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RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:17:05 PM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline

quote:

Any of us could loose everything tomorrow and become homeless. It's easy for us, comfortably off, to pontificate about homeless people as if they were from a different specie.

The fact is that whilst some choose homeless life, many do not, and find themselves thrown into it. It's easy, to loose a job, and then a home. Without an address, good luck on finding a fucking job.

People are so ignorant, and so hopelessly judgemental.

KittinSol, this is just not true. We don't live during the Great Depression, and there are jobs avaliable everywhere. I will grant you that a lot of these jobs suck. But you do what you have to, or you end up like this. I have been flat goddamn broke several times in my life. I have taken and kept some of the shittiest jobs imaginable. But, I have never and will never accept a handout in my life. I'd rather starve. It has nothing to do with ignorance or passing judgment. I have compassion for people that are disabled and children. I don't blame them. However, I do blame able bodied adults that refuse to step into line, get off their asses and do what the rest of us have to. I am not trying to be a prick. I understand that a lot of these people have issues with substance abuse or mental problems. Alcoholism and addiction are problems I am very familar with. It runs in my family. But there are programs out there. You just have to be willing to be helped. A lot of these people don't want to make any effort. They want things to be handed to them. It's sad, but there is little society can do to help these people.

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 21

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:17:19 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Any of us could loose everything tomorrow and become homeless. It's easy for us, comfortably off, to pontificate about homeless people as if they were from a different specie.

The fact is that whilst some choose homeless life, many do not, and find themselves thrown into it. It's easy, to loose a job, and then a home. Without an address, good luck on finding a fucking job.

People are so ignorant, and so hopelessly judgemental.

Hi kittin. I think a lot of anger is directed at those that don't even try to get out of the hole they're in (if they even see it as a "hole"); should society be made to support those people?

Of course, not all homeless, or jobless, people are in the "nut-crusher" category. I'm not talking about them.... I believe a decent society helps those that honestly need it.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 22

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:18:20 PM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

They are just refusing to live the way everyone else expects them to.

Human freedom at its finest (and I mean that quite sincerely). Please explain though, why they are entitled to one drop of sweat from my brow?

For greater reason than we would go into Iraq and 'free' them.
Hey, you sweat real hard I bet. Look, don't give the fuckers your books. Fuck 'em.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 23

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:20:08 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Is the Bible on your bookshelf ?

Kitten, I'm being completely literal and factual when I say that it is right next to Principia Discordia.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 24

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:20:41 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

Maybe they should be reading books on self improvement.

Yeah, I would have shit if one of them had listed Horatio Alger as a literary hero.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 25

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:20:44 PM

PanthersMom

Posts: 2215
Joined: 11/26/2007
From: Cleveland Ohio
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

you win the longest profile award.

you aren't kidding! well written and alot of thought put into it tho. just had to perv it, willow's right, i've never seen one like it.

PM

_____________________________

That which does not kill me, better run pretty damn fast

I miss my ex, but my aim is improving!

(in reply to faerytattoodgirl)

Post #: 26

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:20:59 PM

SugarMyChurro

Posts: 1912
Joined: 4/26/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
Unfortunately, some people can't cope with the rigors of modern life and choose to live this way. It's sad and hardly worth celebrating as a rebellious act of defiance towards society.

You're so immersed in the bullshit you can't pull yourself above it and see the sky.

Some helpful links:

http://freegan.info/

http://www.squat.net/

Youth International Party
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yippie

STEAL THIS BOOK By Abbie Hoffman
http://www.eriswerks.org/steal.html
or
http://tenant.net/Community/steal/steal.html

Some people choose this way. It's a political statement whether you like it or not. They are intelligent, organized, and even have access to technology. And this has been going on since long before the advent of the internet.

Free your mind...

-----

TESTIMONY OF ABBIE HOFFMAN
(from public records of the trial of the Chicago 8 and then 7)
http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/Chicago7/Hoffman.html

MR. WEINGLASS: Will you please identify yourself for the record?

THE WITNESS: My name is Abbie. I am an orphan of America.

MR. SCHULTZ: Your Honor, may the record show it is the defendant Hoffman who has taken the stand?

THE COURT: Oh, yes. It may so indicate. . . .

MR. WEINGLASS: Where do you reside?

THE WITNESS: I live in Woodstock Nation.

MR. WEINGLASS: Will you tell the Court and jury where it is?

THE WITNESS: Yes. It is a nation of alienated young people. We carry it around with us as a state of mind in the same way as the Sioux Indians carried the Sioux nation around with them. It is a nation dedicated to cooperation versus competition, to the idea that people should have better means of exchange than property or money, that there should be some other basis for human interaction. It is a nation dedicated to--

THE COURT: Just where it is, that is all.

THE WITNESS: It is in my mind and in the minds of my brothers and sisters. It does not consist of property or material but, rather, of ideas and certain values. We believe in a society--

THE COURT: No, we want the place of residence, if he has one, place of doing business, if you have a business. Nothing about philosophy or India, sir. Just where you live, if you have a place to live. Now you said Woodstock. In what state is Woodstock?

THE WITNESS: It is in the state of mind, in the mind of myself and my brothers and sisters. It is a conspiracy. Presently, the nation is held captive, in the penitentiaries of the institutions of a decaying system.

MR. WEINGLASS: Can you tell the Court and jury your present age?

THE WITNESS: My age is 33. 1 am a child of the 60s.

MR. WEINGLASS: When were you born?

THE WITNESS: Psychologically, 1960.

MR. SCHULTZ: Objection, if the Court please. I move to strike the answer.

MR. WEINGLASS: What is the actual date of your birth?

THE WITNESS: November 30,1936.

MR. WEINGLASS: Between the date of your birth, November 30, 1936, and May 1, 1960, what if anything occurred in your life?

THE WITNESS: Nothing. I believe it is called an American education.

MR. SCHULTZ: Objection.

THE COURT: I sustain the objection.

THE WITNESS: Huh.

MR. WEINGLASS: Abbie, could you tell the Court and jury--

MR. SCHULTZ: His name isn't Abbie. I object to this informality.

MR. WEINGLASS: Can you tell the Court and jury what is your present occupation?

THE WITNESS: I am a cultural revolutionary. Well, I am really a defendant---full-time.

MR. WEINGLASS: What do you mean by the phrase "cultural revolutionary?"

THE WITNESS: Well, I suppose it is a person who tries to shape and participate in the values, and the mores, the customs and the style of living of new people who eventually become inhabitants of a new nation and a new society through art and poetry, theater, and music.

MR. WEINGLASS: What have you done yourself to participate in that revolution?

THE WITNESS: Well, I have been a rock and roll singer. I am a reporter with the Liberation News Service. I am a poet. I am a film maker. I made a movie called "Yippies Tour Chicago or How I Spent My Summer Vacation." Currently, I am negotiating with United Artists and MGM to do a movie in Hollywood. I have written an extensive pamphlet on how to live free in the city of New York. I have written two books, one called Revolution for The Hell of It under the pseudonym Free, and one called, Woodstock Nation.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Post #: 27

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:22:03 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PanthersMom

quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

you win the longest profile award.

you aren't kidding! well written and alot of thought put into it tho. just had to perv it, willow's right, i've never seen one like it.

PM

Obviously you haven't read mine.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to PanthersMom)

Post #: 28

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:23:38 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

Posts: 3506
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline

Mine is also well written but I'm not bragging or anything.

_____________________________

Memory Lane...been there done that.

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 29

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:25:54 PM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

Hi kittin. I think a lot of anger is directed at those that don't even try to get out of the hole they're in (if they even see it as a "hole"); should society be made to support those people?

Hi Level. Yes, society should help people in need. I believe it's not helping them enough. I don't care if they choose to be homeless or not.

It's not up to me to judge whether a person is in difficulty through some kind of moral flaw of his own. Who is anyone to judge? I shudder to think what would come of many of us should we get ill, loose our jobs and defaut on our rents or mortgages.

For those who have safety nets, it's excellent that they have a buffer zone should anything happen to them.

For the others... well, fuck them, I suppose

.

_____________________________

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 30

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:25:57 PM

lauren0221

Posts: 681
Joined: 8/29/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: PanthersMom

quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

you win the longest profile award.

you aren't kidding! well written and alot of thought put into it tho. just had to perv it, willow's right, i've never seen one like it.

PM

Obviously you haven't read mine.

It's lucky I read fast:) Maybe you should cut out at least some of the details?

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 31

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:29:13 PM

lronitulstahp

Posts: 5392
Joined: 10/17/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

quote:

ORIGINAL: PanthersMom

quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

you win the longest profile award.

you aren't kidding! well written and alot of thought put into it tho. just had to perv it, willow's right, i've never seen one like it.

PM

Obviously you haven't read mine.

faerytattoodgirl ...made me perv Padraig, and Your comment made me perv You(again...whatever) i may perv people all night, i'm drunk with perving!!!!

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 32

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:29:19 PM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline

quote:

You're so immersed in the bullshit you can't pull yourself above it and see the sky.

I am immersed in bullshit? The people you cite are not homeless. They are hippies. Most of them grew up in upper middle class homes, and they can afford to act like this. They have good families to fall back on if they get hungry. They don't make up half of a percent of the homeless population.

(in reply to SugarMyChurro)

Post #: 33

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:30:18 PM

lronitulstahp

Posts: 5392
Joined: 10/17/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SL4V3M4YB3

Mine is also well written but I'm not bragging or anything.

consider yourself perved!!!

(in reply to SL4V3M4YB3)

Post #: 34

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:30:39 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

Posts: 3506
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline

Isn't there a bull above the bullshit anyhow?

_____________________________

Memory Lane...been there done that.

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Post #: 35

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:32:27 PM

Padriag

Posts: 2633
Joined: 3/30/2005
Status: offline

Since when did making a career of being unemployed or homeless become political dissent???? These people are living off the welfare my taxes pay for. So let me give you and them a news flash... if I'm paying for it, you better damn well believe I am going to have a say in how they live. If they don't like my, or other tax payers, having a say about their "lifestyle"... get a job and support their own damn lifestyle. When they are paying their own bills and for their own home, I really won't care how much or little they read or whatever else they do; but if I'm paying to support them, they better be making an effort towards becoming self sufficient.

As for what I would do with them, lets start with requiring them to at least seek employment as condition to any continued welfare, require monthly drug testing with failure of the test or failure to show up for the test resulting in loss of all welfare benefits.

And personally... I'd do what I've already done in three cases... gave someone a job. Two of those people screwed it up... one of them did so in a spectacularly bad way that nearly resulted in his going to jail. Some people you just can't help. My solution for those people is a harsh one... cut them off and leave them to their own devices... a man gets hungry enough his stomach may talk some sense to him when everyone else hasn't been able to get through.

_____________________________

Padriag

A stern discipline pervades all nature, which is a little cruel so that it may be very kind - Edmund Spencer

(in reply to SugarMyChurro)

Post #: 36

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:32:30 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SugarMyChurro

Some people choose this way. It's a political statement whether you like it or not.

Fine. Great in fact. But why are they entitled to the money I work for?

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to SugarMyChurro)

Post #: 37

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:33:01 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

Posts: 3506
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

quote:

ORIGINAL: SL4V3M4YB3

Mine is also well written but I'm not bragging or anything.

consider yourself perved!!!

I shall return the perv in kind and if there happen to be naked pictures they will always have a place on my hard disk drive.

_____________________________

Memory Lane...been there done that.

(in reply to lronitulstahp)

Post #: 38

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:39:07 PM

SugarMyChurro

Posts: 1912
Joined: 4/26/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
The people you cite are not homeless.

What exactly is homeless? Define it. Almost everyone has somewhere they stay. They may not own it or have any legal right to it however...

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
They are hippies.

A yippie is not a hippie. I don't see what you mean.

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
Most of them grew up in upper middle class homes, and they can afford to act like this. They have good families to fall back on if they get hungry.

Yeah, some are well educated and from the middle-class. You admit that much and insist it's not a choice? It's not a political statement?

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
They don't make up half of a percent of the homeless population.

I really couldn't say. But I doubt that your stats have any basis in reality. You might consider these sources:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squatting
http://squattercity.blogspot.com/

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Post #: 39

RE: The Homeless Book Club - 3/1/2008 6:39:12 PM

lronitulstahp

Posts: 5392
Joined: 10/17/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Who are homeless veterans?
The U. S. Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) says the nation's homeless veterans are mostly males (4 % are females). The vast majority are single, most come from poor, disadvantaged communities, 45% suffer from mental illness, and half have substance abuse problems. America’s homeless veterans have served in World War II, Korean War, Cold War, Vietnam War, Grenada, Panama, Lebanon, Operation Enduring Freedom (Afghanistan), Operation Iraqi Freedom, or the military’s anti-drug cultivation efforts in South America. Forty-seven percent of homeless veterans served during the Vietnam Era. More than 67% served our country for at least three years and 33% were stationed in a war zone.
How many homeless veterans are there?
Although accurate numbers are impossible to come by -- no one keeps national records on homeless veterans -- the VA estimates that nearly 200,000 veterans are homeless on any given night. And nearly 400,000 experience homelessness over the course of a year. Conservatively, one out of every three homeless men who is sleeping in a doorway, alley or box in our cities and rural communities has put on a uniform and served this country. According to the National Survey of Homeless Assistance Providers and Clients (U.S. Interagency Council on Homelessness and the Urban Institute, 1999), veterans account for 23% of all homeless people in America.

Well i suppose we must pay to support vets if we're forced to pay to support wars against our better wishes.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 40

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