RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check?

RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (Full Version)

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xoxi -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:08:16 AM)
I give up. You're right I did only quote a part of your post. The part I left out, aside from the quote of yourself by yourself from a previous post you wrote, was this: " How does that kind of behaviour promote mental health within the bdsm 'community', or does it matter to you?" I am honestly trying to give you advice here...I do think you make valid points occassionally, even the ones I disagree with. But far too often you don't let your points stand on their own merit and resort to whatever this is. Drama or throwing sand or whatever. Just can you like...try...for a week...to just make posts about the issues at hand instead of the people posting about them? Try to be the bigger man here? You might find it surprising how well people respond to valid contributions. Anyway I'm done here...I don't want you to think I'm bullying you...and no I'm not being facetious. If you honestly want to try to reduce your drama generating techniques feel free to hit me up on the other side and I can point out things that you might not even realize offend people. Otherwise I'll just have to assume that you like being persecuted...and take this quote t face value quote: Xoxi, you seem to be under the impression that I take offense that bullies don't like me. I happen to be quite proud to know I am the kind of person bullies don't like.

DMFParadox -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:08:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sammiebabygirl i am not a Dom and this is not a direct answer to your question, but it is an example of why some Doms may feel the need to be the "White Knight". i have a friend who is a self-identified Dom. He has been in the life style for many years and i will admit is a good Top. However, he is always the rescuer, whether he can afford to be one or not. We are friends and with us, it is give and take. He helps me out, but i give back. That is a friendship. Recently, a friend of mine started asking him to help her out financially. i was unaware she was doing this until he told me about it. He had been giving her money for a while and it was actually hurting his own finances. The only real connection between them was me. They were not friends and he was getting nothing in return from her. i asked him why he was doing it and he said, "because i need to be liked". i put a stop to it by telling her he cannot afford to help her anymore and not to ask. However, it is because of his need to be liked and other insecurities in himself that he will never be my Dom. jen Those insecurities are a death warrant. I've got similar ones--in my case, it's "saying the right thing" and the associated awkwardness, and yeah, it's something that can totally ruin it for a sub. Sometimes you just have to deal with the fact that you NEED to do or say those things that will drive people away. If you can't, then you're--in poker terms--scared money, and you're going to lose the game.

domiguy -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:12:04 AM)
(Domiguy flashes gang symbols....Takes his left hand and makes an "O" by connecting the thumb to the index finger then proceeds to take his extended right index finger and jam it back and forth throught the "O.") Yo, Bobby, whatchoo doin in this part of town? Your turf ends at the Arrrrrrrgh thread...You've stumbled into D.G. turf...What Am I supposed to do with you now? (Domiguy lifts up his shirt to show bob the gun tucked into his waistband....Bob's eyes dart nervously from the gun handle to the outline of the huge and heavenly Domidong accentuated nicely by the snug yet forgiving fit of some nicely faded Kenneth Cole Jeans) I thought back on September 6th you were not going to post on this thread anymore? So here it is the 30th and I see you have dishonored yourself by coming back out here.....If you were me...What would you do? (Domiguy reaches into waistband, pulls out gun and shoots Bob) Now look at you.

MidMichCowboy -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:14:18 AM)
I think I understand what you are getting at SusanofO. How do Dominants keep any tendency to want to be seen as "heroic" (or to be helpful) to a submissive in check for the good of their submissive, and also for themselves? It’s a thin line. I don’t mind helping people, as long as I won’t drag my children’s family situation down. I am not a miracle worker. I prefer a sub that is strong. I don’t mind helping her with some situations (much as I would any friend). If she is looking for someone to rescue her from situations of her own doing, the relationship is doomed. Protecting her from physical abuse from an ex, I’m ok with, as long as she does her part too. Helping to finance her grown children who are screw-ups and such, will not happen. I don’t need to be a hero to anyone but my children. In a good relationship, being a good support is important. Going too much further, can be a disaster.

winterlight -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:18:06 AM)
ignores this and all posts from .............

MissHarlet -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:22:50 AM)
Keywords are topics and not personalities ..... this is my mantra on the message boards ...

VieVivante -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:26:21 AM)
All this talk of white knights. Booorrrrring. I prefer to act the dark knight any day of the week. It is just sooo much more fun.

Bobkgin -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:42:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: xoxi I give up. You're right I did only quote a part of your post. The part I left out, aside from the quote of yourself by yourself from a previous post you wrote, Which happened to explain the linkage between white knights and bullies? quote: I am honestly trying to give you advice here...I do think you make valid points occassionally, even the ones I disagree with. But far too often you don't let your points stand on their own merit and resort to whatever this is. Drama or throwing sand or whatever. Aswad and I have had many discussions in the forum. None produced "drama or throwing sand or whatever". Submittous and I have had many exchanges in the forum. None produced "drama or throwing sand or whatever". Now either we explain this by saying that both Aswad and Submittous are my bootlickers, or we acknowledge that mature people can have civil discussions including disagreements without resorting to "drama or throwing sand or whatever". And if we can stipulate the latter, then what does that say about all the "drama or throwing sand or whatever" Merc and his gang initiate whenever they engage me? quote: Just can you like...try...for a week...to just make posts about the issues at hand instead of the people posting about them? Try to be the bigger man here? You might find it surprising how well people respond to valid contributions. The bullies are not going to transform into mature individuals in a week, or any time soon, Xoxi. I ignore a good deal more of their pus than I address. And I will continue to do so. But ignoring most does not require me to ignore all of it. From time to time it is good to air out this topic instead of seeing threads bushwhacked by the bullying. quote: Anyway I'm done here...I don't want you to think I'm bullying you...and no I'm not being facetious. If you honestly want to try to reduce your drama generating techniques feel free to hit me up on the other side and I can point out things that you might not even realize offend people. Otherwise I'll just have to assume that you like being persecuted...and take this quote t face value quote: Xoxi, you seem to be under the impression that I take offense that bullies don't like me. I happen to be quite proud to know I am the kind of person bullies don't like. I don't know anyone who likes being persecuted. But it is a fact of life for some of us, and I've learned to live with it. And I would certainly want people to take the above quote at face value.

came4U -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:59:36 AM)
quote: Yo, Bobby, whatchoo doin in this part of town? Your turf ends at the Arrrrrrrgh thread...You've stumbled into D.G. turf...What Am I supposed to do with you now? (Domiguy lifts up his shirt to show bob the gun tucked into his waistband....Bob's eyes dart nervously from the gun handle to the outline of the huge and heavenly Domidong accentuated nicely by the snug yet forgiving fit of some nicely faded Kenneth Cole Jeans) uhh was that a death threat?? was that a real genuine death threat or a fake internet death threat???? I do believe that was an actual death threat. I wouldn't even bother complaining here, I would go direct to a legitimate source. For god sakes..what has this become??? This has gone beyond bullying, it has just turned sick sick!

Bobkgin -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 8:59:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: domiguy Domiguy .... pulls out gun and shoots Bob And another member of the gang shows up.

domiguy -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 9:04:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bobkgin I don't know anyone who likes being persecuted. But it is a fact of life for some of us, and I've learned to live with it. Yes...I read about the plight of the Bobkgin's in a history book....You were all rounded up and gassed....It was horrible. Stripped of all possessions. Treated like animals....But you, my friend, are a survivor..."The Last of the Bobkgins" .....You are the remaining remnant of a tedious and long winded peoples....Go with God, my friend.

came4U -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 9:06:25 AM)
I do NOT affiliate with gangs or associate with any internet bullies nor chasing/following/and other such goofy behaviour. I act and think ALONE. Glad I am able and qualified of such. What was the topic anyways? Oh yes, a topic on 'white knights' and then some violent wording occured. Gotcha.

crouchingtigress -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 9:16:30 AM)
i hope you dont mind me chiming in with a totally different POV as usual what you are talking about is a human quality, and a very useful and beautiful one...we all want to rescue. be it animals, siblings, friends, relationships. our species is an interdependent one, and the reason babies are born totally helpless. in order to really thrive as we go through life we have to be giving as much as we a re taking, its just a natural law. now to you question: who we rescue is a huge clue as to what triggers us internally....so yes i may want to make sure the baby bird i just found gets the best medical care, and not even give a dollar to a street person...neither life is more valuable but because of a value judgement i have deemed it so... these events and my reactions to them if i stand back and not judge offer very powerful bread crumbs to lead me in to a forest of the deepest self knowledge... if wandering alone and vulnerable in the dark Forrest of your psyche, is your thing, then it is a great tool....most of us it is not our thing though, so we end up simply reacting to one trigger over another with out ever thinking it through....which makes keeping it in check really hard to do. the ones that can keep in in check ae the ones that self examine thier motivations and possible payoffs...and possible losses and make a sound assessment of each...

crouchingtigress -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 9:27:17 AM)
bob: a rock when smashed upon another rock does damage to both rocks, but a rock when smashed in to water just sinks....

Mercnbeth -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 10:00:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bobkgin quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth quote: So what should we think of Merc taking quotes out of the Safe punishment. thread and posting them to the Why is Punishment not seen as Abusive? thread so as merely to smear me? If he had issue with the quotes in the Safe punishment. thread, why not post his comments there? Bob I had no issues until your pontificating was getting tiresome and your hypocrisy and the inconsistency of your own words and self importance was no blatant that it required illumination. No need for a "white knight" to protect anyone though - just keep posting. Thanks, me and the rest of the "gang" enjoy you immensely! Bullies usually do, until people get bored with the bullies. Eventually, Merc, bullies become irrelevant. Only so many times you can cry "wolf" and get people to look. Now Bob, I thought the "Bobkin Rules" were to quote completely? quote: Bob I had no issues until your pontificating was getting tiresome and your hypocrisy and the inconsistency of your own words and self importance was no blatant that it required illumination. Remember, they are your quotes Bob no matter where they appear. Sorry if your words "smear" you. The response to them also "smears" you. You have yet to respond to why they "smear" you when quoted in their entirety. Your inconsistency smears you. The paranoia you have needing to accusing people who point out your conflict, smear you. Bob - YOU smear you. Edited to add: Actually in thinking about it further I was wrong. Never afraid to point it out when it happens. You don't smear you. There is no "smearing" on your part at all; only further clarification and confirmation. Sorry to be so wrong. Look at the most obvious confirming example. You "withdraw" your "dominance" in the event of conflict and you "block" those who have a conflict with you hear. VERY consistent at a level of consistency that people strive to achieve in their life. Avoidance and withdraw with a large dash of immature "peeking" between squinted eyes and behind spread fingers, and a healthy dose of name calling. No need for a "white knight" to protect anyone though - just keep posting. Thanks, me and the rest of the "gang" enjoy you immensely! No answers of course only more name calling. If a "bully" dictates terms and conditions and responds to challenge by "withdraw" and name calling; which view, between our two expressed, is an example of that condition? Go ahead, you have permission to draw from any post of ours, inclusive of beth's perhaps a easier target, and find any "one true way" or even a "group one true way". We stand by who we are, how we live, and what we do, with no condition or need for validation that one other person or couple need do the same. Of course you can make a similar representation however it doesn't hold up in the face of documented posting. I can understand why my doing so upsets you. However... My, My, -- VERY high marks for consistency. Never has a mirror been so effective an illustration tool. Trust I'll never tire of holding it up to you or any similar source of hypocrisy; which may suit your goal of being relevant. As stated in one of my first responses to you - you are important. A negative example is effected and necessary to point out a positive path. Sorry to be unable to continue for a bit. The Street Fair starts in 1 hour! GREAT PICS forthcoming!

Bobkgin -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (9/30/2007 10:00:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: crouchingtigress i hope you dont mind me chiming in with a totally different POV as usual That's what a discussion is for. [:)] quote: what you are talking about is a human quality, and a very useful and beautiful one...we all want to rescue. be it animals, siblings, friends, relationships. The willingness to rescue the young is something most mammals do (and stipulating there are mammals that will eat their young). It is a very useful and beautiful quality under the right circumstances, and not in other circumstances. quote: our species is an interdependent one, and the reason babies are born totally helpless. in order to really thrive as we go through life we have to be giving as much as we a re taking, its just a natural law. That is subject to many different interpretations. [;)] quote: now to you question: who we rescue is a huge clue as to what triggers us internally....so yes i may want to make sure the baby bird i just found gets the best medical care, and not even give a dollar to a street person...neither life is more valuable but because of a value judgement i have deemed it so... these events and my reactions to them if i stand back and not judge offer very powerful bread crumbs to lead me in to a forest of the deepest self knowledge... if wandering alone and vulnerable in the dark Forrest of your psyche, is your thing, then it is a great tool....most of us it is not our thing though, so we end up simply reacting to one trigger over another with out ever thinking it through....which makes keeping it in check really hard to do. the ones that can keep in in check ae the ones that self examine thier motivations and possible payoffs...and possible losses and make a sound assessment of each... I happen to be one of those who does walk the "dark Forest". And you are quite right, the choices we make leave "powerful bread crumbs" with which to understand what motivates an individual.

Bobkgin -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (10/4/2007 5:41:19 AM)
What is so ironic about the "white knight" syndrome is how much attention and sympathy it generates for their target. Bad enough seeing ten or fifteen people following a single individual, attacking him/her at every opportunity. We all tend to feel sympathy for such an individual as most of us have witnessed such "swarmings" in school yards. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people must resort to the worst, and most obvious, forms of propaganda to make their 'point'. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people attack every thread where their target appears, ruining the discussion for everyone else in their zeal to get their target. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people contribute almost no on-topic material, if indeed they contribute any, while attacking a thread to get their target. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people must flaunt their immaturity over and over again. But because of their antics, they generate more traffic through their target's profile than he'd likely get any other way. And what's worse, it is not at all infrequent that someone writes their target to compliment him on his profile. One lady even said it was the best she'd read in the three years she'd been here. Net result of "white knight" syndrome? I leave the math to the audience at large.

Mercnbeth -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (10/4/2007 6:12:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bobkgin What is so ironic about the "white knight" syndrome is how much attention and sympathy it generates for their target. Bad enough seeing ten or fifteen people following a single individual, attacking him/her at every opportunity. We all tend to feel sympathy for such an individual as most of us have witnessed such "swarmings" in school yards. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people must resort to the worst, and most obvious, forms of propaganda to make their 'point'. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people attack every thread where their target appears, ruining the discussion for everyone else in their zeal to get their target. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people contribute almost no on-topic material, if indeed they contribute any, while attacking a thread to get their target. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people must flaunt their immaturity over and over again. But because of their antics, they generate more traffic through their target's profile than he'd likely get any other way. And what's worse, it is not at all infrequent that someone writes their target to compliment him on his profile. One lady even said it was the best she'd read in the three years she'd been here. Net result of "white knight" syndrome? I leave the math to the audience at large. That's just about the saddest and loneliest post I've ever seen on CM.

camille65 -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (10/4/2007 6:21:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Bobkgin What is so ironic about the "white knight" syndrome is how much attention and sympathy it generates for their target. Bad enough seeing ten or fifteen people following a single individual, attacking him/her at every opportunity. We all tend to feel sympathy for such an individual as most of us have witnessed such "swarmings" in school yards. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people must resort to the worst, and most obvious, forms of propaganda to make their 'point'. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people attack every thread where their target appears, ruining the discussion for everyone else in their zeal to get their target. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people contribute almost no on-topic material, if indeed they contribute any, while attacking a thread to get their target. Bad enough these ten or fifteen people must flaunt their immaturity over and over again. But because of their antics, they generate more traffic through their target's profile than he'd likely get any other way. And what's worse, it is not at all infrequent that someone writes their target to compliment him on his profile. One lady even said it was the best she'd read in the three years she'd been here. Net result of "white knight" syndrome? I leave the math to the audience at large. Removing the personal angle, and the white knight angle your left with the complaint of a group of posters that continously repeat behaviour. I agree with much of what was posted here. There are some posters that even without reading I can guess the gist of what they are posting. It can be tiresome and irritating but there is nothing I personally can do about it, so I usually stay silent on it. Bob, you now fall into that catagory. Your views and stance do not change, you are unwilling or unable to accept anothers way of thinking/being. That is I guess, part and parcel of having an open forum. I would rather put up with it than have a forum that is so heavily moderated that only certain views can be put out.

Skier -> RE: How do Dominants keep "White Knight" syndrome in check? (10/4/2007 6:30:53 AM)
I don't do lost causes, but I plead guilty to being afflicted with the White Knight Syndrome. Not attacking or defending it. That's just the way it is. So far it doesn't seem to negatively impact my ability to function in the real world.

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