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RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 8:19:05 AM

KnightofMists

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Joined: 7/29/2005
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bella

I do not want to discourage you but I feel compelled to give you a prespective that you have not shared in your OP and maybe have not considered.

First, I think relationships can work out even when parties come from different incomes and lifestyles. But, I believe your question only scratches the surface of the problem. The issue describe is not so much different incomes and lifestyles... but one of values and attitude. Often when a person make comments as your Sir is making, it is a reflection of a deeper set of values and ideas specifically related to material wealth and other related things. Obviously his comments cause you concern and might of even belittled you because you confronted this comments. The question though, has he actually changed his values or is he now thinking that I can say this because it hurts my girl. Not saying it doesn't mean he doesn't still believe the things he said before. I suspect that you are very much concerned that he is only hiding his thoughts on this issue because of the obvious nervousness you feel about him coming to visit you.

I suggest that you more than confront the comments but attempt to open the discussion with regards to the values that motivated the comments in the first place. Understanding his motivations will go along way to establishing why specifically motivated those comments in the past. You might learn that he places certain judgements on certain actions/enviroment because of his values. Values that are actaully very similiar to your own. The only differences is the judgement of the actions/environment. However, it might be you will uncover an aspect of his character that you do not like and then will have to decide if you can live with this aspect or not. I truly feel that you would be better off knowing today rather that wait tomorrow when you could be alot more attached, emotionally and physically.

< Message edited by KnightofMists -- 3/23/2008 8:20:53 AM >

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to hissweetbella)

Post #: 41

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 8:23:16 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenix2raven

I would simply ask him to stop making comments like that. Make it clear and respectful. If he has an explanation for saying such things ask him and find out why he is thinking that way. You may be surprised or disappointed but most importantly you will know what kind of person he is and be able to decide if this kind of thing is a deal breaker? The other question I would ask myself is do I want that around my ums. If my answer is no then it becomes very simple. You say no, red, deal breaker etc. if he continues it then dump him.

I disagree with this. It's funny, the forum goes in waves like this, there are at least a couple of threads going where people insist on ultimatiums - "you do x,y or z otherwise it's over". Ultimatums NEVER end healthy. You ask someone to act in a way that makes them not who and what they are and down the line, when there is a disagreement, then the ultimatum will come up. "Well, you said this, I did it, and now its your turn."

You accept how someone is or you don't. Don't ask them to change and alter. Don't manipulate the situation or relationship that way. The man obviously didn't mean it to come out the way it did by her following postings - so you want her to chuck in the towel because of some offhand comment that has a element of truth in it - in general terms?

Sometimes, it's a struggle when your used to having nothing and then a man/woman wants to give you everything. I'm there right now. You want to submit, you love that it pleases him, but you struggle not wanting to come across as needy or greedy or with him because of that. It's an internal struggle with your own pride, with your own sense of worth. It's not his fault - it's how we choose to submit that matters.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

Post #: 42

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 8:50:49 AM

hissweetbella

Posts: 52
Joined: 3/22/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

Sometimes, it's a struggle when your used to having nothing and then a man/woman wants to give you everything. I'm there right now. You want to submit, you love that it pleases him, but you struggle not wanting to come across as needy or greedy or with him because of that. It's an internal struggle with your own pride, with your own sense of worth. It's not his fault - it's how we choose to submit that matters.

the.dark.

Wow, there have been so many wonderful posts and i want to respond to each of them, but it is hard for me to sit at the computer for more than a couple of minutes on the weekends, and especially being that today is Easter and i want to enjoy the day with my rugrats. This post really jumped out at me, and i just had to start here. i hope no one feels slighted as i mean no disrespect to all the other kind souls who have offered their opinions.

As i said, the last part of what the.dark. said really resonates with me. i have gone out of my way to never, ever put myself in a position where i might look like i am needy or greedy. When he takes me out to an expensive restaurant, i always ask him to order for me. i try to suggest things to do that don't cost anything or bring a DVD that he has mentioned wanting to see when i visit him. i'll go to the market while he is in the shower and pick up ingredients and then make dinner for him. Things like that. i've watched several people take advantage of him and try to get everything they can out of him, and i don't ever, EVER, want him to think i would do that.

i think i have gone overboard, though. When he found out i wasn't visiting as often because i didn't have the money for the trip, it was embarrassing, and taking the money he offered at first felt like taking charity. When i mentioned to him how i felt, he pointed out that he wanted to contribute and that i had not asked and he wanted to see me and could easily afford to bring me to him. i still refuse to take the money at least every other visit, though.

edited to add the main thing i had wanted to say...
the.dark. would you mind elaborating more on what you meant by submitting in this situation, please?

< Message edited by hissweetbella -- 3/23/2008 8:53:21 AM >

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 43

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 9:20:18 AM

sirsholly

Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: hissweetbella

i think i have gone overboard, though. When he found out i wasn't visiting as often because i didn't have the money for the trip, it was embarrassing, and taking the money he offered at first felt like taking charity. When i mentioned to him how i felt, he pointed out that he wanted to contribute and that i had not asked and he wanted to see me and could easily afford to bring me to him. i still refuse to take the money at least every other visit, though.

He wants to be with you and you with him. I know, and can relate to, your desire to pay your own way. But the fact is you can't. Personally i would rather have my toenails removed than to have someone put cash in my hand. But perhaps you would allow him to buy your plane ticket?
Just a thought...

(in reply to hissweetbella)

Post #: 44

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 9:29:53 AM

camille65

Posts: 5746
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Austin Texas
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I think that sometimes an attitude becomes so familiar that a person isn't even aware of showing it. That said, I totally understand but sort of from the other side. It gets exhausting hearing hateful things towards the upper class. Seriously it does, I can almost see people rolling their eyes over that statement but untrue and derogatory remarks hurt no matter what sort of people they are directed towards.It makes a lot of people uncomfortable when they realise just how I grew up. With some it is like seeing a shutter come down over their eyes and things change between us. With others it sparks a conversation about how wealthy people only are wealthy because they lied/cheated/abused their way up and other crap like that. 'Every thing is handed to you' so they tell me my opinion can't count because I don't get it. People sling crap across all boundaries I've learned. That is how I grew up but it sure isn't how I live as an adult.I was a wee bit petrified the first time my owner came to my house, it may be kind of big but it is horribly run down. The yard is a weed filled & gopher ridden mess. My drywall inside has gaping holes and doors that no longer open. Most of the time it isn't clean enough for my standards but physically I can't get it done. Um yeah okay that is all of the time lol so you have that huge advantage! If I go to see him, he has to pay and jeez I really really hate that. I hate being dependant financially on someone, even someone with whom I'm dependant upon in so many other areas. I keep trying to see it as another way he takes care of me but it is a struggle inside. Point is, it matters to some and doesn't matter to others. There is such a thing as middle ground, there is such a thing as empathy and understanding. He already knows how you live even if he hasn't seen it yet. It doesn't sound like it has turned him off and I doubt that will change over something like where you live. Never ever have I looked down on someone for living in a trailer, small apartment or sharing a house. Filth? Yup, that turns me off because that for the most part can be changed or taken care of. Taking care of your kids has been your priority and rightly so, if the living place is clean then I really think that is enough. That is something you should be proud of. I hope something I said made sense to you.

< Message edited by camille65 -- 3/23/2008 9:34:50 AM >

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Post #: 45

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 9:35:44 AM

lronitulstahp

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Joined: 10/17/2007
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quote:

My question is this. Have any of you had relationships work out when the parties have very different incomes and lifestyles? His comments about regular people have become fewer and fewer, so i believe they were said without thinking. i don't think for one second that he intended to hurt my feelings. i'm just so nervous right now that i'm rambling, so i'm going to just wait for your responses

i have dated all kinds of men, some Doms, some vanilla, wealthy, well off, middle class, poor, Black, white, Latino....and what i've learned is that people are people. We have the same basic needs, and the same basic insecurities. He wants you, He cares about and chose you....not for your tax bracket, or anything that has to do with money. Accept that he mis-spoke...often people who love someone don't realize they set you aside in a class by yourself, but that you belong to many "micro-groups" that are a part of you pre-relationship.
One of my better relationships was with someone who was soooo vastly different from me it would seem impossible we ever met...but the differences made for great conversations and a friendship that outlasted the relationship itself. i thought He'd hate my chabby chic home when he was used to contemporary high-end chic....but he loed the fluffy chairs and cozy bed...he thought it was feminine and reflective of "me". i am sure your Sir doesn't expect the Taj Mahal...he just wants to visit "your" home...don't be ashamed...be glad to know that wanted you...just as you are.(sorry if i sounded a bit Bridget Jonesey at the end....)

(in reply to hissweetbella)

Post #: 46

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 9:56:23 AM

MD1Master

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Joined: 3/7/2008
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Socioeconomic boundaries can be very difficult to overcome. In my experience, relationships which work the best are where persons each come from the same socioeconomic background and therefore can relate to one another. Later in life when two individuals come together that have varying backgrounds it is significantly more difficult, but not impossible. Listen to his words, I do think it is telling that he makes comments about shoppers at Wal-Mart without making the mental leap that you are "one of those people."

On the other side, if he is a good person (you need to judge this), allow him some time to adjust. You are providing him a different perspective and he will need time to see things differently. It sounds as if his finances are secure and he has earned his placement on the financial/social ladder. Therefore he sees everything from his own perspective. You may need to assist him with this. He probably can not understand why one shops at Wal-Mart with the lines when clothing can be sent from a tailor, groceries can arrive by delivery or a service can pick them up, and the maid (whether full- or part-time) picks up the staples for the house.

I suggest 100% inviting him to your home. His reaction will tell you about the man and the future of your relationship. Never be ashamed of an honest living! Certainly do not allow anyone to make you ashamed of yours!!!

(in reply to hissweetbella)

Post #: 47

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 11:17:55 AM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
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bella,
There have been so many great responses to your post and I find something good to pull out of almost all of them. First of all, as someone else mentioned, your question makes me want to hug you and comfort you because I feel you are sincerely perplexed. You are bothered by your Sir's comments and how he might feel about the home you've worked hard to make yet your first response is not just to be rude back or make ultimatum's. I feel for ya.

His use of "those people" really shows snobbery yet, if I were in your shoes, I'd be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. You and I know (as some of "those people"

) that the major difference between us and him is that he fell assbackwards into a pile of money that we didn't. However, maybe he's not so much choosing to be a snob as maybe just laboring under some really wrong misconceptions about others very different from him. Sometimes people aren't intentionally malicious as much as truly ignorant of how others' lives work.

I think you are right on track to say to him that you are one of "those people" and to be open with him about how it makes you feel when he says such things. Ask him who "those people" are and just what impressions he has of them. Maybe you can educate his ignorance away. If he cares about you and you're one of "those people," maybe he'll soon see there are no "us" and "them" except in the differences in our bank accounts. Sounds simplistic but it just might work. That is, if he truly wants it to and doesn't want to remain ignorant. I hope things work out for you.

I truly wish you the best. You sound like a neat person. Good luck dear.................luci

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(in reply to hissweetbella)

Post #: 48

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 12:03:49 PM

Evility

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Joined: 12/19/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65
I think that sometimes an attitude becomes so familiar that a person isn't even aware of showing it.

That's a fair point. Logic dictates that if he really had an aversion to "those people" he would have connected with a submissive who is, well.... "better connected", so to speak. Since he's the beneficiary of an inheritance maybe he's been exposed to these kinds of comments and attitudes in the past and maybe it's more a matter of tradition than malice as I suggested in an earlier post mentioning his 'true colors'.

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 49

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 12:12:59 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Evility

That's a fair point. Logic dictates that if he really had an aversion to "those people" he would have connected with a submissive who is, well.... "better connected", so to speak. Since he's the beneficiary of an inheritance maybe he's been exposed to these kinds of comments and attitudes in the past and maybe it's more a matter of tradition than malice as I suggested in an earlier post mentioning his 'true colors'.

Or it's a result of what the op herself said

quote:

i've watched several people take advantage of him and try to get everything they can out of him.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

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Post #: 50

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 12:34:43 PM

Evility

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Joined: 12/19/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP
Or it's a result of what the op herself said
quote:

i've watched several people take advantage of him and try to get everything they can out of him.

Are you suggesting that his past experiences legitimize his offensive and sweeping declarations of an entire socioeconomic class that he feels is beneath him i.e. "those people"? If that's the case then the OP (who is part of said socioeconomic class) needs to just take a deep breath and learn to live with it.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 51

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 12:38:37 PM

Evility

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MD1Master
Listen to his words, I do think it is telling that he makes comments about shoppers at Wal-Mart without making the mental leap that you are "one of those people."

Making that comment one time without making the connection isn't necessarily a mortal sin. After several friendly reminders a flag would go up if it was me.

(in reply to MD1Master)

Post #: 52

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 12:59:27 PM

SimplyMichael

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quote:

I suggest that you more than confront the comments but attempt to open the discussion with regards to the values that motivated the comments in the first place. Understanding his motivations will go along way to establishing why specifically motivated those comments in the past. You might learn that he places certain judgements on certain actions/enviroment because of his values. Values that are actaully very similiar to your own. The only differences is the judgement of the actions/environment. However, it might be you will uncover an aspect of his character that you do not like and then will have to decide if you can live with this aspect or not.

Oh why go to the trouble of actually communicating when it is so much easier to just make assumptions? People often have far more in common than they realize if they would just follow KOM advice here.

(in reply to KnightofMists)

Post #: 53

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 1:27:10 PM

UncleNasty

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Joined: 3/20/2004
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As you're the only one on the insdie of this only you can figure it out. I don't presume to have the answers, only thoughts.

His behavior hits a chord in me. That of disregard for others feelings.

If it were me I'd look to see if an attitude of disregard is present in other contexts too. If so then that carries some unpleasant confirmations. That being that disregard isn't just contextual but is an overall dynamic.

Best of luck.

Uncle Nasty

(in reply to sambamanslilgirl)

Post #: 54

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 2:04:56 PM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
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Hello bella
Firstly - I am going to note what I see. I see many people making assumptions that your dominant is a snob. Personally, my opinion is that there is nothing wrong with being a snob quite frankly. However, I don't see him being a snob, or down on those with lower incomes. I really believe that if he was that negative - he wouldn't be with you, would he? My impression, with your following posts, is that he simply didn't voice his thoughts clearly and my advise is to look at what kallista said and drink that in.

Ok to your direct question.

quote:

edited to add the main thing i had wanted to say...
the.dark. would you mind elaborating more on what you meant by submitting in this situation, please?

When Darcy and I began our relationship, I found it totally easy to submit. As the relationship developed, I found it more and more difficult to deal with travel, seeing him regularly etc because I am a single parent with family to consider and not a high income. His decision was to contibute to my expenses. I found this incredibly difficult to accept because I was and am very independant. Also, my pride, my stupid pride, was getting in the way. I felt that I was not contributing enough to our relationship and it did become a bit of an issue. But it was issues on my part.

Darcy likes to go out - we go to gigs, parties, dinner - he loves decadant things (good wine, food,cigars) - but it was harder and harder for me to contribute to the point where I was too scared to know which event we were going to next. But Darcy had no idea because I didn't tell him how it was affecting me - so he could not deal with issues without full information. When I finally explained to him, he wasn't angry or upset - but he explained to me that my contribution was just as valuable, but that it was totally different to his and that in submitting, I had to accept this part of him and his giving. That submitting isn't always doing what I wanted or thought was right, that my pride was causing me to not submit and that was basically, stupid. That by not accepting his generosity and love and the fact that he loved to spend time with me and take me to experience new things, that I was refusing to submit.

Sounds hard hey, I can see it now, people rolling their eyes saying, oh thats such a hard thing, submitting to being given yummy things. But it is hard, when you are trying so hard not to take advantage of someone who you know has been taken advantage of before, and not to be seen to be like those in the past. But the thing I forgot is that Darcy knows me better than I know myself sometimes. And I forgot that it was Darcy's wants and needs that mattered, not what I thought I should be doing. By paying for petrol, that meant Darcy got to see me - that I could be at his side on demand. That by purchasing me a ticket to a gig, I was by his side, as he desired. That the car he contributed to purchasing was not because it groovy, but because he knew it would keep me and the children safer if I was in an accident or broke down - it was his piece of mind. It's sometimes so easy to submit to what you want, even easy to submit to what you don't like - but submitting to what seems to be a treat? It's hard,hard,hard - until you focus on the fact that its about him, not about my pride. I still struggle with it even now, but there are times when I have bitten my tongue recently and instead of say 'but' I have instead said 'thank you' and his response to that is that he is proud I am finally listening and submitting to him, not to my pride.

I don't know if that makes any sense and sorry the post was long - I tried to cut it down but it made no sense to me shorter.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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Post #: 55

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 2:10:31 PM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
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Please don't take this as disrespectful, but I say that is bollocks (thats the brit in me) - it's more that he knows he isn't responsible for other peoples feelings, nor should he be. He isn't the worlds Master, he is her Master.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to UncleNasty)

Post #: 56

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 2:22:58 PM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
Hello bella
Firstly - I am going to note what I see. I see many people making assumptions that your dominant is a snob. Personally, my opinion is that there is nothing wrong with being a snob quite frankly. However, I don't see him being a snob, or down on those with lower incomes. I really believe that if he was that negative - he wouldn't be with you, would he? My impression, with your following posts, is that he simply didn't voice his thoughts clearly and my advise is to look at what kallista said and drink that in

As I used the word "snob," I'd like to add another 2 cents here if I may. Firstly, I'm not assuming he is a snob. By referring to an entire group of lower income individuals as "those people," he pretty much erased any inkling that he isn't a snob, IMO. I DO find alot wrong with being a snob, especially if it's based on someone's economic worth. However, I am very willing to believe that he isn't that way out of malice, but out of ignorance.

Who knows why he is with the OP? There's probably lots of reasons. Apparently - by her own words - he seems to forget that she is one of "those people." She must be so charming and beautiful that it completely escapes him

. "How can she possibly be one of 'those people' as great as she is?," he may think. Whatever the reason, it's pretty clear cut that, in his mind, he is worlds better than "those people." In my opinion, that is being snobbish and that is asanine. BUT....as I said, it may not be meanness that makes him feel that way, just lack of exposure to those who have much less than him and had to work for it at that. I say, "So, he's a snob? Let the OP give him a chance to learn the error of his ways and show him that if she's one of "those people" and she's damn good, so are many/most of the rest of those - us - people................luci

< Message edited by slaveluci -- 3/23/2008 2:24:43 PM >

_____________________________

To choose a good book, look in an inquisitor’s prohibited list. ~John Aikin

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 57

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 2:37:07 PM

RCdc

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I agree luci - no one does know why he said it. Maybe it isn't out of ignorance, maybe it is out of experience - his experience?(Like celeste - I think it was - suggested). Maybe it was just bad word phrasing on his part. Who the fuck knows - unless communicated and asked calmly and not defensively?

But I see people losing sight of her question - can people from different backgrounds work? Not whether he should change, or whether or not he is a snob. My answer is yes, absolutely, but you have to communicate and submit and know your own ethics and whether you can submit to what he is.

Why should 'we' assume he is the one who should 'mend his ways'? To me - that is a kind of snobbery as well - an assumption that his ideas may be wrong or lesser? He may have different experiences, ethics, understanding - but his ways to him are right - all the OP needs to do is decide whether she can submit to them or not.

the.dark.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to slaveluci)

Post #: 58

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 2:57:19 PM

greenearth21

Posts: 228
Joined: 7/9/2006
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I wouldnt go as far as saying he's a snob because I don tknow him from atom, neither do i know you or the situation. But i know being involved with someone from a different socioeconomic back ground can be somewhat intimidating, bu tin reality, they arent any different than you are. Yes they can drive a bently and you can drive a chevy...so what?
I would have to say though, that his "those people" comment was obviously not directed to you but...if he knows of your situation ...i dont think it would kill his ego to just realize that not everyone can afford a lifestyle that he is accustomed to. Or not everyone has a "normal" lifestyle as his.
I'm a stron gbeliever of judging a man's or woman's character by what they speak. Whether I agree with it or not...whether it offends me or not...and whether that is the intention, it is enough to have an idea of who they really are or what they believe in or just their opinion of whatever the situation or case is.
I do not look for sympathy for anything bu tneither do i have tolerance for anyone who is insensitive.
You have your home, you like it, you worked for it, your children are safe in it and thast all that matters. Anyone who comes in and nit picks this and that....kick them out faster than how they came in.
Your home is your castle and whoever enters it should respect it as such...whether its up to their standards or not...shouldnt be your problem.

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 59

RE: nervous as can be - 3/23/2008 3:09:24 PM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
I agree luci - no one does know why he said it. Maybe it isn't out of ignorance, maybe it is out of experience - his experience?(Like celeste - I think it was - suggested). Maybe it was just bad word phrasing on his part. Who the fuck knows - unless communicated and asked calmly and not defensively?

Ok. Let's say it isn't out of ignorance but due to his experience. Has he had bad "experiences" with every single person that he's apparently lumping together as "those people." What if I said I knew a couple black guys who were pure assholes? Does that mean that I can get away with calling all blacks "those people" and not be called a racist (and rightfully so)? I doubt it. IF there have been some people with less money than him who have used or abused him in some way, that's understandable. But to then look at everyone who buys clothes at Wal-Mart and lives in a trailer as "those people" and have disdain for them is wrong, judgmental, narrow-minded and classist. No two ways about it. That's very "bad word phrasing" in my book and shows a deeper belief system and a stereotype that he's formed.

quote:

But I see people losing sight of her question - can people from different backgrounds work? Not whether he should change, or whether or not he is a snob. My answer is yes, absolutely, but you have to communicate and submit and know your own ethics and whether you can submit to what he is

True. I agree with that. People from different backgrounds can indeed work, of course. And, as you point out, she has to know whether or not she can submit to someone with his ethics. I could not if he truly believes he's better than a whole segment of the population simply because he's been blessed enough to inherit some dough. I would run screaming the other direction. But, that's just me. I actually went the extra distance by giving the guy the benefit of the doubt that it's just his ignorance and lack of exposure to different people. I tried to be understanding

.

quote:

Why should 'we' assume he is the one who should 'mend his ways'? To me - that is a kind of snobbery as well - an assumption that his ideas may be wrong or lesser? He may have different experiences, ethics, understanding - but his ways to him are right - all the OP needs to do is decide whether she can submit to them or not

You're exactly right. That IS what it boils down to. She has to decide if she can submit to someone with his beliefs, ethics, etc. I was simply pointing out that I could not. I would not. I could not show him honor and respect because I would be convinced he's a classist, snobbish ass IF he truly believes in his superiority to "those people."

It is MY opinion that he should "mend his ways" because those particular ethics and beliefs smack of hatred, ignorance, intolerance and lots of other crappy descriptors. If her partner called blacks, gays, Jews or any other group "those people," oh the scoldings he would be getting. Yet, once again, it's only poor people. Only "trailer dwellers." Everyone knows they are a special, nasty underclass not worthy of respect, right? I know you didn't say that but that sentiment comes through time and time again here in these forums. If it's a racist or sexist or anti-kink comment, the jerk gets torn a new one. Look down your upturned nose at the trailer dwellers and Wal-Mart shoppers and it's a hoot. I just can't stomach it. Just a personal hot button. Normally, I would totally agree that it's it's own form of "snobbery" to say he should change his thoughts. But not when they are of this ilk. No different than unthinkingly grouping any racial or religious group together as all being the same and somehow "less than".................luci

< Message edited by slaveluci -- 3/23/2008 3:12:57 PM >

_____________________________

To choose a good book, look in an inquisitor’s prohibited list. ~John Aikin

(in reply to RCdc)

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