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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 6/1/2008 1:49:51 AM

Hippiekinkster

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quote:

ORIGINAL: hizgeorgiapeach

I'll have to see if I can't pull some of my old psych texts out of storage as well, Morrigan. There are conflicting theories as to when the personality is "set" so to speak. The theories that I remember best from my courses are those which held that the most crucial portions of personality were formed early on - some parts barely out of infancy - and that by determining certain environmental factors during those crucial years a person either would or wouldn't follow possible genetic predispositions. It is a theory which I agreed with for the most part. I simply - don't see it being The determining factor.

A friend of mine here has written a book about traumatic experiences within the womb. I really don't have anything to say about that since I have no experience or memories whatsoever. I don't discount the possibility, however.

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 6/1/2008 3:14:22 AM

mons

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ciedl1212

i had a head injure and my writing is bad i tried the spell check but i still see not well so i hope that ios the reason you can not understand ( we never know what can happen to us i never thought i would have this jniure ever but i do

mons

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 6/1/2008 3:31:22 AM

mons

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everyone thank all

i work more then 20 years with special needs childern and trust me some i still worry for they wanted to hurt and kill on child walk around and said he wanted to kill this on girl i hurt my back catching her as he push her off a 16 foot playground thing he would carry pencils sharper and he was only five . i am sorry for the man i spoke of bu tmore worry for the police men a hit to the head can do damage i have the thick glasses and i still can not write will . i call the police they tried to bully me into saying i saw something i do not lie and i was taught a liar is not to trusted . this is what i was taguht from young childhood they his sisters were so mad i was threaten and i do not fight so i called the police . they do not get it i do not know why he hit that policeman and what in the world was he thinking that is murder if he hit him in the right place . so i think his parent just did not let him go to the right classes in his fmaily there are four special needs kids no wait the mother is special the daughter and him and two childern what happen , i hate to think if that were my son but i taught him , lol he misses school and was stop but the poilce and they check him and felt him balls and penis lol he was so outrage and wanted me to call the police . i told him if you were in school they would had not touch you and he shut up. thank you all for all the imforamtion and i will read tha book missmrogan i am a very good reader lol speller oops no but reading i can do i still say a pray for him his paernts did not help him

thanks all of you brain folks .

mons and your help was so great night

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 6/1/2008 7:13:06 AM

hizgeorgiapeach

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OK I've got to say something directly in responce to this one, mons. I'm ringing the bullshit bell.

My oldest is a Special Needs child - birth defect related - and spent her entire life from age 13 months until age 19 in the public school system in special needs classes. I was around up at the school during many of those years on a regular and frequent basis, as a volunteer assistant. I was around Hundreds, perhaps Thousands, of special needs children during those years. I still attend the local Special Olympics as a spectator (despite hating sports) on a regular basis; I was constantly up at the hospital with her for various checkups and medical procedures, in clinics that only dealt with special needs children.

What you're describing isn't something that I saw in any of them. They were almost without exception sweet natured and considered everyone they met to be a friend. There were a few along the years that had behavioral problems as well as other special needs, but they were very definately in the minority rather than the majority. And the problems they were born with are NOT related to being a "born criminal" by any stretch of the imagination. You seem to have confused the concept of Born Criminality with a Lack of Discipline in Those with Special Needs.

You said in the original post something about this kid's parents not Allowing him to be placed into spec.needs classes. News Flash - it's not a decision made Strictly BY the parents. Nor is a decision to mainstream or partially mainstream made strictly by the parents or strictly by the schools. It's done during a cooperative process refered to as IEP - Individiual Educational Program - wherein the Parents, Teachers, and Administration all meet and go over the child's medical and educational records Together once a year, and come up with a Cooperative plan on how that child's needs will best be met. How do I know this all so very Very well? Reread my first sentence in this post - my oldest daughter IS special needs, so I sat through MANY an IEP meeting. If you work with special needs children - or had done so any time in the past 15 years in the US - you'd know this. Because IEPs are a Federal Mandate for those who have been medically diagnosed as having/being special needs. Mainstreaming - either partial or complete, based on the abilities of the child in question - is Also part of that federal mandate. The ONLY way I know of - from having dealt specifically With This System for Years - for the boy in the original post to have been Strictly mainstreamed is if he was already well older than childhood when the regulations were put into place or was't medically diagnosed as being special needs.. He'd have to definately be physically an Adult at this point - over 21 - for that to be the case. And another FYI - strictly behavioral problems from things like lack of discpline or poor upbringing are not classified as Special Needs.

(edited to clarify a couple of statements, and for spelling.)

< Message edited by hizgeorgiapeach -- 6/1/2008 7:17:10 AM >

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 6/1/2008 4:32:53 PM

Ozzfan1317

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomAviator

I personally dont believe in the idea of a "born criminal"... Actually, thats a pretty dangerous notion that led to the eugenics programs of the 40's and 50's etc... I think criminal behavior is learned, not born. I feel environmental factors and upbringing pose a much greater role than being "bad stock"... Now with his being special needs there may be a whole other area at play in that if he has no understanding of right and wrong, and hence cannot comprehend the criminality of his conduct he is not a "criminal" even if he kills his mother and eats her... Criminality requires a guilty mind... If hes special needs he may lack capacity and is just simply insane.

I agree I dont think anyone is born a criminal they either become violent because of Mental imbalances that are not properly cared for or becuase of being subjected to Violence and poverty and desperation as a child and eventually even as a young adult.

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 6/2/2008 7:31:03 PM

Alumbrado

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Just came across this....hmmmmm...

quote:

Today, Daytona's crime rate is more than double Florida's and the nation's, having jumped 13 percent in 2006 alone, according to the most recent figures available.
But what especially unsettles law enforcement here is that juveniles -- some as young as 7 -- are being arrested for a larger share of the city's felonies.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/2008/jun/02/spike-in-number-of-child-felons-rattles-fla-city/

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 1:57:49 AM

mons

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hello

your letter had so many right answers and yes many of the special needs childern are not like the two i spoke of i had childern so sweet and kind but i must tell you there were and still are the ones who are emotional distress and the one child i spoke of at five he is born killer there was no reason for him to act this way he just wanted to kill and he was so cute i love him all of the kids i love but there were some who was dangerous once my twin came to visit our classroom and do you know one child push her to make her fall and he laugh but i woudl not ever be anger at this weet boy. but when you have the spieal op they would nto ever bring out a dangerous child never . when he push her off of that play thing i ran likr never before to catch her she would ha dboke he neck and she would whimper she could talk well . i know how you feel these kids are so special and sweet ., but there are one in 900 i would say how have some major anger problem even at 5 and mom never took drugs . i am sl glad you work with the kids i hit my head and can not see well enough to work i miss my job so much take care and you daughter wonderful this was not towad anyone child mons

domavitor yes they are born pulling rocks in thier mouths oh yes i was beaten up by a 7 year old 20 years of watching i seen it all the parents are normal and kind and they love theeir kids but you not right read up on this subject then come back and tell me what you learn and i am saying this in respect it is somethng i seen my sister work for outreach a service car for the little ones i took care of now they are youg teen and young adult and oh she would come and tell me the sad things it hard to understand unless you work with them it is yes a crimal born not every child just one in 900
mons

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 6:19:56 AM

Aneirin

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Everyone is born, so is born with the potential to be a criminal, but the definition of criminality is all dependent on the constructs of the time. As with time and the experience of people, what defines criminality changes.

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 6:46:21 AM

Irishknight

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Yeah....had I been born 800 years ago, I would be ransacking towns, enslaving the people and having my way with the women. Today, I would have to be elected to office to get away with those things.

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 7:12:59 AM

DarkSteven

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There are some who are born with birth defects, one being an XYY chromosome match, that makes them predisposed towards violence. I would argue that any medical condition that causes an excess of testosterone would tend towards criminality.

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 7:19:38 AM

Irishknight

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or being extra horny

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 7:27:07 AM

Aneirin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

There are some who are born with birth defects, one being an XYY chromosome match, that makes them predisposed towards violence. I would argue that any medical condition that causes an excess of testosterone would tend towards criminality.

Here we go, there are people trying to find out if certain people are predisposed to criminality from birth. My question is, once such information has been found out, what is one to do with it, breed it out or just as it seems with our day, genetically alter the defect out, what you have to ask then, is what is next, what defect in society is the next for the chop. If this isn't modern day eugenics, what is it, and what is it's purpose ?

The only way to deter crime is to have an effective law system that serves to deter by it's very threat of implementation. Everyone in life needs laws of governance, a line in the sand to work to.

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RE: is it possible to be born a criminal? - 10/13/2008 7:53:19 AM

DomKen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

There are some who are born with birth defects, one being an XYY chromosome match, that makes them predisposed towards violence. I would argue that any medical condition that causes an excess of testosterone would tend towards criminality.

Here we go, there are people trying to find out if certain people are predisposed to criminality from birth. My question is, once such information has been found out, what is one to do with it, breed it out or just as it seems with our day, genetically alter the defect out, what you have to ask then, is what is next, what defect in society is the next for the chop. If this isn't modern day eugenics, what is it, and what is it's purpose ?

The only way to deter crime is to have an effective law system that serves to deter by it's very threat of implementation. Everyone in life needs laws of governance, a line in the sand to work to.

A person with XYY has trisomy. Trisomy of a different chromosome is the cause of Down's Syndrome. Treating that condition is not eugenics and attempting to help those with XYY is not eugenics either.

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