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RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 5:20:44 AM   
Alumbrado


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quote:

Japanese is the language of karate


Actually, it was developed in Okinawa, by people who spoke the Shuri-Naha version of the Okinawan language... as a result,  many Japanese can't even tell you correctly what the words 'kara te' mean, and that includes people who teach it.  

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Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 5:21:41 AM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomAviator

I learned Afrikaans for family reasons which proved handy when visiting South Africa even though they all speak english.



Hmmmmm...

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RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 5:53:55 AM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

Japanese is the language of karate


Actually, it was developed in Okinawa, by people who spoke the Shuri-Naha version of the Okinawan language... as a result,  many Japanese can't even tell you correctly what the words 'kara te' mean, and that includes people who teach it.  


While the 1st part is true,the rest isn`t.

My Kancho Senei Kancho Eizo Onishi traveled to Okinawa every month for years to earn his rank.He trained under Kanken Toyama (1888-1966) and Juhatsu Kiyoda (1888-1967) in the cities of Shuri and Naha to earn his hachidan (8th-degree black belt).

He established my system in '52', in Japan.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Ok smart guy,who brought the art to Okinawa?No googling allowed.

A correct answer ,get`s you out of doing shoji.(cleaning the dojo after class)

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 5/7/2008 6:09:10 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 6:40:53 AM   
LaTigresse


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

My child's school in Iowa forced Spanish down the kids' throats.  What it did was to make it harder for them to learn English.  These kids were being stunted in learning one language to be politically correct and try to learn another. 
Let's give them lesser education in the name of higher education?   Having seen how ineffective it was when put in action I will fight tooth and nail if the political nitwits try to destroy the education he is getting here.  The children need to have a firm grasp of one language before you confuse them with another.



So trying to learn more in school is baaaaaad, and you want to put a stop to that sort of thing?


Apparently so. But then he also moved from Iowa (some of the best public schools in the nation ) to Arkansas.

I don't think anymore needs to be said about the intelligence of that particular post. Especially since I know for a fact, that Iowa schools are not shoving spanish down any students throat. Though it might be beneficial if they did.


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RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 8:04:26 AM   
Irishknight


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Joined: 9/30/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado
So trying to learn more in school is baaaaaad, and you want to put a stop to that sort of thing?

I love the way you try to cloud truth with a stupid statement.  Read the post again.  I am actually wanting them to LEARN in school. These kids were having trouble SPEAKING english.  They had more spanish work than english because of their politically correct agenda.  It HURT their learning of BOTH languages.  I watched it and fought it for 4 years and that is one of the reasons I moved away from that state.
In less than one year of being allowed to focus on his primary language, my kid has gone from a barely passing reading comprehension to one that is rated as nationally equivalent to a child 3 grades higher. 
My point is simple.  Get the kids using one language before you teach them a second. 

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Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 8:06:37 AM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		wait.. are you saying, that prior to this school curriculum, your kids didn't speak English? what did they  do? grunt, growl, hoot, and point?

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Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 8:14:34 AM   
Irishknight


Posts: 2016
Joined: 9/30/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse


Apparently so. But then he also moved from Iowa (some of the best public schools in the nation ) to Arkansas.

I don't think anymore needs to be said about the intelligence of that particular post. Especially since I know for a fact, that Iowa schools are not shoving spanish down any students throat. Though it might be beneficial if they did.



Apparently, you don't know much.  Your mind seems clouded with a bit of bigotry toward Arkansas.  From kindergarten on it was shoved down their throats.  There was no option.  As far as the intelligence, I didn't insult the small amount your statement tried to show. I merely stated that your plan has been put in action and is not working.
Lastly, I have lived with Iowa public schools.  They are highly overrated and produce a large number of kids who have less than a firm grasp on the basics.  You look at figures on paper and rail against Arkansas schools and praise Iowa.  Try checking them both out for real some time.  I actually did and have the experience and the real knowledge to back up what I am saying.  In fact, I have 5 years of progress reports that prove they did get force fed spanish.  If you call me a liar then you are also calling those supposed great schools a bunch of liars.

Are all of the schools in Iowa bad?  No.  Was the super large magnet school my kid was forced to attend bad?  Yes.  Are all Arkansas schools terrific?  No.  is the tiny school with 500 students overall that he attends a fantasic school?  Absolutely.

< Message edited by Irishknight -- 5/7/2008 8:54:05 AM >

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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 8:34:33 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Irishknight - its interesting what youre saying about the Spanish thing, as received wisdom would suggest that kids raised by parents with two languages get to be fluent in both. Also, over here in Wales, kids are taught Welsh from age 5, even in south Wales where Welsh as a natural language has long been extinguished, and they seem to get on alright - but it would be interesting to hear from any Welsh people here with experience of it?

I still remember, when I was about 14-15, there was a period of 3-6 months when I suddenly couldnt speak English fluently any more. I could understand it, write it and read it but had trouble putting a spoken sentence together. Something was going on in my brain no doubt. Whether that was learning German, which I'd just started, or something to do with puberty I dont know though?

E

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RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 8:47:23 AM   
Irishknight


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Joined: 9/30/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

wait.. are you saying, that prior to this school curriculum, your kids didn't speak English? what did they  do? grunt, growl, hoot, and point?

There is a difference in speaking poor english and NO english as you were well aware before making that statement.  You merely want to take any blame away from a flawed program that is being shown to be detrimental in this incarnation.
And, I had to spend considerable amounts of time and energy correcting my child's language skills after the school got ahold of him. 

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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 8:48:45 AM   
Irishknight


Posts: 2016
Joined: 9/30/2007
Status: offline 		I would attribute the trouble you mention to puberty.  It tends to cause boys to revert to caveman style grunting as well.

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 11:34:31 AM   
spinninsweetness


Posts: 477
Joined: 3/6/2008
From: London
Status: offline 		The reason I'm not bilingual, as school would have wanted, wasnt the fact that language was taught, but the timing and the type of language taught.

I learned French for 5 years at secondary school, starting in year 7, and now barely remember any of it. Written French I can get, to some degree, but spoken I beyond my skills.

We were taught how to ask for that t-shirt in red, blue, green etc. Do you have the t-shirt in large/med/small? Are your eyes blue/green/brown? Useless in the real world, useless in business.

When I took it, a modern language through to GCSE's was mandetory. Now it isnt, so there is even less chance of kids learning. And yes I know, I could get off my arse and go about learning it myself, but its really low on my list of priority's.

Where I'm from there is a movement to bring back the Cornish language, to seperate as a seperate country from the rest of the UK. Not a huge movement mind, but still there is a possability to learn Cornish, a dead language, and gain qualifications in it.

If I ever learn another language, I'll go for American. Looks fairly easy.

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Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 11:59:13 AM   
Hippiekinkster


Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Irishknight - its interesting what youre saying about the Spanish thing, as received wisdom would suggest that kids raised by parents with two languages get to be fluent in both. Also, over here in Wales, kids are taught Welsh from age 5, even in south Wales where Welsh as a natural language has long been extinguished, and they seem to get on alright - but it would be interesting to hear from any Welsh people here with experience of it?

I still remember, when I was about 14-15, there was a period of 3-6 months when I suddenly couldnt speak English fluently any more. I could understand it, write it and read it but had trouble putting a spoken sentence together. Something was going on in my brain no doubt. Whether that was learning German, which I'd just started, or something to do with puberty I dont know though?

E
It's that damned compound verb thing.

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 12:37:33 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		Yes, and we all know that SOME people's poor challenged children can only learn one lil ole language at a time...

I guess my sister-in-law is a terrible person for demanding her children learn both english and spanish from day one. Funny thing.......they have grown up speaking both fluently. Even funnier, they test above average and are doing quite well.

In addition, the system I propose has been in effect at a private school here locally for many years and those students are thriving.

I've researched the benefits of multi-lingual education and wish it had been available for my children from day one.


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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 1:26:55 PM   
PainSmith


Posts: 53
Joined: 12/30/2007
From: the Republic
Status: offline 		Many kids in many countries learn lots of languages. In the country with the highest GDP per capita, Luxembourg (2007 figures), kids learn four languages (French, German, English and Luxembourgish). The idea that learning multiple languages disadvantages kids is disproven by the facts.

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 1:31:13 PM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

Japanese is the language of karate


Actually, it was developed in Okinawa, by people who spoke the Shuri-Naha version of the Okinawan language... as a result,  many Japanese can't even tell you correctly what the words 'kara te' mean, and that includes people who teach it.  


No one watches movies anymore?  Te is hand, Kara is open, unless i have been lied to, which has happened before.

i can also say "don't shoot me i know military secrets" in several languages.

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Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 1:38:33 PM   
MontrealPhoenix


Posts: 1526
Joined: 2/27/2008
Status: offline 		"If I was you I would work on the english a bit more....just saying... "

Interesting that you would say that since "If i were you is correct.....just saying *wink*
 
Phoenix




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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 1:44:22 PM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
Status: offline 		Je ne desire pas d'etudier les autre langues,
basta ya des otros idiomas,
Ya ne hochu vyuchit innostrannikh yazikye (sorry bad russian translit)
and the only things one needs to know in Latin is QID means 4 times a day, and BID means 2 times a day, and "illegitimati non carborundum" means "Don't let the bastards wear you down".
       see, and all i have ever wanted to be was a cunning linguist.

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live hard, die young and leave a good looking corpse when you die.
Love ya, but, when the zombies start chasing us, i am tripping you.
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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 1:48:37 PM   
Irishknight


Posts: 2016
Joined: 9/30/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Yes, and we all know that SOME people's poor challenged children can only learn one lil ole language at a time...

Wow a bigot and someone who has to resort to insulting children she has never met.  I need not defend my child's intellect from someone who continues to use unsupported false facts about scholls she has never attended and then resorts to childish name calling when shown to be wrong.  And, I'd be willing to bet he'd give your superior kids a run for their money.  You are a bitter, bitter person.

You get mad when people show that your facts are anything but facts.  If your school has a program that works then more power to it.  The schools that are trying to implement it in Iowa are causing more harm to the kids than good.  Maybe you should have your school send someone to theirs to try to fix it.

As for your sister in law, maybe she is a bad person, maybe not.  I never met her nor feel inclined to attack her reputation.  I'll leave that to small and insecure people.

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 1:56:43 PM   
Irishknight


Posts: 2016
Joined: 9/30/2007
Status: offline 		I am speaking of a particular program if you haven't noticed.  It is proving to cause problems at this time.  Perhaps if they would stop screwing around and get it right, things would be different.  I can only attest to the school my child attended which is a huge school.  They are having a steady lowering of the average test scores.  Either the work is getting harder or they are doing something wrong.  Otherwise smart children are being screwed out of a decent education for programs that are not working.
I will again state that my belief is that the primary language should be stressed first then bring in secondary and even tertiary languages. 

(in reply to Irishknight)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Monolingual English is a disadvantage - 5/7/2008 2:11:56 PM   
toservez


Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline 		The problem with learning another language is a catch-22 for Americans.

You are never really going to learn it well enough to use it if there is not a direct need or consistent opportunities to use what you learn which for many Americans comes when in adulthood. But the best time to learn additional languages is when you are a kid.

I read all the posts here and to me everyone is kind of right. It would be great if Americans would learn at least one additional language but for most people in this country the opportunity to truly use that language when a kid is just not realistic yet let alone most want the need or great opportunity to be there.

I tend to agree with the OP. That English has or will become the basic language of communication. For instance the last time I was in China the government was going out of their way to stress learning English as being critical to the prosperity of China. They even were teaching American slang in between videos on MTV.


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Profile   Post #: 60
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