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ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Oh god, I know you didn't, rulemylife. All's cool :-) .

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ORIGINAL: rulemylife

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ORIGINAL: DomAviator

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ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Considering that its illegal to not have ID in the first place...

Huh?  Did this suddenly become Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union?  Even though Bush and Company have tried their best.  There is absolutely no legal requirement to carry ID anywhere in this country.  The only exceptions to that are when you are performing an activity that specifically requires you by law to do so. 

Yes an activity like failing to produce it on request when asked for it by a police officer. Texas Penal Code 38.02 to be exact "FAILURE TO IDENTIFY" LOL So yes there is no legal requirement to carry it - just to produce it, for any of a zillion things from being asked for it by a cop detaining you to driving to making a transaction in a pawn shop to opening a bank account to going into a bar etc etc etc...
[/quote 

This was from the Texas ACLU newsletter of last year.  If something changed since then I'll stand corrected, but I haven't heard about it.


Failure to Show ID.  HB 855byRep. Delisi, R-Temple, would have allowed officers to arrest a person solely for failure to produce identification during any lawful detention. This bill would have expanded police powers in a pedestrian or traffic stop dramatically and disproportionately impacted communities of color. The ACLU of Texas aggressively opposed the legislation and, after a lively debate in which civil liberties were invoked, the bill failed on a record vote on the floor of the House. 

Rulemylife, the only thing is  is that a Cop is not going to "take your word for it" as to your true identity.
They want to know who you are!
And, they can detain you until they find out.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to rulemylife)

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ORIGINAL: popeye1250

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ORIGINAL: rulemylife

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ORIGINAL: DomAviator

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ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Considering that its illegal to not have ID in the first place...

Huh?  Did this suddenly become Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union?  Even though Bush and Company have tried their best.  There is absolutely no legal requirement to carry ID anywhere in this country.  The only exceptions to that are when you are performing an activity that specifically requires you by law to do so. 

Yes an activity like failing to produce it on request when asked for it by a police officer. Texas Penal Code 38.02 to be exact "FAILURE TO IDENTIFY" LOL So yes there is no legal requirement to carry it - just to produce it, for any of a zillion things from being asked for it by a cop detaining you to driving to making a transaction in a pawn shop to opening a bank account to going into a bar etc etc etc...
[/quote 

This was from the Texas ACLU newsletter of last year.  If something changed since then I'll stand corrected, but I haven't heard about it.


Failure to Show ID.  HB 855byRep. Delisi, R-Temple, would have allowed officers to arrest a person solely for failure to produce identification during any lawful detention. This bill would have expanded police powers in a pedestrian or traffic stop dramatically and disproportionately impacted communities of color. The ACLU of Texas aggressively opposed the legislation and, after a lively debate in which civil liberties were invoked, the bill failed on a record vote on the floor of the House. 

Rulemylife, the only thing is  is that a Cop is not going to "take your word for it" as to your true identity.
They want to know who you are!
And, they can detain you until they find out.

No, they actually can't, and if I find the energy I'll try to document that for you but it all comes down to the Constitution and unreasonable search and seizure.  Yes, if they have grounds they can arrest you but they can't just come up to you on the street, demand ID and arrest you if you refuse to provide it.  Before you tell me that it does happen, I know it does, but it's not legal without them having some reason to do so and those cases never make it to court.

(in reply to popeye1250)

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ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

            OP...with all due respect i don't see how asking someone to present ID is a bad thing.  In any other country i've been, a person (adult) MUST carry ID at all times.  It's not about disenfranchisement, it's about security, a protection in case of emergency( picture a 15 car pileup...all the passengers without ID...a nightmare to contact families, get emergency treatment...etc) 
      

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  Kansas Governor vetoes republican effort to deny legitimate voters their due rights of enfranchisement. 

 
        What better way to prove if a person is legitimate?  It's not a test, or a pledge of any sort....it's basic identification proof. 

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ORIGINAL: DomAviator

Yeah OK you just try telling a southern cop, especially say Pasadena PD or Harris County Sherrifs office or better yet maybe the constable in Vidor Tx that you are who you say you are and he has to take your word for it because you have consititutional rights.... If you note the statute references punishments for answering falsely... How pray tell do you suppose that they will verify your answer? Hint, they wont shake the magic eight ball and ask it if your being truthful. You will either hand over your license or non driver ID on request so they can call it in, or you will sit in the Harris County Jail until your fingerprints come back from AFIS as clear - no wants no warrants. In the meantime - just for "being an asswipe" which is Southern cop for saying anything besides "sir, yes sir" you WILL pick up a disorderly conduct, verbal assault on a peace officer, terroristic threat, or other charge. The consitution is nice in theory, in the ACLU offices, and in front of the supreme court BUT on the streets its toilet paper. The constitution guarantees protection against "unreasonable search and seizure" a cop will FIND a reason - even if that reason is the violation of the public profanity law for saying "what the fuck are you doing" as he caves your face in with a billy club... In another thread I posted Houston Chronicle links to what REALLY goes on - remember the inmate who bled to death out of his asshole as 60 others begged the deputy to get medical help? The deputy who was "fired" as a jailer and then put out on the street as a patrol constable. Word of advice, if youre ever driving through here and want to live, keep your teeth in your head, keep your asshole tight, etc... Don't try to tell the cops what your rights are...  

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ORIGINAL: DomAviator

Yes an activity like failing to produce it on request when asked for it by a police officer. Texas Penal Code 38.02 to be exact "FAILURE TO IDENTIFY" LOL So yes there is no legal requirement to carry it - just to produce it, for any of a zillion things from being asked for it by a cop detaining you to driving to making a transaction in a pawn shop to opening a bank account to going into a bar etc etc etc...

quote:

  FAILURE TO IDENTIFY.
    (a)  A person commits an offense if he intentionally refuses to give his name, residence address, or date of birth to a peace officer who has lawfully arrested the person and requested the information.
    (b)  A person commits an offense if he intentionally gives a false or fictitious name, residence address, or date of birth to a peace officer who has:
            (1)  lawfully arrested the person;
            (2)  lawfully detained the person;  or
            (3)  requested the information from a person that the peace officer has good cause to believe is a witness to a criminal offense.

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ORIGINAL: DomAviator
Word of advice, if youre ever driving through here and want to live, keep your teeth in your head, keep your asshole tight, etc... Don't try to tell the cops what your rights are...  

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(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally refuses to give his name, residence address, or date of birth to a peace officer who has lawfully arrested the person and requested the information.

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ORIGINAL: DomAviator

Yeah OK you just try telling a southern cop, especially say Pasadena PD or Harris County Sherrifs office or better yet maybe the constable in Vidor Tx that you are who you say you are and he has to take your word for it because you have consititutional rights.... If you note the statute references punishments for answering falsely... How pray tell do you suppose that they will verify your answer? Hint, they wont shake the magic eight ball and ask it if your being truthful. You will either hand over your license or non driver ID on request so they can call it in, or you will sit in the Harris County Jail until your fingerprints come back from AFIS as clear - no wants no warrants. In the meantime - just for "being an asswipe" which is Southern cop for saying anything besides "sir, yes sir" you WILL pick up a disorderly conduct, verbal assault on a peace officer, terroristic threat, or other charge. The consitution is nice in theory, in the ACLU offices, and in front of the supreme court BUT on the streets its toilet paper. The constitution guarantees protection against "unreasonable search and seizure" a cop will FIND a reason - even if that reason is the violation of the public profanity law for saying "what the fuck are you doing" as he caves your face in with a billy club... In another thread I posted Houston Chronicle links to what REALLY goes on - remember the inmate who bled to death out of his asshole as 60 others begged the deputy to get medical help? The deputy who was "fired" as a jailer and then put out on the street as a patrol constable. Word of advice, if youre ever driving through here and want to live, keep your teeth in your head, keep your asshole tight, etc... Don't try to tell the cops what your rights are...  

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ORIGINAL: hizgeorgiapeach
And people WONDER why I own guns, know how to use them, routinely do target practice both at inanimate targets and live/moving targets (can we say Hunting? I knew we could!) - and have no qualms about carrying a concealed weapon.
 
And  before you point out that it's "illegal" to carry a concealed weapon - note the CONCEALED portion of that - which means no one else knows it's even There unless it is Necessary to Use it!  If they know it's there, it's No Longer Concealed!  Hell, I'm even Licenced by my state to carry a Concealed Weapon, which no doubt scares the livin snot outta some people.  (It shouldn't, unless they intend to attempt to do me bodily harm or rob me, but hey... respect and fear both gain you elbow room on the freeway!)  But that licence, which I feel I should not Need constitutionally, keeps me from getting harassed by overly enthusiastic "law enforcement officials" more times than not, as they go about the business of enforcing unconstitutional yet unchallenged laws that are on the books in every state of the US.  Did I have to show a "valid ID" when I applied for my Concealed Carry permit?  Yep, had to undergo a fingerprinting and extensive background check as well.  Shocked the heck outta several aquaintances when it came back absolutely clean and the state had no problems issuing me that permit!
 
Av, just because someone carries an ID doesn't mean that they're Legally obligated to do so.  Just because the cops will make up excuses to abuse their power, and it may be fact, doesn't make it RIGHT, and doesn't mean that any of us have to Like it or Agree with it or Sit Still for it. 

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Actually in Texas, ironically it is NOT illegal to carry a concealed weapon IN YOUR VEHICLE without a permit. (On your PERSON requires a permit, which I happen to have - in Texas as well as several other states that allow them for non-residents) But anyway in Texas, you can carry a concealed pistol in your car with no permit, you just cant take it out of the car and with you on your stroll across the parking lot unless you have a concealed carry permit

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ORIGINAL: Owner59

Well,driving`s a privilege and the cops own the roads.For that,you need a valid driver`s license.

That`s a different deal than requiring a state issued photo ID (to vote,exist,etc)

Being made to carry ID(under penalty of law) to live in America,isn`t law,......yet.

You`re only supposed to be pulled over if you`ve violated a traffic law or are wanted.

You`re not supposed to be stopped on an officer`s whim.

It`s not a police state,.....yet.

You`re supposed to be presumed innocent,for now.

In a police state,you`re required to carry ID by the state,under penalty of law.

We don`t have that here and we don`t want it here either..

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ORIGINAL: Irishknight

It's rare but we stand in total agreement.

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ORIGINAL: Owner59

Well,driving`s a privilege and the cops own the roads.For that,you need a valid driver`s license.

That`s a different deal than requiring a state issued photo ID (to vote,exist,etc)

Being made to carry ID(under penalty of law) to live in America,isn`t law,......yet.

You`re only supposed to be pulled over if you`ve violated a traffic law or are wanted.

You`re not supposed to be stopped on an officer`s whim.

It`s not a police state,.....yet.

You`re supposed to be presumed innocent,for now.

In a police state,you`re required to carry ID by the state,under penalty of law.

We don`t have that here and we don`t want it here either..