RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (Full Version)

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iwearpanties -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/9/2007 5:49:50 PM)

wow lady huggs you have many many questions here i will do my best to to answet ythem with out be long .

1. i dont want to be female nor a drag queen i dont fully dress by that i mean wig and make up dress'ess. but i like ths silky undergarments just like i think many pantie bois do some go deeper into the dressing i have no wnats to but if a Mistress wanted toosee fully in make up and all done my her then i would.

2. you have sometihng there with this one i personnelly feel that some might use this for that reason or type of play only example i can give would be seeing so called pro domme sites with out bashing anyone please  you see it there forced cding / panty wearing / forced bi??  we all have linmts and each limit can be pushed or taken too a extreme point then cut off?

3 as for the pantie its colors prints flowery designs , matieral as well as the type of cuts boy shorts , high briefs , grany panty's  , bikini panties , low rise panties.  and thena bra is it visable under the shrit , satiny , lace .
4. ive never known or met a Mistress or female that honestly seeks male wife .

5.wearing femme things for a male or submissive i think helps set the play or sessions as to lower the macho side of the male ego but also used in mind contorl or metal sate for the sub

6. i think all males and females have fantays about both sexes male might feel seeing a female in tiny panties or corset as a prop she doing it too atract him /   he wear a boxer brief makes a bulge in his crotch she see wants and is wonder is it that big ??/  just may take not every ones we all hve diffrent wants or props.
7. subbing to female when dressed mgith be  les sameful or more compy for a male then say dressing for a Male Dom / Master. also might feel she has less

8.going back to answer before socity says men are macho you cant wear silky unides or a bra even if it feels good but a female can wear a male button down dress shrit nd look sexy but i guy in a dress most say freak or fag rite so then wearing panties migth hlp espically with humiliation to be told to wear by Mistress / master ?

9. clotheing a male dress in sharp business siut might say hes successful ? or a woman in business might  that and maybe make her look more demanding and powerful. a cop /police man or woamn show sign of power nite stick , hand cuffs .brite red panties a slut/whore . white panties and bra a virgin .. i thinkclothes and power or level could go on for ever... now rember it dont and cant and do not speack for all submisives you ask my thoguths i tryied too help but alwasy feel free tooask any questions



LotusSong -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/9/2007 6:11:52 PM)

This is just an aside to this thread and what your comments brought to mind.  I understand and can appreciate the silky feeling that is enjoyable against the male genitals.. but what does a BRA do for the male wearing them?  I've always wondered...



iwearpanties -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/9/2007 6:39:56 PM)

that can be a humiliations espically when wearing witha pantie nd or garter



LadyHugs -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/9/2007 7:41:01 PM)

Dear iwearpanties,
 
You can see why I am at times asked to be the moderator of a round table discussion or panel.
[Chuckles]
 
You are a good sport for continued input.  It is a shame others haven't spoken up and I do realize you are only speaking for yourself.  But, I think this has taken a very rough start and opened a smooth and informative dialog with you and diaperedsub.
 
What I am seeing though--is that there can/may be a blurred line between real life's choices in styles of submission, role-play and or fantasy with so many who enter into feminine areas as men.
 
I can only speak for myself --I am not willing to invest into someone's fantasy at this late stage in my life-- I am getting older and don't have the energy or years to waste on living out all the fantasies and get to the real bare bones of a relationship where both individuals are happy.
I would prefer to grow old with a male slave companion.  I like to have security and consistancy and no surprises after the fact. 
 
I also experience personally, when I am with a masculine male the more elevated into femininity I become.  So, a butler would propel me into the highest level of being a Lady.
When served by a femme male, as wonderful as they are as individuals--I feel deflated and without the energy.  But, I will add--I think I am an ultra-feminine Dominant so this energy is exaggerated and to balance, I need to have an ultra-masculine as to balance me and my energy.
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs
 
 
 



diaperedbaby -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/10/2007 6:48:50 AM)

I will try to answer some of your questions, just from my own prospective
 
 
 
1.  Do you think about being mistaken for a Gay man who is a drag queen or one who is evolving into one by wearing feminine undergarments? 
No. it wouldn't matter.
 
2.  Could this be a avenue to be bisexual 'safely'  through dressing femmie?  
For some it could.
 
3.  If it is all about the 'feel' of under garments, why not have male under garments 'tailored' as to give that 'firm/tighter' feel? 
I think that is certainly a option. Female clothes are much easier to obtain.
 
4.  Why is there a thought that women seek a male wife?  Might be many women who dislike the thought of marriage yet, prefer a Master/Mistress-slave relationship--
It is just a preference, I do think based on a recent post with numerous responses that many ladies liked the idea.
 
5.  Enhancement is often associated with improvement, development and or amplification.  IF there is a Dominant-submissive relationship, why does it require 'dressing' femme to enhance performance when relationships are often based on consistancy as well as expectations of performance in the partnership?  Having to enhance yourself in order to bring you up to the desires and expectations of the lady/woman as Dominant; wouldn't this be seen the same as 'conditional?'  Wouldn't this be much like a case of being a skinny person, then don a fat suit so there can be an enhanced experience of being fat, yet--you are able to take it off as and when you please, as to be skinny again--as not to maintain the state of being fat--isn't this a 'conditional' experience as well? [Borrowed example from a very inquisitive lady who wrote me one time]  Having to lean on enhancements as to perform in a consistant manner and what is expected over all; is an addiction perhaps?
This just comes down to preference and what works for someone. Everyone has a preference of what they seek whether tall, small or anywhere inbetween.
 
6.  Without the 'sex' and or 'sexual intercourse' factors --just focus on the acts, behavior, belief system, spiritual, mental, emotional self -- would it be possible to be submissive without fetish, without props and self placement in sensations and visible stimulation, e.g. clothes, frocks, props, etc.?
I think one actually could. I could myself. But it is still a preference that takes you into a more submissive mindset. Alot of it also depends on the person you are with.
 
7.  What do men who do femme want out of Female Dominants?  What are they expected to do as to be an ideal partner for someone who likes to dress femme?
Much of it is mental. The control aspect would be tops for me.
 
8. This is a repeat question, still unanswered but--still is an interest to me and perhaps others reading this thread -- What do you (gentlemen who identify as sissy, diapered boys, cross-dressers, femme fetish, etc) see as humiliation role play and or mind/emotional/spiritual placement for humble and or status reassignment into something under the Female Dominant; and what do you gentlemen see as being an insult and or mocking women?  Where are your lines between those two sides?
I don't think my dressing femme is a insult to women. Or it isn't my thoughts. Wanting to emulate a female I would think is more flattery than the opposite.
 
9.  What power do clothes have over you that nothing else can replace it; to give the 'enhanced' experience of submission and or fetish and or humiliation?
That is it. It puts you in a much different submissive mindset. Or it does for me.

 
Again, I will state--this is not to flame or disrespect however, these questions and responses may/can/will help understand beyond the props and or labels.
 
Hope more folks will participate in the discussion of an exploring nature. [Smiles]
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

< Message edited by LadyHugs -- 12/9/2007 9:33:29 AM >




LadyHugs -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/10/2007 1:46:13 PM)

Dear diaperedbaby,
 
Thank you for your responses.
 
Respectfully submitted,
Lady Hugs



balletsissypa -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 7:02:48 AM)

Lady Hugs,  (curtsey)
   i would like to try and answer Your questions:
1. think for some You are completely right, the "being femnized" for them is more of a fetish that they use to decompress and relax. They usually go right back to being dominant malesonce they have achieved orgasm. The orgasm itself is important to lookat also as many men get very masculine and very domininant once thy orgasm. That is why chastity devices are gaining in popularity. i must admit to having been that way myself in the past. Forothers, like myself, we consider ourselve girls and so the clothes and all are just  part of who we are. If i am a girl, why would i dress like a boy? Thats my thought process anyway. i have a job that i have o be dominant in often but that does not traslate to my personal life.
2.Men are visual beings. Thats the best explanation i can give Your for the props. Yes, for men, being made to wear womens clothing or ct like a woman is humiliating to them and that is what they areseeking. There are others like myself who embrace their girlhood and want the 'props' because thats one of the erks of being a girl. i think the majority of submission out there is conditional. i think you would be hard pressed to find a really totally submissive person. Everyone has conditions, its just a matter of the level. How many slaves out there would let you tattoo 'slut' on their face or let you lop off an arm? The point is there are always conditions.
3. i don't know how i woudl take to a woman dressed as a male as my Dom. i am a bi-novice but prefer women. Being with a man is an important experience for me as a developing girl but i prefer other womens bodies to make bodies. i think many cd/tvs think of themselves as lesbian although i think many of them still wish to use their penis as a penis which really doesn't fit.
4. Some men would still need that. You have to remember that people evolve over time too. What i thought i was and wanted 15 years ago is certainly not who i am or what i want now. As we experience things over time we refine ourselves and what we are looking for. Could somepeople be dead on in what they want now? sure...others may still be exploring
5. i think its in your beliefs where you will find the answer to that. i adore women and worship them. i want to be one of them but i want to be a submissive one. i do not believe all women are dominant just like all are not submissive. If you are the person who needs to be in womens clothes because you find it humiliating because you consider women to be lesser people then that is crossing the line. If you find it humilitaing becuase you think its too girly and sissy, then i would say, NO thats not crossing the line.
Hope that makes sense.
lauren
xoxox



Boondoggle -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 9:39:48 AM)

I'm glad I came back to this thread because it has turned into an actual discussion, which is very refreshing. Here's my treatise on the subject:

Crossdressing is something in which I have only recently begun to have an interest. I don't think I will ever consider myself a crossdresser, much less a drag queen or transvestite. I do, however, see an appeal in forced crossdressing/feminization/sissification. I believe this appeal comes from a perceived level of humiliation associated with it, and humiliation is something I enjoy (actually, more of a love/hate relationship) a lot. That said, I don't find a lot of crossdressing the least bit humiliating. I've worn skirts (mostly around a former partner's place, they were her skirts, but also in public a couple times), but because they were comfortable and because I looked good in them, not for any sort of kink related reason. Aside from the skirt, I was dressed normally. While I don't think this is crossdressing, it is violating societal gender stereotypes. I think that, for many, going against the traditional gender roles is what they find appealing and possibly humiliating. While I don't think that I would have a problem going to school/work wearing a tasteful and comfortable skirt (I'm a student and I work at a very large university), going to the movies in a short dress, heels, makeup and a stuffed bra would be extremely humiliating, though not terribly appealing on a sexual, or any other level. Wearing a dress styled after a young girls traditional party dress would be even more humiliating and would be sexually appealing (especially if combined with diapers, for which I have a fetish), even though I am not into age play.

I think the difference in these three scenarios lies mostly in the social perceptions of these style of dress. Wearing a skirt to school/work would certainly provoke some questions, but none that couldn't be easily answered by explaining the style & comfort value. Going to a movie in full drag would certainly attract much more notice, but wouldn't be unreasonable considering I live in a fairly large and quite liberal city. Just wearing, much less going anywhere dressed as a young girl would almost certainly be interpreted by others as done for sexual purposes. While this would (obviously) be correct, I think I would find it quite humiliating (in a good, sexual way) to have my sexual desires advertised so prominently. Dressing up as in a maid's uniform would probably fall somewhere between going out in drag and wearing the little girl's dress for me, though the inclusion of diapers would make it much more sexual.

I am also decidedly not an exhibitionist, so I'm sure that greatly influences my perceptions of the subject.

As for a FemDom dressing in drag, I can see why it might appeal to some, but it doesn't to me. I think this is closely related with some peoples strong sexual attraction to others in uniform. Society associates power with uniforms, including business suits. Likewise, society associates submissiveness or passiveness with many types of 'traditional' feminine clothing styles (especially those of a maid and young girl...). When a Domina dresses in an outfit that has these associations with power, I can certainly see how it could be appealing. I think the desire to assert both power and femininity (two thing often viewed as mutually exclusive by society) is what has led to the stereotypical ProDomme outfit of a corset and tight black leather. It is an outfit that has come to be societally associated with dominance and femininity. I think this is why aspects of that style of dress are subtly being adopted in more mainstream clothing styles as women desire to express their femininity without the attached perception of weakness. Conversely, that perception may very likely be a large influence in some men's desire for feminine clothing.

I think I've rambled enough for now.

Ben



LadyHugs -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 2:26:23 PM)

Dear balletsissypa,
 
Thank you for your comments and contributions.
 
Respectfully submitted,
Lady Hugs



LadyHugs -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 2:51:34 PM)

Dear Boondoggle, Ladies and Gentlemen;
 
I read your post #88 and things have cropped up as far as questions to ask, explore, share and discuss.
 
Hopefully everybody will read and participate on this thread.
 
1.  Exhibitionism, is where you subject others to viewing you and or the 'product.'  So, I do find a bit of confusion if you will, when you say that...'I'm not into exhibitionism."  Then in other paragraphs, you state you wouldn't mind walking about in public in feminine clothes.
So, this is a real struggle for some who think that you might just keep it 'in house' when you say 'I'm not into exhibitionism.'  Then another statement has you in public wearing female attire.
So, what is it when you wear female garments in public; given social standards?
 
2.  In terms of being "Forced" into cross dressing, wearing feminine attire; in D/s and or BDSM the philosophy is anti-force and or anti-consent.  No such thing as being 'forced' when a person is already doing such behaviors on their own--they enjoy it, and is their fetish.  Why do men who wear feminine attire insist on using the terms -- "Forced cross dressing, forced wearing garments and or under garments; especially when you enjoy it and insist on doing it?"
 
3.  Why do men want/need to be humiliated? 
 
4.  As a seasoned Domina --I haven't dressed around the clock with 'sterotypical' uniform as a Dominant woman.  I feel just as empowered with my uniform as I do without it.  Would men who participate in what would be sterotypical garments that would identify one as a sissy and or diapered child find themselves unable to give service to such a Domina?   I do realize during there are incidents in history, where women were bathed while still wearing their kid skin opera gloves.  But, being modern--I do want to be able to maintain my status on my own merits and not based upon my uniform.  For those who 'demand' their Female Dominants to always be in uniform is impossible and sets them up for failure.  I know when there are conditions I feel more are rooted in fantasy rather than a daily experience--I move on from such comments as someone who still is in fantasy and hasn't understood that life exists outside of a Domina's uniform.  So, are the ways one communicates and or comes across, is setting up a woman up for failure--and the frustration is, that women aren't willing to fail--Comments?
 
Just some thoughts.
 
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs
 
 



Grlwithboy -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 4:28:55 PM)

Honestly, I don't mind the idea of a guy working out some of his less-than-totally-healthy possible gender hangups by dressing up in women's clothing as opposed to other ways. I don't mind hashing out some of my OWN misogyny (guess again if you think you have no misogynistic hangups and you are a woman) with a guy dressed in said fashion. I don't mind playing around with hot and cathartic stuff, and I don't take the feminine parody of drags personally, because frankly I feel like surface femininity is artificial to me too, just not as taboo.

I guess I'm kind of at a loss here, because it seems to me that most people are resenting the idea that a CD MAY, oh no, use the Domina as a vehicle for fetish fulfilment in some capacity. We are constantly doing that in D/s - using one another as a vehicle for fantasy, no matter how *real* your M/s relationship may be due to your own parameters. It's a question of what behaviors you don't mind having reinfirced versus what behaviors you don't like having reinforced, and a good sub is reinforcing my preferred behavior all the time or the play becomes joyless.




LadyEllen -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 5:08:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grlwithboy

I guess I'm kind of at a loss here, because it seems to me that most people are resenting the idea that a CD MAY, oh no, use the Domina as a vehicle for fetish fulfilment in some capacity. We are constantly doing that in D/s - using one another as a vehicle for fantasy, no matter how *real* your M/s relationship may be due to your own parameters. It's a question of what behaviors you don't mind having reinfirced versus what behaviors you don't like having reinforced, and a good sub is reinforcing my preferred behavior all the time or the play becomes joyless.



Nail on the head

E



Shawn1066 -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 5:14:12 PM)

The concept of crossdressing never hurt my head until I tried to read this topic.  It's not that I don't follow, or see the sense, in a lot of ideas...  I just think everybody is looking into a tad to deeply.

Once in a blue, blue moon, dabble in crossdressing for my Owner.  It's something I take extremely seriously when I do it, because I want to do it -well-.  It's not something I need in order to be submissive.  I don't equate being feminine with being submissive.  As a human being, I'm an amalgamation of masculine and feminine.  The same is true of me as a submissive.  Do I lean more towards things that are deemed feminine at times?  Yes.  That's just how I am.

I don't find crossdressing humiliating.  It's not something I need to be "forced" into.  I can be my Owner's girl just as easy and naturally as I can be her boy.  I don't have to change anything about myself, and I can do that without any crossdressing either.

What I'm wearing doesn't make me anymore submissive than what my Owner wears makes her any more dominant.  On a lazy day, she's dominant wearing pajama pants and...guess what...I'm submissive wearing pajama pants too.



Boondoggle -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 5:24:33 PM)

Dear Lady Hugs,

Thank you for the excellent thoughts and questions. I'd love to see more participation as well.

The 'answers' to your first two questions are actually very closely related. I don't consider myself an exhibitionist in that I don't get any thrill, sexual or otherwise, from publicly displaying my sexuality. Nor do I have a desire to show off my sexuality in public. I find the idea of having my sexuality exposed in public (or in private) humiliating, and that idea is something that simultaneously scares and excites me. The key difference is in my level of instigation. While the end result may possibly be the same, I don't desire to choose to go there. Having another, one to whom I am attracted and trust, compel me to expose my sexuality (heh heh, that sounds dirty [;)] ) is something I find attractive. Ultimately, it is, and must be, a consensual decision. However, having that decision, and the details about what all is involved, taken out of my control is what appeals to me. While I am not truly being forced into this behavior because I am agreeing to submit to the decision, it is most certainly not me choosing this course of action.

When the word 'forced' is used in the context of a power exchange, I think this idea that the Dominant makes the choice while the submissive obeys is what's meant.

In many ways, I think exhibitionism and humiliation trigger many of the same parts of our sexuality. The key difference, for me, is in who controls the situation. As for why people (I'm absolutely certain that these desires span gender and sexuality differences) desire exhibitionism and/or humiliation (assuming they are related), I haven't a clue.

Unfortunately, I don't entirely understand your last question. I found some of the phrasing towards the end unclear. I think I understand the gist of the message, however.

I certainly don't think that all submissives who enjoy sexual costume play (there are females as well who enjoy dressing up as sluts, maids or babies) are only able to submit to Dominants in uniform. And while there may be some correlation between those who enjoy kinky cosplay and those who prefer Doms and Dominas in uniform, I don't think that such a correlation would have a large influence on preference in dominants. If there was some sort of significant connection, I think it would probably have been noticed, at least anecdotally, by now. Personally, though I most definitely do enjoy seeing a woman in an attractive outfit and such an outfit may catch my eye, I don't think the presence or absence of a uniform has ever influenced my desires for or against a potential partner. As well, I suspect that the vast majority of those who are interested in any sort of intimate relationship, especially one involving a significant power exchange, in other words, those interested in more than just kinky sex or scening, will not be heavily influenced by the presence or absence of a uniform. For a select few, however, I could imagine that the desire to see their Dominant in uniform could have an effect on the relationship. Hopefully, they would recognize that and be clear about their desires.

Ben

Edit (because it apparently takes me and my ADD three hours to write a post): Well said Grlwithboy. I couldn't agree more. So well said that I decided to take a quick curious peek at your profile only to find out we live THREE MILES?! from each other. And you're nerds to boot, most excellent. I feel like I've found a new neighbor and should bring you a fresh apple pie or something.



Reigna -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 5:50:50 PM)

I'm a genetic female whose genetic male sub is a full-on MtF crossdresser--wig, makeup, the whole megilla. I don't wear any sort of uniform or costume, though sometimes my clothes have a bit of an edge to them. So, no forced feminization for him and no fancy getups for me. But we still find LOTS to do.

I get that a lot of people find us weird or icky, but I sense more than a little transphobia in this thread. I always have to chuckle--and then sigh--when people on a board like this get all squicky about the unconventional behavior of others.



Reigna -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 6:19:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: balletsissypa 

... "being femnized" for [some] is more of a fetish that they use to decompress and relax. They usually go right back to being dominant malesonce they have achieved orgasm. The orgasm itself is important to look at also as many men get very masculine and very domininant once thy orgasm. That is why chastity devices are gaining in popularity.


Why would the male's orgasm and subsequent desire to go back to being his usual self be an issue? Unless he safewords, who cares what he wants? "I'm so glad you enjoyed your orgasm. Now, keep your pink dress on, sissy, and bring me some tea" works wonders for me.



iwearpanties -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 7:58:28 PM)

hi all great to see this thread is still going .. Regina i think what he was getting to is normal for sub who are like your and your lucky Man/ M t F   not many speical ladys like you are into this type of play . but getting back to what iwas saying . Boond  was saying that most sub now if both male and females to i dont know but i know it is more common of male sub once hes cum the need too submitt dosnet alwasy stay the want too return too villana life take contorl and the subside fades away inti the closet till the subness is recharged too play again is how i think he was trying to say...



LotusSong -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 8:01:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reigna


I get that a lot of people find us weird or icky, but I sense more than a little transphobia in this thread. I always have to chuckle--and then sigh--when people on a board like this get all squicky about the unconventional behavior of others.



LOL!  "transphobia".    No, my dear.. it's not a fear (outside of being hit with their purse [:D]). 
 
This thread is a discussion as to why sissies more often than not run into disappointment when seeking a dungeon as just a place to dress up in.  It also is trying to explain how others feel about it and to perhaps see the activity from a different view.  Lady Hugs has presented some excellent thought provoking questions.  My favorite being the domme who might have to only be able to dominate while being dressed as a caricature of a male.  I just about heard the ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww from the guys :)

I wonder why this activity is so prevalent in males?



Reigna -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 8:40:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong
LOL!  "transphobia".    No, my dear.. it's not a fear (outside of being hit with their purse [:D]). 


'Mmkay. [;)]

Actually, judging from the trans folk I know, you'd be more likely to get punched in the nose. But I understand what you're saying. And ... wow. Just wow.



Grlwithboy -> RE: Sissies' Acceptance Problem (12/11/2007 10:05:16 PM)

Actually, I've played with a ton of guys who enjoyed my periodic enjoyment of swagger, crossdressing, and butchness, and who addressed me as "Daddy." Many more than the handful who expressed being ho-hum on the idea on this thread.






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