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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 1:56:09 PM   
SailingBum


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OmegaG


And I could tell you stories relayed to me by my mother of the children in her classes in the 60s acting no better then they do today and the parents turning a blind eye.

My parents were not proponents of public humiliation and punishment.  To act up in a store meant we would leave imediately, either with one parent while the other continued to shop or the shopping trip was over if there was only one parent.  Had they humiliated me in public I believe that I would have learned that bad behaviour is acceptable, so long as one was an adult.


Oh that makes perfect sense punish the parent by not being able to finish their shopping because the kid is acting up!!!  Why didn't I think of that.  How about dealing with it right then and there without creating a scene so the kid will realize the consequences of their actions.  Instead your telling the kid by your actions that it's OK to act up as long as your with a adult.  SHEESH

BadOne 

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 2:25:28 PM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
Status: offline 		I highly doubt public humiliation will moderate behavior in a socially productive direction.  Judging by how my two boys acted growing up, I would gauge public humiliation more likely to produce either social withdrawal or extreme anger.  Neither strikes me as a desirable trait to instill in a child.




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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 2:26:42 PM   
Leatherist


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

I highly doubt public humiliation will moderate behavior in a socially productive direction.  Judging by how my two boys acted growing up, I would gauge public humiliation more likely to produce either social withdrawal or extreme anger.  Neither strikes me as a desirable trait to instill in a child.





Amen.

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 2:34:46 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
Know your subject can handle it before deciding it's a great idea, else you'll be spending a lot of effort picking up the pieces of the toy you broke.


I would assume that the child's mother DOES know her child. 


Bad assumption.



Bad assumption, but great recommendation.  From what I have observed of far too many parents (including my ex wife), they do not take the time to know their children as human beings.

Damn shame, too.  They don't know what they're missing.


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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 2:43:43 PM   
darchChylde


Posts: 5279
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From: Warm Springs, GA but i live in San Francisco.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: audioguy58

An excellent idea. I came up with a similar idea some time ago.

I was thinking that the Domme could make the sub wear a special harness with a clear plastic pocket in the front where the Domme could insert signs that say "I didn't help with the dishes" or "I didn't take out the trash".

The harness would have locking buckles at the rear.

Sincerely,
Kevin



Good idea, but its' use needs to be balanced with postitive placards.

"i went the extra mile with the chores."

"i made Ma'ams day."


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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 2:47:00 PM   
ownedgirlie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
Know your subject can handle it before deciding it's a great idea, else you'll be spending a lot of effort picking up the pieces of the toy you broke.


I would assume that the child's mother DOES know her child. 


Bad assumption.



Bad assumption, but great recommendation.  From what I have observed of far too many parents (including my ex wife), they do not take the time to know their children as human beings.

Damn shame, too.  They don't know what they're missing.



I fully agree, and stated so.  Whether parent or owner, know your "subject."

The error is in assuming this happens.  It doesn't always, unfortunately.  Probably less often than people think.

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 2:50:39 PM   
subtee


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Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline 		FR~

Anthropologically speaking, isn't shame a feature as a teaching tool in nearly every understood culture?

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 3:11:20 PM   
YourhandMyAss


Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Turning out ok had nothing to do with my mom. I'm not an older folk, but I have tons of horror stories from my childhood all stemming from mosher.She treated us horribly at times telling us to go to hell and telling us fuck you, and slapping us in the face when ever she got mad at us, and screaming at us so loud neighbors heard. She was an abusive mother, and she's a bit abusive in how she handles her nieces too when they're over here. It's one of the reasons we never see them I bet.

She says she spanked us and we turned out ok, well, thing is one of us didn't. My brother still carries tons of hate because of her actions. Now some of his actions are baseless, and pure self absorbed bullshit, but some of it's founded.

I'm an adult now and we have a mostly healthy relationship, but she terrorized both of us as children.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Faeorie

I'm sure some of you older folks have even worse horror stories to tell of your parents punishing you...and we all turned out fine... generally.


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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 3:14:07 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee
Anthropologically speaking, isn't shame a feature as a teaching tool in nearly every understood culture?

It has been used in just about all cultures.  But that doesn't mean it's been pretended to be a teaching tool.  No, it's mostly used to simply eliminate the behavior at any cost.  It doesn't teach anything other than "This behavior will get you kicked out and less likely to survive."

It worked on me very well in elementary school when I was ostracized for being gay.  I learned very fast that behavior like that was not accepted and bad.

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 3:29:17 PM   
ownedgirlie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

Turning out ok had nothing to do with my mom. I'm not an older folk, but I have tons of horror stories from my childhood all stemming from mosher.She treated us horribly at times telling us to go to hell and telling us fuck you, and slapping us in the face when ever she got mad at us, and screaming at us so loud neighbors heard. She was an abusive mother, and she's a bit abusive in how she handles her nieces too when they're over here. It's one of the reasons we never see them I bet.

She says she spanked us and we turned out ok, well, thing is one of us didn't. My brother still carries tons of hate because of her actions. Now some of his actions are baseless, and pure self absorbed bullshit, but some of it's founded.

I'm an adult now and we have a mostly healthy relationship, but she terrorized both of us as children.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Faeorie

I'm sure some of you older folks have even worse horror stories to tell of your parents punishing you...and we all turned out fine... generally.




"Turning out ok" is often said, but turning out ok when coming from an unhealthy environment is usually the result of a lot of extra work that is now heaped upon the adult child in order to work through some of that crap.  There's a good reason why there are so many therapists in business these days.

I used to listen to my father-in-law say that a lot.  He grew up watching his drunk father beat his mother, they were poor, with 11 kids in the family.  He shrugs and says "We turned out ok.  I don't know why so many people think they need therapy these days." 

I smile, wanting to ask if that's why his first marriage went to hell in a handbasket and none of his children talk to him?  But I love him, and I share with him how therapy helped me turn out "better than ok" and he mumbles that he just doesn't get it.  :)

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 3:44:04 PM   
velvetears


Posts: 2933
Joined: 6/19/2006
Status: offline 		This mother should have cps called on her and she should be held accountable for emotional abuse. You don't publicly humiliate a child.. period, end of story.  No reason or justification for it ever.  i have worked in settings with chilren where colleagues used humiliation as a way of control... it always disgusted me and made me loose respect for them.   Anyone involved with children should not expect the molding and nurturing, teaching modeling etc isn't going to be easy... TFB.... it's your, job do it.  Maybe this mother should be made to wear a sign that says "I am too ignorant to understand how to get my child to behave in school and I decided to use abuse because I couldn't think of any other way.  I need to be taught how to be a decent human being". 



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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 3:45:55 PM   
YourhandMyAss


Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Yup. It does take a lot of work to be"ok" sometimes and i really wish more people realized that.


quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie


"Turning out ok" is often said, but turning out ok when coming from an unhealthy environment is usually the result of a lot of extra work that is now heaped upon the adult child in order to work through some of that crap.  There's a good reason why there are so many therapists in business these days.


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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 3:51:07 PM   
TracyTaken


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Joined: 2/1/2008
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quote:

This mother should have cps called on her and she should be held accountable for emotional abuse. You don't publicly humiliate a child.. period, end of story.


What bugged me even more, the news media that actually got in the kid's face with a camera had to have had the mom's permission.  That just irks me.  Poor kid.

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 4:02:43 PM   
Gwynvyd


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Missokyst

Kids are horribly spoiled.  Hmm.. I wonder who let that happen?  As a former retail slave I saw a lot of parents indulging their children, but more who plain out ignored the way they acted.  In fact, I saw too many parents that not only accepted their childs bad behavior, they encouraged it as their right. 
Check out any toy department sometime.  Kids open packages right in front of parents.  They take out riding toys, skateboards, ect, and "test" them.  And parents smile and look on. 
Come on.  What is the point of that?  To keep them occupied?  Do they think that letting the kid ride a skateboard in the store will tell them if it is safe to ride outdoors? 
They do it to pacify the child and keep them busy for the moment in the store.

Parents are the reason kids are spoiled.
I could take my kids anywhere and be proud of their civilized behavior.
I never yelled at them, or spanked them.   What I did do was make sure they felt safe with me, and that all actions have consequences.  It is part of teaching a human to be part of the world.
If you can get your child under control before age 3, everything else is cake.
I would never have humiliated my children to teach them a lesson.  But then again, my children were taught right from wrong by example and not the "do as I say not as I do" way I have observed in my retail life.
Kyst


Exactly!!!!!

You shouldnt have to humliate any child... You should teach them how to behave and be good decent humans from day one.

It is amazing the monsters I see running around stores.. and the idiotic parents. My son is horrified as well. He just looks at me and says under his breath, you would kill me if I ever acted like that in my life. I just smile and nod. Mind you he is no angel... but I would never sit on a street corner with a sign. When he has offended someone. He has gone to them. When he stole candy, he took it back to the store, and made amends. I joked with the school's councilor today his teacher prob. goes home each night and drinks a box of wine after dealing with him... but I would never publicialy humiliate him. 

Gwyn 

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 4:03:39 PM   
charlotte12


Posts: 471
Joined: 5/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SailingBum

quote:

ORIGINAL: OmegaG


And I could tell you stories relayed to me by my mother of the children in her classes in the 60s acting no better then they do today and the parents turning a blind eye.

My parents were not proponents of public humiliation and punishment.  To act up in a store meant we would leave imediately, either with one parent while the other continued to shop or the shopping trip was over if there was only one parent.  Had they humiliated me in public I believe that I would have learned that bad behaviour is acceptable, so long as one was an adult.


Oh that makes perfect sense punish the parent by not being able to finish their shopping because the kid is acting up!!!  Why didn't I think of that.  How about dealing with it right then and there without creating a scene so the kid will realize the consequences of their actions.  Instead your telling the kid by your actions that it's OK to act up as long as your with a adult.  SHEESH

BadOne 


That kind of attitude is right up there with the whole theory about if you ignore a crying baby it will eventually stop crying.  I seriously doubt there's ever been a baby that cried because it felt like annoying its parents.  It's probably hungry, or needing comfort or just needs to feel safe.

If a child is acting up in the store why does either the parent or the child need to be punished?  Shouldn't there be attention paid to why the child is acting up?   Even if they throwing tantrums for nothing more than attention it should be considered why do they feel they aren't getting enough attention?  Tantrums for attention aren't appropriate behavior but instead of simply teaching them what isn't appropriate behavior I would like to see more parents teaching what IS appropriate behavior and perhaps taking a little more responsibility for their own part in the child's behavior.

charlotte




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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 4:04:02 PM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

If one wants to instill a life long hatred of oneself with a child-this is exactly how to accomplish it.


Odd.... I rather like myself.


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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 4:08:42 PM   
TracyTaken


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Joined: 2/1/2008
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quote:

That kind of attitude is right up there with the whole theory about if you ignore a crying baby it will eventually stop crying. I seriously doubt there's ever been a baby that cried because it felt like annoying its parents. It's probably hungry, or needing comfort or just needs to feel safe.


Babies can cry simply because they are tired.  While I would never recommend ignoring a crying baby, I'm a big proponent of taking a break from crying baby when the caretaker feels stressed out over it (meaning a 10 minute break away from the sound of the crying).

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 7:21:14 PM   
OmegaG


Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SailingBum

quote:

ORIGINAL: OmegaG


And I could tell you stories relayed to me by my mother of the children in her classes in the 60s acting no better then they do today and the parents turning a blind eye.

My parents were not proponents of public humiliation and punishment.  To act up in a store meant we would leave imediately, either with one parent while the other continued to shop or the shopping trip was over if there was only one parent.  Had they humiliated me in public I believe that I would have learned that bad behaviour is acceptable, so long as one was an adult.


Oh that makes perfect sense punish the parent by not being able to finish their shopping because the kid is acting up!!!  Why didn't I think of that.  How about dealing with it right then and there without creating a scene so the kid will realize the consequences of their actions.  Instead your telling the kid by your actions that it's OK to act up as long as your with a adult.  SHEESH

BadOne 


My parents believed that since they were out parents that only they, and nobody else in the store had to hear a second more of the bad behaviour then necesary.  They felt that removing us from the store allowed other shoppers to continue their shopping experience in peace.

Ironically I either don't remember what happened after we were removed from the store or I was never removed, I remember my sister having to sit in the car with my mother while my father and I finished the shopping.

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 7:25:00 PM   
TracyTaken


Posts: 615
Joined: 2/1/2008
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quote:

My parents believed that since they were out parents that only they, and nobody else in the store had to hear a second more of the bad behaviour then necesary. They felt that removing us from the store allowed other shoppers to continue their shopping experience in peace.


Mine too, but they would have carried me out by my hair.

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RE: Nice Punishment Idea - 2/8/2008 7:41:50 PM   
OmegaG


Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TracyTaken

quote:

My parents believed that since they were out parents that only they, and nobody else in the store had to hear a second more of the bad behaviour then necesary. They felt that removing us from the store allowed other shoppers to continue their shopping experience in peace.


Mine too, but they would have carried me out by my hair.



That would have been public display of anger, which they were strictly opposed to, as well as public display of affection, public display of attitude and public display of agression.

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