quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertRat

I knew what ya meant. Was just explaining it to the guy and not correcting you. Your meaning was quite obvious.

Bob

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol
Now, on to the means we have to eradicate xenophobia and prejudice in our immediate vicinities. Any thoughts?

quote:

DesertRat
Maybe we all need to be more comfortable and secure about who we ourselves are, and then we won't feel threatened by the ways of others

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

There is one human race but 'race' as it's commonly accepted here with its colourful definition (pink, brown, peach, and green) simply doesn't exist. It's very possible that I, a seemingly white Jewish chick from Europe, could have more in common with Nelson Mandela, a Zulu from South Africa, than with my cousin Billy Goldenberg from Australia.

I attach  a handy-clickable for information. Fuck, I'm mad.

http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=8149

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave
This is true but what wont work is trying to pretend that differences do not exist and some of those differences do not pose serious social problems.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

The jargon itself may be factual, it's the interpretation that follows from the knowledge of that jargon that is wrong IMO.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Whenever a little ad hominem attack creeps into the debate its reasonable to conclude  that the opposition is rattled.

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

I simply offer my opinions based on my experience and observation of the world as I see it. [/qoute]

yes, experiences as you see it.. NOT a study., not FACT!!!!!!

you said it right there!.. you're offering your opinions and experiences. can you or can you NOT concede to the fact that your opinions or experiences may not exact the science behind? . i see things entirely differently than the average person may.. but whatever i see is accepted per the scientific demarcations that back up what i'm saying.

what you're saying is backed up by observations. unless you're doing a globally double blind.. then i really have no use for your observations. at that point your observations are conjecture.

ok, going off your observations, how would i be classified? someone originating from obviously black stock be classified?

my IQ is not great, only slightly above 145 which while it DOES make me technically a genius, i don't hold much credo in intelligence quotient.  (and i have taken 3 IQs.. 141, 148 and 145.. so i take the median).. that technically makes me genius. i speak french, italian, latin, spanish, english and olde english, some serbo croatian, american sign language, some Q gaelic, a little ancient greek and some aramaic. also i have a degree in physics, chemistry, linguistics and ceramic art.

gee.. i guess the capacity for thought is lost on me. per your observations i should NEVER be capable of complex thought.

do you attribute my intellect to my race? (surely not, you seem to have bell curve views of intellect).. am i a fluke?

would you blame my intelligence on the fact that i'm multiracial? is it my white side behind why i'm so smart?

or *COULD* you concede to the fact that perhaps my intelligence is a product of where i was born? the nutrition i had? and the environment i was raised in?

if i were SOLEY going by *racial* stereotypes..lol i'd be drinking a 40 ounce on the corner and selling crack while pimpin some hos.

sorry, asians don't have the market cornered on math skills. whites don't have the corner on  critical thinking and all middle easterners are not terrorists.

you totally shun the various factors that govern intelligence.

honestly.. i feel sorry for you.. perchance you should get out more.

is your passport up to date?

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

If I see a group that sits in the Sun and eats grubs for breakfast and have done that for a good number of years and I see another group that builds nuclear weapons is it so unreasonable to conclude that those groups are not equal ?

there are so many indig groups that just astound me. they're hunters and gatherers and eat bugs or have odd initiation rights that i feel are SO out there.. BUT that does not inherently oblige them to being predisposed to lack of intellgience.

they just simply are doing what needs to fundamentally be done to survive in their sphere of influence. it does NOT mean that they are intellectually incapable of going beyond that.

sorta like the croc analogy.

they are doing what is necessary to stay alive.

ok so different people on different continents and varying phenotypes live differently or exhibit different traits.

you never addressed my reasons for IQ being disparaging. i posed that on a different post.

you also never approached the imperialism of africa. you want people to address what you pose, yet you do not do the same. as such.. i will not bother to address yours.

why should i bother to address your arguments?... when you do not bother to address mine?






_____________________________

One Man's Phobia is Another Man's Fetish

(in reply to seeksfemslave)

quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

quote:

DesertRat
Maybe we all need to be more comfortable and secure about who we ourselves are, and then we won't feel threatened by the ways of others

This is true but what wont work is trying to pretend that differences do not exist and some of those differences do not pose serious social problems.

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveish

The funny thing was that she had the slur in reverse - she'd apparently heard it about someone of her own race from someone of another, and she's still innocent enough to not understand it.

quote:


When I turn illegally on a red light...I hire an attorney.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Griswold

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

There is one human race but 'race' as it's commonly accepted here with its colourful definition (pink, brown, peach, and green) simply doesn't exist. It's very possible that I, a seemingly white Jewish chick from Europe, could have more in common with Nelson Mandela, a Zulu from South Africa, than with my cousin Billy Goldenberg from Australia.

I attach  a handy-clickable for information. Fuck, I'm mad.

http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=8149

What have you been smokin'?

I'll tell you what...most white people don't have anything against black people.  That's (largely) been made up by the press.  Yeah, I know...more black people get picked up/off by the cops...but it's common knowledge that (let the hate spew begin) blacks kill more blacks than....(etc.).

"A greater percentage of black people, according to the general population, end up in prison for the SAME crimes that white people go to prison for".

Uh huh. 

Tell me something I don't know.

White people know that if they sell dope, they need to set aside some percentage of their dope sales in reserve for a GOOD ATTORNEY!!!!!

(Now, there's a thought).

When I turn illegally on a red light...I hire an attorney.

Why?

Because I don't have to pay incredibly high insurance rates for the next 11 years due to my horrid driving record when I hire an attorney to make my bad choices go away.

In the current issue of "The Economist", an international review of the world as it stands at that week (Aug 4 - 10, 2007), Ted Hayes of "Choose Black America" says "we're being overrun", speaking of the Mexican advance on their jobs.

Apparently it's no longer the whites that are destroying America (or their opportunities), now it's the Mexicans.  And as it appears, now the vitriol of black people is no longer against whites...it's against the Mexicans who are "stealing their jobs".

How about black people saying..."hey...I'll take that job...I'm good with that...."

How about black people potentially agreeing with what Bill Cosby said....(effectively)..."it's you".

I don't blame anyone for my lack of advance in society.  I've done ok...I could have done better...I'm certain others have advanced in positions they didn't deserve (they were taller, better looking, had better background)...but you know what?

They got the advance.

(It might just be you!...regardless of the color of your skin!)

I'm guessing, aside from the obvious, that they may have been better looking, came from better schools, had a better address....

They might have fucking tried harder.

And I'm willing to give them that.

There are a number of people, and yes, a number of races that will continue to excell beyond their due.

Until people of all races accept the fact that the world is generally equal, and it applies the worlds rational of equality, in a relatively equal basis....but you have to participate....and sometimes that means you actually have to work harder (and sometimes, harder than the other guy...and yes...occasionally that sucks).....

Then there will be inequality.

And yes....occasionally that sucks.

(And no...I'm not a racist...I just run the numbers).

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveish

~grinning at Griswold~

I'm all about personal responsibility, and I will echo your sentiment that it sucks. When I am not personally responsible for myself or my position, I falter. That sucks. That there is no one to blame but myself, that sucks even harder.

I'm not sure if I agree that white people don't feel bad about other races. I live in a fairly open-minded southern city, a large one, and although I wasn't raised with racial prejudices I can tell you that it's alive and well.

One of my UM's uttered a racial slur, brought to my home from her school. It brought tears to my eyes - it was the first time she said anything about it. The funny thing was that she had the slur in reverse - she'd apparently heard it about someone of her own race from someone of another, and she's still innocent enough to not understand it.

Until then, though, it seemed that none of them noticed colors and I had such hope that maybe this would be the generation that "got" it. And it's not just white people against black, or black against white, or Mexican against anyone in particular. It's ~differences~ that seem to be so threatening, like a carry-over from earlier years where everyone had to assimilate to be acceptable.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Well, perhaps it would have been courteous to suggest this to the 'OP' directly? Just a thought :)

quote:

PS: 'race' is more than a scientifically inacurate word, it's an inadequate notion altogether. Your premise that 'racism' cannot exist in the absence of the notion of 'race' is bordering on insulting for the many of us who have been on the receiving end of it. Just another thought.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EbonyFtshGoddess

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

If there is no such thing as race, there can be no such thing as racism.

there is no such thing as race, yes.. that is scientifically proven. racism stems from the inate human need to pigeon hole and quantify things so they are more easily digestible.

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

But of course we know each of them exists, but if we find a new term for race, then clearly the term for racism, racist etc,  must also be changed.

there is no such thing, biologically speaking, as race. if you had read the rest of the forum, that would be blatantly apparent to you based upon irrefutable facts posed by other posters.

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo
From a scientific point of view (from all the talented scientists who've contributed here) it would seem that "race" is merely the term that the government and society has coined to differentiate our enthnicities or origins, even if it isn't exactingly accurate. 

hmm.. sorry, i didn't know that people into BDSM were entirely incapable of being scientists. gee.. my university better refund me my money for all of the Bachelors of Science that i have (and in more disciplines  than i noted here. i actually have a triple major, quadruple minor).. i just merely noted the degrees i possess based upon what is relevant to the topic at hand. so yes, people on this forum are just as liable to be scientists, artists, lawyers and even perhaps politicians. just because we're on a BDSM forum does not mean that we are incapable of being scientists. i, myself, am fundamentally a scientist. people that are totally not knowledgable of certain disciplines would not be able to express themselves in scientific terms.

quote:

ORIGINAL: EbonyFtshGoddess

i think i jumped the gun on Gris.

never let it be said when i jump the gun that i can not admit to that fact.

i read each post and then i respond.. this time upon several reads.. i think i did jump it.

never let it be said that Goddess is not magnanimous.

i do feel i felt his post was taken wrongly by me. after a few readings i did see that i misinterpreted him.

but ONLY him.. no one else gets a *get off of Goddess free* card

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveish

The funny thing was that she had the slur in reverse - she'd apparently heard it about someone of her own race from someone of another, and she's still innocent enough to not understand it.

  - my highlights

Need I say more, slaveish? You are using the semantical arsenal of racial prejudice without even being aware of it. It was part of the reason why I posted the thread in the first place. 'Race' is a very American notion, and one I shall combat actively for as long as I can. It is meaningful in the historical context of segregation in the South. It's a shameful remnant of the USA's past. It's good that we are questioning it.

Goddammit.