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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 12:31:40 PM   
SimplyMichael


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Justme696

Ask him as suggested above...and skip the posts that say that all people who use "under consideration" are bad or wannebees. (no, I don't use it)
It is the sub/slave who accepts the "under concideration"also, so why judge so harsh about the Owner.


Why so harsh?  Because if you are supposedly fucking training someone and doing all this dommy shit and the person who you have collared has zero idea of what the fuck you are going to "train" them in, you are probably a dipshit.  So it isn't so much using a "training collar" that makes me think stupid it is the fact that neither party has any idea of what sort of training is going to go on.  Thus my original post is the "training" is going to consist of a lot taste testing of semen.

< Message edited by SimplyMichael -- 5/11/2008 12:34:03 PM >

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 12:34:35 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

quote:

ORIGINAL: Justme696

Ask him as suggested above...and skip the posts that say that all people who use "under consideration" are bad or wannebees. (no, I don't use it)
It is the sub/slave who accepts the "under concideration"also, so why judge so harsh about the Owner.


Why so harsh?  Because if you are supposedly fucking training someone and doing all this dommy shit and the person who you have collared has zero idea of what the fuck you are going to "train" them in, you are probably a dipshit. 



different ways to do things, doesn't make soem one better then an other.
and now you scare people with reacting like that ;)  

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 12:42:39 PM   
sambamanslilgirl


Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		sorry for not reading the other replies first

quote:

ORIGINAL: EagerToPleaseYou

My question is: What is the difference between being under consideration and being in training? Are they the same?


perhaps this is something you should have asked before accepting his training collar - that's my advice.



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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 12:43:35 PM   
SteelofUtah


Posts: 5307
Joined: 10/2/2007
From: St George Utah
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

quote:

ORIGINAL: Justme696

Ask him as suggested above...and skip the posts that say that all people who use "under consideration" are bad or wannebees. (no, I don't use it)
It is the sub/slave who accepts the "under concideration"also, so why judge so harsh about the Owner.


Why so harsh?  Because if you are supposedly fucking training someone and doing all this dommy shit and the person who you have collared has zero idea of what the fuck you are going to "train" them in, you are probably a dipshit.  So it isn't so much using a "training collar" that makes me think stupid it is the fact that neither party has any idea of what sort of training is going to go on.  Thus my original post is the "training" is going to consist of a lot taste testing of semen.


I REALLT hate to Admit this Michael but ...... There are people out there who believe that a Consideration Collar and a Training Collar are valid parts of the Master/slave relationship. I donlt get it myself but it doesn't change the fact that there are more of them then there is of me so I can only assume there is a reason behind it which is why I always try to understand how someone THINK the Collar System works

OP can you do me a Favor and Educated or not can you give they way YOU understand the collar process? I mean what you think a Collar is all about and why someone might use a Systems of collars rather than just One?

Steel

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 12:53:19 PM   
EagerToPleaseYou


Posts: 17
Joined: 11/24/2007
Status: offline 		Damn! Now you put me in the position of feeling like I need to stick up for Sir.

Sir and I have had numerous discussions of the goals in our relationship, and our play. I clearly understand my role, and he his. Sir has been a Dom, and a good one, for many, many years. He is a good man in his vanilla life as well, one of those rare few that educate our children for the love of it.

With that said, I have not asked Sir the difference between a "collar of consideration" and a "training collar" because it was something I felt I could investigate on my own. If I ask, he will certainly answer me. This is a new relationship for me. We are still learning each other and, I might add, enjoying that investigation very much. To me, this is a small and trivial question for Sir and I hesitate to take the time that we have discussing something I'll eventually figure out on my own.

And, why the big chip on your shoulder SimplyMichael? It was a simple, and quite innocent question. If you didn't want to offer constructive information, why did you even post? Yes, I am new here, and many will not take me seriously because of that, but FYI . .. .just because someone is new to a site, does not mean that they do not have some background and experience that could benefit others. I'll bet there are many new subs out there that are just too afraid to ask, but still appreciate the answers that have been given. I want to thank you for the example of what kind of man to avoid in the future.

L.

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Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:04:51 PM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline 		Eager, "Collar of Consideration" is a big warning sign.  There's people -- both male and female Doms -- who at least claim to use it in a positive way.  I've never seen that myself.  But hey, it probably happens somewhere, and I wish them well.  However, many of us have seen the Collar of Consideration used to get the (usually brand new) female sub to ignore all other relationship potentials while the male Dom gets to do whatever he wants.

Be careful.


_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
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(in reply to EagerToPleaseYou)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:09:44 PM   
EagerToPleaseYou


Posts: 17
Joined: 11/24/2007
Status: offline 		Thank you Steel for asking questions. I appreciate the opportunity to clarify.

Sir and I have not discussed the meaning of collars, however, I have been reading and reading, for months - books, forums, websites, articles, etc. My understanding is this:

Training collar - a training collar represents a trial period where the Dom and the sub evaluate whether their needs and desires mesh, whether the relationship itself will work, and whether it will work to the extent that a permanent collar will be offered or desired.

Collared - a committment between the sub and Dom where the Dom has control over the sub physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and sexually - submission is complete and no longer questioned. To me, at this point, you would go from sub to slave, Sir would become Master. That's just the way that I can emotionally relate to this.


As far as collars of consideration . . . I've never seen them really defined and I, personally, don't see any use for them. Would that period of time be more like the hanging out, getting-to-know-you stage anyway? To me that just comes naturally between two people who are considering each other for a partnership.

I do welcome the questions . . .

L.

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Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:12:06 PM   
mstrj69


Posts: 295
Joined: 5/27/2004
Status: offline 		As your first responder said, every one will have a different meaning to the two.  To me, a training collar could mean it is never going any farther.  You want to be trained and he is willing to do it but gave you that collar to keep others from interfering during the training.  Or, he could want to take it farther, I can not read his mind.

You said it was something small that he would answer.  Then ask him and ask him where he wants it to go and for how long?  You also mentioned he has another sub,  Is she too knew to the lifestyle and him?  If not, maybe you could have asked her if she would help you learn what he means and wants when you are unsure or does she think you should just go ahead and ask him.  As you are new, a lack of questions from you will make him woner why.  He does not expect you to know everything or why would he have to train you?

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:13:27 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Justme696

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

quote:

ORIGINAL: Justme696

Ask him as suggested above...and skip the posts that say that all people who use "under consideration" are bad or wannebees. (no, I don't use it)
It is the sub/slave who accepts the "under concideration"also, so why judge so harsh about the Owner.


Why so harsh?  Because if you are supposedly fucking training someone and doing all this dommy shit and the person who you have collared has zero idea of what the fuck you are going to "train" them in, you are probably a dipshit. 



different ways to do things, doesn't make soem one better then an other.
and now you scare people with reacting like that ;)  


I WANT to scare nitwits into thinking before leaping otherwise they might end up with someone who thinks there is no way better than another.

quote:

  If you didn't want to offer constructive information, why did you even post?


Who says it wasn't constructive?  Considering we see people in your position who in another month post about being used and discarded once they realize what a dipshit their dominant is.  I have never said that collars of consideration or training are ALWAYS used by idiots, but one hears of them FAR more often online than in real life AND the people who use them in either place tend to be the more nutty fringe.  That is my opinion based on having done this for years in the real world in rather large bdsm communities and having seen how and by whom they tend to be used.  So while it might not be constructive for YOU, I feel quite safe in saying it is constructive advice for many.

< Message edited by SimplyMichael -- 5/11/2008 1:19:09 PM >

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:16:40 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
I WANT to scare nitwits into thinking before leaping otherwise they might end up with someone who thinks there is no way better than another.


it is good to show people that there is more then one way...and make them think..agree

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:29:20 PM   
RealSub58


Posts: 1073
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

quote:

but seems to me these questions should have been answered by him before you took a collar


I have to agree.  It's best not to accept the sort of relationship that requires you to receive input from a group of strangers in order to understand what is going on.



Great reply Katy.  I would add.....
Because everyone's lingo is different, you have to go with the flow of what your dom chooses to define anything.
Relying on an open forum for your label defintion is not what your dom might ever think.

And did you understand the reference to poly?
There are also many definitions to poly, depending upon who says it and how one uses the word.

(in reply to KatyLied)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:32:45 PM   
CountrySong


Posts: 554
Joined: 1/25/2008
Status: offline 		I can tell you one good use for a collar of consideration. It gives your sub a little more power to say NO in the meat market situations she often finds herself in at play parties. A lot of the males there think her saying NO is just her saying "MAYBE just ask me later and try harder". The reaction tends to be different if she is collared in any way. No means go ask her Master and then when he says No they sulk but they do leave her alone.

It is also a good way to tell how she is going to be in collarded life. It is kind of like how a woman acts before and after marrage. Before marrage she is really trying and often lieing. After she has that security of marrage she lets that gaurd down and you get to see more of the real her. Best to learn the truth ASAP and be able to move forward than invest a year or more in a lie.
Peace

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:34:51 PM   
RealSub58


Posts: 1073
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EagerToPleaseYou

Thank you Steel for asking questions. I appreciate the opportunity to clarify.

Sir and I have not discussed the meaning of collars, however, I have been reading and reading, for months - books, forums, websites, articles, etc. My understanding is this:

Training collar - a training collar represents a trial period where the Dom and the sub evaluate whether their needs and desires mesh, whether the relationship itself will work, and whether it will work to the extent that a permanent collar will be offered or desired.

Collared - a committment between the sub and Dom where the Dom has control over the sub physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and sexually - submission is complete and no longer questioned. To me, at this point, you would go from sub to slave, Sir would become Master. That's just the way that I can emotionally relate to this.


As far as collars of consideration . . . I've never seen them really defined and I, personally, don't see any use for them. Would that period of time be more like the hanging out, getting-to-know-you stage anyway? To me that just comes naturally between two people who are considering each other for a partnership.

I do welcome the questions . . .

L.



Are not training and under consideration the same?  Just different labels?

Neither Sir nor I believe in collars.  We want committment from each other.  And I didnt need any special title when getting to know him.  But then I didnt come to the relationships with a list long of expectations trying for him to fit any of my expectations.  Vice versa.  Accepting who the other person is, letting time see if that person is for you.  If not move on.

< Message edited by RealSub58 -- 5/11/2008 1:35:44 PM >

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:49:21 PM   
CalifChick


Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EagerToPleaseYou
Sir and I have not discussed the meaning of collars, however, I have been reading and reading, for months - books, forums, websites, articles, etc. My understanding is this:


See, that's just the problem.  There is NO ONE SINGLE definition of those things.  And that's what we're trying to tell you.  Think of it like this:  a man you are interested in, or are dating, or just walked past on the street, whatever... he takes your hand and puts a ring on your finger and says "I want you to wear this."

What does that ring mean?  Does it mean he wants to marry you? Does it mean that he did just marry you (after muttering some strange ritualist words under his breath)?  Does it mean he thinks you have pretty fingers and the ring is too small for anyone else so he just wants you to have it as a gift? 

Any of those things are valid definitions of "what does this mean"... and it could be NONE of those.  The only person who knows is the person who put the ring on your finger, so the only right answer is the one you get when you ask him, "what does this mean?"

Cali


_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:52:39 PM   
EagerToPleaseYou


Posts: 17
Joined: 11/24/2007
Status: offline 		Thank you all for your considered responses, and you, SimplyMichael for clarifying yours 

Yes, I do see Training and Under Consideration as virtually the same.

As far as Sir and I, well he did say when we began discussing things that the first step is wearing his Training Collar until "such time as you earn a permanent one through your demonstrated ability to be submissive." 

Sir and I had been seeing each other for a while before he told me about his lifestyle. I was thrilled to hear it because I'd been leaning that way for years and never quite took the leap. We have a great rapport, many of the same interests, and can sit in silence together. He's a wonderful man and I'm sure will be a wonderful Dom.

He has had his other sub for 18 months now. My understanding of poly is, of course, the classic definition - able to carry on more than one intimate, romantic relationship at the same time while special attention is paid to make sure that everyone gets their needs met. This definition is also his and has already been discussed by us. I am the only other sub or relationship he has taken on in the last 18 months. Before that, I'm not sure.

Thank you all for listening!

L.

< Message edited by EagerToPleaseYou -- 5/11/2008 1:54:58 PM >

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 1:56:26 PM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

one of those rare few that educate our children for the love of it.


Wow, are you saying he's an uncompensated teacher?  That is rare indeed.


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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 3:25:46 PM   
EagerToPleaseYou


Posts: 17
Joined: 11/24/2007
Status: offline 		No, not uncompensated . . . the man has to eat, but he does put in way more time than most, volunteering to be part of most all of the activities etc.

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RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 3:27:27 PM   
Bound2One


Posts: 614
Joined: 1/11/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EagerToPleaseYou
Training collar - a training collar represents a trial period where the Dom and the sub evaluate whether their needs and desires mesh, whether the relationship itself will work, and whether it will work to the extent that a permanent collar will be offered or desired.

Collared - a committment between the sub and Dom where the Dom has control over the sub physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and sexually - submission is complete and no longer questioned. To me, at this point, you would go from sub to slave, Sir would become Master. That's just the way that I can emotionally relate to this.


Hi, Eager.  You know, you can read all you want and know what you believe the definitions to be - but there are so very many varied definitions for these things, and it's *so* individualized that it's very important for you to sit down with your Dom and have this discussion.  There's nothing wrong with understanding the path he envisions for your relationship.  It does sound like he has a gameplan, so to speak, and you should be aware of it so that you know what his expectations are.  At least, that's my humble opinion.   

I do understand the backlash you can receive on the boards when mentioning being new and being 'under consideration' or 'training'.  A lot of submissives are used by dominants who just want to get into their pants and then they take off, and the submissive is left wondering what happened.  This doesn't sound to be your case, because in your subsequent posts you've indicated you have an ongoing relationship with your Dom and you have communicated about other issues.  I'd suggest talking about this one as well, just to clarify things in your mind.  You will be better able to serve him when you have a clearer picture. 

One more thing I'd suggest discussing with him - his definition of sub and slave.  That's another highly individualized topic which deserves a nice long chat so that he knows how you identify, and you know what it is that he desires.  Some doms don't wish to have a slave; others don't wish to have a sub, and of course, vice versa. 

Good luck!


(in reply to EagerToPleaseYou)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 3:43:29 PM   
RichardandV


Posts: 25
Joined: 5/7/2008
Status: offline 		Interestin thread, I think that everyone has their own belives on what a "training" collar means.  In our household a slave who first enters is given a training collar. Yes they have been accepted all ready and are not under consideration, they belong to the household.  The significate of the collar is letting everyone else know that they are still being trained and to act accordingly.  Its actually very good for the new slave as we travel to different events and a slave wearing a training collar is never approched asked a question or anything.

The only exception is from those who doesn't understand the signaficate of a white collar, thats why we never leave a new slave unattend during large events.

Respectfully,
V

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Can someone explain please? - 5/11/2008 3:46:45 PM   
CalifChick


Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline 		Gosh, you're saying now all these collars have certain colors associated with them??? 

Cali


_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to RichardandV)
Profile   Post #: 40
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