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Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 3:16:37 PM

Kirren

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I've said before, I am not very sure when it comes to political platforms. Ive been reading, and none of it makes any kind of sense, so I turn to you guys...those of you who know what the hell all this stuff means, incumbant, what evers for where ever....Because I am so completely lost in the shit storm of OMG its a woman or a black man, and what will we do, and whos gonna get it, and what do they stand for, while Obama turns is back on the American flag, and Hillary is for abortion and gas tax holidays...

I cant make heads or tails of it...so can some one, with OUT the sarcasm thank you, PLEASE break it down for Me in simplest terms, as to what each one stands for....and how likely they are to ACTUALLY do it, based on past histories in politics....

Thank you.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 3:21:33 PM

SteelofUtah

Posts: 5307
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From: St George Utah
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............. Yeah ....... NO.

Steel

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 3:31:02 PM

Arpig

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From: Increasingly further from reality
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It's simple...they are lying to the public, just the same way they have lied to the public in the past, and the way they will lie to the public in the future. They are politicians, and that is what politicians do.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 4:04:04 PM

Level

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Joined: 3/3/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirren

I've said before, I am not very sure when it comes to political platforms. Ive been reading, and none of it makes any kind of sense, so I turn to you guys...those of you who know what the hell all this stuff means, incumbant, what evers for where ever....Because I am so completely lost in the shit storm of OMG its a woman or a black man, and what will we do, and whos gonna get it, and what do they stand for, while Obama turns is back on the American flag, and Hillary is for abortion and gas tax holidays...

I cant make heads or tails of it...so can some one, with OUT the sarcasm thank you, PLEASE break it down for Me in simplest terms, as to what each one stands for....and how likely they are to ACTUALLY do it, based on past histories in politics....

Thank you.

No, its far too much to try to break down, Kirren. But I can tell you, Obama hasn't "turned his back on the flag".

Here's a couple of links that might help: http://www.ontheissues.org/Candidates.htm

http://www.motherjones.com/news/update/2008/02/obama-vs-clinton-economic-policy.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/31/AR2006123101004_pf.html

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 4:52:36 PM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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It's real simple this year. If its a conservative source, they're lying. If it's ABC they're pro Clinton no matter what. If it's a reporter from outside of Arizona reporting on McCain nothing remotely negative will appear no matter what

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 5:03:45 PM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
Status: offline

Here it is in short strokes:

Three candidates for President (Two Democrat One Republican).

All three lie and dissemble about what they can do, and what they will do if elected.

Obama wants to sit around and talk--which won't do a damn thing.

Clinton wants to sit around and pass legislation that won't do much.

McCain wants to sit around and not pass legislation that won't do much.

Personally, I go for #3. No law is better than bad law, and bad law is all that #1 and #2 offer.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 5:24:14 PM

MusicalBoredom

Posts: 620
Joined: 5/8/2007
From: Louisiana/New York
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Personally I'm ready to not have a republican in office for another term. I've been around for a few years now and see party strength ebb and flow from one party to the next. I think our system is fairly broken in some areas but changing it will be like trying to force an aircraft carrier going at full steam to do an immediate about face. It will take time and dedicated effort from us, the citizens of this country, to affect any significant change. Unfortunately most of us participate in politics by watching TV and talking about what the anchor says rather than what a political candidate stands for.

The way it should work is that we collectively identify and support several candidates to the party of our choice based on what we want in a candidate. We would spend time letting them know what's important to us and why. The candidates in turn would refine their position and let us all know what they stand for. Party debates would be about letting us know why they differ on various issues, giving us time and information to perhaps change our own position or support one candidate or the other. Ultimately there would be a primary and each party would nominate a candidate for a national election based on the candidate that best represented the wishes of the party constituents. A national election would come and we would elect a president based on issues and their importance to us.

I did like both Obama and Clinton at first. They have some differences but seemed like viable candidates. In the end, Clinton lost me due to her willingness to damage the party that's supporting her to insure her victory. That lost her character points in my mind. It also made me lose a bit of trust in her decision making process. I'm not a fan at all in her propensity to to put self interest above the interest of the office/job. Obama on the other hand has not done the same thing in my mind. He has stayed with his political agenda only stopping to defend his reputation (which should not have necessary in the first place). The only thing I really ever hear against him is quoting a "news" source rather than quoting something he said himself. We end up debating news-selling sound bites rather that political agendas.

So my general thinking is don't listen to the rhetoric, try to find what the candidates actually stand for and vote for the one that best represents your own ideas.

(in reply to SteelofUtah)

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 5:30:02 PM

FirmhandKY

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Joined: 9/21/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

Here it is in short strokes:

Three candidates for President (Two Democrat One Republican).

All three lie and dissemble about what they can do, and what they will do if elected.

Obama wants to sit around and talk--which won't do a damn thing.

Clinton wants to sit around and pass legislation that won't do much.

McCain wants to sit around and not pass legislation that won't do much.

Personally, I go for #3. No law is better than bad law, and bad law is all that #1 and #2 offer.

What he ^^^^ said, except that I think Obama will try to do some stuff ... and be very ineffective at doing it.

Firm

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 5:37:04 PM

subfever

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Joined: 5/22/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

It's simple...they are lying to the public, just the same way they have lied to the public in the past, and the way they will lie to the public in the future. They are politicians, and that is what politicians do.

And you might agree that politicians are more effective liars and cheats that the average citizenry. By that logic, if we only have the best of the liars and cheats to elect our leaders from, why would people want government at all?

(in reply to Arpig)

Post #: 9

RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 5:40:32 PM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
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Not a damn thing will change if any of them are elected. I can't be any simpler than that. The majority of people in this country don't want change, no matter how much they say they do. They want to continue living in their cookie cutter houses, driving their SUVs, living in towns that are nothing more than gigantic strip malls, and paying 4 bucks for a cup of coffee. I don't blame any of the candidates for what this country is becoming. We all are generally smart people as individuals, but we don't agree on anything collectively. We get sidetracked by stupid red herring issues that don't matter. Abortion, gun control, religion, the economy, education, blah, blah, blah are not things the President has any considerable influence on. But we fall for those simple minded campaign buzz words every time.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 5:47:57 PM

Irishknight

Posts: 2016
Joined: 9/30/2007
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I think we are better liars. Who is it that lies to themselves about the qualifications of these people? That would be us. When the biggest qualification that most people can quote for a candidate is that she doesn't have a penis then they need to be honest enough to admit that they don't care about qualifications. "Because she's a woman," or "Because he's black," or"Because he's not Bush" are not qualifications.
As far as what is happening, we have 2 unproven people running on promises. The third has only succeeded in making sure that the majority doesn't always rule when his own party was in the majority and passiong an election reform bill that reformed nothing. I believe that he organized that little coup to distance himself from Bush as much as possible just for this election.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 6:11:17 PM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline

Don`t listen to the cynics and their jaded POV.

Do some reading on your own and take your time.Election day is months away .

Look at their websites,do a bit of googling and ask people you know and respect,what they think.

People have personal biases,so keep that in mind.A Yankees fan will trash talk a Red Sox fan,while giving glowing revues of their own baseball team and visa versa.

Same in politics.There are a few souls who really are in the middle,if you can find one,who don`t have a bias.

I think all the candidates have strengths and weaknesses.All would make a decent president.

Take your time and don`t forget to register to vote.

Do that before the week`s over.There are forms at the post office.Or go on-line to find where to can get the forms.

Fill them out and mail them in.

Hope this helps.

Good luck!

(in reply to Irishknight)

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 6:28:50 PM

Irishknight

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Joined: 9/30/2007
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Okay. Maybe "Because he's not Bush" is aqualification.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 6:45:57 PM

bamabbwsub

Posts: 566
Joined: 5/28/2007
Status: offline

quote:

We get sidetracked by stupid red herring issues that don't matter. Abortion, gun control, religion, the economy, education, blah, blah, blah are not things the President has any considerable influence on. But we fall for those simple minded campaign buzz words every time.

Excellent point, slaveboyforyou!

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 6:47:48 PM

UtopianRanger

Posts: 3251
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirren

I've said before, I am not very sure when it comes to political platforms. Ive been reading, and none of it makes any kind of sense, so I turn to you guys...those of you who know what the hell all this stuff means, incumbant, what evers for where ever....Because I am so completely lost in the shit storm of OMG its a woman or a black man, and what will we do, and whos gonna get it, and what do they stand for, while Obama turns is back on the American flag, and Hillary is for abortion and gas tax holidays...

I cant make heads or tails of it...so can some one, with OUT the sarcasm thank you, PLEASE break it down for Me in simplest terms, as to what each one stands for....and how likely they are to ACTUALLY do it, based on past histories in politics....

Thank you.

Kirren.....

I'll make this short and sweet because I'm on battery only power at the moment :

All three are basically nuanced versions of ''corporate cocksuckers''..... And what I mean by that is, regardless of which one of them becomes our next President, the United States will still be governed under /by a neo-liberal mentality/philosophy ; where big business/corporatism rules the day.

I could go on and on and parse this out to the finest detail......but after three plus years and three-thousand posts that are overwhelmingly dedicated to politics/economics/current events, it becomes a tad bit boring for even someone like me - You understand

Here is a more detailed look at my opinion of the three :

http://www.collarchat.com/m_1795474/mpage_2/key_obahma/tm.htm#1796880

Ciao for the night.....

- R

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 7:05:24 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirren

can some one, with OUT the sarcasm thank you, PLEASE break it down for Me in simplest terms, as to what each one stands for....

          Without sarcasm? Is coldly cynical still allowed?

       I sadly gave up on Barak being the candidate I hoped he was. He has done/said a great many stupid things through this campaign. He would do more of that as President. I'm concerned the reason so many powerful Dems are supporting him is a belief that he would be easy to manipulate.

       John McCain is George Bush's appointed heir.

       Hillary Clinton is Richard Nixon with a vagina.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 7:14:54 PM

Irishknight

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Joined: 9/30/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Hillary Clinton is Richard Nixon with a vagina.

OMFG That's funny!

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 7:32:30 PM

awmslave

Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
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The candidates who explained their understanding and views regarding economy are out (Ron Paul was the most clear abut economy). So, "playing safe" is the name of the game. Mrs. Clinton chief adviser basic principle is the same old "tell people what they want to hear". Billary follows this principle very tightly. By doing so she looses spontaneuity and she is the most disgenuine and phony candidate out of three. Mr. Obama has chosen not to say much at all; people just like to think he will bring some kind of change to replace crash course USA is today. McCain is a genuine conservative and he will try to get spending under control: easy in theory, unpopular and very hard to do.

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/6/2008 8:15:51 PM

Real_Trouble

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Joined: 2/25/2008
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To the OP:

The moment you ask someone to break down politics for you, you are asking to be deceived.

Something to consider, in the future...

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RE: Can some one PLEASE break this down for Me? - 5/7/2008 12:01:26 AM

DomAviator

Posts: 1253
Joined: 4/22/2008
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Ok want a break down - here it is:

Barrack HUSSEIN Obama is a pathological liar who flip flops in the interest of expedience. He was born of a radical mother from Kansas who mated with a black man from Kenya. He was then raised as a muslim in Indonesia until he was 14. (You know, Indonesia - where they have the Bali bombing and Al Queda is rampant.) He denies being a muslim however and has a racist preacher who thinks Louis Farrakhan - leader of the nation of Islam will free the blacks from the white devils in this God Damn KKK or A. You know he is most famous for saying God Bless America! No God DAMN America! He has a wife who announced that "for the first time she was proud to be an american". Obama was never in the military unless you count al queda camps in Indonesia.

Hillary Clinton is a crooked disbarred lawyer whos political qualifications consists of being married to one of the worst presidents we ever had. She too is a pathological liar and will tell you whatever you need to hear. Case in point , she is one of the most antigun people in america yet she was doing boiler makers and talking deer hunting in Pennsylvania. She was never in the miltary unless you count dodging imaginary sniper fire in an incident that never happened. Hillary wants big govt.

John McCain is a graduate of the US Naval Academy. His father and grandfather were both admirals. He served with honor as a Naval Aviator. His integrity is such that he remained for years in a Vietnameese prison being tortured daily because he refused to use his fathers influence to get his freedom thus abandoning his men. (They offerer to send him home because his father was CINC Naval Air Forces Pacific.) He is a bit outspoken, to the point where he is known as "senator hothead" but thats because he leads like Navy Captain - which is what he was. (The equivelant of a Col.) He has a long and distinguished history in politics and is above all a man of honor who subscribes to the Navy code - Honor, Courage, Committment.

To put it simply - we have a mouthy bitch crooked lawyer married to a womanizing crooked lawyer, a mouthy half black radical muslim crooked lawyer married to a mouthy bitch anti-american lawyer. Or we have a war hero Naval Aviator, married to a gorgeous blonde who owns a beer company. :) Tough choice huh?

MC CAIN!!!!!!!!!!

(in reply to Real_Trouble)

Post #: 20

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