RE: SLAVES VS SUBS

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: SLAVES VS SUBS

Page: << < prev 3 4 [5] 6 7 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 11:27:22 AM

gypsygrl

Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

If a slave says 'no' she actually means it,
Wow - A slave with permission to say 'no'! I'm stunned.

How liberal! Perhaps this community should take a turn for equal rights? slaves can order Masters around half of the time? subs can put Dom's over their knee and spank them for being naughty little Dom's?

I took what she said very differently but am waiting for clarification. But, the way I read it is that a slave only says 'no' (resists or whatever form 'no' takes) as a matter of survival, when the consequences of compliance would involve a danger to the slaves well-being.

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 81

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 11:34:34 AM

MadRabbit

Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: devotedsylph

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit
Such a person who no longer makes any choices would be roughly on the same level as this coffee mug on my desk or as Rover phrases it, "a sack of taters".

But for some people, that is sort of their goal - to be objectified and turned into just another owned possession.

Simply,
sylph

There is a huge difference between objectication kink and attempting to remove a person's autonomy.

The first one is sexy.
The second is impossible.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to devotedsylph)

Post #: 82

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 11:46:22 AM

kyraofMists

Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Beside the 3rd person speech restriction beth isn't even allowed to use words where the letters 'n' and 'o' appear together. The downside, of course, is that she can't refer to me as being "all kNOwing - kNOw it all!". Not only appropriate, but in addition the way I want it and like it.

Curious question... If a repairman was supposed to come to the house and you call beth to ask if they have shown up yet and they have not, how does she answer that question without having "no" appear together?

Knight's Kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 83

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 11:52:29 AM

CuriousLord

Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

I doubt anyone's yet provided a definition for slave yet where conscentuality wasn't either in it or assumed. This said, I took it to be, "Oh, wow, a relationship where the slave can have limits and refuse the Master."

To me..
-A slave follows her Master's orders.
-She can not refuse consent to a particular action.
-She can refuse consent to the general arrangement at any time.
-If this withdrawl of consent is not recognized, then the former "Master" is criminally acting outside of the dynamic.

This is to say, a Master tells his slave to.. eat a pizza. (Or anything else.) The slave truly hates pizza with everything in her being. She can not say, "No, I won't eat the pizza, but I'm still your slave"; she can say, "I'm no longer your slave" (and she wouldn't have to eat the pizza).

If she does say this- the dynamic is broken. The Master is no longer a Master, the slave is no longer a slave. They make reconcile is later, and try to fix things, but they're simply not these things at this point. If the former Master tries to force the slave to eat the pizza still, he's acting as a vanilla person forcing another vanilla person to eat pizza. In the absense of the dynamic, he doesn't have this right (barring extraordinary circumstances, such as the former slave's life would be saved by eatting pizza), and he's acting criminally.

In short, there are no "No"s in the M/s relationship. The slave -can- say "No".. just, once she does, there's no more M/s relationship.

(in reply to gypsygrl)

Post #: 84

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 11:55:33 AM

CuriousLord

Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Beside the 3rd person speech restriction beth isn't even allowed to use words where the letters 'n' and 'o' appear together. The downside, of course, is that she can't refer to me as being "all kNOwing - kNOw it all!". Not only appropriate, but in addition the way I want it and like it.

Curious question... If a repairman was supposed to come to the house and you call beth to ask if they have shown up yet and they have not, how does she answer that question without having "no" appear together?

Via the contraction, "n't". :P ("He hasn't shown up yet.")

(in reply to kyraofMists)

Post #: 85

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 12:07:48 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Beside the 3rd person speech restriction beth isn't even allowed to use words where the letters 'n' and 'o' appear together. The downside, of course, is that she can't refer to me as being "all kNOwing - kNOw it all!". Not only appropriate, but in addition the way I want it and like it.

Curious question... If a repairman was supposed to come to the house and you call beth to ask if they have shown up yet and they have not, how does she answer that question without having "no" appear together?

Knight's Kyra

The repairman has failed to appear.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to kyraofMists)

Post #: 86

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 12:21:27 PM

kyraofMists

Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Beside the 3rd person speech restriction beth isn't even allowed to use words where the letters 'n' and 'o' appear together. The downside, of course, is that she can't refer to me as being "all kNOwing - kNOw it all!". Not only appropriate, but in addition the way I want it and like it.

Curious question... If a repairman was supposed to come to the house and you call beth to ask if they have shown up yet and they have not, how does she answer that question without having "no" appear together?

Knight's Kyra

The repairman has failed to appear.

Celeste

LOL

Yeah, I thought of that as I was changing my sheets. I was just curious how much verbal manuvering has to be done to avoid those two letters appearing together. I am sure like most things, it would become second nature to a personn who practices it all the time.

In our relationship, the word no is not off limits. What is not allowed is refusing to do his will, no matter what letters are used to exhibit that refusal.

Then another thought comes to mind... the word no is off limits, so master says "slave do X" and slave says, "fat chance of that happening" and then doesn't do it. They didn't use the letters n and o, but an order was refused....

Just Sunday afternoon musings *eg*

Knight's Kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Post #: 87

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 2:05:06 PM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

Yeah, I thought of that as I was changing my sheets. I was just curious how much verbal manuvering has to be done to avoid those two letters appearing together. I am sure like most things, it would become second nature to a personn who practices it all the time.

In our relationship, the word no is not off limits. What is not allowed is refusing to do his will, no matter what letters are used to exhibit that refusal.

Then another thought comes to mind... the word no is off limits, so master says "slave do X" and slave says, "fat chance of that happening" and then doesn't do it. They didn't use the letters n and o, but an order was refused....

Just Sunday afternoon musings *eg*

Knight's Kyra

As someone who stinks at spelling, it would probably take me forever to get into the habit just because I wouldn't know when the letters appear together.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to kyraofMists)

Post #: 88

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 2:06:02 PM

came4U

Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline

ok, let me explain. We / I am refering to slave in the BDSM sense. We are not talking about non-play activities such as 'actual slavery' of human beings which is illegal both morally and conventionally.

My point is, that people mix the terms slavery and submissive as if they are a 'game' and yet such slaves/subs are mere toys who volunteer.

quote:

quote:

The difference between subs and slaves to me??

If a slave says 'no' she actually means it, if a sub says 'no' it is considered 'play'.

aka: a true slave would fight back for life and limb a sub giggles knowing she is fairly safe.

A big difference, In reality.

This is a really intriging, if cryptic, take on the distinction. It strikes a bell with me, but I'm not sure why. Please expand?

Ok,

quote:

Hello, folks,

I am a surrendered woman who is submissive to the man whose life I share. The fact that he has chosen to not exercise mastery over me is the single thing differentiating me from a slave.

So for me the answer to the OP is simple --

Active exercising of mastery (cause) leads to enslavement (effect), thus the submissive woman becomes a slave.

Of course, your mileage may vary,

~Kimveri

kim has the right idea, which I wish she would expand more. kim seems enlightened on the difference. It is NOT that He (the master) would cause disasterous effect to his slave but he does have the 'potential' to. Thus where life and death/loss of soul begins in this conversation. Soul separation.

another good example:

quote:

As a slave, I have lost the ability to walk out the door without having to put on a mask and be someone different rather than the unique individual that my slavery allows me to be. It's not a matter of 'choice' on whether to leave or stay. I make a choice every moment of every day to be true to who I am.

I guess, simply put, when I identified as a submissive it was because of my ability to be a submissive. Now, I identify as a slave because of my inability to be anything else.

this implies a different category of slave, just as there are different categories of submissives. I am sure, Ms. Celeste would agree that a strict 'NO' at something as serious as her Master saying "ok, I will dangle you over this cliff with dental floss, lets see how much you love me". Thus her ability to deny such actions as life and limb. There is no zoning into sub-space enough to make a person do obey this act. Yet, she would in turn, put this man in charge of pulling a plug her plug in hospital if she were in dire inability (if that is in your will for example)of mental and/or physical distress that is beyond repair. He would do so out of love to avoid continued disrespect to your lifeless body and to ease uncecessary suffering. The distinct difference is her choice is human and natural. A slave, even in her most cherished situation in serving MUST, IS and WILL obey (ignore threats of disownership topics and bear with me) to strict confinement and edurance of mind and body yet she must have the capicity to say 'no'. Without this capacity, she is not a slave, she is crippled. An emotional and physical cripple. Someone that even the weakest of 'masters' would disregard as ill (aka the term doormat) if she volunteered for such tasks. To totally remove your soul, foundations of language and any free-thought you are no more prized than a garden slug. A slave says no for a reason. That reason being 'I am ALIVE, I am ME, I am YOURS'.

and with the person who commented about pizza:

quote:

In short, there are no "No"s in the M/s relationship. The slave -can- say "No".. just, once she does, there's no more M/s relationship.

If such slave says no (life and death excluded in this situation) body becomes quite ill from pizza), which snowballs into emotional disaster over and over as well as physical illness, is such person a bad slave or is such owner a bad Master? It is this dynamic that makes root my point. Saying 'no' is not always out of spite, saying 'no' is for actual self-preservation mode of any human who is still 'human'. Take that away, we revert back to becoming amoeba.

So, trying to be short here, but in essence I am saying that if anyone and I mean ANYONE claims to be such a slave that you cannot say NO to jumping in front of a bus for your Master, you are not a slave, you are 'nothing', soul-less, aquired garden material. If you deny this truth, you are either in deanial that it is a 'I can't say no game, but it is actually just play' or actually you would jump in front of that bus to prove you are a slug. Don't get me wrong, people have done this for the one they love, it doesn't make them a slave, even being a slave one is still human, still evolving, still ALIVE.

(in reply to slaveish)

Post #: 89

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 2:37:17 PM

gypsygrl

Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline

quote:

If such slave says no (life and death excluded in this situation) body becomes quite ill from pizza), which snowballs into emotional disaster over and over as well as physical illness, is such person a bad slave or is such owner a bad Master? It is this dynamic that makes root my point. Saying 'no' is not always out of spite, saying 'no' is for actual self-preservation mode of any human who is still 'human'.

Thanks for the explanation. This is pretty much how I was reading your original comment. I've yet to run into a Master (in real life, though I'm not saying they don't exist...I just haven't run into any.) who expected a slave to follow an order or comply with a wish at the expense of her well-being.

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

(in reply to AquaticSub)

Post #: 90

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 2:47:12 PM

gypsygrl

Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline

quote:

This is to say, a Master tells his slave to.. eat a pizza. (Or anything else.) The slave truly hates pizza with everything in her being. She can not say, "No, I won't eat the pizza, but I'm still your slave"; she can say, "I'm no longer your slave" (and she wouldn't have to eat the pizza).

If she does say this- the dynamic is broken. The Master is no longer a Master, the slave is no longer a slave. They make reconcile is later, and try to fix things, but they're simply not these things at this point. If the former Master tries to force the slave to eat the pizza still, he's acting as a vanilla person forcing another vanilla person to eat pizza. In the absense of the dynamic, he doesn't have this right (barring extraordinary circumstances, such as the former slave's life would be saved by eatting pizza), and he's acting criminally.

This is a formalistic approach to an M/s dynamic. The part in bold suggests a rather ad hoc attitude which, in my mind, points to the unrealistic nature of an M/s dynamic in which the slave isn't allowed to say no, ever.

And, it doesn't get at the slave/sub distinction.

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 91

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 2:58:04 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kyraofMists

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Beside the 3rd person speech restriction beth isn't even allowed to use words where the letters 'n' and 'o' appear together. The downside, of course, is that she can't refer to me as being "all kNOwing - kNOw it all!". Not only appropriate, but in addition the way I want it and like it.

Curious question... If a repairman was supposed to come to the house and you call beth to ask if they have shown up yet and they have not, how does she answer that question without having "no" appear together?

Knight's Kyra

I haven't seen them yet

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to kyraofMists)

Post #: 92

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 3:36:51 PM

CuriousLord

Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

quote:

This is to say, a Master tells his slave to.. eat a pizza. (Or anything else.) The slave truly hates pizza with everything in her being. She can not say, "No, I won't eat the pizza, but I'm still your slave"; she can say, "I'm no longer your slave" (and she wouldn't have to eat the pizza).

If she does say this- the dynamic is broken. The Master is no longer a Master, the slave is no longer a slave. They make reconcile is later, and try to fix things, but they're simply not these things at this point. If the former Master tries to force the slave to eat the pizza still, he's acting as a vanilla person forcing another vanilla person to eat pizza. In the absense of the dynamic, he doesn't have this right (barring extraordinary circumstances, such as the former slave's life would be saved by eatting pizza), and he's acting criminally.

This is a formalistic approach to an M/s dynamic. The part in bold suggests a rather ad hoc attitude which, in my mind, points to the unrealistic nature of an M/s dynamic in which the slave isn't allowed to say no, ever.

I can assure you, it's quite realistic in that I've had such relationships and currently maintain one.

I am unsure, though.. what would a slave have to say "No" to, assuming a mature Master and a truly submissive slave?

quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl
And, it doesn't get at the slave/sub distinction.

I'm afraid that the subject tends to drift to more specific aspects by page five of a thread.

(in reply to gypsygrl)

Post #: 93

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 4:01:36 PM

slavegirljoy

Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: slavegirljoy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kikinymph
this is the definition that I gave.

MY THEORETICAL IDEAL DEFINITION OF A SLAVE:
A slave is a person who can, or will, give up any prior committments that they have in order to be in service to the Owner. This is including committments to job/career, children, spouses, family.

Kiki

This definition might work for some but, not for this slave. When my Master took ownership of me, He didn't require or want me to disconnect myself from the other people in my life. i came to Him with all of my possessions, with all of my history, and with all of my obligations. i didn't stop being the person i already was, in order to become some anonymous slave to Him, with no past or outside interests. i didn't take on some whole new identity, like in the witness protection program, where no one who had known me before would have any idea how to contact me. If that were a requirement to being a slave, i never would have wanted to become an owned slave.

I believe the idea is more that a slave is one willing to give these things up at her Master's order, not that she has to give them up even if her Master doesn't command it.

The basic idea here is that a slave follows her Master's orders, that her Master doesn't have to barter with her or try to convince her to do something like a Dom may have to with a sub.

The "bartering" or, rather, the discussion of wants/needs/requirements of my Master and i came before i made my decision to become His slave. The rules, that i would be required to live by, were set by my Master and understood and agreed to by me, before i accepted my His collar and became His slave. If He had required that i give up all connections to family and friends, negotiations would have ceased between Uus. The mere suggestion of that would have been a red flag to me, that this is not someone i would respect or trust and, without those two qualities being present, i would not be interested in serving.

As far as i'm concerned, turning your back on the people who are a close and integral part of your life, prior to becoming a slave, is contradictory to some of the most basic character traits that i consider essential to, not only being a long-term slave but, to having any long-term, committed, intimate relationship. Those qualities are Loyalty, Honesty, Fidelity, Responsibility, Reliability, and Dependability. The willingness to turn your back on your children, your parents, your siblings, your close friends, for no other reason than to become a slave, indicates, to me, that those character traits are either not present or not very strong.

Those are the character traits i look for in deciding to become involved in an intimate relationship, with the hope of it being long term. Those qualities are also essential to my Master, in His choice of slaves. i understand that different Masters have different qualities they look for in a slave and, perhaps these qualities are irrelevant to some. But, i still don't see how having the willingness to turn your back on the people who you are close to, in order to become the property of another, would be a desirable trait in a slave, much less a requirement to being a slave.

Not only that but, if the slave cuts all her ties to the people she is closely connected to, in order to become a slave and, then something happens down the road, that ends her service to her Master, such as in His death or His decision to release her, she has no family or friends to turn to for comfort, help, or simply to not be all alone. This would be a very insecure way to live, i believe, and would make it very difficult to feel comfortable serving a man who would require or even desire this from a slave.

slave joy

Owned property of Master David

"Commitment transforms a promise into a reality."

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 94

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 4:20:17 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen68

LA will come along sometime today with about a billion links to all of the times this has been discussed. What it boils down to is there is no definitive answer. It is unique to the individuals involved in a relationship and what words they choose to describe their roles.

Well I guess I still can, but I've been out of town and it doesn't seem as if this thread needs more fuel :)

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Aileen68)

Post #: 95

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 4:24:56 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
I now I have a standard reply whenever this thread appears.

Heard an interesting comment on this question last week. The difference between submissive and slave is that a submissive includes two "I's" and a slave has none - both literally and philosophically.

Now if I can only get LA to add this quote whenever she lists the archive search listing the powered bones of previous slave v. sub threads.

Well I like the quote because it is intriguing and certainly caused me to take some time and really evaluate the concepts in a new perspective.

But since I ultimately disagreed with it, I'm gonna need some more general support before I do that in the future ;)

And since others said they wanted the links, here you go (and note that this is NOT a complete list):

http://www.collarchat.com/m_586226/mpage_1/key_slave%252Csub/tm.htm#586267
Curious, sub v slave?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_515303/mpage_1/key_slave/tm.htm#515333
What is the difference?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_308296/mpage_1/key_slave%252Csub/tm.htm#309867
sub or slave?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_342405/mpage_1/key_slave%252Csub/tm.htm#342794
~slave vs sub~

http://www.collarchat.com/m_410567/mpage_1/key_slave%252Csub/tm.htm#410982
slave or sub

http://www.collarchat.com/m_497775/mpage_1/key_submissive%252Cslave/tm.htm#497977
I'm new to this but...

http://www.collarchat.com/m_366860/mpage_1/key_slave%252Csub/tm.htm#366893
Difference bet/submission and slave?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_365776/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cslave/tm.htm#366767
slub question

http://www.collarchat.com/m_281198/mpage_1/key_slave%252Csub/tm.htm#281512
difference between slave and submissive

http://www.collarchat.com/m_251014/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cslave/tm.htm#251062
definition of "slave"

What's the difference between slaves and submissives?

Submissive or slave?

Slaves versus submissive

Submissive or slave? (2)

Submissive vs slave (2)

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 96

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 4:26:39 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists
I haven't seen them yet

I like Celeste's better. Haven't is just a contraction of "have" and "not" so still breaks the rule IMO.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to KnightofMists)

Post #: 97

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 4:55:32 PM

Bobkgin

Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

If a slave says 'no' she actually means it,
Wow - A slave with permission to say 'no'! I'm stunned.

How liberal! Perhaps this community should take a turn for equal rights? slaves can order Masters around half of the time? subs can put Dom's over their knee and spank them for being naughty little Dom's?

It is nonsense to suggest a slave has "permission" to say "no", unless her master has actually granted her that privilege.

On the other hand, as I said in my earlier posts, a slave can certainly quit, and this is one of the ways in which she can do it: through refusal to serve.

Just because a slave agrees to serve does not negate her natural born ability to exercise free will. A slave can do anything anyone else can do.

But as Bitatruble said earlier: there are consequences for her behaviour whereas the consequences for a sub doing exactly the same thing may be a good deal less drastic.

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to CuriousLord)

Post #: 98

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 4:58:13 PM

Bobkgin

Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

If a slave says 'no' she actually means it,
Wow - A slave with permission to say 'no'! I'm stunned.

How liberal! Perhaps this community should take a turn for equal rights? slaves can order Masters around half of the time? subs can put Dom's over their knee and spank them for being naughty little Dom's?

I took what she said very differently but am waiting for clarification. But, the way I read it is that a slave only says 'no' (resists or whatever form 'no' takes) as a matter of survival, when the consequences of compliance would involve a danger to the slaves well-being.

She should certainly mean "no" if she says it.

However, by saying "no", she is saying she doesn't trust her master's judgment.

If that is the case, she shouldn't be serving him as a slave (probably not as a sub either).

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to gypsygrl)

Post #: 99

RE: SLAVES VS SUBS - 8/26/2007 5:01:59 PM

Bobkgin

Posts: 1335
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Kawarthas, Ontario, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: devotedsylph

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit
Such a person who no longer makes any choices would be roughly on the same level as this coffee mug on my desk or as Rover phrases it, "a sack of taters".

But for some people, that is sort of their goal - to be objectified and turned into just another owned possession.

Simply,
sylph

There is a huge difference between objectication kink and attempting to remove a person's autonomy.

The first one is sexy.
The second is impossible.

It is true that no one can remove another's autonomy.

However, it is also true that a slave can choose to behave as if she has no autonomy.

It is by consistently and willingly making that choice, and that choice alone, that a slave demonstrates her devotion to serving her master.

That does -not- make her an object.

It makes her a slave willfully choosing to serve her master in whatever capacity he might wish.

If she cannot make that choice, then she is deciding to stop being his slave, and there are consequences for that.

This is why slavery (and the accepting of a slave's devotion) should never be taken lightly.

_____________________________

When all is said and done, what will you regret?

That you never really lived?

Or there was so much living left to do?

For those interested: pics and poetry have been added to my profile.

(in reply to MadRabbit)

Post #: 100

Page: << < prev 3 4 [5] 6 7 next > >>

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: SLAVES VS SUBS

Page: << < prev 3 4 [5] 6 7 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.953