RE: muslim(ah) members?

RE: muslim(ah) members? (Full Version)

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Rule -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 9:45:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Etch Yes indeed Mohammed spoke with Allah. It is mentioned in the Qur'an that he spoke to Allah and saw him but not with his mouth and eyes, with his heart. [sm=rofl.gif] More Jewish subversion of an historic event. They simply could accept that Mohammed met Allah in person. They must have considered Mohammed to be a filthy liar and have felt themselves entirely justified in changing his testimony to something that a Jew could accept.

Rule -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 9:49:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule The one incarnate god who is known to be merciful nor compassionate was the God of the Jews. A cut and paste error. I cannot correct myself anymore in my original post. Read AND instead of NOR here.

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:02:35 AM)
You're turning it into a religious debate. I thought you were just interested in knowing something. You've reached sensitive parts concerning both religions. My replies will be in your inbox later.

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:12:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule quote: ORIGINAL: Etch Muslims regard the Qur’an as the main miracle of Muhammad, as proof of his prophethood, and as the culmination of a series of divine messages. So yes it was not literally written by neither Allah nor Mohammed The present form of the Qur’an is accepted by most scholars as the original version authored or dictated by Muhammad. I cut out some of your texts in this quote. Well, I disagree. I consider the Qur-an the miracle of the Jew(s) who glibly subverted the texts of Mohammed. I very well know the difference between the incarnate Allah and the incarnate God of the Jews and the Divine. Allah was the incarnate god that Mohammed interacted with. The god of the Muslims is not Mohammed's god, but the God of the Jews, whom Mohammed fought. It seems like you're dictating me whom my god is. Just for the record; in Islam Allah is the god of Muslims, Christians and Jews. All the prophets were sent by Allah. So we don't have a separate god for jews like you say. Why cant you see that every religion has its point of view concerning all those events. If you wanna know mine fine but don't tell me whats right and whats wrong with my religion.

GreedyTop -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:21:04 AM)
Etch... sweetie, you are being so beautifully eloquent and open about your religion. I thank you for that, as I appreciate someone who can discuss their beliefs without proselytizing (sp?). However, you'll come to realize that any religious discussion with certain people inevitably turns sour.

Rule -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:34:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Etch It seems like you're dictating me whom my god is. Just for the record; in Islam Allah is the god of Muslims, Christians and Jews. All the prophets were sent by Allah. So we don't have a separate god for jews like you say. Why cant you see that every religion has its point of view concerning all those events. If you wanna know mine fine but don't tell me whats right and whats wrong with my religion. I am interested only in truths, not in the erroneous perceptions of these truths by whatever religion.

Rule -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:36:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GreedyTop Etch... sweetie, you are being so beautifully eloquent and open about your religion. I thank you for that, as I appreciate someone who can discuss their beliefs without proselytizing I agree. Well spoken, Etch!

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:53:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GreedyTop Etch... sweetie, you are being so beautifully eloquent and open about your religion. I thank you for that, as I appreciate someone who can discuss their beliefs without proselytizing (sp?). However, you'll come to realize that any religious discussion with certain people inevitably turns sour. Eh, i can see that now. Thank you =)

GreedyTop -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 10:58:48 AM)
I have a copy of the Qu'ran here somewhere.. I need to read it. Once I find it, and have spent some time reading it, I'd love to chat with you when I have questions?

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 11:00:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule I am interested only in truths, not in the erroneous perceptions of these truths by whatever religion. I'm almost 22 years old. I admit that i can't answer most of your questions, moreover, i cant justify the rest which i can answer. Good luck with your truths seeking.

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 11:01:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GreedyTop I have a copy of the Qu'ran here somewhere.. I need to read it. Once I find it, and have spent some time reading it, I'd love to chat with you when I have questions? Sure i'd be happy to answer, if i could.

DePubed -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 11:03:59 AM)
Muslims in my opinion are actually better pre-dispsosed for our BDSM lifestyle than some other religions. It is totally under-the-surface and sub-conscius, but,for example, take polyamory: Islam permits multiple wives, and therefore a 'poly' situation is something that a muslim can relate to, as opposed to Christians whose beliefs allow only monogamy. Also, take slavery: islam accepts slavery as a social institution decreed by Allah. Slaves are slaves because Allah decreed that they are to be slaves. Thus a muslim can easier accept his being a BDSM 'slave' or owner than other religions where everyone is basically equal. Wasnt it lthe famous Lawrence of Arabia who became a BDSM lifestyler after he, as a young stud was captured, stripped naked, tied spread eagle, and flogged by his muslim captors? His erections and orgasms while tied and flogged were so cathartic that afterwards he had to seek out people to tie and flog him as a stress release. Also remember that in the Quaraan the Prophet Mohammed instructs that all men and women should keep their bodies shaved hairless from the neck down as a form of submission to Allah and that being hairless and pre-pubescent-looking reminds them that they are children of Allah. Think about how in BDSM many submissives are kept bodyshaved or at least without pubes, etc. So I do think that there ought to be more muslims into BDSM as BDSM is not so problematic or in opposiiton to their religious tenets.

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/11/2009 11:25:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DePubed Muslims in my opinion are actually better pre-dispsosed for our BDSM lifestyle than some other religions. It is totally under-the-surface and sub-conscius, but,for example, take polyamory: Islam permits multiple wives, and therefore a 'poly' situation is something that a muslim can relate to, as opposed to Christians whose beliefs allow only monogamy. Also, take slavery: islam accepts slavery as a social institution decreed by Allah. Slaves are slaves because Allah decreed that they are to be slaves. Thus a muslim can easier accept his being a BDSM 'slave' or owner than other religions where everyone is basically equal. Wasnt it lthe famous Lawrence of Arabia who became a BDSM lifestyler after he, as a young stud was captured, stripped naked, tied spread eagle, and flogged by his muslim captors? His erections and orgasms while tied and flogged were so cathartic that afterwards he had to seek out people to tie and flog him as a stress release. Also remember that in the Quaraan the Prophet Mohammed instructs that all men and women should keep their bodies shaved hairless from the neck down as a form of submission to Allah and that being hairless and pre-pubescent-looking reminds them that they are children of Allah. Think about how in BDSM many submissives are kept bodyshaved or at least without pubes, etc. So I do think that there ought to be more muslims into BDSM as BDSM is not so problematic or in opposiiton to their religious tenets. In Islam, polygamy is allowed and practised under certain restricted conditions only. The single passage in the Qur'an dealing directly with the topic of polygamy is in Surah 4 Verse 3: "And if you fear that you cannot act equitably towards orphans, then marry such women as seem good to you, two and three and four; but if you fear that you will not do justice (between them), then (marry) only one or what your right hands possess; this is more proper, that you may not deviate from the right course." Which is actually impossible. !!!! Slavery is not accepted in Islam. It opposes Islamic principles of justice and equality. I mean, we are not allowed to buy animals what about humans ? It is a movie. Mohammed does not instruct in Qur'an, It's always Allah's instruction. There is absolutely no verses in Qur'an mentioning body shaving.

Eigenaar -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/12/2009 4:42:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: hisannabelle ...groping is also fairly common, as is dealing with having to listen to sexist comments and conversations at work... perhaps i'm more sensitive to things like this as a rape survivor I can not believe what you say is true. If it is and colleagues touch you sexually I wonder why you do not go to the police and what makes you think wearing a headscarf will prevent them from groping. What has this furthermore to do with Islam when you call yourself a rape survivor and it is not uncommon in Islam rape survivors are killed by their own family because Muslims do not rape and you made it up? quote: ORIGINAL: Etch ** !!!! Slavery is not accepted in Islam. It opposes Islamic principles of justice and equality. I mean, we are not allowed to buy animals what about humans ? "Never should a believer kill another believer, except by mistake. If anyone kills a believer by mistake he must free one Muslim slave and pay compensation to the victim's relatives, unless they charitably forgo it; if the victim belongs to a people at war with you but is a believer, then the compensation is only to free a believing slave; if he belonged to a people with whom you have a treaty, the compensation should be handed over to his relatives, and a believing slave set free. Anyone who lacks the means to do this must fast for two consecutive months by way of repentance to GOD: GOD is all knowing, all wise. If anyone kills a believer deliberately, the punishment for him is Hell, and there he will remain: GOD is angry with him, and rejects him, and has prepared a tremendous torment for him." Sura 4:92-93 The above says slavery is accepted. Mohammed is said to have thousands of slaves he also had sex with besides with members of the family according to the Qur'an. This when he restricted others this behaviour. Does the Qur'an in your opinion justify Imams dictating believers to slaughter infidels like pigs and dogs in the streets of the Netherlands?

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/13/2009 9:03:49 AM)
I've sent the reply about the slavery issue. Check your inbox. No it doesn't. And we dont consider those as true Muslims. Don't you have people who misuse their reliogious or political positions ?. In Egypt we've been living with christians for ages. Christians are about 15 ~ 20 % of Egypt's population and we dont slaughter them in the streets of Cairo. Millions of Tourists come to Egypt annually and they find great hospitality whatever their religion is. Every thing has its good side and bad side. Unfortunately you always see our bad side only. I dont blame you its mainly our fault. I hope the coming days would be more peacful.

Rule -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/13/2009 9:47:02 AM)
Eigenaar, apparently, is like me Dutch, and The Netherlands does have a problem with predominantly Moroccan, Islamic youths who do not behave in a civil way and appear to be truly evil. That said, I do see the good side of populations that mutilate the penises of their male offspring, as well as the bad side. Nevertheless, desiring to be good can result in becoming evil. When one fears dogs, one gets bitten by dogs. Desiring to be good, equates to fearing becoming evil. As St. Paul said, generalizing: those who are circumcized of penis, are not circumcized of heart; whereas those who are not circumcized of penis, are circumcized of heart.

Eigenaar -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/13/2009 10:07:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Etch I've sent the reply about the slavery issue. Check your inbox. No it doesn't. And we dont consider those as true Muslims. Don't you have people who misuse their reliogious or political positions ?. In Egypt we've been living with christians for ages. Christians are about 15 ~ 20 % of Egypt's population and we dont slaughter them in the streets of Cairo. Millions of Tourists come to Egypt annually and they find great hospitality whatever their religion is. Every thing has its good side and bad side. Unfortunately you always see our bad side only. I dont blame you its mainly our fault. I hope the coming days would be more peacful. I am not aware of having religious leaders or politicians summoning their followers to slaughter people in their own streets. I am sure they would be criticized for doing so by these followers but this is not the case with the mentioned imams. I am not looking to point to your bad sides but come with facts illustrating Islam is not only a bed of roses and that (sexual) slavery is not condemned by the verses we discussed and it is not certain homosexuality does not exist in the Qur'an.

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/13/2009 11:45:29 AM)
quote: I am not looking to point to your bad sides but come with facts illustrating Islam is not only a bed of roses and that (sexual) slavery is not condemned by the verses we discussed and it is not certain homosexuality does not exist in the Qur'an. I didnt say that and i don't know why you want to prove or illustrate that especially here. I'm waiting for those verses.

Etch -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/13/2009 11:52:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule Eigenaar, apparently, is like me Dutch, and The Netherlands does have a problem with predominantly Moroccan, Islamic youths who do not behave in a civil way and appear to be truly evil. That said, I do see the good side of populations that mutilate the penises of their male offspring, as well as the bad side. Nevertheless, desiring to be good can result in becoming evil. When one fears dogs, one gets bitten by dogs. Desiring to be good, equates to fearing becoming evil. As St. Paul said, generalizing: those who are circumcized of penis, are not circumcized of heart; whereas those who are not circumcized of penis, are circumcized of heart. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circumcision " Religious male circumcision is considered a commandment from God in Judaism.[5] In Islam, though not discussed in the Qur'an, circumcision is widely practiced and most often considered to be a sunnah.[6] It is also customary in some Christian churches in Africa, including some Oriental Orthodox Churches. " Circumcision is not necessarily an Islamic act. And I can't see how could it be related to heart. Would it make a difference to you if you're talking to an uncircumsized Muslim?. I guess not.

thishereboi -> RE: muslim(ah) members? (9/13/2009 11:57:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GreedyTop Etch... sweetie, you are being so beautifully eloquent and open about your religion. I thank you for that, as I appreciate someone who can discuss their beliefs without proselytizing (sp?). However, you'll come to realize that any religious discussion with certain people inevitably turns sour. Yea, in fact if one were a cynic, they might think that certain posters only ask about your beliefs, so they can tell you how stupid you are for having them. I am not sure what the get out of it, but it seems to make them happy. It's a shame because I really enjoy hearing about other beliefs and religions and with this kind of crap, people will be less likely to share.

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