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Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 5:48:16 AM   
silentfire


Posts: 14
Joined: 10/28/2007
Status: offline 		Do You find this lifestyle touches a deeper level of commitment then say a marriage?  Offering oneself completely for another to own?  Hmmmmmm that word OWN seems to change everything........
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 6:11:39 AM   
Sabella


Posts: 265
Joined: 7/26/2005
Status: offline 		No. I think a good RELATIONSHIP can reach a deeper level of commitment. Everything else is props, toys or methods used to obtain a goal whether it's short or long term that may or may not be successful if the people involved are willing to work at it.

I own my cat. Does she obey me? when she wants to, ie when she responds to my interaction with her the way I want her to.


_____________________________

“The giant Grof was hit in one eye by a stone,
and that eye turned inward so that it looked into his mind and he died of what he saw there.”
From The Forgotten Beasts of Eld, by Patricia A. McKillip

(in reply to silentfire)
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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 6:19:09 AM   
batshalom


Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
Status: offline 		I suppose it can feel deeper. All magic-like, you know? Especially when it's a new way of thinking and interacting, and double especially when you're lolling around in the NRE. But no. Not deeper. No more committed or non-commited than anything else.

(in reply to Sabella)
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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 6:21:01 AM   
chellekitty


Posts: 3923
Joined: 3/27/2005
Status: offline 		it may seem deeper for you, because it works for you.....but it is not innately deeper than any other relationship....a relationship is as deep as the people in it are willing to go....

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to batshalom)
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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 6:21:54 AM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

it may seem deeper for you, because it works for you.....but it is not innately deeper than any other relationship....a relationship is as deep as the people in it are willing to go....


yup

(in reply to chellekitty)
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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 6:23:50 AM   
eyesopened


Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline 		Certainly there are married people who are more committed to each other than a lot of "lifestyle" couples (triads, whatever) and certainly there are "lifestyle" couples (etc) who are more committed than a lot of married people.  One is a legally binding contract the other isn't.  That doesn't make one contract better than the other.

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No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 7:19:10 AM   
IrishMist


Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Do You find this lifestyle touches a deeper level of commitment then say a marriage? 

No, I don't.

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Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 7:39:17 AM   
Celeste43


Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline 		My aunt and uncle have been married over 50 years. They've buried parents, siblings and ums. They've raised ums and helped with handicapped ums. There was a time about 5 years ago when he went into the hospital and a day later she collapsed and wound up two floors below him. There is nothing they haven't shared, no depth of fear, no vulnerability, no happiness. And they're vanilla.

However for someone who needs control, an equal power relationship where she is expected to be a self starter, self controlled adult will not be satisfying because it doesn't fulfill her need for control.

Equally, for someone who needs an equal power relationship, a D/s one will not fulfill her need to be a self starter, self controlled adult, indeed she will view a submissive partner as one who doesn't pull his own weight in the relationship, in decision making. She would view a toppy type as a control freak, abuser who didn't have any trust in her and not as someone compatible.

There is very little different between wiitwd and vanilla relationshipwise, to be healthy they must allow each person to grow, to lean on the other for support, to have good and clear communication skills, to be composed of two people equally committed to the well being of the relationship who will forego what they want in favor of the needs of the relationship and a high level of compatibility.

The fact that at your age, you are unaware of these simple facts and couldn't even recognize unhappiness in your partner does not say great things about you. There are private therapists, there are group therapy sessions and there are self help groups that can help you to learn what you still haven't. I urge you to get to work on yourself, and learn those necessary skills.

(in reply to IrishMist)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 8:45:18 AM   
toservez


Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

it may seem deeper for you, because it works for you.....but it is not innately deeper than any other relationship....a relationship is as deep as the people in it are willing to go....


Perfectly stated, if this was a way to have a deeper relationship for any two people then it would be preached from the mountain top publicly. They are deeper relationships for most of us because it is a best fit case.

It is a human trait to want to think our way is the best way but it is actually somewhat insulting to suggest all the other ways including vanilla cannot have deep feeling relationships.



_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to chellekitty)
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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 9:03:00 AM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Celeste43

My aunt and uncle have been married over 50 years. They've buried parents, siblings and ums. They've raised ums and helped with handicapped ums. There was a time about 5 years ago when he went into the hospital and a day later she collapsed and wound up two floors below him. There is nothing they haven't shared, no depth of fear, no vulnerability, no happiness. And they're vanilla.

However for someone who needs control, an equal power relationship where she is expected to be a self starter, self controlled adult will not be satisfying because it doesn't fulfill her need for control.

Equally, for someone who needs an equal power relationship, a D/s one will not fulfill her need to be a self starter, self controlled adult, indeed she will view a submissive partner as one who doesn't pull his own weight in the relationship, in decision making. She would view a toppy type as a control freak, abuser who didn't have any trust in her and not as someone compatible.

There is very little different between wiitwd and vanilla relationshipwise, to be healthy they must allow each person to grow, to lean on the other for support, to have good and clear communication skills, to be composed of two people equally committed to the well being of the relationship who will forego what they want in favor of the needs of the relationship and a high level of compatibility.

The fact that at your age, you are unaware of these simple facts and couldn't even recognize unhappiness in your partner does not say great things about you. There are private therapists, there are group therapy sessions and there are self help groups that can help you to learn what you still haven't. I urge you to get to work on yourself, and learn those necessary skills.


lol from two sentences which ask a general question you diagnose and suggest treatment for the OP? 

(in reply to Celeste43)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 9:09:23 AM   
RRafe


Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline 		Commitment is not based on kink.

It's based on why you want to be intimate.

And that covers a lot more ground than a fantasy life.

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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 12:35:57 PM   
MasterDaveM


Posts: 78
Joined: 12/5/2006
From: Tampa
Status: offline 		i dont know if ownership is a deeper "commitment" than marriage.... but it takes a hell of a lot of trust to give that to another

i would submit to you that marriage is a very serious commitment. it isnt just a piece of paper... its a mental and legal block for many. some multi year relationships turn to dust in the face of that "paper"... in ownership or even "just vanilla dating"... you can walk out at any time

in a marriage, you cant just "walk" without serious financial and emotional distress

(in reply to RRafe)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 2:33:39 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		Considering the average length of marriages and the average length of BDSM relationships....nope. 


(in reply to MasterDaveM)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 2:39:15 PM   
asubmissiveheart


Posts: 462
Joined: 11/20/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RRafe

Commitment is not based on kink.

It's based on why you want to be intimate.

And that covers a lot more ground than a fantasy life.


I agree with this, when you are in a committed relationship, it can be like
a great marriage.
But it takes a lot more than kink to make a long term committment work.
Life is more than D/s fantasy.

(in reply to RRafe)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 4:12:13 PM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: silentfire

Do You find this lifestyle touches a deeper level of commitment then say a marriage?  Offering oneself completely for another to own?  Hmmmmmm that word OWN seems to change everything........


There are two issues here, as I see it.
 
First, as it relates to the community as a whole:
 
When "ownership" has the same level of responsibility and commitment as marriage (half the house, half the retirement fund, half the vacation home, half the bank account, the car, etc.) I suspect that there will be quite a few less "owners" and "owned".  Rather negating any inference that the commitment of ownership is anything "more" than marriage, and likely is something quite a bit "less" than marriage.
 
Second, as it relates to anyone individually:
 
As has been stated previously, if you're more compatible with an ownership dynamic than marriage, it's likely that it will work "better" for you (completely subjective to the individual).  I'm  not prepared to say that means a "deeper" commitment... moreso a more compatible dynamic in which to successfully express that commitment on a longterm basis.
 
John

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Sri da Avabhas

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RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 4:30:42 PM   
PryderiLoup


Posts: 90
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: silentfire

Do You find this lifestyle touches a deeper level of commitment then say a marriage?  Offering oneself completely for another to own?  Hmmmmmm that word OWN seems to change everything........

In the “Communication” topic I held this belief, that D/s relationships were somehow deeper. That the level of trust, communication etc was somehow better.

What I have concluded, after reading here, talking with others, and going over my own vanilla and D/s relationships is that there is not a correlation between the type of relationship and the level of these qualities.

I think what happens is that we confuse lifestyle with other elements of a relationship. In other words, it is not so much the lifestyle we choose, as the way we choose to conduct our relationships.

Part of the confusion, I think comes from the fact that for many of us, (not all) are more committed to this type of relationship because it fulfills us, and satisfies us like no vanilla relationship would. Because we value it more, we work harder at it. Then we say “Wow, these D/s relationships are…” Harder, deeper, etc. The reality is that we choose to work harder, communicate better, develop more trust.


(in reply to silentfire)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 5:25:57 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: silentfire

Hmmmmmm that word OWN seems to change everything........


I promise you if you go to a munch and carefully listen to people talking about their relationships, you will find out that MOST (Generalization Police, I said, most, not all) of them still have the same issues, problems, and disagreements that most vanilla relationships have.

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to silentfire)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 5:34:20 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: silentfire

Do You find this lifestyle touches a deeper level of commitment then say a marriage?  Offering oneself completely for another to own?  Hmmmmmm that word OWN seems to change everything........


No, not in the slightest. Only the people involved can make a relationship deep, not the style of relationship.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to silentfire)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 5:44:31 PM   
silentfire


Posts: 14
Joined: 10/28/2007
Status: offline 		My aunt and uncle have been married over 50 years. They've buried parents, siblings and ums. They've raised ums and helped with handicapped ums. There was a time about 5 years ago when he went into the hospital and a day later she collapsed and wound up two floors below him. There is nothing they haven't shared, no depth of fear, no vulnerability, no happiness. And they're vanilla.

However for someone who needs control, an equal power relationship where she is expected to be a self starter, self controlled adult will not be satisfying because it doesn't fulfill her need for control.

Equally, for someone who needs an equal power relationship, a D/s one will not fulfill her need to be a self starter, self controlled adult, indeed she will view a submissive partner as one who doesn't pull his own weight in the relationship, in decision making. She would view a toppy type as a control freak, abuser who didn't have any trust in her and not as someone compatible.

There is very little different between wiitwd and vanilla relationshipwise, to be healthy they must allow each person to grow, to lean on the other for support, to have good and clear communication skills, to be composed of two people equally committed to the well being of the relationship who will forego what they want in favor of the needs of the relationship and a high level of compatibility.

The fact that at your age, you are unaware of these simple facts and couldn't even recognize unhappiness in your partner does not say great things about you. There are private therapists, there are group therapy sessions and there are self help groups that can help you to learn what you still haven't. I urge you to get to work on yourself, and learn those necessary skills.



It was just a question but thank you for the theraputic direction ................The reason I asked is because some Masters say it is a closer bond and others do not......

(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Deeper Commitment ? - 10/29/2007 6:33:13 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		This is the best way I've found to answer that question.

Would you feel comfortable and secure going up to my sister on the day her husband dies and tell her that at least her relationship wasn't as strong or intense or committed as a master/slave one so she won't be feeling it as badly?

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to silentfire)
Profile   Post #: 20
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