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RE: BDSM Organics - 3/6/2008 9:10:43 AM

HouseDV8

Posts: 37
Joined: 5/10/2007
From: Houston
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

Damn. I thought this was going to be about collars and restraints made out of hemp -- something I could really use right about now. That cowhide and neoprene just ain't where it's at. I'm jump starting my shibari next week, for sure.

http://twistedmonk.com/

I thought that too! However, i am happy to see the deeper conversation going on.

My contribution to the OP,

I feel that in order to achieve holistic success, emotionally, spiritually, physically, mentally, morally, financially, etc etc, we absolutely must stay true to our organic nature. But, as someone already pointed out...all choices are valid. People can do whatever they want, and usually do!

_____________________________

It is not how long we have known each other, it is how well.

"Artists have the power, through our imagination, to escape a degenerate world and create a better one." - Infamous

(in reply to RedMagic1)

Post #: 21

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/6/2008 9:19:56 AM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Thanks Action,
This is a really fun topic for me. Since most of the questions I put open for discussion I have dealt with at one time or another.

(in reply to Action)

Post #: 22

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/6/2008 9:28:00 AM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

"Not everyone you need will be into every exact thing you are. But unless you have a true, clinical fetish, I doubt that with compromise and communication it will be impossible to get enough of your needs met. And for those with authentic fetishes, that's when you start calling your neighborhood professional who will indulge wearing latex and doc martins even in summer if you pay enough to make it worthwhile."

I hear you on the fetish issue.. When I started in San Diego scene a long time ago bondage was considered "something vanilla's do". So I learned the bullwhip and things more compatible to the group I ran with.

However bondage never was very far from my mind. I have two rivers that from childhood ran together for me. A lot of fun childhood memories of bondage by tying the nieghborhood girls up and saturday afternoon Godzilla movies. So when I got older, western bondage first got to be what I tried, but my love of Japanese film lead me to Shibari\Kinbaku. Its funny now I am very happy in myself and content. I still do the harder BDSM stuff but its more because of my connection with that person when I play.

< Message edited by Kinbakudayo -- 3/6/2008 9:32:57 AM >

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 23

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 10:29:14 AM

Stephann

Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline

I like bowling. I did it from time to time as a kid, and bowling allys abound (or at least they did) in Japan, while I was in the Marines. Yet I haven't been bowling in probably three years, and if I never do it again, I won't die a miserable person.

Things that are organic, for me, mean things that we deem important enough to invest time and energy into. Bowling, for me, isn't a priority for me, and I don't feel I'm missing out because I'm not bowling much. Yet if a group of friends wanted to go bowling once a month, I'd happily join in. If the same friends wanted to bowl three hours a night, four nights a week, I certainly wouldn't be interested.

It isn't a question of if I enjoy something, or require it in my life. It's a question of what's important enough for me to invest the limited time and resources I have into an activity. This applies to my BDSM activities.

I don't feel I'm obligated to do any sort of play for anyone elses benefit. However, I do like that in engaging in play that I only like, but not love, often opens doors to friendships that I otherwise might not have had the chance to explore. It's a trade off. At a party, I might love the host, tolerate the food, dislike the wine, and love the music. All in all, that's a 'good' party, that has less than fantastic elements. I drink less of the wine, eat less of the food, and focus on spending time talking or dancing with the host. I do what is in my power to improve my personal experience, and have no regrets as a result. If I felt I was obligated to eat too much food I didn't like, I probably wouldn't enjoy the party so much, and not likely return.

Regards,

Stephan

_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 24

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 10:48:53 AM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Hello Stephan,
Good to see you on here thanks for posting. I hope you and your lovely Charlote are well.

I hear you about time and investment if it means something. When I finally found out shibari wasnt simple intutive ropework. I worked on and invested time into it like a madman.

What I found that was interesting was when I got deeper into kinbaku, my other artistic insights began to open up. Now I am major into photography not just for kinbaku but for other more vanilla pursuits as well.

I think good things like this only come from investing time in yourself as you say.

(in reply to Stephann)

Post #: 25

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 11:00:15 AM

Stephann

Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline

Hello Kinbakudayo,

I wasn't positive that was you behind the screen. My regards to yours as well!

And I agree, the more you delve into things that are interesting to you, the more other opportunities open up. What started as an interest in picking a few tunes for my last slave turned into a passion that really changed how I viewed life.

Still, I don't think I really answered the heart of your question. I think it's good to learn skills that we know will make us more attractive to others of similar mind. Learning new things, as you said, gives us a broader perspective and gives us the chance to grow as individuals. If left to my own devices, I very well could have ended up glued to a computer screen 18 hours a day, 7 days a week, for the past 18 years. Fortunately, that wasn't an option, and I'm a better man for it. Still, there's the old 'be true to yourself' approach. If I spent all my time learning about things I don't have any interest in, just because it'll attract (say) a girl, then I'd probably end up with a girl I have no real interest in. Same goes for friends; I know very little about cars and have no interest in changing that, so learning a ton about cars just to hang out with mechanics would mean I have a bunch of friends based on a skill I don't really care about.

But I will say that in attending munches or a dungeon, there's probably only about 5% of the people there I'm remotely interested in knowing. This is no different than, say, if I visit a vanilla bar. Stretching out to learn new things doesn't mean becoming someone new to please and impress the masses, it just means finding a healthy balance of being open minded to new ideas, while remaining focused on enjoying the things you really like.

Hope that makes sense?

Stephan

_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 26

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 1:53:07 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I've got a question re hemp. I suffer from hay fever. Meaning walk into the barn to watch my daughter ride, the aisles are dusty and I can't breathe or see from the dust. Can't fill the hay nets, sets off the allergy. Will hemp rope set off my allergies?

Right now we just have cotton and nylon/polypropolene/some artificial fiber. And they work great. But hemp is not cheap and we don't want to start buying natural fibers to discover I can't tolerate them.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to Stephann)

Post #: 27

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 2:45:47 PM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Thats a tough one.

I have tried a few different hemp rope makers and here is how I see it

Most of what I have seen in hemprope from the US makers I would not use for bondage in that circumstance. See if you can pick up 1 strand of rope from twisted monk in the Osada Steve rope. Its very tightly spun and tends to have less particles fly around. You might want to check with Rick Sauve if he can send you an broken end of cut off of what he has. Then see if you can tolerate it around you. Most hemp sellers try to be helpfull on this issue.

The other issue is to have your partner run his hands through the hemp rope every day for a month out as far away from you as possible, as much as possible. The oils from his hands will soften the rope out and also remove alot of loose material on the rope. That will help alot as well

If that doesnt pan out. I would look at regatta braid cotton as close to 5-6 millimeter as you can.

Good luck on that one.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 28

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 4:53:05 PM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Yeah that does make sense. You hit on an interesting point for me. About ten years into my time (2-3 years ago?) with BDSM I went through a major burn out. While I learned a number of fun things I didnt really care to meet people that did that type of play I did. Why? because that play simply didnt interest me anymore. I honestly have to admit my current girl really rebuilt my love of BDSM with kinbaku.

I have learned now that my interests are one thing, but I like to relate to people on more then just my BDSM interests is even more important. I tend to be a little unfairly hard on those from the BDSM world because I want to know if I have more then that with them in common.

Now off topic, When you going to Charlotte to model something in a shibari tie? She comes over so well in the pictures you have of her. It really matched how she is in person as well. Just a photographic observation :)

(in reply to Stephann)

Post #: 29

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 4:59:19 PM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Hello House DV8

Yeah we tried going deep and moved towards stuff but thats fun to talk about too.

I totally agree on people being true to themselves. I do think in a group dynamic of the BDSM scene it does tend to be hard to do that from time to time. I quess it really depends on where someone is at the time in their life.

Thanks for joining the conversation.

(in reply to HouseDV8)

Post #: 30

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 5:30:10 PM

catize

Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline

I came to this (whatever one wishes to call it) to explore my masochistic fantasies. The reality turned out to be even better than my dreams (lucky me!) and along the way I discovered submission. Despite the fact that submitting to another’s authority is the harder part of wiitwd, it brings me the greatest joy and satisfaction.
Yes, there are things that, given a choice, I would prefer to avoid. However these things are not harmful to me so I do them. These activities are not intrinsic for me, yet I feel that I am still true to myself, because it is not about the act but the attitude. I am certain this does indeed make me more ‘attractive’ to both of them, but it also makes me more attractive to myself.

_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 31

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/7/2008 5:58:33 PM

Exquemelin

Posts: 113
Joined: 2/2/2007
From: CT
Status: offline

I was really hoping this was gonna be a BDSM robot asking about us BDSM organics.

_____________________________

testing
The Hammer is my penis.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 32

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 10:22:51 AM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Sorry no robot.

(in reply to Exquemelin)

Post #: 33

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 10:27:35 AM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

quote:

These activities are not intrinsic for me, yet I feel that I am still true to myself, because it is not about the act but the attitude. I am certain this does indeed make me more ‘attractive’ to both of them, but it also makes me more attractive to myself.

Thats an interesting way to look at it

< Message edited by Kinbakudayo -- 3/8/2008 10:28:04 AM >

(in reply to catize)

Post #: 34

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 2:30:33 PM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kinbakudayo

Doing play that we like but may not be “popular” in the groups we run. How does it affect us?

It means that I engage in those things in private rather than public venues. Even a king must maintain awareness of the feelings of his subjects and act in an appropriate manner. Most adults have the ability to be socially adept. Those who choose to act contrary will be escorted out and not invited back. If I'm in a venue which prohibits the drawing of blood, I'll leave the knives at home. If I am hosting an event, I'll make sure that those invited will know that a blood sport station will be available and they can make a choice on whether or not to attend, or whether or not to watch if they do attend.

quote:

What are the issues of finding styles of play that may make us more attractive to a Dominant\submissive person, but has little organic connection to us?

First issue is probably time investment. Have you put in enough time to discover enough about each other to know whether or not you're compatible. Second issue, is there enough compatibility and enough willingness on both sides to try out those things which may not entirely float your boat, but aren't a hard limit or complete turn off. Sometimes you have to give a little to get a little and I don't think it's asking to much for someone with whom you have a wonderful connection to step outside their immediate pleasure zone in order for everyone's need to thrive to be taken into account.

If one of my 'must haves' is a hard limit for someone, then I'm not going to compromise on it. But if it's just an iffy, don't much care thing, sure, I'll go there and hope my partner will, too.

quote:

The simple issue of a dominant\submissive giving up on his\her organic needs due to not being able to find someone with the same needs. Is this a valid thing to do?

I don't think valid is the right word. Postpone, perhaps. Hey, I had just as much truble as the next guy in finding someone with whom I was compatible in a long term sense .. my numero uno .. my main squeeze .. but, until we found each other, we both had a blast playing with numbers 2 - 200. ::winks:: Neither of us was completely satisfied with 2 - 200, but in the end, we both got it all and didn't have to miss out on a whole hell of a lot of fun while we were looking.

quote:

The issue of a Dominant’s\sub missive’s self in holding to something they want organically but losing to keep a relationship safe. What are the issues surrounding this?

I'd worry about resentment building, especially if I had taken the time and care to make sure that what I require to thrive was going to be taken into account with a particular person. If I mean so little that I've been 'yes'd' just to get compliance, that doesn't speak to a relationship which I'd find worth keeping.

Nice thread.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 35

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 3:05:48 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

Nice pics, OP. I'll see if I can reciprocate with the babyblocks version soon.

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Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Post #: 36

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 4:10:08 PM

Noah

Posts: 1660
Joined: 7/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kinbakudayo

... BDSM Organics. What I mean by organic is what we originally came to the BDSM world for. The organic desires we had before we met others like us and began to be affected by that influence.
...

It is common to hear or read from a quite kink-inexperienced person something along the lines of: I really don't know what I want or even how to describe my orientation, but I'm drawn to this (place/group/forum)

Your notion of "organic desires" seems at odds with this.

It also seems to suggest that influence from others somehow sullies or confuses that "organic desire".

Would you like to clarify?

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 37

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 5:25:16 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kinbakudayo
Doing play that we like but may not be “popular” in the groups we run. How does it affect us?

I don't believe their is any universal answer to this question that will provide any value. For myself, I am not concerned that my play maybe unpopular or popular with the community as a whole or in part. I suspect their is a variety of opinion on my play.... but the only opinion that is of concern is mine and those I actually play with.

quote:

What are the issues of finding styles of play that may make us more attractive to a Dominant\submissive person, but has little organic connection to us?

I don't play to find a partner or make myself more attractive...... sounds like a pretty shallow reason to play if you ask me.

quote:

The simple issue of a dominant\submissive giving up on his\her organic needs due to not being able to find someone with the same needs. Is this a valid thing to do?

It might be valid for some... but it is not for me.

quote:

The issue of a Dominant’s\sub missive’s self in holding to something they want organically but losing to keep a relationship safe. What are the issues surrounding this?

Never had this issue.... don't expect to have it either.

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 38

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/8/2008 6:02:51 PM

Kinbakudayo

Posts: 68
Joined: 2/21/2008
Status: offline

Hello Noah,

What I am refering to when I mean "organic' is that we normally have Fetish,Desire,Compulsion, or Pathological (this definition of course is a matter of persceptive) need we have that attracts us to the world of BDSM. This is what I am seeking to hear about and how its affected.

(in reply to Noah)

Post #: 39

RE: BDSM Organics - 3/9/2008 9:27:19 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

Of course, one way around not being into play that is popular in the local groups is by not playing publicly. We don't. He's into damsel in distress and sex, none of that requires a cross or a spanking bench, stocks, bullwhips etc. So why spend our time and money going places where we can't do what we're into, and we're not into what's being done. Sort of like saying if you like football then you would also like curling because they're both sports.

Personally I used to like watching curling, but the only football I watched voluntarily were the games my son played in.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to Kinbakudayo)

Post #: 40

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