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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 11:09:02 AM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble
Still others are spoken to ensure he knows that sometimes, when he's being particulary sadist, I think he's a Fucking Blackhearted Bastard (note the caps!) ... always said with the utmost respect and affection, of course.

LMAO!!!!!!

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 11:12:11 AM

servantheart

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble
Still others are spoken to ensure he knows that sometimes, when he's being particulary sadist, I think he's a Fucking Blackhearted Bastard (note the caps!) ... always said with the utmost respect and affection, of course.

Celeste

(makes note to self to always show the utmost respect when disrespecting Sir...)

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 11:13:31 AM

sublizzie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

You apply that rule to all dominants and submissives? Not merely "your" dominant?

I apply that rule to my interactions within the group of which I am a member. I apply the rule outside the group if the people I am with are D/s rather than Tops & bottoms. I don't foist my D/s rules on people who are not practitioners of D/s.

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 11:21:33 AM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sublizzie
I apply that rule to my interactions within the group of which I am a member.

I've not encountered that many submissives who extend such a rule beyond their dominant. Is that a generalized custom within your group?

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 11:28:25 AM

leadinghand

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No protocol is silly if it means something to you. I only have a few, but we have developed many (I will call them) ritual habits that lead to a specific mindset or put us in a place. For example, I will have her knee at my feet if I hve something very important to tell her or if it is something I wish to make a command. She knows then to be open and accepting of what I have to say, it gives us both better focus.
She asked to call me Master because she said it was the right word for what she feel. Who would not allow that and be thrilled by it?

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When insired by a great and extraordinary purpose, thoughts break their bounds. You transcend limitations, consciousness expands and you find yourself in a new, and wonderful world

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 11:33:08 AM

BitaTruble

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sublizzie
When I am serving Dominants, they are always served before any submissives. That's a particular protocol I find appropriate in a D/s situation. Not all situations are D/s but I still work to ensure that Dominants are given the first servings, best pieces of food, nicest tableware, etc.

Hi Lizzie,

Just wanted to say that I'm right there with you. This is, however, something which I had to learn. I always believed that as a hostess I should serve my guests (children first to get the little buggers outta the way- then ladies before gentleman) then my own spouse and I partake last before sitting down to eat.

That changed when Himself and I started to entertain as a M/s couple. When we are having a social gathering at the house, Himself gets served first, then other dominants then switches followed by submissives and, again, myself last.

Before anyone asks how do I know who's switch, who's dominant and who's submissive, well, we don't invite people to our house who we don't know so I'm well aware of the orientation of our guests.

In a strictly vanilla setting (bosses, clients, employees, family) I go back to the standard Miss Manners school of ettiquette.

What it boils down to though, is I never eat a meal while it's still hot! ::laughs::

Celeste

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 12:24:06 PM

Celeste43

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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: Celeste43
Ask anybody who's been in the military and they'll tell you that they can say Yes Sir while thinking 'what a jackass'.

Oh, believe me, we can think MUCH worse things! (4 years USMC)

(you learn to keep the "fuck you, Sir" silent until after said officer leaves the general vicinity!)

So you do understand that protocol doesn't lead the heart. If it did, then anyone you were obliged to say Yes Sir to would have gotten your full respect.

So why do you think it works differently in other relationships?

Oh and as for telling you when she's not well, I don't think of that as protocol, but as communication. Protocol and ritual to me are the outward trappings, not the inner and the inner are of more importance to us than the outer. YMMV.

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 12:56:03 PM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Celeste43
So you do understand that protocol doesn't lead the heart. If it did, then anyone you were obliged to say Yes Sir to would have gotten your full respect.

So why do you think it works differently in other relationships?

I don't. My original question was geared as an exploration of the role protocol plays in sustaining relationships (D/s and M/s relationships in particular).

I will say that, when I was in the Marines, there were several officers I though were complete morons and nincompoops....I saluted them anyway, and called them "Sir" without (too much) hesitation. My personal feelings aside, they WERE officers, they WERE in command, and the proper functioning of the military unit demands they receive those token gestures. To paraphrase what was said in another thread...you salute the rank, not the man.

Now, obviously a D/s relationship is not the military--and the requirements and goals of the interactions are vastly different. You most assuredly are respecting the man and not the rank, as it were. However, the military is itself a form of Power Exchange, thus while the D/s is different, it may not be entirely dissimilar at certain conceptual levels.

In my mind, I am of the opinion that protocols, while not intrinsically required for the relationship, do facilitate the basic structure of Power Exchange. They don't make one either submissive or dominant, but they are a means of expressing submission and dominance as an interpersonal dynamic.

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 1:21:29 PM

ownedgirlie

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Interesting discussion.

I call him Master, because he is my Master. He is above me and this reference to him gives him the respect he deserves from me. Those who are is equal, or who are casual to him call him by name. I do not, and do not ever foresee myself doing so. I do have affectionate terms that I call him, Mr. Wonderful being one of them. It's funny because even my mother refers to him as Mr. Wonderful now :)

As for other protocols and rituals. He established a bed time ritual for me, which I didn't quite understand at first, but did anyway, of course. Over time I have realized how this ritual is the perfect way to end my day, relaxing me and bringing my mind to a calm and peaceful place. And it ends my day with my thoughts on him and my slavery to him. I am grateful for it.

He established a protocol of how I am to present myself to him, as well. It brings me focus, and prepares my mind for whatever he plans on doing to me, or having me do for him. I love it, and it would be awkward and uncomfortable now for me to offer myself to him in any other way.

Other protocols just sort of emerged on their own. They are things I took it upon myself to do, which he has grown accustomed to and now enjoys. For example, I often undress him when we are together, and every time I remove his shoes, I kiss his feet. He never required this; I just do it because I am drawn to do it. Yesterday I removed his shoes and I thought he said something to me so I re-positioned myself to a kneel and waited. And he looked at me and quirked his head, as though he was waiting for something that was missing. When I realized I had misunderstood and he had not spoken to me, I lowered my face back down to his feet to kiss them. Returning to my kneel, I noticed a change in his face, that he was now content. It was all quite subtle, but noticeable.

Things like this that I began to do on my own are now expectations that he enjoys. I wouldn't call them formal protocols or rituals, because they were never established as a rule for me. They just gradually became part of our dynamic, and something we both count on as an intimate expression of who and what we are to each other.

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 1:24:41 PM

Missokyst

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Heh.. Heck I must have been a wildchild. I can recall using the first names of my teachers when I was in grade school. And they never stopped me. LOL. And I have called various political types by their first names if I know them a bit. I never understood the concept of rank as it applies to a non military world. I think if one were to believe in passed lives I must have been one of those people who overthrew governments.
It is funny what triggers our buttons.
Kyst

quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

To paraphrase what was said in another thread...you salute the rank, not the man.

Now, obviously a D/s relationship is not the military--and the requirements and goals of the interactions are vastly different. You most assuredly are respecting the man and not the rank, as it were. However, the military is itself a form of Power Exchange, thus while the D/s is different, it may not be entirely dissimilar at certain conceptual levels.

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 1:31:04 PM

Archer

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Those protocols are most often a way of expressing the D/s involved in a situation.
They may or may not express respect for the person they do express recognition of the dynamic.

I still say that given the opportunity to observe over a period of time I could find protocols that even the most fervent anti protocol people have developed without even recognizing it was happening. Anything that happens regularly tends to form a protocol between people.

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RE: How important is protocol? - 9/4/2007 4:12:51 PM

LadyHugs

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Dear celticlord2112, Ladies and Gentlemen;

Protocol is very important to me, as it provides the foundation to conduct 'rituals' and or 'ceremonies' per se; which reaffirms our roles with each other and to the roles within the relationship.

Protocols provides the curtain or veil if you will, which passage to one phase into another can be distinctive and not prone to assumption. As a practice, protocol allows that mental and emotional phase in and or out of the M/s and or D/s role. It enhances the expectations and anticipations.

For an example, the kneeling of a slave/submissive is more than an obvious lowering to the knees. For me, it is a slave/submissive putting themselves in a position of disadvantage, it also places them in a position of which my natural perfume can work on their senses and begin the natural processes of arousal. For me, kneeling is a silent salute. I then feel the power is transferred because I am acknowledged in honor as well as authority and or invested by that slave/submissive. This allows the connection to begin--the energy exchange and we heighten off each other's power. The protocol in ending a session, permits the disengagement of that energy charged exchange, such as in a scene; to where we can recover ourselves and into a less intense moment. To me, protocol is the invisible curtain which helps me pass into different phases as well as the expectations of those phases.

Just some thoughts.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

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