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RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 12:38:58 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xoxi

just like it excites cutters mentally to know they are disfiguring themselves.


Most cutters are trying to displace a pain with one that is easier to bear.
That part doesn't really work, most of the time, but the endorphins help them.
Squeezing ice cubes is the rational approach to the same problem they try to solve.

quote:


I can honestly say I've turned down plenty of healthy relationships simply because the other person wouldn't be able to dominate me in the way I enjoy. It's something I need sexually and while I don't seek it in everyone, it's also something I can't be happy without. What does that say about my mental state?


Most people can't be happy without one or more of the following:
  • Sex
  • Love
  • Beer
  • Friends
  • Football
  • Make-up
  • Shopping
  • Partying
  • Arguing
  • Money
  • Food
  • Air
  • TV
What does that say about their mental health?

If nephandi turned poly tomorrow, or we went our seperate ways, I'd turn down any offers that weren't of pretty much the same sort you're talking about, except from the opposite angle. Settling for less is not an option. Just as I wouldn't want to regress into childhood, I wouldn't want to leave behind any other part of my self-actualization. One doesn't miss what one hasn't had, usually, but losing a leg is worse than being born without.

Does this make us insane?

No, it makes us picky.

quote:


If I am insane I wonder if I should just 'come to terms' with my insanity and make concessions for it, or if I should try to be 'cured' or 'healed' - if that would even work.


Sexual reconditioning generally works. That's how you "cure" LGBT people.

Do we need to "cure" everyone into the same Xerox of the hypothetical "normal" state?

quote:


I read the link on paraphilias and agree that by mental health standards I am insane.


Mental health standards do not involve the word "insane". They do involve things like assigning a diagnosis of paranoia, delusions and schizophrenia to political dissidents, however, if the prevailing doctrine of the country is that the state is perfect and that one should love it. Like in the USSR. I'm glad I wouldn't be mentally "healthy" in that setting.

quote:


I truly wonder if I should even question that - or if I should simply accept my insanity and try to manage it.


Or accept that you are who you are, and that there's no reason to change that if you can live with it.

quote:


What makes my desires any different than cutting, or anorexia?


They don't go away with the medical equivalent of whacking an electrical appliance that doesn't start.

quote:


I'm harming myself physically and am emotionally distressed when unable to live out my desires.


See the above bulleted list for the latter point.

As for the former point, we could section every combat sport practicioner, and monitor the other sports, section people who smoke and don't eat right, etc... pretty soon, the inmates would be running the asylum, and the asylum would be the world to just about everyone. Why not then just make the whole world an asylum, and reserve the actual asylum buildings and their staff for inmates (a.k.a. citizens) that need and/or want it.

quote:


Why do I get a free pass just because it's a sex thing?


Why do you need a free pass in the first place?

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 2:36:40 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline 		What's all this shit about BDSM being a mental illness? I knew at one time it was thought of in that way, but from what I understood, BDSM is no longer viewed as a mental illness and hasn't been for a few years now.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 4:07:27 PM   
p90421584


Posts: 2
Joined: 8/30/2007
Status: offline 		If you are deadly serious about knowing yourself and why you have become the person you are, may I suggest that a good Freudian psychoanalyst might help you.  Otherwise, just try reading Freud's stuff on masochism.

< Message edited by p90421584 -- 9/22/2007 4:10:55 PM >

(in reply to breatheasone)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 4:15:30 PM   
kiyari


Posts: 631
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

You may be crazy - At my income level I qualify as "eccentric".


LOL

Yeppers... and so... Fundamentally Unfair.

Unfair to those of us who are otherwise
[as in: apart from economic status]
in similar mentality and vein as estan ustedes.

_____________________________

Black Water Dragon

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 4:47:49 PM   
Tigrita


Posts: 484
Joined: 8/16/2007
From: California
Status: offline 		Some people throw themselves out of airplanes or jump off of buildings for thrills.  Some people ride bulls.  Are these activities any less dangerous, any more logical than BDSM?  Are those people any more sane than us? 
Shyness is now a mental illness (social anxiety disorder).  Hyperactivity is now a mental illness (ADD/ADHD).  It seems like things that used to be quirky personality traits are now mental illnesses/disorders. Insanity is defined by a few old farts and changes by the minute.

I think there are people who seek out BDSM for unhealthy reasons.  Just like there are people who over or under eat for unhealthy reasons, and people who are either shy or wild to the point of impeding their life.  If that is the case, I would hope for their sake and those who love them, that they can get help, support, treatment, and find a healthy peace with themselves and whatever activities and personality traits that they have.  But if you know yourself, and you don't feel like you are hurting yourself or anyone, then nearly the same things can be perfectly healthy.  If your life is "together", you feel emotionally happy and stable, who cares if you fit some people's definition of crazy. 

I ask, would you feel more healthy if you tried to deny your yearnings for BDSM? 

Personally, I see BDSM as catharsis.  I enjoy humiliation, degradation, objectification, not because I truly see myself that way, but because it allows me to go deep within myself and explore feelings that exist, that I don't normally accept.  It makes me feel very alive, and human, and primal, and intimate.  In returning to my strong, confident, independent state, I'm even stronger for having gone down the hole, into the dark, and pulled myself back up, knowing that I don't belong/deserve to be there truthfully.  I know there are others who believe that is their true place.  I am in absolutely no position to judge them; if it makes them feel fulfilled and they aren't hurting anyone unconsensually, then perhaps they are perfectly healthy too.  Just do what feels right for you, and if it does feel wrong get help.  But feeling guilty because you feel like it should  feel wrong is very different and just the man fucking with your head.  Don't let yourself be labeled by those who don't know the first thing about you.

All the best, and big hugs.

(in reply to Squeakers)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 4:52:07 PM   
mmb1


Posts: 304
Joined: 8/3/2007
Status: offline 		Where is ChiaThepet when you need him? lol, who the hell is sane?

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 7:41:48 PM   
submittous


Posts: 345
Joined: 6/12/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: p90421584

If you are deadly serious about knowing yourself and why you have become the person you are, may I suggest that a good Freudian psychoanalyst might help you.  Otherwise, just try reading Freud's stuff on masochism.


YIKES!

or maybe sticking with a kink friendly talk therapist would work better......

_____________________________

"If you are lucky enough to find a way of life you love, you have to find the courage to live it." John Irving

(in reply to p90421584)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 8:12:50 PM   
bipolarber


Posts: 2792
Joined: 9/25/2004
Status: offline 		I totally disagree that it is either unhealthy, or a mental illness. Working these sorts of feelings and urges out in a safe, and consentual fashion proves that you are NOT insane, nor even irrational. You, like so many others into BDSM, have found a way of working with these dark, socially unacceptable desires, in a way that doesn't hurt anyone, and is in fact benificial and enjoyable to yourself and your partner(s).

To me, BDSM is my REFUSAL to be a bad person. I like working out my neuroses on a symbolic level, rather than taking them out on someone in real life.

There was a great little story by Ray Bradbury... "The Little Town Where No One Got Off." In it, a man decides to get off a train, and just see if all the stories about how nice people are in small town's is true. (Turns out everyone is suspicious of him.) But he meets up with an old man who's been waiting for someone to get off the train... because he wants to kill someone. He wants to kill a total stranger because of "all the nasty, boiling thoughts that he inherited from his primative ancestors." (I won't spoil the ending, you'll have to read the story.) But I remember that story because it always made me think: what whould I have done with all these feelings, these dark, violent desires, if I HADN'T found BDSM? Now THAT is a scary thought!


(in reply to catize)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 8:13:48 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: p90421584

If you are deadly serious about knowing yourself and why you have become the person you are, may I suggest that a good Freudian psychoanalyst might help you.  Otherwise, just try reading Freud's stuff on masochism.


Err... no. Freud was an idiot. Psychoanalysts tend to be traditional in that regard.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to p90421584)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 8:34:56 PM   
p90421584


Posts: 2
Joined: 8/30/2007
Status: offline 		Freud was not an idiot.  Only someone who hasn't read his stuff would say such a thing.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 8:39:22 PM   
RRafe


Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: p90421584

Freud was not an idiot.  Only someone who hasn't read his stuff would say such a thing.


He did seem to have a bit of an oedipus complex.

_____________________________

I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

(in reply to p90421584)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 8:40:50 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: p90421584

Freud was not an idiot.  Only someone who hasn't read his stuff would say such a thing.


I've read enough. I'd rather memorize football statistics than his drivel.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to p90421584)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/22/2007 8:42:10 PM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RRafe

He did seem to have a bit of an oedipus complex.


You kidding me?

Have you seen Freud's mother?

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to RRafe)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/23/2007 1:39:51 AM   
heartcream


Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline 		at this time i am reading some information that talks about the reptilian brain stem. altho i have only recently begun to study this, i feel it is somewhat relevant. the reptilian brain makes decisions based on whether it views something as 'bad' or 'good' for us. the reptilian brain regulates the stuff like breathing and so on.

it does not know how to change it's mind once it is made on it's own. if something happened within the first two hours of a child's life, let's say the mother was not present, the child will go around 'wandering' with a feeling of not belonging for the rest of it's life basically. there is a lot of new research goin on right now dealing with the reptilian brain and how it has kinda taken over our society more than is it's real function. it is the fight/flight thing among others.

the limbic brain is the one we would do much better operating from. someone mentioned peptides. when there is a trauma the neural peptides flush thru the body. what can happen then, is whenever something reminds the person of that experience the peptide rush is triggered again, greatly causing duress and stress to the body and soul. it is actually a common occurrence within the body and most of us have no connection to it happening. i also do believe there is a 'normal'. i believe when the brain can balance out, the individual then resides in their own state of 'normal'.

_____________________________

"Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague." Vincent Van Gogh

I'd Rather Be With You

Every single line means something.
Jean-Michel Basquiat



(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/23/2007 2:18:20 AM   
seeksfemslave


Posts: 4011
Joined: 6/16/2006
Status: offline 		Haven't read all the posts but my two pence worth anyway...

Surely insanity means a break down of reasoning processes, hallucinations and a general retreat from what most perceive as reality. If so then you are clearly not insane.

Deviant: well yes I think you are , but is that so wrong and why do you apparently find it so difficult to deal with?  Maybe you have a fear of sliding back into your earlier self destructive modes of behaviour ?
Possibly you dont really enjoy as much as you claim the submissive activities you describe.?
Who can really know us if we cant know ourselves ?
Just thought of that , not bad is it ?

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 9/23/2007 2:19:49 AM >

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/23/2007 2:55:40 AM   
southeasternsub


Posts: 15
Joined: 3/11/2007
Status: offline 		Sane? What is sane? Who gets to define what is sane? Are they sane?

It seems to me that long before anyone felt the need to put a label on every little thing all these disorders still existed. The difference being that then people just dealt with it and got on with their lives. Today we feel the need to pick apart every little thing often paying others hundreds of dollars to help us do this, just so we can put a label on something and in the process finding out we have several other labeled disorders and in the end what good does it do? If I stop eating chocolate tomorrow, will my love for chocolate go away? Will it show up someplace else in some other form?

We are who we are and we need to learn to accept that and deal with it in a way that can be productive to us and those around us. To heck with the labels and to what the so called "moral" majority thinks is sane.

(in reply to seeksfemslave)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/23/2007 3:11:16 AM   
MissMagnolia


Posts: 3636
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave

Haven't read all the posts but my two pence worth anyway...

Surely insanity means a break down of reasoning processes, hallucinations and a general retreat from what most perceive as reality. If so then you are clearly not insane.

Deviant: well yes I think you are , but is that so wrong and why do you apparently find it so difficult to deal with?  Maybe you have a fear of sliding back into your earlier self destructive modes of behaviour ?
Possibly you dont really enjoy as much as you claim the submissive activities you describe.?
Who can really know us if we cant know ourselves ?
Just thought of that , not bad is it ?


Five pages of mostly crap and finally a reasonable response. "Insanity" is a relative term, as is mental illness. Billions of people in the world have a mental illnesses, but most of them take medication which keeps them "normal", myself included. The only time the majority of sufferers are declared insane (and it is not a term that is widely used in the treatment of those who are psychotic), is when something happens, either externally or within the brain itself, to cause a chemical imbalance. The person then may lose track of reality, behave inappropriately or become a danger to themselves or others. This is not generally a permanant state, it is a state one is in until the brain chemicals balance out, with medication or without. Permanantly psychotic people are locked away and sedated as much as possible, so I doubt that they would be typing in the forums on CM. Actually, looking at some of them, perhaps they are. lol.

Also, lets not forget social mores. Things that we do that seem very normal to some of us, are seen as absolutely crazy to others. Some people use rats as a food source, but I couldn't eat them.

Now I'm going to take my medication, because my eye twitch is getting bad, and the voices just told me that I'm missing a Gunsmoke marathon on Foxtel.

_____________________________

if at first you dont succeed..then skydiving isnt for you

Resident Whip Cracker AND Resident Orbs Of Joy.


(in reply to seeksfemslave)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/23/2007 5:01:39 AM   
seeksfemslave


Posts: 4011
Joined: 6/16/2006
Status: offline 		Only reasonable MsM . I'm keeping my eye on you from now on lol
The more I read that last but one line the more pleased I am with myself.

(in reply to MissMagnolia)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: What if I am insane? - 9/23/2007 5:28:29 AM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xoxi
I wonder, why do I have this 'kink' and is it truly sane?
There is evil among humanity. It does not matter whether that evil has evolved as such by natural selection or whether it was created.
 
You have this kink because you either evolved in response to this evil or were created to complement this evil. You are a superhuman being that is not only able to endure and to survive such evil, but to thrive in its presence.
 
Sane? Well, you are not normal, nor ordinary, no. You are extraordinary. Considering the adverse conditions of evil that people are sometimes faced by, your kink is one of the sanest responses to that evil imaginable.

(in reply to xoxi)
Profile   Post #: 99
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