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RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/19/2004 8:05:29 PM   
wildpony


Posts: 15
Joined: 1/28/2004
Status: offline 		i'm number 7, and i would give anything to be number 8. not that anyone asked.

(in reply to kharah)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/22/2004 2:50:05 PM   
CoolScentDomme


Posts: 10
Joined: 3/18/2004
Status: offline 		Why subs and slaves have to be part of these 9 level things..every where I go on the net I see that.Ok so maybe for the 9 that made it up it was good.But not every one has to have one of these levels.Why do they have to be in a catagory? Oh well just My opinions..
MissCSD

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Some times ya just gotta say WTF...

a good sub ...is a bound and gagged sub

(in reply to kharah)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/22/2004 2:58:31 PM   
Estring


Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Because Cool. Just because.

(in reply to CoolScentDomme)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/22/2004 3:04:33 PM   
CoolScentDomme


Posts: 10
Joined: 3/18/2004
Status: offline 		LOL ok.....just My opinion

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Some times ya just gotta say WTF...

a good sub ...is a bound and gagged sub

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Profile   Post #: 24
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/22/2004 3:14:09 PM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CoolScentDomme

Why subs and slaves have to be part of these 9 level things..every where I go on the net I see that.Ok so maybe for the 9 that made it up it was good.But not every one has to have one of these levels.Why do they have to be in a catagory? Oh well just My opinions..
MissCSD


They don't in my opinion. I know I don't fit in there anywhere. I'm with my Dom 24/7. Anyway, if you had read through all the posts this same person also wrote the ten levels of submission...even she could'nt get it right. She had to add more to it.
Hehe.

(in reply to CoolScentDomme)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/22/2004 3:14:51 PM   
Estring


Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Lol. Just joking with you.

(in reply to CoolScentDomme)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 3/22/2004 3:20:39 PM   
CoolScentDomme


Posts: 10
Joined: 3/18/2004
Status: offline 		LOL I know Estring......

_____________________________

Some times ya just gotta say WTF...

a good sub ...is a bound and gagged sub

(in reply to Estring)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/26/2006 6:33:58 PM   
SirDaniel


Posts: 93
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: Las Vegas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kharah

Hey i figured some information is better then none at all and you can all feel free to add/subtract heck pull it apart .. maybe we can all get something out of this then.. Because to me posting something even if it has a lil value on the boards is better then not posting anything at all...:)

and thank you for your input..
hugs
kharah


Thank you for the orginial post. It gave myself and a slave I am speaking to some common ground to base a discussion on. To see where she classifiys herself. Good artical and IMHO well worth to have a round. Well all know that WIITWD is all done differently but, who re-invent the wheel. Use the one already there to help get you where you want to go.

Once again Thank You kharah.





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Sir Daniel
Las Vegas (Sin City), NV

http://members.cox.net/sirdaniel

quote:

Be true, honest, caring and loving,
and you will be found.
It is true, be you Master or slave.

(in reply to kharah)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: RE:Karah: the term SWITCH! - 10/26/2006 8:15:10 PM   
Celeste43


Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline 		This says that only sadists can be twue masters and that twue slaves get off on scrubbing the twue master's toilet.

Guess I don't belong anywhere. He doesn't get off on sadism and I am totally non service wired. Sigh! What is a wannabe to do?

(in reply to sub4hire)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: RE:Karah: the term SWITCH! - 10/26/2006 8:20:32 PM   
crouchingtigress


Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
Status: offline 		 poor celeste......not a number.....how on earth will she ever be counted?
 
 
*thinks*....maybe shes a 43 after all.....hmmm....

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Service slut, durable plaything, and ponypenquincatdogpig, to Lee Harrington

This is him

"Its none of my buisness what other people think of me."




(in reply to Celeste43)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: RE:Karah: the term SWITCH! - 10/26/2006 11:10:17 PM   
Arpig


Posts: 9930
Joined: 1/3/2006
From: Increasingly further from reality
Status: offline
quote:

Lol. As much as I like Dylan, I do sing better than he does. But I think most people could say the same thing.

Apparently I am not one of those who can say that truthfully

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CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran


(in reply to Estring)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/26/2006 11:24:26 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline 		I first read this piece about 8 or 9 years ago and thought to myself.. WTF?

Reading it again now, my opinion hasn't changed.

This thread died out over two years ago.. and with good reason.

(The other) Celeste

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"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to kharah)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/27/2006 12:03:24 AM   
MisPandora


Posts: 2911
Joined: 4/7/2004
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: inyouagain
If I were to offer a true criticism of the information, I would wonder why it was prepared by lesbians, as opposed to inclusion of other lifestyle viewpoints, whether male or female, in a more democratic fashion?


If you were aware of the history of women in leather (gay women, predominantly), the Lesbian SM Safety Manual, and the women's groups (Samois and LSM), were just breaking ground and entering the real public spotlight at that time.  Judy Tallwing McCarthy was just about to march with other leatherpeople on Washington and would later become the first International Ms Leather.  Women were behind their brothers in SM, and they were all dying off rather quickly.  The women were reaching for resources wherever they could find them, and where they couldn't, they created their own.

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Pandora
Ms World Leather 2004
Ms Philadelphia Leather 2004

"Simply put, if you want a real femdom to love you, give her reasons to love you." Gloria Brame

(in reply to inyouagain)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: 9 levels... - 10/27/2006 3:45:13 PM   
onlythewindknows


Posts: 259
Joined: 10/22/2006
Status: offline 		heh o dear i forgot about all that stuff - i remember reading it many years ago.  

kinda takes the fun out - makes it all seem more like taking the bar exam.

no seriously - it is interesting to have "levels" defined.

if we really want to get *wonky*, i think a better model would be a four-level scale of 1. how much someone only tolerates or actually enjoys pain (Pain vs. Comfort), 2. how much someone dislikes or likes serving Another (Servitude vs. Non-servitude), 3. how much someone prefers being Subject or object (Object vs. sUbject) and 4. how much someone does or does not feel that they need to be rewarded for all the above (Denial vs. Reward.) Kinda like the Keirsey temperment sorter.

So you would say something like: "I am a PNOR - i like pain but am not into Service though i like being objectified but i need to be rewarded." or "I am a CNUD - i don't like getting whipped and i don't like being Someone's servant and i especially don't like being told i am just a piece of meat but i DO LOVE having my orgasms denied to me."

That would be 16 categories.

Then you could also have a mild and strong version of each in which case you could have like a pNuD for mild pain/strongly against servitude/mildly needing to be in control /strongly into being denied rewards.

Then there would be (oh gosh) i think 256 categories.

OH i forgot "neutral" for each - add that in - you could have 625 categories!

isn't exponential growth fun?

could make it simple and break down to the essentials of taking, giving, being and getting.

- wonky windy

< Message edited by onlythewindknows -- 10/27/2006 4:21:11 PM >

(in reply to sub4hire)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/27/2006 4:18:28 PM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		The three levels of submission, the seven levels of submission, the nine levels of submission, the ten levels of submission (that was one I hadn't seen), the eleven levels of submission, the twelve levels of submission... they're all tacitly endorsing a hierarchy.  As soon as enough achieve the highest level, someone will invent a level higher to that they may continue to feel superior.
 
John

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"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

(in reply to kharah)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/27/2006 4:23:59 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kharah

Actually i would love to hear your thoughs and others as well and no i did not take it as any sort of attack.. It is just that at times people will ask me are you are a submissive or slave.. I may be wrong but i believe there are different types of submission and slavery as there definately are different levels of it.. So in a way i was posting this for myself as well.. for when i tell a person i am somewhere between sub and slave that is true, i just believe there are different levels of supplication. i also believe that there are different instances when one may behave more slave like. It is dependant upon many aspects, what is expected of the submissive, what is expected of the dominant. What roles are taken on and at what level? I also realise there are some that cannot or do not want to be in these roles 24/7.. Maybe it is just me there are many a time i have heard top/Dom and Master interchangable just as i have heard bottom/sub and slave.. so maybe it was just me trying to get others to think and in a way help myself along in my journey.. Once again thank you for your inputs and your thoughts.. :)

kharah


Hello A/all,

When I am asked whether I am a Dominant, a Master, a slave, or a submissive, I generally respond with "The name is Sinergy, and yours would be?"

Probably wouldnt get asked so much if I did not wear green name tags to events.

Sinergy



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David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to kharah)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/28/2006 2:40:00 AM   
Fitznicely


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/18/2006
Status: offline 		I find that list to be a good way to tell newbies and players apart from the enlightened minority. While it does serve as a point of conversation, it bears as much relevance to reality as a bicycling fish.

(Says he with a glowing "Newbie" badge next to his name. Tsk. Can't I go straight to "Deviant"?)


< Message edited by Fitznicely -- 10/28/2006 2:44:19 AM >

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I tell you this: No eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn
Proud Owner of Darkmoonkat. Such a good girl!

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/28/2006 5:49:05 AM   
windchymes


Posts: 9410
Joined: 4/18/2005
Status: offline 		Back on the Bob Dylan question......"Lay Lady Lay, Lay across my big brass bed" sounds pretty dominant to me

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You know it's going to be a GOOD blow job when she puts a Breathe Right strip on first.

Pick-up artists and garbage men should trade names.

(in reply to Fitznicely)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: 9 Levels of Submission - 10/28/2006 6:07:54 AM   
gypsygrl


Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline 		Ya know, I've been reading those lists for a couple years and I don't think I ever took the idea of "levels" to imply an evaluative hiearchy.  There's a logical hiearchy implied in putting together the list, its easier to understand something if you put some things first and discuss more complex things later, but that's not the same as implying the judgement that one level is superior to another.  I guess in my mind, I read the word "level" as being similar to the word "states," and because I'm familiar with people's objections to the idea of levels, I try to avoid using the word.

I can imagine a "wheel of submission" that avoids a list entirely and simply organizes the different categories around a core, or something like that.



(in reply to wildpony)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: RE:Karah: the term SWITCH! - 10/28/2006 10:46:00 AM   
ClassAct2006


Posts: 318
Joined: 4/12/2006
Status: offline 		I've seen it before. Always thought I may with a few tweaks be probably a version of 8.

(in reply to sub4hire)
Profile   Post #: 40
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