RE: .limits.

RE: .limits. (Full Version)

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LuckyAlbatross -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 2:24:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jauntyone My answer was not so different; only in words. Yet, you feel the need to bring up the same argument that is always brought up when the questions of limits is expressed. It is a shame; I had always thought you above that. But that doesn't answer it. Which is why I and so many others continue to bring it up- it's relevant and valid. Unless you are going to preface your "I have no limits" line with "Excluding general life context limits which most people agree upon" or something like that...then you will continue to have to face that afterwards. My limits have nothing to do with kinky stuff, or sex stuff, or masterly stuff- they simply are limits.

santalia -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 2:26:43 PM)
Greetings For me, there is no such thing as a "soft" limit. i have limits, but they are hard limits and for specific reasons which my Owner agrees they are important to retain. i do not include things in my list such as those unable to give consent for (i'm certain you know what i'm referring to...) because they're the ones that i think should be limits for all and therefore negates them from even being possibilities. What i have as limits are things that would harm me mentally or emotionally if they were done to me. i know my Master would never do anything to harm me physically (though He may leave some delicious marks on me...of course i don't consider those to be harming....smiles) so i don't have any limits for things that might harm me physically. Well wishes -santalia{JR}

MzMia -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 2:41:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross For me there's "limits" and "room for negotiation" My limits are based on ME- not who I am with or the situation. With a particular person, I might decide not to negotiate on some things or not allow certain things. That doesn't mean they are limits OF MINE, simply that the room for negotiation with that person at that time is zero. I think that keeps things simple. LA describes dead on how I feel about my limits. My limits are to the bone, and involve my personal morals and values. I also respect submissives that tell me UP front what their hard limits are, and I admire them for having the moral turpitude to actually HAVE limits. I know I am in the minority on this, but some of us have hard limits and seek someone that has the same hard limits as we do. A submissive that has no or very limited limits is not the submissive for me. Again, I know this might sound strange, but the submissives that I give a second glance to are ONLY the ones that have the same hard limits as I do. Also, I never disclose what my hard limits are prior to hearing their's first, that way they can't lie to agree with me. [;)] I love this because it damn near clears the playing field for me, but the few that are left--> are the ones I consider.

MasterFireMaam -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 2:44:37 PM)
A limit is a limit...until it is not a limit. In the end, it's the "bottom" who has to decide when this it true. To FORCE someone to cross a limit without prior consent can be akin to rape, in my mind. Sometimes, it's ok and the person comes out with a positive experience....sometimes not. I'm not willing to risk, as the facillitator, the 'sometimes not' without prior negotiation. As the experiencer, I damned well better have given consent to cross that limit...and whatever guidance I give/gave had better be heard in dealing with it. Master Fire

Najakcharmer -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 2:52:45 PM)
That depends. If someone says, "Sushi is a hard limit for me because I think raw fish is icky and slimy," I might push that limit, and also pay close attention to their use of the term "hard limit" in the future since I don't think we have quite the same definition. If someone cites childhood abuse, severe deep rooted phobia, a clinical or medical condition or something else along those lines, and discusses potentially problematic triggers that they consider hard limits in consensual D/s scenes, that I respect.

Rover -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 2:54:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross quote: ORIGINAL: jauntyone My answer was not so different; only in words. Yet, you feel the need to bring up the same argument that is always brought up when the questions of limits is expressed. It is a shame; I had always thought you above that. But that doesn't answer it. Which is why I and so many others continue to bring it up- it's relevant and valid. Unless you are going to preface your "I have no limits" line with "Excluding general life context limits which most people agree upon" or something like that...then you will continue to have to face that afterwards. My limits have nothing to do with kinky stuff, or sex stuff, or masterly stuff- they simply are limits. Similarly, I find myself feeling responsible to respond when I see the illogical "no limits" statements. Every mentally healthy individual has limits... Dominants, submissives, slaves... and they are not dependent upon anyone else... they're inherent to each of us as a human being. John

Grlwithboy -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 3:03:30 PM)
I think we fight about jargon a lot. I like to think in specifics - what is this person capable of doing/incapable of doing? What is this person's value system and what of that is acceptable to challenge/going to make him or her melt down if it's challenged? What are you willing to do for Person You Love Most versus Joe Blow. What shared moral absolutes might we both not even have to think twice about?

LadyMaraSedai -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 3:04:16 PM)
Very well said. Sir. Thank you for sharing. I couldn't agree more.

RCdc -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 3:04:17 PM)
melissa - I hope you don't mind me asking a couple of questions? - and if you don't wish to respond, that's cool. If you are no limits then does your Master have limits? And does your no limits include non consent of another/others? Peace the.dark.

RCdc -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 3:05:41 PM)
erin - ya know I am sent to try you.... [;)] my biggest sorries ever.... Peace the.dark.

Missokyst -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 3:35:55 PM)
Damn that sounded hot. How was it? I have always fantasized about if that was possible. Side to side, not a biggie. But through.. whoooooooooha. Dish! Kyst quote: ORIGINAL: ELUSIVE1 Saturday I had a syringe stuck down straight through each nipple...not sideways like a nipple ring, straight down through...

Domspaintoy -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 3:42:20 PM)
As i was reminded by Master today i dont have any limits so its not an issue for U/us. [;)] dpt.

sambamanslilgirl -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 4:24:07 PM)
for us (and i speak for Daddy when i say this) there's no middle ground when it comes to limits. we don't have hard or soft ones ...merely ones we both (and they're same) wouldn't consider doing because it's not for us and/or we have no interest in trying.

adoracat -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 4:41:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rover Similarly, I find myself feeling responsible to respond when I see the illogical "no limits" statements. Every mentally healthy individual has limits... Dominants, submissives, slaves... and they are not dependent upon anyone else... they're inherent to each of us as a human being. John i can see i would frustrate the hell out of you then. smiles i have limits, obviously. can i list them when asked? no. i cant access my brain like that. if you asked me if something was a limit, or brought up an idea? yes, i can get around the brain in that fashion, and be able to answer. same thing when Sir asks me "ok what would you like?" i cant answer. if he says "do you want this?" i can. kitten, who has said she was difficult but sometimes it takes a while to see exactly how difficult.

Rover -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 4:46:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: adoracat i can see i would frustrate the hell out of you then. smiles I save my frustration for the golf course. :) John

adoracat -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 4:57:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rover quote: ORIGINAL: adoracat i can see i would frustrate the hell out of you then. smiles I save my frustration for the golf course. :) John which is why its a darn good thing Sir has patience with his slave. ;) kitten, who is entirely able to laugh at herself.

LadyHeart -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 5:27:46 PM)
Since it was my words that inspired this thread, here's my contribution: The Readers Digest Version: A limit is something I do not have a submissive's consent to do. Couldn't get much simpler than that. Here's the fuller explanation. I do not play word games. A so-called "soft" limit is not a limit, it's a strong preference. My process of determining which is which goes like this. When I start working with a new submissive, I go through their limits list one item at a time. Let's say they have "electrical play" on their list. We talk about it. If it's on their list because they have never tried it and they are terrified of electricity, OK - that goes on the Preference list. We won't go there at the moment. We might tackle it gradually, one step at a time, with due negotiation at some point, but for now, we won't go there. But if it was on their list because they have a pacemaker - then it's a Limit. Period. (I am curious to see that many of those who posted about "soft" limits are submissives. Frankly, I think that having these sorts of woolly definitions can lead to trouble. It's as though they aren't game enough to say, I REALLY don't like this but if you push me I might. It's not fair on a Dominant to place them in a Catch 22 like that - if it turns out they do like it after all, then all is well, but if it turns pear shaped, the Dominant is the villain. I would like to see the words "soft limits" consigned to the bin, but that's me. ) From time to time we review their lists together. They are not set in concrete. But if I don't want to lose their trust, I would be a fool to push anything on their Limits list. I like to think that I am not a fool... :)) LH

jauntyone -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 6:19:36 PM)
Greetings LuckyAlbatross General life limitations? The concept looks good on paper or in type, but, let us be honest; people are so different that their moral and ethical ‘life limitations’ will vary a great deal. I am a trained killer. I am ordered to kill; I kill. That is my job; my profession. What’s more, I feel no remorse when the body hit’s the ground. For many; I am the kind of person who most would warn away from. The ‘General life Limitations’ that most live by, I do not have the luxury of subscribing to. I have my own morals and my own ethics that I do live by; without reservation; and without regret. The rules that I have placed on myself are my own; and I adhere to them strongly. Yet, when it comes to experiencing ALL that life has to offer; I do not, and will not limit myself. I refuse to box myself in and say ‘I will not do that because it’s dangerous, or because I might hurt another by my actions’. Now, If you choose to believe that I would physically harm another just for the fun of it; then by all means, I will not try to dissuade you of such thoughts. Either way, I stand by my words. I have no limits because I refuse to limit myself in what I may experience in life. Greetings Darcyandthedark Yes, Master does have some limits to what he will and will not do with me. However, his limits are not my own. Limits are personal boundaries; there is no magic potion that is given that will suddenly say ‘ my limits are your limits”. Master may decide what I can and can not do; but that does not mean that he has the ability ‘change’ those things that I want from life. As for the non consent of another or others. I will be honest. If you are referring only to my slavery, then no, I would never impose my own boundaries on another. If you are referring to life in itself; then this is something that I have no control over. I wish you both well melissa

goodgirl85 -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 6:42:17 PM)
Isn't that what half this lifestyle is about really? Pushing limits, and exploring new terrority. I have never experienced "figging" before. In a chat room, when I "volunteered" myself to Dom a few months ago for a "figginf scene" -- and trust me it was all in the joking around attitude-- he replied that he had never seen/heard a sub actually volunteer for it. I recently just asked my Dom if it would be something that he is interested in trying. I have never tried it. I may not like it. It may become a hard limit for me. But how will I know what i can and can not handle if I don't try to push my limits. Slapping me in the face used to be a limit for me.... now I love it. (Dont ask how it happened, it was in the middle of the punishment scene) The same with choking. I used to be only lightly... now I like it sometimes until I am on the verge of passing out. You grow by pushing limits-- both vanilla and kink. Hard limits can in fact become something you find yourself wondering about someday and wanting to try it and end up loving it. PUshing limits is how you grow... if you aren't going to grow then whats the point of faking it?

sublimelysensual -> RE: .limits. (6/29/2007 6:51:05 PM)
When I was first starting out, I did use the concept of hard & soft..since I've experienced more, I no longer use soft. If something is a limit for me, it's a limit, period. If someone were to ignore one of my limits, and do something by surprise, I would be done with that person. I'm always very open about what I enjoy and don't enjoy, and anything I may be fearful about, but if something isn't going against my morals and values (which is where my hard limits lay), I'm up for it. As for the "no limit" thing..just because something is so obvious you don't think it needs to be stated, doesn't negate the fact that it's a limit for you. Example..hoping the mods don't bite considering the context, necrophilia..yes, you would think that could be left unsaid..but guess what..the term came from somewhere and not from people NOT doing it, lol. Now, I would never knowingly involve myself with someone into something like that, but, it's still a limit. Just my two cents, as always... -a

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