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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 2:57:49 PM   
seeksfemslave


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
And no matter how big the Universe is wouldn't it have to "end" at some point?
And what would there be at the "end" of the Universe?
Some good answers in here thanks.


This question, and the fact that it would probably have to "begin" as well is a  mind bender that arrogant scientists splutter and cough  when asked about and acolytes ie dimwit followers, think scientists have "solved".
Nothing could be further from the truth, but science is rational isn't it. It must be because it believes itself to be NO?

To forestall the obvious responses: just because the scientific method can be seen to be logical and successful in solving the relatively simple problems dont get carried away and believe that scientists wont succumb to prestige and general purpose bullshit when considering the really difficult problems.

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 7/8/2007 3:02:26 PM >

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 2:58:25 PM   
Raechard


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Status: offline 		Beyond the universe is the void are we measuring the universe or the nothing? The nothing is 0m^3.

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 2:59:58 PM   
kiyari


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

the teeth that bite;
the claws that catch;
beware the frumious bandersnatch.

That is all.



Damn! Jabberwocky love...

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 3:02:58 PM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

There are many quantum singularities in the universe all pulling in different directions some will balance one another but others will absorb more mass and so become stronger. They call a quantum singularity a black hole because not even light can escape its pull and we all know how fast that travels. In the end the universe will stop expanding maybe and there will be a big crush I’m told. This will result in one solid chunk of everything which can then explode again to repeat the cyclic universe. I’ll be dead then so it doesn’t matter but I may be born again a thousand times if the same explosion occurs and the same events repeat exactly. Pause for thoughts…


This is the central question, if you can follow, does God play dice?  Yes, I believe he does, and the reconciliation is that in the fullness of time, he can play all variations of the game, that means that whatever the science tells you is within your scope of understanding and belief and that the universe will one day fall in on itself regardless of our science, and god will shake the dice anew.





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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 3:03:28 PM   
kiyari


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

LOL, the equivalence principle, no matter is created or destroyed, perhaps the quantum foam is what is given by the asshole of a black hole, but it probably slaughters more trees in the end by you writing on this screen than to hack down a birch and write the papyrus outright.


but cute,

Ron



Outed! *grins*

<http://www.lumber-cartel.com/trees.html>

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 3:05:09 PM   
kiyari


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

the universe begins for you when you are born, and ends for you when you die......think beetlejuice, the rest is wanton desire.

BetelGeuse



If a tree falls....

aah

Edited to add: Ya got some problem with Wanton Desire???

< Message edited by kiyari -- 7/8/2007 3:06:05 PM >

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 3:14:57 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		If it is not for me, it is only inertia, and there are equations for that--------

Kyrie Eleison
Down the road that I must travel
Kyrie Eleison
Through the darkness of the night
Kyrie Eleison
Where I'm going will you follow
Kyrie Eleison
On a highway in the light

but you blew it off the first time, and I don't see why you would pick up this yoke now.





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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 3:19:11 PM   
kiyari


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

If it is not for me, it is only inertia, and there are equations for that--------

Kyrie Eleison
Down the road that I must travel
Kyrie Eleison
Through the darkness of the night
Kyrie Eleison
Where I'm going will you follow
Kyrie Eleison
On a highway in the light

but you blew it off the first time, and I don't see why you would pick up this yoke now.



...guess I missed the "yoke" first time around...

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 3:22:21 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		if a tree falls------------

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 4:23:46 PM   
CuriousLord


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

I can live without them, but that is too simple given the premise of the OP. Which is where I am trying to throw my bales.

Ron



Uhhhhhhhhhh.......and anti-gravity has very little to do with this, health science teacher.We are fairly sure that what gets sucked in is not annihilated, we just don't know where the fuck it goes............one more reason that we have to believe that is that the universe appears to be expanding, not sucked in on its own weight.


I think you're a little confused.. Are you trying to play stupid as a joke, or.. do you mean this.. or.. ?

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 4:40:01 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		No, I mean it.  There isn't enough gravity is not what we are looking for here, and a bullshit answer on your behalf in any case, where do the matter sucked in go than, G?

Let's give the dog a walk.

if you were a HIGHSCHOOL science teacher-----  ain't that how this started out?

How do you explain the vastness of the universe and how you kinda hang out in it, dude...........

but do explain this for me in terms of anti-gravity, when for these what 13-17 year olds you haven't explained gravity beyond Isaac Newton and the apple (which is only an illustration and could never have happened) but have only explained the simplistic laws of physical nature. 

If indeed you are a science teacher, you know that my model is terribly fucked, but it is a model that will be sufficient and answer at the necessary for non-scientific endeavor.

But, you must be aware, that if there are not more dimensions than we can explain right now, that gravity (and fuck anti-gravity) is not something that you will do well explaining............it should be at this point left at sucked in this hole and reconstituted in another............

And don't fuck with me too much, and come up with this off-hand incredulity like you know something obvious, brad pitt, 'cause you don' impress me much.

alright as edit, that was rather harsh, why don't you explain gravity and anti-gravity and how that works in a black hole and I will flip the fuck out when I think you are beyond your means.


< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/8/2007 4:42:28 PM >

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 4:57:53 PM   
CuriousLord


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Status: offline 		Your preception of my position is "terribly fucked".. your model and.. train of thought.. are.. I still think you're joking. I'm not trying to be rude or condescending here, but you're typing in such a manner that I have difficulty even trying to get what you mean. "Let's give the dog a walk?" "ain't that how this started out?" (Was this asking if I was a highschool teacher first?) "you kinda hang out in it, dude....." I don't get what you're trying to say in these things.

Still, you asked a couple of questions, so let's address those.

"How do you explain the vastness of the unverse and how you kinda hang out in it, dude......"

I posted before about how I'd explain it. Still, I don't think it's vital for someone to understand the vastness of the universe. I doubt anyone really -does- understand it in any meaningful way. We simply refer to it.

You keep talking about "anti-gravity", btw. I'm not sure where you got this from. I never mentioned such a thing.

"where do the matter sucked in go than, G?"

The matter sucked into a blackhole? It's.. still there.. it doesn't go anywhere. Now I get Einstein and.. what's his name, "Boise"? (I'm horrid with names).. did this thing with a space grid manafold curving into itself, making it something more than a relatively simplistic shape.. and that this was where blackhole theory came from, if memory serves. Still, that's a dated idea. It's good for science fiction, but not too much more.

A valid question might be, "What is the fate of the information sent into a blackhole?".

Also, I call myself a "Science teacher", as opposed to "Science professor", as, while I do teach at the university level, I hold no such formal degrees in Education nor do I carry a high rank in such a teaching position. I consider it a part-time job.

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 4:58:31 PM   
LeMis


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quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nah, fuck that line of reasoning, a black hole---first question, why don't it swallow the universe up doc?


Not enough gravity.

Plus they evaporate 'n such due anti-matter reactions in the vacuum. (There are more complex answers, but I suppose you wanted a simplier one.)


Damn!
I was gonna say that 

P.S.  I am not a science teacher, but I do help educate the minds of tomorrow...  hehehe   


< Message edited by LeMis -- 7/8/2007 5:01:57 PM >

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 4:59:57 PM   
bipolarber


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Status: offline 		Interesting question, and one that I doubt anyone has a simple answer to. Myself, if I were teaching your hypothetical class, I would take it in steps. First, I'd try to give them some scale of the solar system. I'd put various scaled pins into a circle of foam, about the size of a dinner plate...
   "Okay, this represents our solar system. It's approcimately nine light hours across, not counting the Oort Cloud at the outer fringes. Imagine about three inches beyond this a tiny dot that represents Voyager II, the fastest moving man-made object. It was sent on a mission to Jupiter starting in the year 1978, about a year after Star Wars first came out, and Jimmy Carter was still in office. At this scale, the next solar system you might encounter would be Proxima Centuri, 4.3 light years away... that would make it about the same diastance here as New York to to LA."

   Next, I'd replace the circle of foam with a smaller block, with only two pins in it, about six inches apart.

    "This is our sun, and Proxima Centuri. At this scale, the center of the Milky Way, our home galaxy, would be about 50 miles away. (Insert the name of an appropriate city near you)"

Then, I'd replace the foam blocks with one of those large, swirled looking toy balls you can get from Wal Mart. On it, using a Sharpie pen, I'd place randomly little "@" symbols representing about 30 galaxies.

    This would represent the "local group" of galaxies. There are about 30 of them, and the distance to them is varied, but they are all flying away from each other as space itself is expanding. So fast, that astronomers can actually measure the "red shift" in their light as they do so.

Beyond this, we deal in specualtion. Thanks to dark feild astronomy (pointing telescopes into areas of space where there are no visible stars, and taking extremely long exposures) We know there seem to be BILLIONS of galaxies out there, each localized group of galaxies (like our own local group of about 30) would be represented by a single grain of salt. Now, salt the parking lot of the local mall on a snowy day... and you've got an inkling of the scale of the known universes.

Problem is, we don't know if this is the only one.

If you have access to a copy of "Cosmos" the old Carl Sagan series on PBS, you could play the first half of episode #1, where Carl takes us through a half hour long explanation of this very topic. The boxed set is about $100, and worth every penny, even if a few of the episodes are beginning to date themselves... (mostly because we've found out so much more about the outer soloar system in the last 25 years.)

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 5:00:42 PM   
CuriousLord


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

alright as edit, that was rather harsh, why don't you explain gravity and anti-gravity and how that works in a black hole and I will flip the fuck out when I think you are beyond your means.


I sort of doubt I'll ever have to be beyond my means when it comes to Science on this board.. feel free to ask away..

..but what do you want to know about gravity? In the most basic sense, a blackhole sucks stuff in with gravity.. mass is attracted in.. and can't escape. Again, evaporation is Hawking's pet project on a contradiction to this. I'd explain it if you're interested.

Or are you asking me how gravity works..?


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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 5:01:45 PM   
CuriousLord


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LeMis

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nah, fuck that line of reasoning, a black hole---first question, why don't it swallow the universe up doc?


Not enough gravity.

Plus they evaporate 'n such due anti-matter reactions in the vacuum. (There are more complex answers, but I suppose you wanted a simplier one.)


Damn!
I was gonna say that


Lol. I'm kinda surprised he had to ask. Was he trying to look for some grand philosophical reason or something and I'm missing the question..?

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 5:24:41 PM   
velvetears


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Status: offline 		Wasn't the universe at one time expanding and now it is shrinking (there's a scientific word for it i am sure)?

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 5:34:03 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		piss, boot, concept, means, direction and ability--
[quote}
Plus they evaporate 'n such due anti-matter reactions in the vacuum. (There are more complex answers, but I suppose you wanted a simplier one.)
[/quote}

you said it and are now dismissed, your services are no longer required.

Grab a parting gift  on your way out the door.



< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/8/2007 5:35:29 PM >

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 5:40:49 PM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

Wasn't the universe at one time expanding and now it is shrinking (there's a scientific word for it i am sure)?


this has been bandied about alot, and at present  the consensus is it is expanding ever since einstein which is a small matter of the time the universe has stood, but a pretty good guess based on empirical evidence

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RE: If you were a Science Teacher.... - 7/8/2007 5:44:38 PM   
Lordandmaster


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Status: offline 		Nope, it's still expanding.  Maybe the term you're looking for is the "redshift"?

This is a really good site, in plain English, maintained by the UCLA astrophysicist Ned Wright:

http://www.astro.ucla.edu/~wright/cosmology_faq.html#z

quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

Wasn't the universe at one time expanding and now it is shrinking (there's a scientific word for it i am sure)?

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