Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming Page: [1] 2 3   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 4:00:59 PM   
SuzanneKneeling


Posts: 233
Joined: 8/31/2005
Status: offline
In case there's anyone here who still needs to see how unanimous the scientific world is on the fact that we are driving climate change with greenhouse gas emissions, you can read about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_opinion_on_climate_change

National and international science academies and professional societies have assessed the current scientific opinion on climate change, in particular recent global warming. These assessments have largely followed or endorsed the IPCC position that "An increasing body of observations gives a collective picture of a warming world and other changes in the climate system... There is new and stronger evidence that most of the warming observed over the last 50 years is attributable to human activities".[1]

This page documents scientific opinion as given by synthesis reports, scientific bodies of national or international standing, and surveys of opinion among climate scientists. It does not document the views of individual scientists or self-selected lists of individuals such as petitions.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 4:33:34 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
One day, I'm finding a model of the green-house effect.  Or making it.  Whatever.

quote:

ORIGINAL:  Joint science academies' statement on growth and responsibility: sustainability, energy, efficiency and climate protection

It is unequivocal that the climate is changing, and it is very likely that this is predominantly caused by the increasing human interference with the atmosphere. These changes will transform the environmental conditions on Earth unless counter-measures are taken.


Probably my favorite summation so far.

(in reply to SuzanneKneeling)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 5:28:06 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CuriousLord

One day, I'm finding a model of the green-house effect.  Or making it.  Whatever.

quote:

ORIGINAL:  Joint science academies' statement on growth and responsibility: sustainability, energy, efficiency and climate protection

It is unequivocal that the climate is changing, and it is very likely that this is predominantly caused by the increasing human interference with the atmosphere. These changes will transform the environmental conditions on Earth unless counter-measures are taken.


Probably my favorite summation so far.


Thank you susan,for taking the time to research and post this.

Some will never "get it".But like kids who cross their arms and hold their breath,trying to be difficult,we,the normal,thoughtful,regular folks will just have to drag the kid along,kicking and screaming.

These so called conservatives,and their lack of forethought,is shameful.Putting us into debts so large,our kids will have to pay them.Using up every last resource and burning the environment up,while they roam the earth.Leaving the mess and the clean up,for our kids,and their kids.

The level of selfishness is just astounding.

I once heard Rush Limbaugh say, that people before him polluted the earth,so he was going to,also.Like it was his "right" to pollute,and had to do his share of the damage.He wasn`t going to go along with any of this new,conservation thinking.In fact,he links the environmental movement,to the Communist movement.That`s not a joke.

When conservitives inserted politics into science and medicine(starting w/ Regan),
they caused a lot of damage.Everything from the enitial mis-handling of the AIDS crisis,and  Terri Schiavo,to the pin heads who are getting in the way of fixing the climate change problems.

Just shut  them up,and put them in the back seat,like kids.

Hey curiouslord,you might find a green-house model to fit you,here.
http://www.alaska.net/~clund/e_djublonskopf/Flatearthsociety.htm






http://www.alaska.net/~clund/e_djublonskopf/Flatearthsociety.htm

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 9/16/2007 5:33:10 PM >

(in reply to CuriousLord)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 7:52:31 PM   
HaveRopeWillBind


Posts: 514
Joined: 7/15/2006
Status: offline
This is the part of that Wikipedia page that I liked...

"Dissenting statements

With the release of the revised statement by the
American Association of Petroleum Geologists, no scientific bodies of national or international standing are known to reject the basic findings of human influence on recent climate."
 
None. Yet people on here keep going on about how the climate effect is in question by reputable scientists and peer study groups. So where are they? The whole bit of questioning global warming was originally begun and financed by tobacco companies with the thinking that if they could cast doubt on the science of climate change then the science of second-hand smoke might be suspect as well. Kind of a guilt by association sort of thing where all science comes into question.

Yes the climate has cycled up and down before, but always over a span of at least hundreds and more commonly thousands of years. Never before has it cycled in the span of a single lifetime.

< Message edited by HaveRopeWillBind -- 9/16/2007 7:54:03 PM >

(in reply to Owner59)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:03:41 PM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HaveRopeWillBind
Yes the climate has cycled up and down before, but always over a span of at least hundreds and more commonly thousands of years. Never before has it cycled in the span of a single lifetime.

That is the Milenkovitch lie. In fact there have been drastic rises in average global temperatures of at least five degrees occurring in less than a year. (The climatologists are scared by that as they do not understand how that is possible; I do.) Also there have been significant drops in global temperatures due to volcanic activity (like that of Santorini in 1649 BC).

(in reply to HaveRopeWillBind)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:16:22 PM   
FangsNfeet


Posts: 3758
Joined: 12/3/2004
Status: offline
Oh well, another Scientific Consensus is that the Sun will one day go Super Nova in about 4.5 billion years. In another 11 billion years after that, the Milky Way galaxy is suppose to collide and be eaten by Andromada. Our planet, solar system, and galazy are fucked. So what's the big deal with gas emissions, green house effects, and global warming?

The human race needs technology without any handicaps for faster colonization of the universe so we don't face extention. Right now, we're all one easy target for a Gamma Ray, Massive Solar Flare, Asteroid, or Commet to hit us. Earth can't be saved. It's best we take every resouce we can dig up and get the hell off the third rock before it's too late. 

_____________________________

I'm Godzilla and you're Japan

(in reply to SuzanneKneeling)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:24:50 PM   
HaveRopeWillBind


Posts: 514
Joined: 7/15/2006
Status: offline
Santorini, much like Mt Pinatubo and Mt St Helen's, even Krakatoa, and Vesuvius were mere blips on the geological scales with no effect greater than a decade and mostly over within 2 years. That is like comparing apples and oranges just to confuse the issue. As for the 5 degree changes you mentioned none have been worldwide, only local in scope from what I have read. That again is a bad comparison. Your body can have temperature variances of that much from one part to another, that doesn't mean you are sick. There are lots of ways to have sudden localized temperature changes for a limited period of time. That's not what global warming is all about. Global warming is about long term trends, not some erratic spiking. The trend is up, and it is up faster than ever in history. That's what it's about and why it is alarming.

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:33:42 PM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HaveRopeWillBind
Santorini, much like Mt Pinatubo and Mt St Helen's, even Krakatoa, and Vesuvius were mere blips on the geological scales with no effect greater than a decade and mostly over within 2 years.

Indeed? Know anything about dendrochronology?
 
quote:

ORIGINAL: HaveRopeWillBind
As for the 5 degree changes you mentioned none have been worldwide, only local in scope from what I have read.

Per chance you should read some more, eh?

(in reply to HaveRopeWillBind)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:40:17 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
HaveRope, but we can't think like that-no grant money!
People can think whatever they want just stay the fuck away from my tax dollars!
The *last* thing we need to do is to give another dime to the global socialists in the "U.N."
U.S. Taxpayers shouldn't be paying for lobster dinners and "pension plans" for those non-producing layabouts!


_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to HaveRopeWillBind)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:43:53 PM   
HaveRopeWillBind


Posts: 514
Joined: 7/15/2006
Status: offline
If you mean the study of tree rings, I only know a bit. One thing I do know is that they are not really valid for massive climate change because in that case the tree would not likely still live in an altered climate. Most plant life requires a relatively stable climate to survive after all. The fact that the California Redwoods are over 2000 years old only shows that the climate has been predominantly stable for that long. The chance that they won't survive another 50 to 100 years is pretty good now.

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 8:48:27 PM   
HaveRopeWillBind


Posts: 514
Joined: 7/15/2006
Status: offline
Popeye,
I'm not a big fan of the UN either. But they are not the only ones calling in on Global Warming. The scientific community that is recognized as such in the US is on board too. The UN is trying to call the shots on how to deal with it. But in the end it is a worldwide problem and they are the only worldwide governing body we have that functions at all currently. So like them or not they need to be in it or be replaced by a better organization. No single country is going to fix this.

(in reply to HaveRopeWillBind)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 9:01:47 PM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
When crops do not grow due to a volcanic eruption, humanity has got a serious problem, not so? Admittedly the problem will be most severe in the afflicted hemisphere at higher latitudes, but the lower latitudes will suffer as well, both directly and indirectly.

(in reply to HaveRopeWillBind)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 9:16:23 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HaveRopeWillBind

Popeye,
I'm not a big fan of the UN either. But they are not the only ones calling in on Global Warming. The scientific community that is recognized as such in the US is on board too. The UN is trying to call the shots on how to deal with it. But in the end it is a worldwide problem and they are the only worldwide governing body we have that functions at all currently. So like them or not they need to be in it or be replaced by a better organization. No single country is going to fix this.


HaveRope, the "U.N." is not a "governing" body.
They're supposed to be a deliberative body but they've turned out to be an organized crime body.
It needs to be disbanded!
Why pour money into a 40 year old car that's engine has seized and body is rusted.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to HaveRopeWillBind)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 9:44:08 PM   
Mayhem1703


Posts: 10
Joined: 8/20/2007
Status: offline
The before mentioned 5 degree drop of temperature is what caused what was called the Little Ice Age...  Don't remember a ton about it, but saw a thing about it on the History Channel...  Look it up, might have better information than a roughly 3 or 4 month ago memory...

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/16/2007 11:18:06 PM   
seeksfemslave


Posts: 4011
Joined: 6/16/2006
Status: offline
 
quote:

AASC
Climate prediction is difficult because it involves complex, nonlinear interactions among all components of the earth’s environmental system. (...) The AASC recognizes that human activities have an influence on the climate system. Such activities, however, are not limited to greenhouse gas forcing and include changing land use and sulfate emissions, which further complicates the issue of climate prediction. Furthermore, climate predictions have not demonstrated skill in projecting future variability .....


Who said dat ? AASC = American Association of State Climatologists.

(in reply to SuzanneKneeling)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/17/2007 12:25:33 AM   
pollux


Posts: 657
Joined: 7/26/2005
Status: offline
Since we're quoting Wikipedia...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientists_opposing_the_mainstream_scientific_assessment_of_global_warming

quote:

Believe accuracy of IPCC climate projections is inadequate Scientists in this section conclude that it is not possible to project global climate accurately enough to justify the ranges projected for temperature and sea-level rise over the next century. They do not conclude specifically that the current IPCC projections are either too high or too low, but that the projections are likely to be inaccurate due to inadequacies of current global climate modeling.
  • Roger A. Pielke, Senior Research Scientist at the Cooperative Institute for Research in Environmental Sciences (CIRES) wrote: “Humans are significantly altering the global climate, but in a variety of diverse ways beyond the radiative effect of carbon dioxide. The IPCC assessments have been too conservative in recognizing the importance of these human climate forcings as they alter regional and global climate. These assessments have also not communicated the inability of the models to accurately forecast the spread of possibilities of future climate. The forecasts, therefore, do not provide any skill in quantifying the impact of different mitigation strategies on the actual climate response that would occur.” [8]
  • Hendrik Tennekes, retired Director of Research, Royal Netherlands Meteorological Institute: "The blind adherence to the harebrained idea that climate models can generate 'realistic' simulations of climate is the principal reason why I remain a climate skeptic. From my background in turbulence I look forward with grim anticipation to the day that climate models will run with a horizontal resolution of less than a kilometer. The horrible predictability problems of turbulent flows then will descend on climate science with a vengeance." [9]
  • Antonino Zichichi, emeritus professor of physics at the University of Bologna and president of the World Federation of Scientists : "models used by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) are incoherent and invalid from a scientific point of view". [10]
[edit] Believe global warming is primarily caused by natural processes Scientists in this section conclude that the observed warming is more likely attributable to natural causes than to human activities.
  • Khabibullo Abdusamatov, mathematician and astronomer at Pulkovskaya Observatory of the Russian Academy of Sciences and the supervisor of the Astrometria project of the Russian section of the International Space Station: "Global warming results not from the emission of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere, but from an unusually high level of solar radiation and a lengthy - almost throughout the last century - growth in its intensity...Ascribing 'greenhouse' effect properties to the Earth's atmosphere is not scientifically substantiated...Heated greenhouse gases, which become lighter as a result of expansion, ascend to the atmosphere only to give the absorbed heat away." (Russian News & Information Agency, Jan. 15, 2007 [11]) (See also [12], [13], [14])
  • Sallie Baliunas, astronomer, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics: "[T]he recent warming trend in the surface temperature record cannot be caused by the increase of human-made greenhouse gases in the air." (Capitalism Magazine, August 22, 2002)[15] Baliunas and Soon wrote that "there is no reliable evidence for increased severity or frequency of storms, droughts, or floods that can be related to the air’s increased greenhouse gas content." (Marshall Institute, March 25, 2003) [16]
  • David Bellamy, environmental campaigner, broadcaster and former botanist: "Global warming is a largely natural phenomenon. The world is wasting stupendous amounts of money on trying to fix something that can’t be fixed."[17] Bellamy later admitted that he had cited faulty data and announced on 29 May 2005 that he had "decided to draw back from the debate on global warming", [18] but in 2006 he joined a climate skeptic organization [19] and in 2007 published a paper arguing that a doubling of atmospheric CO2 "will amount to less than 1°C of global warming [and] such a scenario is unlikely to arise given our limited reserves of fossil fuels—certainly not before the end of this century." [20]
  • Reid Bryson, emeritus professor of Atmospheric and Oceanic Sciences, University of Wisconsin-Madison: "It’s absurd. Of course it’s going up. It has gone up since the early 1800s, before the Industrial Revolution, because we’re coming out of the Little Ice Age, not because we’re putting more carbon dioxide into the air." [21].
  • Robert M. Carter, geologist, researcher at the Marine Geophysical Laboratory at James Cook University in Australia: "The essence of the issue is this. Climate changes naturally all the time, partly in predictable cycles, and partly in unpredictable shorter rhythms and rapid episodic shifts, some of the causes of which remain unknown." (Telegraph, April 9, 2006 [22])
  • George V. Chilingar, Professor of Civil and Petroleum Engineering at the University of Southern California: "The authors identify and describe the following global forces of nature driving the Earth’s climate: (1) solar radiation ..., (2) outgassing as a major supplier of gases to the World Ocean and the atmosphere, and, possibly, (3) microbial activities ... . The writers provide quantitative estimates of the scope and extent of their corresponding effects on the Earth’s climate [and] show that the human-induced climatic changes are negligible." (Environmental Geology, vol. 50 no. 6, August 2006 [23])
  • Ian Clark, hydrogeologist, professor, Department of Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa: "That portion of the scientific community that attributes climate warming to CO2 relies on the hypothesis that increasing CO2, which is in fact a minor greenhouse gas, triggers a much larger water vapour response to warm the atmosphere. This mechanism has never been tested scientifically beyond the mathematical models that predict extensive warming, and are confounded by the complexity of cloud formation - which has a cooling effect. ... We know that [the sun] was responsible for climate change in the past, and so is clearly going to play the lead role in present and future climate change. And interestingly... solar activity has recently begun a downward cycle." (The Hill Times, March 22, 2004 [24])
  • Don Easterbrook, emeritus professor of geology, Western Washington University: "global warming since 1900 could well have happened without any effect of CO2. If the cycles continue as in the past, the current warm cycle should end soon and global temperatures should cool slightly until about 2035" [25]
  • William M. Gray, Professor of Atmospheric Science, Colorado State University: "This small warming is likely a result of the natural alterations in global ocean currents which are driven by ocean salinity variations. Ocean circulation variations are as yet little understood. Human kind has little or nothing to do with the recent temperature changes. We are not that influential."[26]) "I am of the opinion that [global warming] is one of the greatest hoaxes ever perpetrated on the American people." [27]) "So many people have a vested interest in this global-warming thing—all these big labs and research and stuff. The idea is to frighten the public, to get money to study it more."[28])
  • George Kukla, retired Professor of Climatology at Columbia University and Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory, said in an interview: "What I think is this: Man is responsible for a PART of global warming. MOST of it is still natural." (Gelf Magazine, April 24, 2007) [29]
  • David Legates, associate professor of geography and director of the Center for Climatic Research, University of Delaware: "About half of the warming during the 20th century occurred prior to the 1940s, and natural variability accounts for all or nearly all of the warming." (May 15, 2006 [30])
  • Marcel Leroux, former Professor of Climatology, Université Jean Moulin: "The possible causes, then, of climate change are: well-established orbital parameters on the palaeoclimatic scale, ... solar activity, ...; volcanism ...; and far at the rear, the greenhouse effect, and in particular that caused by water vapor, the extent of its influence being unknown. These factors are working together all the time, and it seems difficult to unravel the relative importance of their respective influences upon climatic evolution. Equally, it is tendentious to highlight the anthropic factor, which is, clearly, the least credible among all those previously mentioned." (M. Leroux, Global Warming - Myth or Reality?, 2005, p. 120 [31])
  • Tad Murty, oceanographer; adjunct professor, Departments of Civil Engineering and Earth Sciences, University of Ottawa: global warming "is the biggest scientific hoax being perpetrated on humanity. There is no global warming due to human anthropogenic activities. The atmosphere hasn’t changed much in 280 million years, and there have always been cycles of warming and cooling. The Cretaceous period was the warmest on earth. You could have grown tomatoes at the North Pole"[32]
  • Tim Patterson [33], paleoclimatologist and Professor of Geology at Carleton University in Canada: "There is no meaningful correlation between CO2 levels and Earth's temperature over this [geologic] time frame. In fact, when CO2 levels were over ten times higher than they are now, about 450 million years ago, the planet was in the depths of the absolute coldest period in the last half billion years. On the basis of this evidence, how could anyone still believe that the recent relatively small increase in CO2 levels would be the major cause of the past century's modest warming?" [34][35]
  • Ian Plimer, Professor of Mining Geology, The University of Adelaide: "We only have to have one volcano burping and we have changed the whole planetary climate... It looks as if carbon dioxide actually follows climate change rather than drives it". [36]
  • Frederick Seitz, retired, former solid-state physicist, former president of the National Academy of Sciences: "So we see that the scientific facts indicate that all the temperature changes observed in the last 100 years were largely natural changes and were not caused by carbon dioxide produced in human activities." (Environment News, 2001 [37])
  • Nir Shaviv, astrophysicist at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem: "[T]he truth is probably somewhere in between [the common view and that of skeptics], with natural causes probably being more important over the past century, whereas anthropogenic causes will probably be more dominant over the next century. ... [A]bout 2/3's (give or take a third or so) of the warming [over the past century] should be attributed to increased solar activity and the remaining to anthropogenic causes." His opinion is based on some proxies of solar activity over the past few centuries. [38]
  • Fred Singer, Professor emeritus of Environmental Sciences at the University of Virginia: "The greenhouse effect is real. However, the effect is minute, insignificant, and very difficult to detect." (Christian Science Monitor, April 22, 2005) [39] "The Earth currently is experiencing a warming trend, but there is scientific evidence that human activities have little to do with it.", NCPA Study No. 279, Sep. 2005 [40]. “It’s not automatically true that warming is bad, I happen to believe that warming is good, and so do many economists.” (CBC's Denial machine @ 19:23 - Google Video Link)
  • Willie Soon, astrophysicist, Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics: "[T]here's increasingly strong evidence that previous research conclusions, including those of the United Nations and the United States government concerning 20th century warming, may have been biased by underestimation of natural climate variations. The bottom line is that if these variations are indeed proven true, then, yes, natural climate fluctuations could be a dominant factor in the recent warming. In other words, natural factors could be more important than previously assumed." (Harvard University Gazette, 24 April 2003 [41])
  • Philip Stott, professor emeritus of biogeography at the University of London: "...the myth is starting to implode. ... Serious new research at The Max Planck Institute has indicated that the sun is a far more significant factor..." (Global Warming as Myth [42])
  • Henrik Svensmark, Danish National Space Center: "Our team ... has discovered that the relatively few cosmic rays that reach sea-level play a big part in the everyday weather. They help to make low-level clouds, which largely regulate the Earth’s surface temperature. During the 20th Century the influx of cosmic rays decreased and the resulting reduction of cloudiness allowed the world to warm up. ... most of the warming during the 20th Century can be explained by a reduction in low cloud cover." [43]
  • Jan Veizer, environmental geochemist, Professor Emeritus from University of Ottawa: "At this stage, two scenarios of potential human impact on climate appear feasible: (1) the standard IPCC model ..., and (2) the alternative model that argues for celestial phenomena as the principal climate driver. ... Models and empirical observations are both indispensable tools of science, yet when discrepancies arise, observations should carry greater weight than theory. If so, the multitude of empirical observations favours celestial phenomena as the most important driver of terrestrial climate on most time scales, but time will be the final judge." (In J. Veizer, "Celestial climate driver: a perspective from four billion years of the carbon cycle", Geoscience Canada, March, 2005. [44], [45])
[edit] Believe cause of global warming is unknown Scientists in this section conclude it is too early to ascribe any principal cause to the observed rising temperatures, man-made or natural.
  • Syun-Ichi Akasofu, retired professor of geophysics and Director of the International Arctic Research Center of the University of Alaska Fairbanks: "[T]he method of study adopted by the International Panel of Climate Change (IPCC) is fundamentally flawed, resulting in a baseless conclusion: Most of the observed increase in globally averaged temperatures since the mid-20th century is very likely due to the observed increase in anthropogenic greenhouse gas concentrations. Contrary to this statement ..., there is so far no definitive evidence that 'most' of the present warming is due to the greenhouse effect. ... [The IPCC] should have recognized that the range of observed natural changes should not be ignored, and thus their conclusion should be very tentative. The term 'most' in their conclusion is baseless." [46]
  • Claude Allègre, geochemist, Institute of Geophysics (Paris): "The increase in the CO2 content of the atmosphere is an observed fact and mankind is most certainly responsible. In the long term, this increase will without doubt become harmful, but its exact role in the climate is less clear. Various parameters appear more important than CO2. Consider the water cycle and formation of various types of clouds, and the complex effects of industrial or agricultural dust. Or fluctuations of the intensity of the solar radiation on annual and century scale, which seem better correlated with heating effects than the variations of CO2 content." (Translation from the original French version in L'Express, May 10, 2006 [47])
  • Robert C. Balling, Jr., director of the Office of Climatology and a professor of geography at Arizona State University: "[I]t is very likely that the recent upward trend [in global surface temperature] is very real and that the upward signal is greater than any noise introduced from uncertainties in the record. However, the general error is most likely to be in the warming direction, with a maximum possible (though unlikely) value of 0.3 °C. ... At this moment in time we know only that: (1) Global surface temperatures have risen in recent decades. (2) Mid-tropospheric temperatures have warmed little over the same period. (3) This difference is not consistent with predictions from numerical climate models." (George C. Marshall Institute, Policy Outlook, September 2003[48])
  • John Christy, professor of atmospheric science and director of the Earth System Science Center at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, contributor to several IPCC reports (answering to "If global temperatures are increasing, to what extent is the increase attributable to greenhouse gas emissions from human activity as opposed to natural variability or other causes?"): "No one knows. Estimates today are given by climate model simulations made against a backdrop of uncertain natural variability, assumptions about how greenhouse gases affect the climate, and model shortcomings in general. The evidence from our work (and others) is that the way the observed temperatures are changing in many important aspects is not consistent with model simulations." [49]
  • William R. Cotton, Professor of Atmospheric Sciences at University of Colorado said in a presentation, "It is an open question if human produced changes in climate are large enough to be detected from the noise of the natural variability of the climate system." [50]
  • Chris de Freitas, Associate Professor, School of Geography, Geology and Environmental Science, University of Auckland: "There is evidence of global warming. ... But warming does not confirm that carbon dioxide is causing it. Climate is always warming or cooling. There are natural variability theories of warming. To support the argument that carbon dioxide is causing it, the evidence would have to distinguish between human-caused and natural warming. This has not been done." (The New Zealand Herald, May 9, 2006 [51])
  • David Deming, geology professor at the University of Oklahoma: "The amount of climatic warming that has taken place in the past 150 years is poorly constrained, and its cause--human or natural--is unknown. There is no sound scientific basis for predicting future climate change with any degree of certainty. If the climate does warm, it is likely to be beneficial to humanity rather than harmful. In my opinion, it would be foolish to establish national energy policy on the basis of misinformation and irrational hysteria." (Testimony before the U.S. Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works, December 6, 2006 [52])
  • Richard Lindzen, Alfred Sloane Professor of Atmospheric Science at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and member of the National Academy of Sciences: "We are quite confident (1) that global mean temperature is about 0.5 °C higher than it was a century ago; (2) that atmospheric levels of CO2 have risen over the past two centuries; and (3) that CO2 is a greenhouse gas whose increase is likely to warm the earth (one of many, the most important being water vapor and clouds). But--and I cannot stress this enough--we are not in a position to confidently attribute past climate change to CO2 or to forecast what the climate will be in the future." [53] "[T]here has been no question whatsoever that CO2 is an infrared absorber (i.e., a greenhouse gas — albeit a minor one), and its increase should theoretically contribute to warming. Indeed, if all else were kept equal, the increase in CO2 should have led to somewhat more warming than has been observed." (San Francisco Examiner, July 12, 2006 [54] and in Wall Street Journal, June 26, 2006, Page A14)
  • Roy Spencer, principal research scientist, University of Alabama in Huntsville: "We need to find out how much of the warming we are seeing could be due to mankind, because I still maintain we have no idea how much you can attribute to mankind." (George C. Marshall Institute Washington Roundtable on Science and Public Policy, April 17, 2006 [55])


(in reply to SuzanneKneeling)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/17/2007 12:48:20 AM   
Hottiegurl


Posts: 180
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline
the history channel tonight had a program on the earth, it was very interesting... it went along with saying that the earth was warming up and it will continue to do so ... even with the event of the "Global Warming" but then went on to say that it does not matter... later will come the next ice age and it will stop the warming.
 
I also believe that the world itself does more to its own skies and waters than we have ever done... not that we can't do our best to plant more trees etc.. if we did as Israel did and planted a tree for every wedding, birthday or whatever we would help in our own little ways.  Marin has one of the best recycle and reclaiming programs around the US.  I do my own little part. 
 
And here is one for thinking .... Global Warming big deal .... what happens when magnetic north starts turning again to magnetic south?  Screw Global Warming!  This one is way cooler in its changes. 

(in reply to pollux)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/17/2007 1:01:25 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hottiegurl

I also believe that the world itself does more to its own skies and waters than we have ever done... not that we can't do our best to plant more trees etc.. if we did as Israel did and planted a tree for every wedding, birthday or whatever we would help in our own little ways.  Marin has one of the best recycle and reclaiming programs around the US.  I do my own little part.  
 


The problem with the greening of Israel is the shortage of water which is why traditional farming hasn't been so intensive in that area, not because people couldn't care less. One of life's little ironies I guess.

However, all the planting ot trees and small scale environmental projects will prove meaningless if we don't stop spewing pollutants and greenhouse gases into the atomosphere. Maybe you don't care and don't give a fuck that your children (if you have any) will have to be the ones cleaning up the shit of the people that don't give a damn.

_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

(in reply to Hottiegurl)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/17/2007 1:06:50 AM   
Estring


Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
Interesting how 30 some years ago it was trumpeted that the earth was in for a global cooling that would be catastrophic to the human race. Hmm, did I miss it?
Pardon me if I don't share in the global warming hysteria. And when people like Al Gore actually back up their assertions with changes in their behavior, I might take them seriously. There are plenty of experts who should know, who are not convinced that so called global warming is man made. There is not a consensus. Saying there is doesn't make it so.  

< Message edited by Estring -- 9/17/2007 1:07:47 AM >


_____________________________

Boycott Whales!

(in reply to Hottiegurl)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming - 9/17/2007 1:53:47 AM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring
There is not a consensus. Saying there is doesn't make it so.

Quite. A hypothesis is either disproven or unproven or proven. A consensus is not science, but usually a democracy of fools.

(in reply to Estring)
Profile   Post #: 20
Page:   [1] 2 3   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> The Scientific Consensus on Global Warming Page: [1] 2 3   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.125