The Big Chill"?  Could be done in a similar fashion - a get together at someones place for a weekend only some of the people are into the lifestyle - i think using flashbacks on their lives would be essential.  Some people from his past and some from his present life are there and the coming together of these different facets of his life would make for some interesting dialogue and discoveries.  Even throw in a couple of vanilla people who you can show slowly develop a better understanding of thier departed frind by learning about his hidden self after his death.  So many possibilities.  i wouldn't have him die in a suicide though lol,.... that would not promote anything positive (In Big Chill the guy who died killed himself)

_____________________________

Religion is for people who are scared of hell, Spirituality is for people who have been there

(in reply to bladedom)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Telling Our Stories - 6/27/2007 1:48:17 PM   
charismagirrl


Posts: 297
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bladedom

quote:

Good luck in your project, I wish you much success. Just don't call whatever you lens a portrayal of what "it's really like." I gaurantee that it won't be. Not for the majority. Maybe not even for a recognizable minority.



Is Woody Allen's Manhattan what it's really like for me when I visit the Big Apple? Surely not, and no one expects it to be real for anyone other than the film maker.

I am not doing the movies to tell the vanilla world we're not scary monsters. I am doing them because I want to see a movie that reflects my experiences and hope other will enjoy the portrayal. Since the movie is aimed at people already in the scene I don't need to explain every damn thing. For instance my characters will be at a munch, I doubt seriously I need exposition explaining what a munch is and if the scene is compelling you won't care.

Thanks for the good wishes.



Although i do agree with bipolarber as far as NORM goes i agree with you that it doesn't have to fit EACH and EVERY possible type. No movie can do that.

But a few varying stories could be told, and that would all depend on the author(s) of the story(ies) if the idea of the vingettes were to fly.

i am more awake now than i was yesterday when i mentioned Pulp Fiction but there is also Four Rooms and recently Grindhouse as well as others that have not even just different writers but also different directors for different parts of the story (on a whole). Each bringing their own personal vision to it.

What i see as a Daddy's girl slave is, i'm sure, vastly different than what someone in the leather community would see or even for another Daddy's girl. So the idea of doing a few variences is great but the idea of trying to show every possibility would make for such a long picture that no one would want to see it, or it would mean that everything was merely touched on and nothing more. (which would be pointless)


_____________________________

For today i won't say but...
For today i wont say just...
For today i will simply obey....
For today i will trust that You are right...
For always i will be your imperfect slave

http://www.mycollarspace.com

(in reply to bladedom)
Profile   Post #: 73
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