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RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 10:59:28 PM

Owner59

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From: Dirty Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

As to Kerry, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth end of story.

Have you forgotten about the forged documents on Bush's military service? Besides, 3 Purple Hearts in 4 1/2 months is going to suggest to a lot of people that Kerry was simply too dumb to duck. Considering he was trying to run on his service after what he did when he came home, I'd have been shocked if other vets HADN'T called bullshit on him.

End of story... Is that like Al saying "the debate is over" when somebody mentions the shrinking ice-caps on Mars?

However ,Kerry had nothing to do with the document/bush AWOL thing.

Bush on the other hand,was behind the lying scum calling themselves "Swiftboat Veterans for Truth".

Big difference.

You think people can`t sink lower,but then there`s republicans to remind you differently.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 101

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:04:09 PM

Owner59

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From: Dirty Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydog1

Dom Ken, I thought Clinton hiring people to go physically disrupt Bushes campaign rallies was rather over the top, Craig Livingstone.

Dom Ken, I thought Clinton hiring people to go physically disrupt Bushes campaign rallies was rather over the top, Craig Livingstone.

There is nothing funnier or more pointless than disscussing the 2000 election with someone who thinks Gore wanted "ALL" the votes counted. Simply never happened. He asked the courts to intervene to do a special count in 4 districts, and the USSC said no way, those votes are not more special than any other districts votes. While attempting to have millitary ballots from overseas thrown in the trash.

Lots of people have a hard time grasping that it is not what they say on tv that matters, but what they actually do (and in this case which court cases they file). I did see Gore on tv asking for "ALL" the votes to be counted many times, but he was in fact trying to have votes thrown away. He assumes his followers will just go with the tv blurb I suppose, and he seems to have been correct.

Dom Ken, I thought Clinton hiring people to go physically disrupt Bushes campaign rallies was rather over the top, Craig Livingstone.

Any proof of that ,not-so-lucky?

A link or article to back that up?

Always seems like I`m say those same words to you,and you never back up what you claim.

How about something more than a regurgitation of Rush Limbaugh.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 1/30/2008 11:07:11 PM >

(in reply to luckydog1)

Post #: 102

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:08:44 PM

TheHeretic

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Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Although I do note your careful snippage...

I trim for clarity of my response, and to avoid the pain on the eyes overquoting produces. I don't believe I altered the meaning of your words. People are always able to read back, and to see not only if posts have been edited, but at what time the edit occurred.

You discussed lies about vets, and impugning them. I pointed out that his hands had exactly the same crap on them.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 103

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:14:21 PM

DomKen

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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Hi DomKen

I hope you don’t mind me jumping in especially on history that can’t be changed now BUT…

The lack of action then is still causing us problems today…I think Saddam may have been remembering that history and did not believe we would invade.

I believe that if we were up front with Russia about our intentions to retrieve our hostages with whatever force necessary… and we had no intentions of occupying Iran they would not of interfered.

If we had told Iran we were coming, if they did not release the hostages, and then started building forces for invasion they would have found a way to end the standoff.

Butch

A lesson of history it would do well for us all to learn and keep in our hearts, dictators and tyrants never believe freedom loving people will fight.

However that doesn't change a single thing. The Soviet's would have used our attack on Iran as an excuse to grab Iran themselves, they already had forces ready as part of the eventual invasion of Afghanistan. Direct confrontation with the soviets had to be avoided due to the real circumstances on the ground where the US defense against soviet aggression in Europe was nuclear first strike which would trigger MAD.

And while that may have mattered in 1991 by 2002 Saddam had to be pretty clear that we would invade.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 104

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:16:48 PM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

However ,Kerry had nothing to do with the document/bush AWOL thing.

Bush on the other hand,was behind the lying scum calling themselves "Swiftboat Veterans for Truth".

       I have exactly as much proof as you do. That would be "None."

       Slice it any way you want. I found enough to disgust me on the Dem side in '04 that I walked away from what had been my default party. They aren't doing a good job of luring me back.

      G'nite

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Owner59)

Post #: 105

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:23:23 PM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Although I do note your careful snippage...

I trim for clarity of my response, and to avoid the pain on the eyes overquoting produces. I don't believe I altered the meaning of your words. People are always able to read back, and to see not only if posts have been edited, but at what time the edit occurred.

You discussed lies about vets, and impugning them. I pointed out that his hands had exactly the same crap on them.

Well you should probably snip a lot less agressively because you often appear to be making a point that only makes sense when you've snipped something in what you're responding to.

In this case you're still not responding to my request for clarification on whether any of Kerry's 1970's congressional testimnoy was ever shown to be a lie? I'm not asking if you liked it, I already made clear I am not terribly pleased with how it was done. I want to know if you can show it is definitely untrue.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 106

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:31:16 PM

luckydog1

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owner, do you not remember Craig Livingstone disrputing Bush events in a chicken suit? You can google it I am sure, if it slipped your mind.

Do you just scream "Rush Limbaugh!" out of habit or something, when you can't back up your point with facts?

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 107

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:36:14 PM

luckydog1

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Also Kerry campaign officials met with the man providing the fake document to CBS. There actually was a meeting, CBS arranged it and admitted it. They said it was of course ok

(in reply to luckydog1)

Post #: 108

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/30/2008 11:41:30 PM

DomKen

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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydog1

owner, do you not remember Craig Livingstone disrputing Bush events in a chicken suit? You can google it I am sure, if it slipped your mind.

Do you just scream "Rush Limbaugh!" out of habit or something, when you can't back up your point with facts?

I do remember it and thought it was freaking hilarious. And Chicken George did get Bush I to debate Clinton which helped put a merciful end to one Bush's political career. However compared to the crap Lee "Willie Horton" Atwater pulled it was softball at best.

(in reply to luckydog1)

Post #: 109

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 12:01:58 AM

Feric

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From: San Francisco
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A better title for the Bush's address would be, "No President Left Behind". [snort] W is a man with fixed ideas, but even he can't escape the fact that he will be remembered as the Worst President in History.

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(in reply to MzMia)

Post #: 110

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 1:37:54 AM

luckydog1

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Willie Horton? Oh you mean the guy that Al Gore interjected into national politics, you are aware of that Dom ken, right?

I thought it was freaking hilarious that the Dems nominated a candidate who was letting murders and rapists out of jail for the weekend, and thought they could possibly win. And it is even more hillarious that they still don't understand why the "dumb" public didn't support them in it.

In 92 the right split its vote and Clinton got elected, less than 40% of the vote. Perot got Clinton elected not any sort of skills or campaigning by Clinton.

But we do have you down in favor of physically disrupting campaign events...nice..

(in reply to Feric)

Post #: 111

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 5:50:15 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydog1

Willie Horton? Oh you mean the guy that Al Gore interjected into national politics, you are aware of that Dom ken, right?

Willie Horton references are much older than that!

The Bush campaign used references to him to bash Michael Dukakis in the 1988 presidential race.

Dukakis was not the the governor when the law that allowed Horton out of jail was passed and in fact during his tenure he worked to get the law changed.

Please try to get the history correct folks.

But of course actual use of facts would not help anyone blindly support a political party now would it?

< Message edited by thetammyjo -- 1/31/2008 5:53:12 AM >

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And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to luckydog1)

Post #: 112

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 6:41:29 AM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydog1

Willie Horton? Oh you mean the guy that Al Gore interjected into national politics, you are aware of that Dom ken, right?

An actual outright lie.

In the Felt Debate Gore mentioned the furlough program but not Horton. Horton is all Lee Atwater and accomplices right down to calling him Willie when he never went by that name.

What is funny is the program was signed into law by the previous Republican Gov. Francis Sargent but for some reason Dukakis was somehow responsible for it and got no credit for being the governor who actually signed the law stopping it. But of course the truth doesn't matter all that mattered was defaming a good man who would have been a good president.

(in reply to luckydog1)

Post #: 113

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 7:05:02 AM

TheHeretic

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From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

you're still not responding to my request for clarification on whether any of Kerry's 1970's congressional testimnoy was ever shown to be a lie?

I don't recall that he provided enough specific details in his testimony to do anything but impugn the service of vets in general. The "Cambodia on Christmas Eve" turned out to be pure fabrication, I think, but I'm not sure if that was when he made the remark.

And since you are not responding to any aspect of the campaign, other than the mutual attacks on military service, I'm not feeling really obligated to go Googling.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 114

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 7:11:46 AM

kittinSol

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Feric

W is a man with fixed ideas, but even he can't escape the fact that he will be remembered as the Worst President in History.

I quote you because it's worth repeating :-) . Again, and again, and again, and... again. 'Till the rabid hords calm down, at least

.

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(in reply to Feric)

Post #: 115

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 7:21:02 AM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

Time will tell. He has some good competition.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 116

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 7:23:40 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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We cannot know the future.

To date, however; we can assure ourselves that he is the One.

Ron

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(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 117

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 7:30:02 AM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

We cannot know the future.

To date, however; we can assure ourselves that he is the One.

Ron

_____________________________

(in reply to mnottertail)

Post #: 118

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 8:05:20 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
And since you are not responding to any aspect of the campaign, other than the mutual attacks on military service, I'm not feeling really obligated to go Googling.

Mutual? I looked into your claim that Whoopi Goldberg attacked servicemen and couldn't find anything. You provided no other specifics except Kerry's congressional testimony and subsequent anti Vietnam War activity. I happen to know that both at the time and in the 30+ intervening year nothing he said to Congress was ever shown to be untrue but I was quite willing to see if you had something new.

As to not responding to any aspect of the campaign, I feel I've responded to the points you've raised and have reread the thread and do not see any point you raised that I didn't address. If you feel that I have ignored some point please repeat it and I will respond.

I would still like an explanation vet to vet how you could support Bush knowing how he evaded service and after his having cut outs tell lies about another veteran's military service?

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 119

RE: State of the Union Address - 1/31/2008 11:04:06 AM

luckydog1

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Dom Ken the reason Dukakis go the blame is that the original program (signed by the Republican govenor) did not extend to violent criminals. the courts decided it had to cover violent criminals including murders. the legistlature immediatly voted to resciond the Law and Dukakis Vetoed the recesnion, and it remained the law for the rest of his term, the next govenors term, and Dukakis cancelled it in 1988 after hundreds of stories on it were run in local papers (one won a pulitzer prize.)

We have already established ythat you fully buy into the double standard, that there is no connection of any kind between Democrats and left wing groups, while there is 100% linkage between Republicans and right leaning groups. Real honest of you there. You still have not provided a shred of evidence linking swift boats to Bush. Yet keep making the accusation. And there is none between Americans for Bush who ran the horton ads and the actuall Bush Campaign. And I am sure that lack of any sort of evidence despite an investigation matters not at all to you.

Al Gore talked about the details of Hortons case (Tammy Jo, Gore was in fact in politics and ran for the Democratic Nomination in 88), And Gore brought the issue to the national level. Bush picked up on it. Intersting to note that the Dukakis campaing ran ads featuring scary Latino murdrers and naming them by name, and got called out by Democratic Congress members and Civil rights groups, yet he is not considered racist, and few people remember the Medrano affair.

So does this basically boil down to a Democrat screaming "you can't say that, but we can!"?

Dukakis veoted the law that would have stopped Horton from killing more people. Thats the fact domken. And it is certainly fair to talk about it.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 120

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