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fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 8:10:48 AM

Seph

Posts: 15
Joined: 6/3/2008
Status: offline

I'm in love with an amazing woman who is submissive. We had an online relationship for a year on the premise that it would stay there. It quickly became apparent it was not enough. She has had some very bad personal experiences and has repeatedly displayed a flight response. She has spent some bitter years alone but thus "safe". I don't want to give up on her, simply put I love her too much to just walk away from my commitment to her. Recently we had a breakthrough during which she confirmed she loved me and wished to be with me, this was after voicing fear that she may not be able to reach out. Only 36 hours later to have her hide from me and voice (not to me) she was 'afraid" of me and asked her friends to not speak to me.
She is clearly afraid of what her future holds and her potential vulnerability for future emotional loss and failure. She has asked for time alone to think and she will talk when ready. The back and forth has happened repeatedly in our relationship.

I know it sounds pompous, but I truly believe she needs a loving caring person in her life and she could be truly be happy. How to help her feel safe and ready to try is my conundrum. At the moment I am leaving her be, but am sick at heart. Advice?

Post #: 1

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 9:19:19 AM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

Don't invest time in someone who's phobic about meeting in real life. There are a lot of such people online -- both male and female -- and they are a bigger timesink than the wankers.

How many times could you have kissed (held, spanked, walked in the park with) a real-life woman during the last twelve months?

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 2

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 9:28:14 AM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

I've had women go cold feet on me as well. One reason I don't do long distance. If I can't meet in at least a few months for a date-then I just give up and leave them in thier fantasy worlds.

It's a thing that has worked well for me.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 3

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 9:45:32 AM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

In the bizarre-but-not-really-bizzare coincidence department:

I took a date to a friend's wedding earlier this week. She and I were talking on the phone last night, and she told me the only two decent men she has met on CollarMe are Leatherist and me. If you insist that reality is more important than fantasy, it puts you in an awfully exclusive club.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 4

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 9:55:21 AM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

I wouldn't personally waste time with people who can not maintain their forward moving progress and wiffle waffled on weather they wanted to be with me.

(in reply to RedMagic1)

Post #: 5

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 10:12:02 AM

chamberqueen

Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline

I respectfully disagree with the other comments. If you feel that both she and her love for you are real, let her know that you have patience and understanding. Tell her that she has every right to some time to herself; that you will remain patient, that your feelings for her are strong, and that you understand that it can be a frightening thing to move things to a real time level. Let her know that you respect her boundaries but at the same time care enough for her to want to help her to grow. Remind her that part of your job as her Dom is to guide and protect her and set a time limit for her. For instance, you might say that you think that one week from the date of that email is enough time to think about it, and if you haven't heard from her by then you will need to assume that she really does not want the relationship. Remind her that she has chosen the role of being submissive, and that you will be patient but that it isn't fair to you - either as a Dom or a man - for her to make you feel like a plaything. Mix kindness with firmness.

_____________________________

(in reply to YourhandMyAss)

Post #: 6

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 10:32:47 AM

BRNaughtyAngel

Posts: 1821
Status: offline

There are people who are so consumed by their fears, insecurities and/or bitterness that nothing will ever bring them out from behind that computer screen.

If she is that consumed by fear, she may need professional help in dealing with those fears, and being able to move on with her life.

She has to want to live, and living means that she will experience pain and sorrow to go along with all of the good stuff.

How long will you wait for her? Weeks? Months? Years?

Being emotionally vested in someone, even if you haven't met in real life, makes it difficult to just walk away.

And in the mean time, do you stop living while waiting for her?

Best of luck to you!

(in reply to chamberqueen)

Post #: 7

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 11:18:11 AM

gypsygrl

Posts: 1471
Joined: 10/8/2005
From: new york state
Status: offline

There's probably not a whole lot you can do about the situation from behind the computer screen. A year's a long time, and if she is still afraid, I can't imagine that any more time/patience/getting to know each other is going to help.

While she may not be intending any harm, she's playing with you and so long as you tolerate it, she'll keep playing. I generally expect a meet within a couple of weeks, logistics allowing. If people are that worried about having a cup of coffee, its likely we'll be incompatible in other ways. Its just not that big of a deal. If a meet doesn't look likely within a couple of weeks, I tend to lose interest. Chatting on line is nice, but its nicer with someone you actually know.

_____________________________

“To be happy is to be able to become aware of oneself without fright.” ~Walter Benjamin

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 8

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 1:22:26 PM

Maya2001

Posts: 1656
Joined: 8/22/2007
From: Woodstock ONT,CANADA
Status: offline

I like Chamberqueens idea regarding kindness with firmness...but would add arrange the meet as friends and equals not as Dominant and sub.. you would go to where she lives, rent a motel and meet her at a restaurant or coffeeshop...no strings attached ..if she wants to go to a movie or someother venue at the end of the first meet it is up to her to let you know..make the vist nothing more than dates ending with no more than a kiss or hug with no pressure to play or have sex ..just to get to know each other in person ....if even that scares her...then what she needs is therapy or she never intended to take it into real time...are you positive she is not possibly married and filling her lonely bored times online... I hate to say but I have heard of women that do this sort of thing., often their marriages are lacking in the romance and instead they get it online

_____________________________

Lead me not into temptation - I can find the way myself

(in reply to gypsygrl)

Post #: 9

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 5:17:31 PM

Seph

Posts: 15
Joined: 6/3/2008
Status: offline

Thank you all. I suppose it is time to put a limit on how long I will wait for her. I just feel I am giving up on someone very special. At times she has voiced great joy at my forgiveness and love then runs again. This last time has been very hard.

(in reply to Maya2001)

Post #: 10

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 5:32:09 PM

camille65

Posts: 5746
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Austin Texas
Status: offline

If you are okay with waiting then stay the course you are on. But if you were totally okay with her block in meeting I don't think you would have come here asking about it.

You have invested a lot of time with her and really only you know if you want to continue in the hopes of coaxing her out from behind her computer.

How do you feel about what is essentially keeping your own life on hiatus while you try and fix hers? It would be awesome if you could indeed teach her to be courageous and perhaps even build something wonderful with her.
Do you feel that progress is being made?

I guess what I'm saying is that it is all about how much you want to put into what you have, and is what you currently have going to be good enough if she won't go further?

It took him a very long time to convince me that I could reach out for him but I am so very grateful that he didn't give up. He saw something in me and persisted in the face of my fears and uncertainty so I do know it can work between people. He wanted a future with me and worked until I realized that I could have a future with him.

_____________________________

~Love your life! (It is the only one you'll get).

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 11

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 5:52:15 PM

califsue

Posts: 593
Joined: 2/2/2008
Status: offline

I originally met my Master in 2006. We played one time and he wanted more and I put a stop to it as I knew he wanted more and felt I could not give him that. He was okay about it but he wanted to remain friends. We live about 70 miles from each other. For the most part, he would forward joke emails and on ocassion I would write to him. Finally, in Sept 2007 I wrote to him thanking him for his kindness and friendship. Since I have elderly parents he always said I could talk with him about that even just as a friend. Well lo and behold he wrote back. We went to lunch just to talk and it was all very vanilla. After that for about every six to eight weeks we would meet and play. In February 2008 he wrote and asked me if I was ready to take it up another level. I answered honestly saying I was scared and yes I knew there could be more and maybe. The next month and half we did not have much contact due to my part because I was still playing with others. In April 2008 I sent him a message wishing him well and telling him that I hoped he found the sub/slave of his dreams. He wrote back stating yes he had, stated her name and location and asked if I was still interested. The answer was YES...of course. He wanted an exclusive relationship which has not been easy for me as playing for me was fun without having to share myself and allowed the blocks to remain in place around my heart. The blocks have come down, he has been very patient with me but also started coming and seeing me every week, and what a wonderful journey it has been and it is just beginning. It has been difficult for me due to the ending of a 20 yr on/off nilla relationship and the way that ended in 2004. One of the reasons when I first met him, that I was not in a place to give him more and why even now it has been challenging for me to open up and take down the bricks. However, it was time to stop the other person from having control of my life. And by sharing all of me with Master it has freed me and allowed me to trust again and Master makes me feel safe/secure and loved.

I don't know if the woman is playing you or not but sometimes taking a break and allowing the person to be and some space may be all that is needed to bring her back to you. Personally for me a timeframe would not have worked. I wish you well on whatever course of action you decide to take.

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 12

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 6:48:08 PM

Seph

Posts: 15
Joined: 6/3/2008
Status: offline

I don't believe she is playing me. But she has terrible fears about loss, failure and rejection. I am willing to give her as long as she needs if she makes progress, but just as she seems to breakthrough she panics and flees. This last time I thought we had finally broken past her fear with a statement of desire to be mine. Then 36 hours later she retreated into full flight. She has asked in rather harsh terms to have time to think. I feel that the medium of text only has proven more harmful than beneficial. On one occasion i simply said I am coming for a visit and she completely blew out. It has been a series of slow reconstructions. Call me a fool, but i feel that if she could only breakthrough enough for a calm, polite and social meeting many of her fears would resolve. I also wonder if she realizes this herself and so fears the meeting because she would lose herself in me. Consent is very important to her as it is to me. My life is on hold for her and i am willing to do what is necessary to help her blossom, but I also admit I am no pied piper. Im just a guy with a dominant nature who is in love.

(in reply to califsue)

Post #: 13

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 6:50:47 PM

Seph

Posts: 15
Joined: 6/3/2008
Status: offline

Timeframe is a problem for me. I fear that if I limit her she will simply walk. On the other hand by nature I am a decisive person. I see a real potential for us for something very good, but how do I "know" if she will never be able to "reach out" as she calls it.

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 14

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 6:52:21 PM

angelslave77

Posts: 478
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline

I dont want to be harsh or negative but how do you know for certain she isnt married/invested in another relationship and just stringing you along for the sake of her own ego.
I hope i am wrong but for the sake of your own life move out from behind the keyboard and if she wont come with you then so be it, that would to me anyway indicate a huge incompatiblity.

Anyway op good luck to you i hope it all works out and that she is all that you hoped for

(in reply to califsue)

Post #: 15

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 6:57:05 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Seph
My life is on hold for her

That's the problem. You can be her friend, help her blossom, and still meet other people. You have more options than just (1) staying on hold, or (2) cutting all ties.

She probably isn't your ForeverOne. You can remain friends with her, while courting other women. Or maybe you're the kind of person who can't do that, in which case, yeah, (1) and (2) are your only options. Hopefully you're bigger than that, though.

Don't turn this into a choice of either abandoning her or abandoning yourself.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 16

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 7:06:06 PM

Seph

Posts: 15
Joined: 6/3/2008
Status: offline

How can one in my position ever "know"? She has not hidden the name of her ex or where he lives from me. We interact verbally, textually and telephonically. On one occasion I had to observe an unfortunate interaction with her ex while live online. I, in fact, am the one who is married. I was honest about this from the beginning and also about my impending dissolution.

Is she the one...I hoped so, to be honest. Can I stay good friends? Doubtful, my heart is pretty much totally invested.

(in reply to RedMagic1)

Post #: 17

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 7:07:56 PM

TheBanshee

Posts: 403
Joined: 7/19/2007
Status: offline

Just a thought - you both began a relationship online that was not intended to become real life. Expectations have been set, and no one has a bad hair day or bad breath online.

What I'm saying is, you've been sharing a really wonderful and beautiful relationship that is a mutual fantasy. She may be freaking out about meeting real time because she's afraid of ruining the dream? Maybe she is a little more insecure about herself and she doesn't know if she can be her "online" self in real life? Maybe she's experimented with things online with you that is nice in theory but freaks her out if she really thinks that might now happen?

You might want to try to reassure her that there is no pressure to "do" anything when you first meet. You are really starting a new level in the relationship and that has to begin at the beginning. Good luck!

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 18

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 7:14:20 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Seph
Can I stay good friends? Doubtful, my heart is pretty much totally invested.

I would say that was an error. To invest "totally" in someone who has been repeatedly unable or unwilling to give you something you have stated you need is a good way to create an explosion. And here you are, halfway to kaboom.

I don't have anything else for you, I am sorry. However, if you get yourself into a situation like this a second time, I reserve the right to call you a doofus.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to Seph)

Post #: 19

RE: fear in moving from O/L to R/L - 7/5/2008 7:14:25 PM

Seph

Posts: 15
Joined: 6/3/2008
Status: offline

Banshee, you are correct. She has self esteem issues. She sometimes feels she does not deserve me and also has insecurities about her body. It was a tidy little fantasy world. But she opened up enough to me to share the realities which in no way diminish her attractiveness for me or my love. Perhaps I need to be more assuring that there is NO pressure to do anything. at one point she wished to meet and I balked because i did not wish to meet-use and then send her away alone. I could not do that to her, she felt it as rejection. Such a tangled web when you have only a 2 dimensional means of communication.

(in reply to TheBanshee)

Post #: 20

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