RE: The Prodical Slave (Full Version)

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Padriag -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/28/2005 1:47:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RainGod

[Let Me try to play "catch up" here. There are so many wonderful answers and thoughts here, I wouldn't want to appear ungrateful for the advice.

Padriag wrote:

quote:

I think the question you first need to ask yourself is why you want to punish her


Anyone who knows Me will tell you I simply hate to punish. I dread it as much as the girl would dread it. I would rather never ever have to punish her. So why the need? I try to relate this to how I would do with My son, whom I shall love forever, no matter what he does. Although I love mijo unconditionally, if he lies, just for example, I am obliged to punish him. If I do not, does he not learn that this negative behavior will not meet with consequences? Would I then not be to blame for My passivivity and yes, neglect?
If I did not love someone, I wouldn't care how they acted or if they came and went. she is important to Me... is there another way besides punishment? If so, please.... please give Me ideas and save Me having to hurt us both (metaphorically speaking).

quote:

I hear a man who is hurt, and he wants her to feel that hurt, he wants her to know how much she hurt him, she wants him to understand how he feels.


I don't desire to hurt her as a payback... she knows full well the disappointment caused. I also believe she understands.

quote:

If those issues that drove her away are still there unresolved then it could very well happen again. So ask yourself this, do you have strength enough for that? Do you have it within you to cope with those issues... to cope with her even as she struggles? Can you do that and do it with love... without resentment?


The issues are still there, but they are of a semi-legal nature, and there is truly nothing I can do to interced except try to guide and support her. Yes, it could happen again... but I want to believe it will not. I want to trust...god knows I want to so bad. Trust is not easy for Me, yet I desire it so badly with this one. Yes I can go on without resentment. I never did resent her for leaving...really. Hurt, yes. Felt left out of her life, yes. But I didn't harbor a resentment. Resentments are things I cannot afford to maintain and feed. Some of you may know why I feel that way.


I didn't say you wanted to do it out of vengeance or payback, rather out of a desire to make her know how you feel. The difference is this, vengeance is about trying to justify things... you hurt me so I'm entitled to hurt you. But sometimes we, as human beings, will hurt someone we love because we want them to simply feel what we are feeling, to really know what it feels like. Sometimes we do that when they've done something that has hurt us, sometimes we do it when we are simply hurting and we lack the means to otherwise communicate what we are feeling.

But alright, you feel you need to punish her as a way of correcting her, to prevent her doing this again. As others have pointed out, she doesn't seem to have been being deliberately disobedient, she panicked, she did something irrational. Punishment will not necessarily correct or improve that. However, talking with her about what she did, getting her to talk about it and think about the choices she made and why she made them, teaching her to see for herself not just that what she did was wrong, but how she reached those wrong conclusions, that can effect change.

That is, you need to talk with her about what she did, what her decision making process was and getting her to think about it and examine it. How did she go from being your slave and trusting you... to feeling she had to run away from you... what was the decision making process that led her there? She made some wrong choices, but right now I'm not sure either of you really understand why she made those wrong choices, and you both need to. Once you both understand the series of choices she made that got her there, what her private logic was, you can identify where she went wrong and begin showing her better options, better choices she could have made. In the process you empower her to change her decision making process, the way she deals with things, and how she makes those choices. Its a funny thing about most of our mistakes in life, most are honest mistakes... it is very rare than any of us set out to deliberately screw up... at the time, we honestly believed our choices were correct and only in hindsight we see they were mistakes. From what you say, she made honest mistakes, she had good intentions, at the time she thought her choices were correct... what you need to correct is the private logic within her thinking that led to those incorrect choices, help her see where her thinking was flawed.

As for accepting her back... as I said before, if those issues are still there and still unresolved there is a very real possibility she may panic again and run away again. Those issues need counseling, and you may not be up to providing that. So consider that carefully. Perhaps offer her a probationary period where she can work on earning that collar back. Outline specific steps she will need to take to do that, including for example, getting counseling for these unresolved issues, if there are legal problems involved they need to be resolved, working with you to rebuild communication (possibly even seeking some relationship counseling focusing on building effective communication). That sets goals for her to work towards and gives you a means of measuring both her progress and her commitment. If she does what you ask, then follow through with that collar. But as I also said you need to take a look inside yourself and honestly ask yourself if you have the strength to deal with that. If she is still struggling that is not going to suddenly go away, and you are going to have to be prepared to deal with that. Can you? Don't make commitments you can't keep, because that would do harm to her. If you can't, there's no shame in that, let go of the relationship and be her friend.

From what you have said, you both want this relationship to work, and I'm of the belief that when both have that desire in a relationship there is always the possibility it can. However, turning that possibility into a reality is the hard part and that takes a continuing effort. You need to make sure you both have the tools you need to make that effort and you both are also committed to making that effort. If not, you're just wasting each other's time.

No, I would not punish her. If your son was learning to swim and went under... would you punish him for drowning or reach out to lift him back up? We punish to correct disobedience and defiance... but not when someone is struggling with issues and obstacles they don't yet know how to overcome... that is when we teach and guide. From what you said, her actions were wrong but they weren't done out of defiance or disobediance, they happened because she's struggling with something she doesn't yet know how to cope with, she needs your guidance.



Mylee -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/28/2005 5:48:03 PM)

In the story of the Prodigal son..the son runs off, with his portion of his father's money, he rashly spend allof his funds, on extravagent things, loosing it all and sadly ends up feeding pigs, which was the lowest of the low..when he returns, his father throws a dinner in his honour, a welcome home we could say, the second comes to his father and askes why his father would have a party for the run away son, and not for the 'good' son, the father tells the 'good' son that he was always at his fathers table and they shared the fruits of it together, but the prodigal son has been away and not gotten to share the fruits of his fathers table...


...my point to the bible lesson, the son, the bad one, the run away was welcomed back, with open arms, acceptence, where some would punish the son for leaving and spending his inheratence his father receives him with open arms.....no punishment


Raingod, i am no Master, and i would not begine to tell you whatr to do, but i've learned that compassion can be punishment enough at ties, your slave if you chose to receive her will know that she could be punished for her actions, but you not punishing her may speak volumes to her..i dunno, since i dont know your relationship...all i can offer is to tell you to do what's in your heart, if thats a spanking and corner time or a dinner in her honour, only you will know


best wishes
my'lee



Vancouver_cinful -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/28/2005 5:55:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty

It's prodigal, not prodical...and I do not think that word means what you think it means.


Thank you, Taggard...I'm glad someone spoke up on this. Surprising how many people missed it! There's never a bad time to learn something.

Cin



theRose4U -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/28/2005 8:33:33 PM)

quote:

I would take her back and maybe not collar her again for a while until you knew she was ready for the long haul


I would have to agree with this idea. It sounds like you truly missed her & your heart wants her back even if you are a bit gun shy. I would start as if she was new. Lower in rank than any others & have to EARN her previous position. There is obviously a REASON that she just up & left but part of her submission is trusting you to help her through any issues. This is a task where she failed.



maybemaybenot -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/28/2005 9:30:42 PM)

RainGod:

First let me say.. I am sorry for the pain you and she are going thru.

* my opinion* is consistant with what Mercnbeth posted. I will not say absolutely do not take her back. But I would suggest you proceed with great caution.

Please, please, please do not misinterprret what I am going to say.. You say you < collectively> communicate very well until she panics. OK.... you know this woman, are you able to determine if she has a true " panic disorder" ? Or is it simply she is not able to be completely free in her communications and when it gets too close to the heart, she panics and cannot face her own emotions, reactions, etc ? Neither of these being a bad thing, but definately different things.

If this is a panic disorder, is she willing to take steps to make her self well ? And are you willing to be patient enough to let that take place ? Can you nurture that transition? Panic disorders are very real and often paralyzing, so if this be the case, IMHO re enforcement of this is not a good thing. A more postive appraoch may be to tell her you understand she panics and that you are there to support her, but ultimately she needs to do the work to create her wellness.

**** i am not diagnosing, or asking you to diagnose, I am asking if that is a possibility and if you are equipped to handle it *****

If it is the latter and she can only communicate to a certain point and then panics or closes herself off, are you willing to work with her on this and take the baby steps it will take to get to the place you want both of you to be?

It could be far less complicated than that, I have no idea.. just offering a thought or two.

Speaking solely for me... I am the sort who believes " you can't go home again " < a novel by Thomas Wolf > If I choose to leave a relationship it is because something wasn't working, somewhere there was a problem so great I could not stay. I have had those feelings that perhaps I made a mistake, but on further examination, I always come up on the negative side of returning. I may still love the person, but some where it just wasn't enough "to have loved".

When my partner, be he Vanilla or Dominat has chosen to leave, I make it very clear that I will not take him back should he have a change of heart. Again, he left because he felt something wrong and felt it so wrong that he had to leave.

Both situations for me are irreparable without unhealthy resentments or sense of personal failure on one or both sides. Sometimes they aren't even apparent to the one who has the feeling for a period of taime following the re uniting. I am not willing to take on the burden.

Mercnbeth said it much better than me.

I would not advise you on which road to take, but to ask yourself if you are able to trust this person again, fully and with out any reservations. To ask yourself.. if you do take her back how will you handle her " panic" when things get hairy. However that panic is manifested or to what degree you or she defines panic.

As for punishment.. heck no. Ultimately it will be your choice to take her back or not.. It is sort of like punishing her for your decision. If you do put the stipulation down that if I take you back there will be a punishment and she accepts.. so be it.. But by taking her back you have accepted what she did, you have forgiven her, you have given her the second chance, you have moved past it. What would the punishment accomplish? A child who runs away USUALLY runs away out of defience, you say this is not the case. You say you tell her it is OK to panic, yet you are going to punish her for panicing. You may be sending a very mixed message to an already confused girl/woman. I just don't see it as constructive.. But that is just my 2 cents.

Lastly.. you said you have allowed her to make a time line and that is fine... you also need to take this time and make your own time line. You also need time to process what has happened and what steps will be needed if you accept her back or what steps it will take to move on. It might behoove both of you to make out the time lines in written form, and when you have your disussions on re uniting, compare them. This may be a good indicater of whether or not you are on the same page.

I wish you both well.
maybemaybenot



Misstoyou -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/28/2005 11:03:19 PM)

Actually, sometimes punishment is good for remorseful submissives. (Think penance, if you have a Catholic background.) It allows them closure, and enables them to start over with a clean slate.



sweetpettjenny -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/29/2005 3:23:46 AM)

you need to do what your heart persuades you to do...remember thinking with your heart and not your brain can put you in trouble...ive been there. My question remains , as why she would make up a name on here to keep tabs on you. It looks like the i don't want you but know one else should have you either syndrome. Be careful!!! i am a friend of yours , and i want you to have the best , if she might be the best go for it, then again don't settle to feel , a false sense of safety.



RainGod -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/29/2005 3:41:39 AM)

After considering all options put to Me here... I have decied she shall not be punished as she has already punished herself. The only consequesnce is that she shall not be given back her collar immediately.
I did miss her, but I do also see what many here have said to Me bioth here and in email... she may run again. I want her, so this is the risk I will take. One never truly loses unless one does not run the race.
Thanks for all the advice... even the one about the spelling and meaning of "prodigal". Trust Me, I know what it means. I was lacing this thread to the biblical parable of the same title.



fastlane -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/29/2005 5:29:22 AM)

Prodigal....oh, I though you were asking for protocol?

I got it RainGod, make her next collar one that shocks her when she runs across the invisible fence you bury around the yard. Fido quit running away and I bet she will too![;)]

In all seriousness, I'm glad she's back for you. Good luck!



KatyLied -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/29/2005 5:54:32 AM)

If she runs away (again) she's not worth keeping and definitely not worth the collar you are withholding. That being said, I hope it works out for you. She may have learned her lesson.



Mylee -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/29/2005 6:09:44 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: fastlane

Prodigal....oh, I though you were asking for protocol?

I got it RainGod, make her next collar one that shocks her when she runs across the invisible fence you bury around the yard. Fido quit running away and I bet she will too![;)]

In all seriousness, I'm glad she's back for you. Good luck!





i....can't ...stop LAUGHING!!!!!!



RainGod -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 2:07:29 PM)

Fastlane, that merry God of Puns writes:

quote:

Prodigal....oh, I though you were asking for protocol?


Lol... at this point I am asking for an aspirin.

quote:

I got it RainGod, make her next collar one that shocks her when she runs across the invisible fence you bury around the yard. Fido quit running away and I bet she will too!


Can I get one of those at Lowe's? Dom Depot?

quote:

In all seriousness, I'm glad she's back for you. Good luck!


Thank You, Fastlane... I can only hold the reigns and hope for the best from here. It is good to have her back, though.



ProtagonistLily -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 3:27:30 PM)

quote:

I have a rather serious question, and after having searched My own soul for days for the answer, I find nothing. Now I come to you here in this worthy forum where I am hoping some of you regulars I have seen post here can offer your insight to this perplexing question.

Let's say a Man has a slave... collared, real-time... and she runs away. Not literally runs away, but comes and says it is over. What choice has He but to release her? So He does.... sadly.

She is gone for a few weeks and He grieves her loss a while, but then she comes back... wanting to be taken in, and most sincerely apologetic for her behavior. she didn't leave for another man, nor did she leave because she thought she was being abused. she simply left because of some issues in her personal life that did not involve the Master. she actually "watched" everything He did online as a lurker... reading his posts and longing to return.

How then should the Master accept her return? Surely she should be punished in some way for the sadness caused? How then should she be punished? What is appropriate? This matter is one in which I would greatly appreciate some serious feedback.

Thank you all in advance.


I happen to think this is rather serious. Sorry to barge in on the Doms, but I'm going to give my POV anyway, even though I'm a submissive.

I would not take her back right away; I think I would do some serious communicating, and find out what it was that she didn't think she could share with her owner. At this stage of a relationship, if she is collared in your care, there should be NO secrets what so ever. Given that there were, there's a communication breakdown somewhere, which untimately lead to unneeded heart ache. I don't happen to subscribe to the idea that 'subbies' sometimes just go nuts and do things that hurt people because, well, they are subbies. That's what children do, not adults.

Of course she should be punished, but I doubt a good spanking is going to cure what ails you two. Instead of thinking about 'punishment' I would suggest that you think of it in terms of 'correction'; this behavior needs to be corrected or it will occur again. Punishment is all about you administering to her; Correcting this particular communication problem is going to take work, probably hard work, on both your parts.

I know that this caused a lot of sadness in you, but I would caution you against just taking her back unconditionally. Perhaps it's time to either amend, or put a contract together, so that the expectations are laid out in black and white. Sometimes, this can be very helpful and can ultimately help to avoid her once again donning her track shoes and bolting.

It would be easy to point fingers at the girl and look at it as just her transgressions, but clearly this relationship needs both parties to work on communicating, because in my not so humble opinion, if there was a collar present, there was a serious D/s relationship, and you just don't hide things from your owner under those conditions. And if you do, and the owner allows that to happen, it's a problem for both parties.

My 2 cents,
Lily



denimknight -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 4:00:55 PM)

quote:

Would that not encourage it to occur again? If someone isn't made cognizant of the fact something is wrong to do, will they not know it is wrong to do again?

Or is it perfectly ok for a slave to run away, leaving a Master broken hearted time after time?


Answering the three questions you have posed in order:

#1: It might, this is one of many negative externalities that may come about regardless of what decision is made.

#2: Yes, if someone is not shown that something is wrong then it is very likely that they will do it again. HOWEVER

#3 Yes, it is perfectly ok for a slave to leave you (I doubt she was running, more likely she got in her car or even took a bus). If she believes that you are no longer the right one for her to belong to any slave has the right to void the power dynamic at any point. A beloved mentor of mine once taught me “people enter into and leave our lives for a reason and for a season.” When that reason is fulfilled and that season passed it is vital for her to leave. There is nothing unethical about her doing so.
As for the matter of her returning if only to leave again; if you accept her back and she leaves a second time all that proves is that you made a foolish decision. Learn from said foolish decision and move forward. There is no ethical wrong doing on her part, only a clear indication that you didn't learn the lesson the first time.

Your second question is more than a little unsettling at best (and down right damming at worst). I am not so much concerned with the question itself so much as the context in which it is asked. You seem to be under the impression that a female slave is some kind of a child who has to be taught the difference between right and wrong. Based upon this I can only draw one of two conclusions:
1) You, like the vast majority of "gorean masters" i've come across, function under the highly flawed (to say nothing of sexist) idea that women are somehow lesser creatures and as such they must be taught, defended, protected, and generally looked after by a "big strong man".
OR
2) Thus far you have only been successful in drawing to you women who are in fact unable to take care of themselves, make their own decisions, or even understand the difference between right and wrong.

In either case I think you might benefit from some serious consideration of how you view, interact with, and craft your relationships with women; slave or otherwise.

Respectfully submitted
dk



RainGod -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 4:59:23 PM)

denimknight posted:

quote:

1) You, like the vast majority of "gorean masters" i've come across, function under the highly flawed (to say nothing of sexist) idea that women are somehow lesser creatures and as such they must be taught, defended, protected, and generally looked after by a "big strong man".


Hmmm... am I a "gorean master"? I never realized. Thanks, but, no I am not, nor have I ever presumed to be Gorean.

I cannot pretend I was not a bit offended at the assumption that I am mysogonistic, or that I look down upon women in any way. You must have misread something in the OP. If I endevour to 'teach', 'train', or 'disciline' My girl to learn something, or to be made aware of something, it is designed to be for the better of us both. I did not say I look at her like a child, nor that I desire to treat her as such. Where did you get that idea?

However, you are right on some level here. A slave should be defended, protected, and in a sense looked after by her Master. I don't think many slaves would disagree. Perhaps your idea of a Master/slave relationship do not match Mine. That's fine, but don't assume so much about My ideas, or condemn Me for them, if you don't mind.

quote:

2) Thus far you have only been successful in drawing to you women who are in fact unable to take care of themselves, make their own decisions, or even understand the difference between right and wrong.


Again, I see you as woefully misinformed and altogether wrong. Any slave I would consider is not the sort who is unable to take care of themselves. If she cannot care for herself, how would she care for Me and My intrests as well? Unable to make her own decisions? I again beg your pardon, but she makes a very bold and conscious decision to be Mine. Besides that, the certain slave I am with is in a very key position in a company where she makes decisions daily... on her own. I suppose you've never heard that a lot of submissives and slaves are people who have such positions in their daily lives and have the need to surrender to Someone else in their private lives. I wouldn't want a slave who couldn't make the most basic and simple decisions on her own knowing what I expect of her. She isn't a mindless drone... Did it ever occur to you she may want Me to make decisions for her?

quote:

In either case I think you might benefit from some serious consideration of how you view, interact with, and craft your relationships with women; slave or otherwise.


Well, thank you Doctor, but I again find you to be very rude and assuming, especially when you obviously are so misinformed on My relationship, and I dare say, with the mechanics of a healthy Master/slave relationship.

Thanks.



RainGod -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 5:44:41 PM)

sweetest jenny writes:

quote:

you need to do what your heart persuades you to do...remember thinking with your heart and not your brain can put you in trouble...ive been there.


I am trying to remember that, jenny. My heart has led Me to more trouble than anything else has... I may be a strict Dom, but I am also compassionate and understanding. It sometimes happens that forgiveness and a second chance is a bad idea for Me, but I do try.

quote:

My question remains , as why she would make up a name on here to keep tabs on you. It looks like the i don't want you but know one else should have you either syndrome. Be careful!!! i am a friend of yours , and i want you to have the best , if she might be the best go for it, then again don't settle to feel , a false sense of safety.


I am still shaking My head on that one too. In a way I feel flattered that she may have wanted to make sure I wasn;t moving on... but in a way, I was saddened she didn't put that effort into simply communicating her original concerns with Me... which incidentally was that she simply freaked and wanted to take back control when she became stressed about a problem in her own life. We are now establishing her confidence that she can indeed bring all these problems to Me without fear of being 'condemned' or turned away without answer.

I am trying, and that is all I can do.



denimknight -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 6:17:48 PM)

quote:

Hmmm... am I a "gorean master"? I never realized. Thanks, but, no I am not, nor have I ever presumed to be Gorean.


Dude, it's in your profile. You put it there as a special skill no less. If it's not the case please edit your profile otherwise don't be blown away when I say you consider yourself a gorean master.

quote:

I cannot pretend I was not a bit offended at the assumption that I am misogynistic, or that I look down upon women in any way. You must have misread something in the OP.


Looked back through my entire post and nowhere did I call you misogynistic. Misogynistic means that you hate women. I think you like women a great deal; I just think you consider them lower than yourself.

quote:

I did not say I look at her like a child, nor that I desire to treat her as such. Where did you get that idea?


Fair question, deserves a fair answer. I got that Idea from this

quote:

If someone isn't made cognizant of the fact something is wrong to do, will they not know it is wrong to do again?


That comes from post number 2 on the 28th of this month, the words are yours. Maybe I misread you (if so then I apologize), but it sounds as if you are trying to figure out if you should use punishment to make the girl in question understand that (in your view) her leaving you was ethically wrong.
The use of discipline to teach ethics is the preview of a parent and honestly it should end at some point in the late teens. If indeed you are trying to show her that it was somehow ethically wrong of her to hurt you emotionally then yes, you are being sexist. In particular you are being sexist because by trying to teach her ethical values which assumes that she is unable to make or understand the moral/ethical consequences of her actions. By assuming that YOU can teach her ethical values you are assuming that you have a better grasp of such things then an adult woman. This by its very nature is sexist thinking.
But hey maybe I misread you, if so please state as much and I will cheerfully withdraw the statement. However, I will ask that you clarify what you did in fact mean by that.

quote:

Well, thank you Doctor, but I again find you to be very rude and assuming, especially when you obviously are so misinformed on My relationship, and I dare say, with the mechanics of a healthy Master/slave relationship.


Oh I haven't gotten my Phd just yet (working on it) but I'm flattered that you thought so. If I'm misinformed then it is only because you have provided misinformation in your previous posts to this thread. Everything I have said is based upon nothing less than the data that you have provided.

Respectfully submitted
dk



RainGod -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 7:34:31 PM)

denimknight posted thusly:

quote:

Dude, it's in your profile. You put it there as a special skill no less. If it's not the case please edit your profile otherwise don't be blown away when I say you consider yourself a gorean master.


Duly noted and removed. I assure you it wasn't on purpose.

quote:

I think you like women a great deal; I just think you consider them lower than yourself.


Well, denim, you think wrong. If you say I think them lower than Myself, show Me where.


quote:

quote:

I did not say I look at her like a child, nor that I desire to treat her as such. Where did you get that idea?


quote:

Fair question, deserves a fair answer. I got that Idea from this


quote:

quote:

If someone isn't made cognizant of the fact something is wrong to do, will they not know it is wrong to do again?


So how is that treating her like a child? you've still failed to show your point here...

quote:

but it sounds as if you are trying to figure out if you should use punishment to make the girl in question understand that (in your view) her leaving you was ethically wrong.


Her leaving may not have been wrong, but the way she did it were. At any rate, how am I treating her like a child?

quote:

If indeed you are trying to show her that it was somehow ethically wrong of her to hurt you emotionally then yes, you are being sexist. In particular you are being sexist because by trying to teach her ethical values which assumes that she is unable to make or understand the moral/ethical consequences of her actions. By assuming that YOU can teach her ethical values you are assuming that you have a better grasp of such things then an adult woman. This by its very nature is sexist thinking.


Who are you to gauge My or her ethics? What we consent to and how we relate to each other is between us. My emotional hurt was not the question here, denim. you read wayyy too much into things. The question was if I allowed her to return, what should I do to punish? If you read the thread you would have seen I had taken the good advice here and decided not to punish her at all, but have witheld her collar until a later time.

I think you had best understand this lifestyle a bit better before you go confusing teaching ethical values to a slave by her Master with His being "sexist". If she consents to being taught, what's the problem? You seem to not be very tolerant of the ways of others... especially when you use words like sexist.

quote:

Oh I haven't gotten my Phd just yet (working on it) but I'm flattered that you thought so. If I'm misinformed then it is only because you have provided misinformation in your previous posts to this thread. Everything I have said is based upon nothing less than the data that you have provided.


Don't be so flattered... it was scarcasm. Concerning misinformation, I find it rather odd that you are alone in your misdiagnosis. Did ya notice that?





Awakener -> RE: The Prodical Slave (9/30/2005 9:17:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: denimknight


The use of discipline to teach ethics is the preview of a parent and honestly it should end at some point in the late teens. If indeed you are trying to show her that it was somehow ethically wrong of her to hurt you emotionally then yes, you are being sexist. In particular you are being sexist because by trying to teach her ethical values which assumes that she is unable to make or understand the moral/ethical consequences of her actions. By assuming that YOU can teach her ethical values you are assuming that you have a better grasp of such things then an adult woman. This by its very nature is sexist thinking.
But hey maybe I misread you, if so please state as much and I will cheerfully withdraw the statement. However, I will ask that you clarify what you did in fact mean by that.



Uh denimknight I really do not think you have any concept of what a M/s relationship is.
A Master is a parent and so very very much more.



needs2serve -> RE: The Prodical Slave (10/1/2005 6:21:56 AM)

Hey good people,

I am the prodigal slave being discussed on this thread. I adore RainGod. I think it might be helpful for everyone to know this relationship was a fairly new one. Trust is something that is built over time. At the time that we had our little "meltdown", now three weeks ago, that caused our "separation", a lot of the trust that is established through time in a relationship just wasn't present at that point, and I found it difficult to "let go" of the control of my life that I have HAD to maintain for so many years. I didn't even see it coming. I did panic, but at the time, my intention was never to leave RainGod........it just escalated out of control, and before I knew it..........I was......being propelled "out of there" and I did not feel as though I could come back. I accept the responsibiity for what happened. The harsh words that had been spoken...........haunted me and I just didn't feel that under the same conditions, it would be fair to come back.

I did suffer for two weeks. After a few days apart, I made this screen name....yes I did it to keep tabs....not to prevent him from finding another, for I would never stand in the way of his happiness, whatever that may be. But, I had some homework to do, and my "plan" was to take care of the issue that was keeping me from giving completely to him, and them come back and beg forgiveness and try to learn to not be s'damned stubborn about controlling events in my life. I was STILL, even at that point, trying to control the situation (sick, isn't it). I kept tabs on him for two reasons. 1) I wanted to know if he WAS still available. If it turned out he had found another, I would have quietly disappeared. 2) I just couldn't resist having some kind of contact with him. Even if it was EXTREMELY superficial. And believe me, I kept this new person so vague and uninteresting, it was a wonder he ever took the time to respond to her. Eventually, the guilt at my deception began to eat me alive and I had her do things that made him decide it was not worth it to correspond with her.

So I started a journal of sorts. I communicated all my fears and thoughts and hopes and dreams into that journal, that I had been unable to do face to face with him. I confessed my crime of the deception and said UP FRONT, I knew I was signing on for punishment and I accepted that. I knew what I was doing was dishonest, but I would eventually come clean, and I wanted him to know that when the time came, I had never forgotten him. That everything I did, was about him.. I felt he needed that. I knew my departure had hurt him, and I feel a debt is owed.

I am weak. And he is so irresistable. I was unable to stay away until my "other issues" were resolved. I confessed, asked his forgiveness, promised to do better to communicate and to learn to trust and not be so stubborn about controlling things. I really don't want to control some of these things in my life. It would be so liberating to "let go". But it is a lifetime habit, and sometimes I do it without even realizing I am doing it. He did forgive me, but I know he still struggles with what he sees as my instability with regard to my situation. His concern is not without merit. I am frightened too. We have laid out a few ground rules so as to prevent an unintentional "breakup" in the future from repeating itself. He decided that my motives behind my deception were not malevolent and feels I punished myself enough during our absence, and believe me.......NOBODY can be harder on me than I am on myself. I am grateful he has forgiven me and is giving me another chance. I think we have both learned something from this experience.

I appreciate everything everybody has said on this board. You are a very thoughtful and compassionate group of people and your varied experiences and perceptions are a wonderful way to consider alternatives and see things you might have been too emotional to have ever thought of on your own.



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