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RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 1:26:01 PM

AquaticSub

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Me too. Thanks for mentioning that Archer.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 41

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 1:40:07 PM

KiandPhoenix

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Joined: 8/1/2007
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I think thats a complete load of BS. Acording to this co-worker if a man or woman is infertal then they can't have true love .What about all those people out there who get "fixed". Not to mention having kids puts so much tention on a relationship that the relationship dosn't always survive.
~Phoenix

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 42

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:08:06 PM

JackM1

Posts: 137
Joined: 2/3/2007
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just a thought; what about lesbians? though they cant have chidlren with EACH OTHER, they can, biologically, bare children from their bodies. or better yet, what about the scenario of one woman carrying the baby made from the egg of her partner, but fertilized by a donor? now, they are biologically bound, one is the birth mother, one is the biological mother. both are legally and physically the MOTHER(having maybe used an annonymous sperm donor, so there is no actual FATHER, since the father has no idea if his sperm was used, and/or by whom)...does that change the argument at all, since they now do, technically, have a child together?

having been in long term relationships with both of the sexes, i can say that yes; there is a HUGE difference in the relationship, but it has nothing to do with my being in love, or having more feelings(....ok well, lets pretend i liked them equal for now, okay? the analogy is easier that way) for one more than the other. mainly, it was the difference between men and woman in general, as im sure anyone can tell you; woman talk and communicate more, they show their emotions more, and quite frankly..theyre bitches, especially highschool-age girls. men, they are much more...closed up, they think different than women, and sometimes you have a very hard time understanding them, where with girls, though you understand most of what they do, you dont always believe that they have the nerve to do it. i cant presume to speak for gay or bisexual men, but i imagine its the exact same situation. with one sex, you can have a close relationship where you more or less perfectly understand that person, simply because you share the same type of chromasomes...and with another, the mystery of the OPPOSITE SEX keeps you comming back, despite wanting to cut their throat out every other weekend(ok, so thats an exageration on both parts, but i think you get the idea. i personally love women and i love men, and i would be satisfied with which ever i ended up with)

(in reply to KiandPhoenix)

Post #: 43

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:19:05 PM

MadRabbit

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JackM1

just a thought; what about lesbians?

Lesbians are hot...so its ok by Christians.

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Post #: 44

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:22:56 PM

AquaticSub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: JackM1

just a thought; what about lesbians?

Lesbians are hot...so its ok by Christians.

Well... by the men at least.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 45

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:23:46 PM

MadRabbit

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Its the best answer I can come up with regards to why the Bible only talks about men laying with other men.

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(in reply to AquaticSub)

Post #: 46

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:41:02 PM

Grlwithboy

Posts: 655
Joined: 2/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Its the best answer I can come up with regards to why the Bible only talks about men laying with other men.

I love how they don't get all nuts over Leviticus when it's time to blend cotton and poly.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 47

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:45:50 PM

krikket

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From: Washington, DC Metro Area
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

I wanted to post this here since I think it relates to the Alternate Lifestyle scene in general.

His conjecture is that homosexual relationships are merely about sex and cant reach as deep as an emotional connection as a heterosexual couple because of their inability to have children. IDo you think there is connection between the ability to have children and the depth of our romantic love for one another?

Do you think its possible that homosexuals cannot experience love the same heterosexuals can because of their inability to even attempt to have a child?

i haven't read any further than your OP, but have a comment anyway -- and apologize if someone else has already said it (which i suspect they have). Not only is the person short changing a same-sex couple, but all of those heterosexual couples who either aren't able or choose not to have children.

i'd say narrow minded is a compliment in his case.

jimini

P.S. Edited to add -- i knew others would say this better than i did..lol.. but for me it's a really sore subject. While i now have 3 grown um's, there was a long period of my life where i had been told i'd never be able to have children and that was long before invetro fertilization came into being and adoption was almost impossible (don't ya love to prove doc's wrong..lol). My inability to have babies certainly didn't harm my relationship, in fact maybe it was the other way around, in that pregnancy and kids can be hard on a relationship (and no one tells you that beforehand..lol).

< Message edited by krikket -- 8/21/2007 2:52:27 PM >

_____________________________

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Post #: 48

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 2:48:11 PM

Archer

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LOL I know the whole idea that this ONE Levitican law is still valid even though according to them Jesus freed them from the law.
He either freed them from the law all of it or he didn't.
Menstrating women, skin of a pig, clothes made from different materials, Dairy and Meat on the same plate (no more cheeseburgers), etc. all things that violate the law to the same level.

(in reply to Grlwithboy)

Post #: 49

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 4:08:42 PM

SusanofO

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I can believe there are people out there who still think like this. What I cannot believe is that you actually wasted your time debating with one. I rarely do that anymore - unless it is just for fun on my part (seriously). Sometimes we get through an entire half hour before they realize, I am just putting them on - and basically toying with them. It really pisses them off (which is why it can be so much fun), but that depends on who you do this to as well - it can also be not a smart thing to do)...

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 8/21/2007 4:14:13 PM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 50

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 5:32:03 PM

JackM1

Posts: 137
Joined: 2/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: JackM1

just a thought; what about lesbians?

Lesbians are hot...so its ok by Christians.

heh, brilliant, and soooo very very true. notice how they only yell and scream about gay MEN? but women? oh no, thats just one little dirty sin that they cant quite give up(anyone see the news a while back about that tv evangelist who slept with a hooker despite preaching about the HORRABLE sins of the flesh? i would bet money, that if there was another woman with that hooker in that bed his face would have lit up like christmas had come *very* early)

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 51

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 5:41:48 PM

bipolarber

Posts: 2792
Joined: 9/25/2004
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So, I guess het couples who find that they are sterile, should immediately divorice, since they will never reach that "pinnacle?" (Some do, sadly, because the fetish/obsession for reproduction is that strong in some.)

Gay men can't fall in love deeply enough to raise kids? Hummm... then they must really be failures, in comparison to het couples, who currently have a divorice rate of 50%. I'll have to tell that to a gay couple here in town... they've only been together 50+ years. Meanwhile, most of their neighbors lasted less than five. Also, this "factoid" doesn't take into account that many of the marriages that do stay together.... shouldn't. Abuse, neglect, non-consentual infidelity, lying, etc., etc...

Lesbians can't biologically reproduce? Welcome to the 21st century! (I know several couples in Denver who can make your Limbaugh/0'Riley knockoff friend flip out. All you need is a withdrawl from a sperm bank, or possibly ask a nice male friend for a donation, and a turkey baster.) In this day and age, women can give birth to themselves, if they really want to. (Cloning via in virto fertilization! Let the conservative bigot think about THAT one for awhile.)

Out there, right now, are almost a half million kids in need of adoption by caring, loving adults. People who have the financial means to support them, and the serious intent of making them into well adjusted, self sufficent adults. (i.e. democratic liberals.) Maybe THAT's the real reason conservatives don't want gays to adopt... the kids wouldn't be thiers to control.

Sorry if I seem a bit acidic in my replies. But your friend's mental abilities are obviously fodder for a palentology thesis. I don't know to be disgusted by someone so obviously wasting the greatest gift God gave them, (their brain) or just bemused by the obvious bleating of an evolutionary dead ender, slowly being sucked down into the tar pit.

I really pity people like this.

(in reply to spankmepink11)

Post #: 52

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 6:07:37 PM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Its the best answer I can come up with regards to why the Bible only talks about men laying with other men.

Ahh the Bible... such a source of conflict, even between Christians. Do you know there are several different verisions of the Bible used by the different branchs of Christianity, including and excluding various books?

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 53

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 6:16:15 PM

Gwynvyd

Posts: 4949
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Its the best answer I can come up with regards to why the Bible only talks about men laying with other men.

Actualy... the good ol King James really drove the point home when he had the Bible re-translated becuase his dear old Dad was known as a bit of a troublesome Boy Buggerer. To the point that he almost got himself killed a few times by the local gentry. To ease the pissed off nobles he wrote in some more heavily damning "translations" as to what they wanted the political clime to go.. Just take a Jerusalem bible, and a King James bible.. lay them side by side and read verse for verse.. you would be amazed at the changes.

Suffer not a Witch to live was actualy suffer not a Poisoner < one who tells lies.. and cheats > to live. Salem witch trials anyone? Tons more in there.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_James_Version

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 54

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 9:50:36 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AquaticSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Its the best answer I can come up with regards to why the Bible only talks about men laying with other men.

Ahh the Bible... such a source of conflict, even between Christians. Do you know there are several different verisions of the Bible used by the different branchs of Christianity, including and excluding various books?

Somewhat. I am aware of it, but cant go into specifics.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to AquaticSub)

Post #: 55

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 9:52:50 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

I can believe there are people out there who still think like this. What I cannot believe is that you actually wasted your time debating with one. I rarely do that anymore - unless it is just for fun on my part (seriously). Sometimes we get through an entire half hour before they realize, I am just putting them on - and basically toying with them. It really pisses them off (which is why it can be so much fun), but that depends on who you do this to as well - it can also be not a smart thing to do)...

- Susan

I'm young and its still fun. I'm sure I will get tired of it eventually

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to SusanofO)

Post #: 56

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/21/2007 10:57:24 PM

SusanofO

Posts: 5672
Joined: 12/19/2005
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MadRabbit: I know you're a smart guy. I guess that was just my way of saying: Don't let idiots like these get to you. There are a LOT of them out there. I know - I live in Nebraska (a very conservative state).

Plus, my next door neighbors are a Lesbian couple (really) who are just hated by the retired male military captain across the street. He is always telling new people on the block how" weird and corrupted" they are. They're not (and nobody listens to him anyway). But - he's done some pretty vicious things to them - he slashed their tires (and tried to deny he was the one who did) a few years ago. Stuff like that.

They're GREAT neighbors. In the winter, they never fail to snow-blow everyone's sidewalk on practically the whole block, and are very friendly, and both are well-educated (one has a Master's degree, the other a Ph.D.). They helped me plant my garden last Spring. They let me borrow their lawn tools, etc. I bake them cookies every Christmas (they like them).

This guy across the street who hates them is this fundamentalist, Bible-thumper who tries to make their life miserable, but all he really does is make them laugh (at him). It's kind of a pathetic situation, really. They have no kids - they are in their early 50's - but -if they'd wanted some, I think they would have made great parents. They are ultra-responsible types, well-educated, compassionate and just nice women. I'd have zero problem seeing them be parents.

This friend of yours is way, way off base (but you already know that).

-Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 8/21/2007 11:01:45 PM >

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 57

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/22/2007 7:42:39 AM

yrstocollar

Posts: 95
Joined: 8/14/2006
Status: offline

Much as I disagree with your co-worker and second pretty much what everyone else is saying here... I have to congratulate you on your maturity and attempts to reasonably debate the issue rather than getting pissed off. It's only through showing people like this that we are intelligent, "normal" people that we'll eventually get through to them...

...and then we can take over the world!! *evil laugh*

(in reply to SusanofO)

Post #: 58

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/22/2007 2:52:01 PM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

MadRabbit: I know you're a smart guy. I guess that was just my way of saying: Don't let idiots like these get to you. There are a LOT of them out there. I know - I live in Nebraska (a very conservative state).

Plus, my next door neighbors are a Lesbian couple (really) who are just hated by the retired male military captain across the street. He is always telling new people on the block how" weird and corrupted" they are. They're not (and nobody listens to him anyway). But - he's done some pretty vicious things to them - he slashed their tires (and tried to deny he was the one who did) a few years ago. Stuff like that.

They're GREAT neighbors. In the winter, they never fail to snow-blow everyone's sidewalk on practically the whole block, and are very friendly, and both are well-educated (one has a Master's degree, the other a Ph.D.). They helped me plant my garden last Spring. They let me borrow their lawn tools, etc. I bake them cookies every Christmas (they like them).

This guy across the street who hates them is this fundamentalist, Bible-thumper who tries to make their life miserable, but all he really does is make them laugh (at him). It's kind of a pathetic situation, really. They have no kids - they are in their early 50's - but -if they'd wanted some, I think they would have made great parents. They are ultra-responsible types, well-educated, compassionate and just nice women. I'd have zero problem seeing them be parents.

This friend of yours is way, way off base (but you already know that).

-Susan

I appreciate the compliments and thank you. I understand what your saying.

Sometimes it gets to me a bit...mostly when I list to people prattle on and on with such a narrow minded view about God. The most part, it makes me laugh and I just enjoy the debate.

At the same time though, I have never really had to deal with an experience like that. I have a hard time comprehending how people like that can exist since I am just so used to seeing things threw my eyes.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to SusanofO)

Post #: 59

RE: Homosexuality and Parenthood - 8/22/2007 2:56:03 PM

SusanofO

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MadRabbit: It is hard to argue with an idiot. They are almost always convinced they are absolutely right (absolutely being the key word) - no matter how fundamentally illogical their POV may be. I do understand. I really find "black and white thinkers" to be hard to deal with generally (and this person sounds like one, for sure).

- Susan

_____________________________

"Hope is the thing with feathers,
That perches in the soul,
And sings the tune without the words,
And never stops at all". - Emily Dickinson

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 60

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