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my morning political rant - 9/28/2007 5:57:12 AM

chellekitty

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Joined: 3/27/2005
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warning, this is really a political rant...

ok...i am tired of hearing about how 20 deaths a day in a war is unaacceptable...umm hello! its a war...people die....in wars!! there are people out there, and while they wear the same clothes as everyone else around them so it makes them very hard to distinguish the good from the bad, they still want our soldiers dead...because if our soldiers "just came home" they would follow them...cocooning up in a little ball does NOT make us safe...and by the way...when its really hard to get in, its really hard to get out...think about a prison...

people accuse me, because of my age of not knowing about the past, but has it been so long that ya'll have forgotten about the major wars the USA has faught in just the past 100 years (leaving out minor wars and non-wars and wars the USA did not fight in) WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Gulf War...people fucking died...all the time...did we take our toys and go home cause we got over there and went oh shit, the bullets are real? NO....we got into it, because we saw a need and we finished what we said we were going to do....and just because the fighting was over did we leave? NO you fucking people....we don't pack up our bags because the dictator is dead...that just leaves space for a new dictator to move in....psychology/sociology 101....change is uncomfortable...individuals and groups will hold on to miserable familiarity rather than go through uncomfortable change no matter how good the outcome would be on the other side of that change....

btw...if Hitler had had half the pep and speaking skills that Osama bin Laden and some of these other Muslim leaders have....we would still have concentration camps around the world....cause some of those SS soldiers lived to a ripe old age off the art and jewelry they stole from Jews they killed and took to concentration camps....

end rant...one to beam, scotty
chelle

< Message edited by chellekitty -- 9/28/2007 6:07:15 AM >

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

Post #: 1

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 6:10:10 AM

Rule

Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
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Innocents do rant...

The great grandfather of your presidents Bush financed Hitler. Just about every nazi war criminal that did not escape to South America or to Palestina ended up in the CIA. Saddam was a CIA man.

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 2

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 6:15:46 AM

youngsubgeoff

Posts: 900
Joined: 9/25/2007
From: The Asylum
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One thing that needs to be considred though, is that the iraqi people dont give a damn about iraq. they care about sheites and sunnis, thats it.

that being said, saddam was an asshole, and, In my opinion, got more than he deserved.

(in reply to Rule)

Post #: 3

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 6:17:29 AM

chellekitty

Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
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btw...this rant was not about justifying or rationalizing or excusing or debating a war....it was about supporting the troops adequately and i suppose i didn't convey that in my original message...these are just some of the exuses that are fed to us by the liberal media to justify not giving the troops engaging in live action every day the money they need for things that most people would consider essential for a soldier on the front lines...

edited to add: in the future, please don't dismiss me for my age, i don't dismiss you for yours

< Message edited by chellekitty -- 9/28/2007 6:18:22 AM >

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to Rule)

Post #: 4

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 6:34:34 AM

GoddessMine

Posts: 250
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline

Oy, that's a lot to work through, but I'll address two points that stood out to Me. But double oy, so many fallacies!
1) Hitler was extremely charming and relatable to many people, and that is primarily why he carried on the Jewish concentration camps for as long as he did.
2) You need to be more responsible for what you put out there - "umm hello! its a war...people die..." is quite callous. My boyfriend is a former US Marine and served 3 tours in Iraq. He was there when the statue toppled, he was on the frontline in Fallujah, and he conducted many reconnaisance missions. Throughout it all, he was in constant danger, and I was in constant anxiety and depression- these soldiers aren't mere people - they are loved ones, family, and friends.

Love,
GM

Postscript: LIBERAL MEDIA? That's laughable...

_____________________________

Pleasure of the Text? Pleasure of the Goddess, more like it.

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 5

RE: my morning political rant - 9/28/2007 6:40:42 AM

thompsonx

Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

warning, this is really a political rant...

ok...i am tired of hearing about how 20 deaths a day in a war is unaacceptable...umm hello! its a war...people die....in wars!!
Hello! it is a scam by bush&co to steal their dope and fuck their women.

there are people out there, and while they wear the same clothes as everyone else around them so it makes them very hard to distinguish the good from the bad, they still want our soldiers dead...because if our soldiers "just came home" they would follow them
How are they going to get here El Al?

...cocooning up in a little ball does NOT make us safe...and by the way...when its really hard to get in, its really hard to get out...think about a prison...
Prison is not difficult to get into....remember that more than 70% of the people in prison in this country are there on drug related charges.

people accuse me, because of my age of not knowing about the past,
Maybe that is because you do not seem to know much about the past.

but has it been so long that ya'll have forgotten about the major wars the USA has faught in just the past 100 years (leaving out minor wars and non-wars and wars the USA did not fight in)
I am curious as to what a non war or a minor war is.

WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Gulf War...people fucking died...all the time...did we take our toys and go home cause we got over there and went oh shit, the bullets are real? NO
YES...once we had achieved our objectives we left...perhaps you ought to read a little history.

....we got into it, because we saw a need and we finished what we said we were going to do....and just because the fighting was over did we leave? NO
You might want to pick up something a little more advanced than a sixth grade history book.

you fucking people....we don't pack up our bags because the dictator is dead...that just leaves space for a new dictator to move in....psychology/sociology 101
After you retake psychology/sociology 101 you might want to take history 101.

....change is uncomfortable...individuals and groups will hold on to miserable familiarity rather than go through uncomfortable change no matter how good the outcome would be on the other side of that change....
You seem to be saying that a foreign dictatorship is better than a domestic dictatorship.

btw...if Hitler had had half the pep and speaking skills that Osama bin Laden and some of these other Muslim leaders have....we would still have concentration camps around the world....cause some of those SS soldiers lived to a ripe old age off the art and jewelry they stole from Jews they killed and took to concentration camps....
The lack of rhetorical skill was not the reason that Hitler lost the war...He simply went to an ass kicking contest without his boots on.

end rant...one to beam, scotty
chelle

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 6

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 6:49:52 AM

thompsonx

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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

btw...this rant was not about justifying or rationalizing or excusing or debating a war....it was about supporting the troops adequately and i suppose i didn't convey that in my original message
All the troops need in the way of support are orders bringing them home. Bring the troops home and let halliburton and black water to fight their own war.

...these are just some of the exuses that are fed to us by the liberal media
Perhaps you might tell me which media is controlled by the liberals? It is not that hard to google. After you have done so I will be here with a pry bar for you to try and extricate your feet from your mouth.

to justify not giving the troops engaging in live action every day the money they need for things that most people would consider essential for a soldier on the front lines...
All they need are orders to come home and a seat on an airplane.

edited to add: in the future, please don't dismiss me for my age, i don't dismiss you for yours
Does this mean that when you say childish things we are not allowed to point this out?

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 7

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 6:57:01 AM

GoddessMine

Posts: 250
Joined: 9/27/2007
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Zing!

Love,
GM

< Message edited by GoddessMine -- 9/28/2007 6:58:36 AM >

_____________________________

Pleasure of the Text? Pleasure of the Goddess, more like it.

(in reply to thompsonx)

Post #: 8

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 7:12:32 AM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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"But, but, but, Bush's grampa!!!"

Pfffttttt. Get a life.

_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

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Post #: 9

RE: my morning political rant - 9/28/2007 7:15:21 AM

chellekitty

Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
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ok...i don't have time to give you documented facts on everything...i will do that tuesday evening or wednesday (i am leaving for Dallas for Beyond Vanilla in less than 30 minutes, i will be on the train all day Monday, and i have class all day Tuesday if you must know why not...) but i will adress your answers briefly...

and you know this because you are in the dope supply and bedrooms of "bush&co"? you want them out of your dope supply and bedroom, stay out of theirs...

9/11/2001...we didn't know they were here, or what they were doing...we being the general public...

people, that by law, deserve to be there have no problem getting in...i didn't saw the laws were just or fair...i just said that by law...

non war - military action taken without war being declared, tis a simple definition i learned in that 6th grade history class...minor war - those wars that didn't get big media coverage...

once objectives were achieved, major military occupation left, we did not "leave"...peace keeping troops stayed and helped get in place the government the people of the country wanted...

honey, the psychology and sociology was after not before...and i didn't claim to know all history, i just claimed to know enough, and to have not forgotten it...

where did i say that any dictatorship was good?? that was part of the psychology/sociology....

or maybe we weren't afraid to bomb the shit out of people back then....

second post....

and then in 5 or 10 or 15 or 20 years when you're dead, and we're "safe" and all is forgotten...and the nice terrorists who've been training in camps on the other side of the world in iraq slowly infiltrate america and bomb us back to the stone age....well it won't matter because you will be dead...right...

cnn, abc, nbc, cbs, npr (barf) basically everything except fox...

wow...that was a well thought out response...you've already established you want them home....

and no, you can attack me on other points...i won't point out that your a bitter, senile old man if you will stop pointing out my age and what you preceive as a lack of education...

edited for a missing comma....any further grammar, punctuation or spelling mistakes ya'll will just have to deal with

< Message edited by chellekitty -- 9/28/2007 7:17:15 AM >

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to thompsonx)

Post #: 10

RE: my morning political rant - 9/28/2007 7:41:32 AM

Rule

Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty
the nice terrorists who've been training in camps on the other side of the world in iraq slowly infiltrate america and bomb us back to the stone age

That is rather implausible and will have no significant impact at all. If it was that easy, the USA would have a standing army of only 144 men: sufficient to bomb the whole world back to the stone age, as you suggest. Not so.

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 11

RE: my morning political rant - 9/28/2007 7:58:29 AM

chellekitty

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Joined: 3/27/2005
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why not? could it be because we do crazy things like take preemptive action...holy crap...there is a method to the madness...

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to Rule)

Post #: 12

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:07:42 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

btw...this rant was not about justifying or rationalizing or excusing or debating a war....it was about supporting the troops adequately and i suppose i didn't convey that in my original message...these are just some of the exuses that are fed to us by the liberal media to justify not giving the troops engaging in live action every day the money they need for things that most people would consider essential for a soldier on the front lines...

edited to add: in the future, please don't dismiss me for my age, i don't dismiss you for yours

I'm not dismissing you for your age but for your extreme lack of knowledge on the subject you rant about.

Fact: My nephew will soon deploy for his second tour of Iraq. During his first tour, 2005-2006, he did not have, body armor that fit, vehicle armor more sophisticated than scrap sheet metal welded on in the field, communications gear in his truck and meals the taxpayers were charged $80 dollars for that so often contained spoiled food that his unit commander had his men live on MRE's for several weeks.
Fact: In 2005 the US government had been entirely in the hands of the GOP for better than 4 years.
Fact: In 2005 the Iraq occupation, no declaration of war = no war, had been going on for more than 2 years with the above major serious problems not sorted out.
Fact: No GOP budget ever provided money for comm gear for every vehicle in supply convoys or real armor for every supply convoy vehicle.
Fact: KBR still provides the meals for virtually all US troops in country, at $80 a plate, even though Pentagon investigators found multi billion dollar fraud by the company in the delivery of said meals.
Fact: KBR is a major financial supporter of GOP candidates and was spun off from Halliburton in order to be able to try and give Cheney et al some political cover. Luckily people followed the money and found that shotgun and his cronies still own and control KBR.
Fact: My nephew's company will deploy to Iraq with sophisticated comm gear for every soldier in it. They and their families bought high end two way radios from Radio Shack. Even at this late date the GOP controlled Pentagon sees no pressing need for every soldier or vehicle to have commo gear.
Fact: The POTUS has made clear he will never withdraw US forces.
Fact: The administration's myriad bungles of this occupation have made this an utter and complete failure with virtually no chance of turning it around without enormously greater sacrifice of blood and treasure by the US.
Fact: Congress has precisely one really sure fire method of putting an end to this fiasco. That is withholding operational funds for Iraq. That doesn't mean that the Democratic don't support the troops unless you equate not wanting any more of them to die in a pointless occupation to not supporting the troops.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 9/28/2007 8:09:10 AM >

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Post #: 13

RE: my morning political rant - 9/28/2007 8:18:44 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

..and the nice terrorists who've been training in camps on the other side of the world in iraq slowly infiltrate america and bomb us back to the stone age....well it won't matter because you will be dead...right...

You've obviously never tried to infiltrate the US as a tourist, I can't see many terrorists getting in....unless.... they enter illegally via Mexico. Then you're waved through!

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 9/28/2007 8:19:21 AM >

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There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:21:18 AM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

btw...this rant was not about justifying or rationalizing or excusing or debating a war....it was about supporting the troops adequately and i suppose i didn't convey that in my original message...these are just some of the exuses that are fed to us by the liberal media to justify not giving the troops engaging in live action every day the money they need for things that most people would consider essential for a soldier on the front lines...

edited to add: in the future, please don't dismiss me for my age, i don't dismiss you for yours

People support the troops just that most of the people and the media think Iraq was and will not be the key to the “war” on terrorism and we are wasting people and money on a situation instead of putting our resources to a better place.

There is a huge difference between supporting our brave troops and supporting a war because of an arrogant President.

Quite simply as a member of this war is stupid and dangerous to then be categorized and not wanting to keep the troops safe or not support them is quite insulting and a very narrow minded view.

Fear mongering is for the weak minded. Facts and reality is what need to be dealt with.

_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 15

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:21:43 AM

chellekitty

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Joined: 3/27/2005
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i'm sorry that your nephew had to go through this....
the republican government had to deal with the downgraded military that the 8 years of democratic government set up while there were no major wars that the USA engaged in while Clinton was in office...Bush did the best he could with what he had with a major tragedy at effectively the begining of his terms....to say that the Pentagon sees no pressing need for anything that would keep their soldiers safer (there is no such thing as "safe" in a war...sorry, people die, its crass, its callous, but its reality...) would just be stupid...even taking humanity out of it, it would be illogical...and they are not inhumane...

edited to add: i would like to say: i would love to stay and argue with ya'll more but i'm gonna go play with some real 3-d people...sorry...have fun...talk amongst yourselves

< Message edited by chellekitty -- 9/28/2007 8:23:18 AM >

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 16

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:30:39 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

i'm sorry that your nephew had to go through this....
the republican government had to deal with the downgraded military that the 8 years of democratic government set up while there were no major wars that the USA engaged in while Clinton was in office

This tired old lie?
Are you truly unaware that even after Iraq began Rumsfeld wanted to shrink the military even further as part of his "re-engineering" plan? Where are all the new US Army divisions bushco has activated/created? With better than a year after 9/11 to plan the invasion why weren't more troops recruited? Even today with our combat and combat support troops stretched to the breaking point we still see nothing being done to significantly increase US troop levels.

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Post #: 17

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:30:59 AM

domiguy

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Your post holds little merit...Our borders are sieves. If the terrorists really wanted to play the "blow up ball bearing game" here what is to stop them? It makes little sense. We are doing nothing there but wasting lives....The dead will be forgotten soon enought like those who perished on 9/11...How many flags did you see waving on 9/11? It is all for naught. We are all going to die...I guess by your logic, dying on the sand thousands of miles from home "protecting" people who don't want you there is a good idea....It would be laughable if it wasn't all so tragic....we did what we set out to do, the people elected a gov't that has said they no longer desire our presence....But what does that matter? We don't care if our credibility is shot and we could care less of how we are recieved by the rest of the people that share this Earth...We are the big bad U.S.A. ....We don't have to give a fuck.

< Message edited by domiguy -- 9/28/2007 8:31:40 AM >

_____________________________

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Post #: 18

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:35:20 AM

ChicagoSwitchMal

Posts: 417
Joined: 9/9/2007
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Before Im accused of being anti-american let me clarify that I am a patriot. That said I do think the US is sold the idea of war entirely too easily. We haven't had our cities carpet bombed. We don't have our grandfathers telling us the horror stories of what it was like during that time. European's have seen this horror or at least have a living relative to tell the story. These nations are not "weaker" like we like to think of them. Rather they are more experienced and seasoned.

That being said I do agree that 20 people a day is more favorable than 200. But I won't say it's acceptable. 0 is acceptable. Saddam was a monster. But there are a lot of monsters we do nothing about. Why this one? The terrorists didn't come from Iraq. Terrorism is there now becuz we created a power vacume and anyone with a few poppy plants and an automatic weapon wants their piece of it. Yay! We've created more enemies again.

Every reason we went there has proven to be lies or at best "bad intelligence". I fully apreciate anyone opinion but I just don't see how anyone can support this war. Bush can't talk about it without evoking 9/11 and those dots just don't connect for me.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 19

RE: to the liberal cry babies - 9/28/2007 8:43:52 AM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

quote:

This tired old lie?

Surely you aren't claiming that Al Gore was lying when he called cutting the strength of the military one of his great acheivements?

Why...why...that would mean he could be lying about other stuff...

< Message edited by Alumbrado -- 9/28/2007 8:44:31 AM >

(in reply to ChicagoSwitchMal)

Post #: 20

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