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RE: michael vick indicted - 7/18/2007 6:05:36 PM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

I wonder what other big NFL names will fall out of this. This has the potential to be big and ugly. Portis? Remember how he ran to Vick's aid.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 41

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/18/2007 11:47:33 PM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyLadyPamela

quote:

God help the guy I catch abusing dogs,or any animal.
--Owner59....

This creetan, Mike Vic.. is so guilty.. you dont have this much evidence around you without being connected.. I am sure he is guilty.. sure.. I have been following this for along time.. and there are a few more sick bastards in the nba.. nfl...   who are under suspicion.. god help us..

I hope they nail him..nail him good. he makes too much money to be doing this... .. and then doing this takes a certain type of monster.. how can you sit there and watch this take place.. I think the dateline and 20/20 should do a special on the dog fighting events.. write them...

if more people really new what this involves it would sickened the hardest of folks.. how about the live bait dogs... the ones that are gotten fraudulently ..with girlfriends or paid crack heads to show up with kids..boat loads of money and act like they want to take dogs home.. or the ones that steal them ...( these are YOUR loving doggies.. mr. sit on your lap never bit anyone dogs) they are used as live bait dogs.... picture you baby.. thrown in a pit..terrified by the noise and just horrible goings on..the pit will rip them to shreads.. near death..    then there may be a few more breaths left..they use it again for another dog..    sometimes they cant move and are thrown to the side.. they will die...

sometimes they are big...or even will defend themselves a bit.. so they rip out their teeth..or poke out their eyes..or burn them.. they oh yeah sometimes break the rotties legs..or tape their mouths.. live bait dogs ... sometimes to sleep in a cage till the next mornings trial...

then there are the cats.. and racoons.. they are in cages placed over the dogs .. ..or worse turpintine..yes burning turpintine on corn cobs.. placed in their rectums.. so they screetch and whirl around..giving the fighting dogs a chance to get "rialed" .. the looser dogs thrown or winning dog.. half starved...

I one undercover had one of these pimp mother fuckers.. tell me the dogs need it..they like it.. I went behind a truck and puked, becuase I wanted to kill HIM...

then lets talk about the graduate other program of fighting animals for sport.. how about those darling little loving pigs....... the pot belly and such as hogs.. they throw them ... altered of course in their with a few dogs.. ripped them to shreds.. then when the dogs cant finish them off... they all jump in the pit and kick and yell.. and I am not sure what..beat the hog to death..or close..

oh yes, the new thing is now these Mike Vic wonder boys are going to suburban dog parks..where mr. and mrs. vanilla are enjoying normal pet ownership... the thugs.. letting their baby pit fighters go..   to see if they attack.. most dogs in the park will not be shredded.. but there is blood, stiches and other things that the guys can say oooh sorry...    but they see the pits that have the aggressive personality traits they want..

This disturbs me on so many levels.. once something I was trying to prevent.. I get so emotional about this topic.. it is a complex topic.. him..race..athlete.... money and just a whole list of issues.. but the actual activity and the level of "cruelty" is very scary.. very.. mostly men do this..and to be able to enjoy this ..dear god help us..

And me too Owner 59... god help the man I see doing this too... I will go get a few rather brave friends at visit later that night and lets just say do what is neccy... ...

This horrifys me, some people are saying no big deal its just dogs...

My dog(see my profile for pix) was used as a bait dog,before I got him.
As a puppy,he was stolen from the pound in Passaic NJ,by thugs,who abused him in this most horrible way.He was found a couple weeks later in the gutter,catatonic and near death.Un fed,not watered ,biten and torn up,on every limb,his head ,forget it.Poor thing.

He couldn`t walk for weeks,and they thought he would have to be put down.But he recovered and I got him.When I got him home,I noticed the scares ,marks and old wounds and scabs,everywhere on his body.I was un aware of what had happened,at that point.

I called the woman who I got him from and got the whole sad story.How the pound loses a few dogs a week,to these devils,and can`t seem to stop them.I ended up volunteering my time to secure the building.That was ten years ago,not sure what`s going on in Passaic now.

From adopting a dog recently,I`ve learned that you are scrutinized a lot and checked out,before you get a dog.I think that`s the same at most animal shelters.That`s because of all of this,I`m guessing,it makes sense.

Buster, is one of the best dogs I`ve ever had.He rarely barks,I mean it!He`s a perfect gentleman and trained up real easy.Loves people and dogs,and never tests other dogs.He`s as smart a dog as they come,and endears himself to people.He`s always welcome at friend`s,and my neighbors love him.

Sadly,the injuries he received and healed from(so I thought)
have come back to haunt him w/ a spinal problem.The vet says he`ll be cool,if I give him joint supplements and limit his activity.He has no idea why I leave him home so often now.He used to be w/ me 24/7.

World wide,dogs get abused and used and skinned alive for fun and profit.You can`t think about it ,w/ out crying or screaming.

Peace

(in reply to BossyLadyPamela)

Post #: 42

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 2:12:19 AM

JackHammer2000

Posts: 148
Joined: 3/29/2006
From: southern california
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I wonder what other big NFL names will fall out of this. This has the potential to be big and ugly. Portis? Remember how he ran to Vick's aid.

I gleaned the following "big names" from ths article: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/05/29/vick0604/index.html

...videos by rappers such as DMX and Jay-Z pay homage to the sport...

"There exists a dogfighting subculture in the NFL and NBA," says Wayne Pacelle, president of the HSUS. "And to have an athlete of [Vick's] stature charged would be an enormous wake-up call to everyone in professional sports who has dabbled in or dived into the underworld of dogfighting."

...comments made by Washington Redskins running back Clinton Portis, who excused dogfighting in an interview with Norfolk TV station WAVY. "It's [Vick's] property; it's his dogs. If that's what he wants to do, do it," Portis said. He added that if Vick were convicted of dogfighting, he would be "behind bars for no reason."

...former NFL running back LeShon Johnson, who pleaded guilty in 2005 to dogfighting in a case in which more than 200 dogs were seized and 20 people convicted. (Johnson received a five-year deferred sentence.) ...Johnson, a 1994 draft pick out of Northern Illinois who played five seasons for three NFL teams, figured (prominently) in the dogfighting world. Johnson is one of a handful of athletes who have faced charges for dogfighting or spoken openly of their links to the practice.

Former NBA player Qyntel Woods was accused in 2004 of staging fights at his home outside Portland and pleaded guilty to first-degree animal abuse.

Former Dallas Cowboy Nate Newton was arrested at a fight in Texas in 1991. (Charges were later dropped.)

Former boxer Gerald McClellan would watch tapes of dogs fighting before his own bouts and admitted putting his dog into fights.

And former NFL player Tyrone Wheatley praised the spirit of fighting dogs in SI in 2001. But for all those identified, scores of others go unnamed, according to animal control officials and pro athletes interviewed by SI.

Two weeks ago John Goodwin, the HSUS's animal fighting expert, received a tip that a former NBA player ran a fighting ring in Virginia not far from Vick's property. "We hear about athletes all the time," Goodwin says.

Or, as the Pro Bowl running back put it, "Sometimes you just want to see how tough a dog you got."

< Message edited by JackHammer2000 -- 7/19/2007 2:23:10 AM >

_____________________________

"Democracy must be something more than two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner."
-- James Bovard, Source: Lost Rights. The Destruction of American Liberty (St. Martin's Press: New York, 1994), p. 333

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 43

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 8:37:56 AM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

God help the guy I catch abusing dogs, or any animal.

~nod~
I'd prefer if He stayed out of it, though.
I'm probably headed downstairs anyway.
Why spoil my fun?

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to Owner59)

Post #: 44

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 8:45:06 AM

BossyLadyPamela

Posts: 62
Joined: 5/28/2007
Status: offline

I have to write/post about this again.. I spent a few months several years ago..volunteering against this horror.. I found myself stunned and unable to move forward as the darkness..evil darkness took over me.. my joy and rather uplifting human spirit was bruised.. I sat there volunteering with letter writing.. scheduling... making endless phone calls.. investigation.. administration .. during all this I was learning about what really goes on with this entire sport--(I would never call it an actual sport)....... gambling sport....At that time I was not aware there could be so much horror in something so wide spread... commonly brushed under the rug.. I do see this changing thank god...

I am not sure where this horror begins and ends anymore. I dont understand how a man/ person can even see this let alone..... enjoy it.. but lets say regular folks.. one Thursday night you just happen to stumble on it ( a dog fight) being there by association. .. every person I know could not enjoy it.. they may not have the severe reaction that I have...but this is cruelty..... to go behind the scenes is monstrous.. ... evil..pure evil.. just look at any dogs eyes.. any........ there is a soul there.. like you said owner59.. one cant think about this without crying...

I was so disturbed back then I had to get out of it..leave it for wonderful magical people who were cut out to handle this..it filled me up with too much dark and I could not move.. not being any good really to those who needed me.. my inner circle...my dog... my princess needed me.. so I adjusted and stayed away from the guts of being involved........... when ever the word or association of any dog fighting is mentioned or hinted at...I go to that place...get very disturbed.. it hurts me to the core..

I dont know how a person can be void of not feeling the right and wrong of animal cruelty...

That is why as I age, I pull back and find peace in doing only what I can..I cant save the world.. I realize I can only do my part at a realistic pace.. ....... even if you are not an animal lover.. how can you get excited or feel good to see an animal in torture..

I duno.. I close my post here with the complexity of this dog fighting Mike Vick situation..so many parts of this...where do we start..... We cant change him or those like him..if a man can be involved with this and not feel any compassion, he is void of it.. compassion is not taught I dont think.... even if he goes to prison there is ties there that spill deeply into the betting of it.. just google pit bull kennels.... they are so careful with their wording to keep from being prosecuted, but they go right to the edge.. anyone in the rings knows the key words.. it is right out there in your face.. just google pit bull kennels.. dear god, look at them and think of dog fighting..

I am always open to see a situation with a dog..that doesnt look right..... I stumble on it.. the dog is in the back yard..or front clearly not being fed. or just severely neglected... it gets complicated to just go up and knock on the door.. but every time I am faced with this I embrace these words... (I may not have the exact quote) Evil can flourish if good people do nothing.... so I try and do something as if maybe I am the only one that will... I can say when I am very old.. I tried..

I hate the cruelty in men who think this is no big deal.. I am deeply disturbed once again.. I am going to go walk my dog at the park.. and people watch.... maybe find a few animal lover submissive........ wink wink...

kindred spirit hug to those who are out here who feel this with me... I write now and then to my congressmen.. (I know lot of help that does....) but I try and let them know I feel strongly about animal cruelty... and will not re-elect if they are soft on it.. once again.. I know one person .... but still I do it.

< Message edited by BossyLadyPamela -- 7/19/2007 8:52:39 AM >

(in reply to JackHammer2000)

Post #: 45

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 9:32:30 AM

Aswad

Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: maybemaybenot

I think the max on these charges is 6 years, so yeah, I would be OK, but not happy with 4 years if he turned over some names.

Indeed. Taking down one person does little good. Rolling up a league might be good, though.

quote:

Provided, of course, he is found guilty.

Important point that is all too often overlooked.

Though, I would say the right wording is "is guilty", not "is found guilty".
As demonstrated again and again, the two are not the same.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 46

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:01:31 PM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BossyLadyPamela

I have to write/post about this again.. I spent a few months several years ago..volunteering against this horror.. I found myself stunned and unable to move forward as the darkness..evil darkness took over me.. my joy and rather uplifting human spirit was bruised.. I sat there volunteering with letter writing.. scheduling... making endless phone calls.. investigation.. administration .. during all this I was learning about what really goes on with this entire sport--(I would never call it an actual sport)....... gambling sport....At that time I was not aware there could be so much horror in something so wide spread... commonly brushed under the rug.. I do see this changing thank god...

I am not sure where this horror begins and ends anymore. I dont understand how a man/ person can even see this let alone..... enjoy it.. but lets say regular folks.. one Thursday night you just happen to stumble on it ( a dog fight) being there by association. .. every person I know could not enjoy it.. they may not have the severe reaction that I have...but this is cruelty..... to go behind the scenes is monstrous.. ... evil..pure evil.. just look at any dogs eyes.. any........ there is a soul there.. like you said owner59.. one cant think about this without crying...

I was so disturbed back then I had to get out of it..leave it for wonderful magical people who were cut out to handle this..it filled me up with too much dark and I could not move.. not being any good really to those who needed me.. my inner circle...my dog... my princess needed me.. so I adjusted and stayed away from the guts of being involved........... when ever the word or association of any dog fighting is mentioned or hinted at...I go to that place...get very disturbed.. it hurts me to the core..

I dont know how a person can be void of not feeling the right and wrong of animal cruelty...

That is why as I age, I pull back and find peace in doing only what I can..I cant save the world.. I realize I can only do my part at a realistic pace.. ....... even if you are not an animal lover.. how can you get excited or feel good to see an animal in torture..

I duno.. I close my post here with the complexity of this dog fighting Mike Vick situation..so many parts of this...where do we start..... We cant change him or those like him..if a man can be involved with this and not feel any compassion, he is void of it.. compassion is not taught I dont think.... even if he goes to prison there is ties there that spill deeply into the betting of it.. just google pit bull kennels.... they are so careful with their wording to keep from being prosecuted, but they go right to the edge.. anyone in the rings knows the key words.. it is right out there in your face.. just google pit bull kennels.. dear god, look at them and think of dog fighting..

I am always open to see a situation with a dog..that doesnt look right..... I stumble on it.. the dog is in the back yard..or front clearly not being fed. or just severely neglected... it gets complicated to just go up and knock on the door.. but every time I am faced with this I embrace these words... (I may not have the exact quote) Evil can flourish if good people do nothing.... so I try and do something as if maybe I am the only one that will... I can say when I am very old.. I tried..

I hate the cruelty in men who think this is no big deal.. I am deeply disturbed once again.. I am going to go walk my dog at the park.. and people watch.... maybe find a few animal lover submissive........ wink wink...

kindred spirit hug to those who are out here who feel this with me... I write now and then to my congressmen.. (I know lot of help that does....) but I try and let them know I feel strongly about animal cruelty... and will not re-elect if they are soft on it.. once again.. I know one person .... but still I do it.

Wow, that`s heavy.You suffered a quick burnout and were smart enough to step back from the fray.You were brave to even wade in and try.Thanx Pamela.

You gotta hand it to those people who do the work,paid or volunteer.My favorite person on TV,outside of Steven Colbert,is that pretty blond ASPCA officer,on AnimalCops.mmmmmm(I`m bad,lol)

There is a river of drowning dogs drifting by(figuratively)and a lot of abuse and neglect.There is only so much one person can do.We can`t save every one floating by,but we can save one,or two,and maybe let other people know what`s happening.I settle my mind by saying that I`ll do,as much as I can do,but not feel guilty about the dogs I can`t help.

Evil can flourish if good people do nothing....

Truer than ever....

Peace

(in reply to BossyLadyPamela)

Post #: 47

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:12:43 PM

maybemaybenot

Posts: 2817
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline

It may be getting a little darker in Michael Vicks world. I was talking to my former D's mom, who lives in Virginia a short while ago, and she told me that in Va., he could be sentenced to 1-5 years for each dog killed in his presence and the one he killed himself. < allegedly, of course > 8 were allegedly killed in his presence and one he did himself, according to the Federal indictment. I can't find the actual sentencing guidelines, but she does work for the Humane Society and is pretty up on these types of things.

"The top state prosecutor in Surry County, Va., said the Atlanta Falcons quarterback "more than likely" will face state charges in addition to the dogfighting charges brought against him by a federal grand jury on Tuesday, according to the Virginian-Pilot newspaper of Hampton Roads."
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2942125

mbmbn

_____________________________

Tolerance of evil is suicide.- NYC Firefighter

When tolerance is not reciprocated, tolerance becomes surrender.

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 48

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:34:43 PM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

This is going to be ugly. He's gone. The NFL has that new player conduct policy stuff going on. He's already lied about his involvment to the Commish, pretending that he didn't know anything about any of it.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 49

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:36:58 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

Vick may have a different kind of uniform with numbers on it.........

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 50

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:38:12 PM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

I don't think the NFL has made any final decisions about this, but for now they seem content to wait till there's a verdict.

It's a tough call for the NFL, but it should be a no-brainer for the Falcons. I cannot believe the Falcons are going to let an alleged dogfighting ringleader come to training camp, but they seem to be considering it. What a way to drive franchise down the tubes.

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 51

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:44:14 PM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

I'm looking forward to the protest posters that will be flying around training camp.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to Lordandmaster)

Post #: 52

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:48:51 PM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

One thing I have to wonder about is why the major sports are making more money than ever before. With all the thuggery, I don't even watch basketball anymore, and I haven't felt the urge to go to a (major-league) baseball game since all the steroid revelations. I know I'm not the only sports fan who feels this way about these things, and yet salaries keep going up and up; from what I understand, it's never been a better time to own a sports franchise.

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 53

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:55:27 PM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Vick may have a different kind of uniform with numbers on it.........

Ouch!

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 54

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 6:59:21 PM

maybemaybenot

Posts: 2817
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

One thing I have to wonder about is why the major sports are making more money than ever before. With all the thuggery, I don't even watch basketball anymore, and I haven't felt the urge to go to a (major-league) baseball game since all the steroid revelations. I know I'm not the only sports fan who feels this way about these things, and yet salaries keep going up and up; from what I understand, it's never been a better time to own a sports franchise.

Agreed, LAM. I am shocked and disappointed with Goodell. He has said he is not going to do anything for the time being and let the justice thing take it's course. I have emailed and called his office a number of times. He came out as a no non sense, clean up the dirt type guy and is sitting still on this one. I am no Pacman fan, but the guy gets suspended for 8 games without being convicted of anything, yet Goodell is * scared * to take a stand on Vick and wants to let justice take it's course ? WTF is up with that ?

I don't watch basketball either since it has become thug o mania. Never was a baseball fan.

mbmbn

_____________________________

Tolerance of evil is suicide.- NYC Firefighter

When tolerance is not reciprocated, tolerance becomes surrender.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)

Post #: 55

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 7:04:07 PM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

I really can't see the fans going to Falcon games without there being a lot of fuss in the stands. Is Vick really that well loved to begin with? I think they should show him the door.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 56

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 7:04:27 PM

maybemaybenot

Posts: 2817
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Vick may have a different kind of uniform with numbers on it.........

Should he be convicted : I wonder if some of his fellow inmates are familiar with some of the *breeding equipment * sited in the indictment and can make Mr. Vick feel more at home by building a few for him.

mbmbn

_____________________________

Tolerance of evil is suicide.- NYC Firefighter

When tolerance is not reciprocated, tolerance becomes surrender.

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 57

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 7:06:27 PM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

Maybe they can also teach him that water and electric doesn't mix. Since that seems to be his thing.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 58

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 7:10:52 PM

maybemaybenot

Posts: 2817
Joined: 9/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I really can't see the fans going to Falcon games without there being a lot of fuss in the stands. Is Vick really that well loved to begin with? I think they should show him the door.

The Falcons owner has always been a warrior in supporting Vick and his escapades. He released a statement tonight and the curious thing, to me, is his lack of any type of support for Vick in this. Paraphrasing here: he said the organization has not made a final decision on what they will do yet.
I think Mr. Vick should be a little afraid.. I think if he actually does play, there will be some big ol LBs and others who may give him a little message from the puppies. I also think it could get ugly on the road for him. From the hotel accomadations to the water boys.
mbmbn

_____________________________

Tolerance of evil is suicide.- NYC Firefighter

When tolerance is not reciprocated, tolerance becomes surrender.

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 59

RE: michael vick indicted - 7/19/2007 7:34:12 PM

SeanPony

Posts: 169
Joined: 7/6/2007
Status: offline

Michael Vicks needs to have his balls bit off by a crazy and hungry pit bull!

That would be justice right there.

no court system just bad newz for that scumbag.

hahah

(in reply to maybemaybenot)

Post #: 60

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