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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 10:35:20 AM   
Leatherist


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

quote:

ORIGINAL: amayos
Nurture and dominance often fit well together, from what I've seen and experienced. In many ways, to nurture is to teach, to encourage, shape and even discipline.


This is a view I lacked seeing for a long time.  I equated "nurture" with "affection" - not necessarily the same but in the same family.  But when I think about it, nurture means to grow, to develop, to feed...  And all these things you mentioned fit into that.  Somehow though, when I have thought of someone who is nurturing, I thought only of the element of gentle loving and affection.    But to think that way is incomplete thinking.


But it is the reason that some seek a "daddy".
 
I think that anyone who likes the concept of improvement is going to nurture-but not necessarily in the way that a doting parent does.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 10:42:21 AM   
ownedgirlie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist
But it is the reason that some seek a "daddy".

Perhaps, yes.  I'm not in that kind of relationship so I can't speak to that personally, but don't Daddy's also discipline?  I can't imagine it's all sweetness, all the time.
 

 
quote:


I think that anyone who likes the concept of improvement is going to nurture-but not necessarily in the way that a doting parent does.


Perhaps.  Doting is not something I have much experience with, on the receiving end, by parent or by Master.  I think some people receive nurturing, but not in the way they prefer to.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 11:00:19 AM   
Daddyslilpookie


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Status: offline 		I find this to be utterly completly untrue, Master's can nurture it just depends on how good the Master is I have a Daddy Dom which is the most nurturing of all.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 11:18:57 AM   
Dnomyar


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Status: offline 		There has to be some form or type of nurturing being perseived or there would be no relationship.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 12:50:55 PM   
HeavansKeeper


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

quote:

Will nurturing cut into my fishing time??


Not if you take your slave fishing with you. Duh. I mean, do you want to be carrying the tackle box and worms yourself?  And the cooler?  Coolers get heavy, having a pack slave along with you on your fishing trip would be a benefit.



Speaking of nurturing, I promised My Pet I'd carry the tacklebox when we go fishing.  She had a bad experience and hates the serene acts of sitting in a little boat because she got to carry everything and catch nothing.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 12:51:04 PM   
SimplyMichael


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

There has to be some form or type of nurturing being perseived or there would be no relationship.


On that I disagree.  I no more think nurting is undomly than I think the lack of nurturing is undomly.  Creating the relationship YOU want is domly. 

Take someone who is "in service" to someone in a strictly service role, they are unlikely to get nurturing.   I have had submissives in service to me who came by and rubbed my feet, sucked my cock and massaged me till I fell asleep and then left and did that a few times a week.   I was certainly pleasant to them but they got no aftercare, I didn't do anything for them in any direct sense, they just did it because I inspired that in them.   I know I am not alone in such things.  I CAN nurture but in those cases I did not.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 1:28:16 PM   
LaTigresse


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

To nobody in particular...

I do whatever the fuck I WANT to do...THAT is what makes ME Master.  I would be dominant if I were wearing a dress and cleaning a toilet because I would clean it MY way and if I wanted someone else to clean it, they would clean it EXACTLY the same way I did because that is MY way.



Photos please.


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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 1:48:04 PM   
gypsygrl


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quote:

Take someone who is "in service" to someone in a strictly service role, they are unlikely to get nurturing.   I have had submissives in service to me who came by and rubbed my feet, sucked my cock and massaged me till I fell asleep and then left and did that a few times a week.   I was certainly pleasant to them but they got no aftercare, I didn't do anything for them in any direct sense, they just did it because I inspired that in them.   I know I am not alone in such things.  I CAN nurture but in those cases I did not.


But you provided an opportunity, no?  I mean, you made yourself available to them, at the very least.  And in doing so, nurtured--encouraged--a desire to serve.  You could have refused their service, or done something that would have altered the service relationship and turned it into something else, but you didn't do that and stayed within the expected perameters of a service arrangement thereby nurturing the desire to serve.  What if instead of falling alseep, you paid them when you were finished?  It would have fundamentally altered the service relationship and turned it into something else.  Or you asked for the s's hand in marriage?  Again, that wouldn't be very encouraging of a service relationship.

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 1:52:54 PM   
LadyLynx


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Status: offline 		"Masters can't nurture" thats like saying men in general cannot be nurturing, or compassionate, or whatever. Which is BS. my father was both mother and father to me in alot of ways, (**snickers** and no I don't mean that he crossdresses.)

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 3:09:40 PM   
servantheart


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

To nobody in particular...

I do whatever the fuck I WANT to do...THAT is what makes ME Master.  I would be dominant if I were wearing a dress and cleaning a toilet because I would clean it MY way and if I wanted someone else to clean it, they would clean it EXACTLY the same way I did because that is MY way.

If the only way people can tell you are dominant is because you capitalize your name, hang a flogger from your belt, or you wear some other symbol, then you will be very puzzled when someone with charisma enters a room without a flogger or any other outward sign of being dominant and yet effortlessly gets all the respect you crave but never feel.


That's pretty much it. 
 
My own opinion is that a wise Master/Mistress takes care of His/Her property in every way possible in order to keep said property in the best working condition.
 


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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 3:24:32 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

There has to be some form or type of nurturing being perseived or there would be no relationship.


How so?

Relationships are what the participants make of them. 

There is no "has to be" in relationships--that's true regardless of the flavor, vanilla, chocolate, or kink.  There is whatever works for those in the relationship, and that's it.

I nurture my slave, because I want my slave to grow and evolve both as a slave and as a human being.  It works for me, which is the beginning, middle, and end of the "has to be" discussion, as far as I can tell.


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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 3:30:22 PM   
Dommstr49


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Status: offline 		Yes we can be nurturing, at least this one can be.

< Message edited by Dommstr49 -- 5/8/2008 3:31:26 PM >

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 3:48:54 PM   
Bound2One


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

ORIGINAL: Leatherist
But it is the reason that some seek a "daddy".

Perhaps, yes.  I'm not in that kind of relationship so I can't speak to that personally, but don't Daddy's also discipline?  I can't imagine it's all sweetness, all the time.
 


We have a mix of Master/Daddy Dom in our relationship, leaning strongly towards DD most of the time.  I can only speak for our relationship, but yes, he does discipline and correct and mold as he desires.  I see that as nurturing also - nurturing isn't all sweetness and light.  It's guidance and leading and teaching and correction.  To nurture means to give energy into the relationship so that the relationship is as strong and healthy as it can be.  I need nurturing from Daddy, and I nurture him right back. 

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 4:24:10 PM   
gypsygrl


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quote:

nurture means to give energy


Thats a great defination.  I love it. :)

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 4:33:27 PM   
gypsygrl


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Status: offline 		This is a bit off topic, but I started the thread so I guess I can do that.  And its been bugging me all day.

quote:

I do whatever the fuck I WANT to do...THAT is what makes ME Master. 


By this criteria, I'd be the Master too.  I want to submit and to the extent that I have an opportunity and am able to submit, I'm doing what I want.  Consensual slavery/voluntary submission is dictated by wants on the part of both Master and slave.  So, you doing what you want doesn't really do anything to differentiate you as a Master from a slave.  There's got to be something more.

< Message edited by gypsygrl -- 5/8/2008 4:34:27 PM >

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 4:43:08 PM   
Leatherist


Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline 		I give up. I'll never make it as a "total master". My ability to see myself as god is nil, especially when I get up in the morning, having to piss like a racehorse, and my knees hurt. Or some stupid stoned fucker in a beat up car almost takes me out walking down the shoulder of a local road.

Because he was stoned,and not giving a rat's ass about anyone else. Not giving a rats ass about other people is pretty much where I draw the demarcation between ok, and pond scum.
 
 Sure,I could probably find someone whacked enough to let me do anything at all I wanted to them. And delude myself by calling myself thier "master", rather than thier "codependent in dysfunction."
 
 The big question being...."WOULD I  WANT TO?"
 
 

< Message edited by Leatherist -- 5/8/2008 4:44:40 PM >

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 5:29:48 PM   
Stephann


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gypsygrl

quote:

Makes me feel safer and more nurtured than I ever have in my life...


I'm not sure why this led me along the specific tangent it did, but when I read it I thought that even if the Master didn't do a lot of direct nurturing---the sort of stuff you decribe in your post--I think for a slave, just being in  a specific relationship could  be a form of nurturing if it provided what the slave needed.  I mean, its hard for me to imagine a Master not doing some form of nurturing, either direct or indirect, if the relationship is worth having.  Even if the only reason the Master is doing it is to keep the slave coming back (see HappyPervert's comment) it would seem that some nurturing is inevitable.

I'm pretty close to concluding that Masters have to do some form of nurturing otherwise there'd be no relationship. lol



Hi there.

I think your opening post was a straw man.  I suspect you held this conclusion when you started the thread, which is fine.  The problem is that you're using the overwhelming statements that "A Master can TOO be nurturing" to support your belief that a Master must, in fact, be nurturing to be a good Master.  This may hold true for you; it certainly won't hold true for everyone.

Personally, I have a nature that is (possibly) too nurturing.  I often fixate on trying to make my partner feel better, happier, and healthier to my own detriment.  I have to regularly look at myself, and say "it's ok to do what you want, how you want, too!"  Sounds strange coming from a dominant?  Yet when we become emotionally invested in the things we care for, we often end up in situations where we do things that are unhealthy to us to comfort others (staying up all night caring for a sick pet for example, when you have work in the morning.) 

Stephan


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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 5:47:49 PM   
gypsygrl


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quote:

I think your opening post was a straw man. 


Well, yeah. It was a straw man.  Like I said at the beginning, the whole thing struck me as being counter intuitive.  Meaning, it went against pretty much everything I had already internalized.

I'm thinking whats at issue is different definitions of "nurture."  Some people equate it with doting and coddling which would suggest a daddy dom dynamic while others look at it in terms of supporting growth and development, which might involve less obvious forms of nurturing, but would still be nurturing in a larger sense.

Plus, even if the s isn't nurtured in any obvious way, the relationship would still have to be nurtured.

ed because i hit ok too soon by mistake

< Message edited by gypsygrl -- 5/8/2008 5:52:37 PM >

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 5:50:27 PM   
Stephann


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Status: offline 		It still doesn't mean that someone who doesn't actively nurture their slave must be a bad owner.  

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RE: Masters can't nurture? - 5/8/2008 6:09:09 PM   
gypsygrl


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quote:

It still doesn't mean that someone who doesn't actively nurture their slave must be a bad owner.  


Did I say anything about that?  I don't tend to think in terms of good and bad.  I think most people posting on the thread were saying that there's nothing preventing a Master from being nurturing if he wanted to.  

Then, I got caught up in the logical problem of trying to figure out how to maintain a relationship without nurturing it and nurturing started to seem like a logical necessity. 

But, I think that problem kind of resolves itself because "nurturing" is being used in different ways.  I haven't thought it through yet, though.




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