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Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 7:58:28 AM

TwoDommeDivas

Posts: 36
Joined: 7/7/2008
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Hi, we're new. :)

Last night we met with a male sub from CM, who says he wants to play with us with an eye toward seeing if we are compatable for his full-time submission to us. Good so far. And he's cute, and he is smart, and everything he says sounds good. But! He tells us he's divorced and has a roommate. But all the evidence is that he's married. That concerns us on two levels: (1) he's married, and we don't want to interfere with another relationship, and we don't need the trouble, and that makes him less available to us; and (2) he lied to us.

Should either of those things matter? One of us is more concerned with the lying, the other is more concerned with his relationship. Do we have any responsibility not to fuck up his marriage? What if he has children?

Additionally, a lie by omission perhaps, he failed to reveal to us that he's this lifelong devoted Christian who has written a well-reviewed book based on a "lifetime" of biblical research. That's a pretty big thing to omit from all discussions, it seems to me, and a pretty big part of who he is to conceal from us.

So, questions for your opinions:

Should his marital status matter?

Should his lying matter?

Should the book thing matter?

And if so, what should we do about it?

The answers might seem obvious, but we have heard arguments that none of that stuff is our business. We have a play date for Saturday night. We're going back and forth between just calling it off and being done with him, and leaving it on with a little surprise for him, because of his deception, that might make him think twice before pulling this shit again and wasting the time of others and dragging innocent dommes into a potential marital problem.

What say you?

Post #: 1

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:03:16 AM

NeedingMore220

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Well, I'd set aside any plans for a comeuppance for him because he's married for two reasons (1) you don't have proof of such, and (2) it's not your business to punish him for future people. If it bothers you that he lied, then by all means call him on it and see how he responds. But any little 'surprise' just sounds wrong to me.

As to whether marital status should matter to you ... that's up to you.

As for whether he wrote a book about Bible study and his being a Christian ... I don't see a problem with it. He may have thought, perhaps based on past reactions, that it might be off-putting.

You're not entering into a relationship with him - you're getting to know him and have a playdate with him. I'm not sure that entitles you to full disclosure about his life. You do deserve to know if he's married if you have an issue with that.

(in reply to TwoDommeDivas)

Post #: 2

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:04:01 AM

sub4hire

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I think it should matter if the fact he is married breaks your own moral code. Clearly he doesn't care one way or another.

So, its up to you.

For me, yes it would be against my morals. Though I am not you.

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Post #: 3

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:07:10 AM

Leatherist

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I tend not to allow immoral people into my life.

They are trouble.

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Post #: 4

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:12:46 AM

masterforRT

Posts: 176
Joined: 5/16/2008
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I think that lying is worse then being married. Lots of people here (including me) are married. Like NM above said, you're going to be playing with him, not entering into a lifetime relationship.

However, many here may be looking for somethng deeper then a fling-and they should decide for themselves whether someone being married is a deal breaker for them.

That said, I have discovered that Collarme is one place where being honest about you're being married (and other things too) is sometimes held against you-but that's an entire new topic in itself!

< Message edited by masterforRT -- 7/10/2008 8:13:35 AM >

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Post #: 5

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:12:57 AM

Lucylastic

Posts: 40310
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I would have to ask about the evidence and how strong it is before going into anything else, then ask further.... then take it from there. I would want proof of singularity /divorce status. Suspiscion is not enough for me, I would dig deeper.
Lucy

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RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:13:13 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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His being married or not (or having written a book in his chosen spiritual path or not) wouldn't matter to my colleague or myself -except that- if he is actually lying, I want nothing to do with a liar.

My colleage and I entered into a similar relationship some years ago. The gentleman in question -assured us- that he was divorced, but said that he stayed at his family's (wife's) house for the 'sake of the children'... he reassured us that he was definitely not married any more, and could be fully dedicated to us... then, after a truly heinous call from his wife, where she accused us of 'destroying' her marriage, we found out that they had divorced 2 years prior... and re-married several months before! If he'd just -told- us he was married, we would have been fine with that... but he had to go and make up tales, -and- in the process, we discovered that he was also lying to his wife, which was another HUGE strike against him.

Lies of ommission are still lies. I won't tell someone else what to do, but I know that -we- wouldn't be able to continue if we had any doubts... and I wouldn't waste valuable play time on 'teaching him a lesson', only because I doubt that it would be effective.

Calla Firestorm

< Message edited by CallaFirestormBW -- 7/10/2008 8:15:39 AM >

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Post #: 7

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:16:22 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

Additionally, a lie by omission perhaps, he failed to reveal to us that he's this lifelong devoted Christian who has written a well-reviewed book based on a "lifetime" of biblical research. That's a pretty big thing to omit from all discussions, it seems to me, and a pretty big part of who he is to conceal from us.

So, questions for your opinions:

Should his marital status matter?
Should his lying matter?
Should the book thing matter?
And if so, what should we do about it?

Have fun!

However, have an appreciation that associating with liars and hypocrites tends to have those references applied not only to the perpetrator but those around him/her.

Others you reference making an argument that "stuff" is none of your business are correct; until you enable him to act upon serving him and his fantasy. Then it is not only your "business" but it is you.

Like I said - have fun!

< Message edited by Mercnbeth -- 7/10/2008 8:18:52 AM >

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Post #: 8

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:17:15 AM

sassysexygirl

Posts: 213
Joined: 8/23/2007
Status: offline

greetings :) here are my thoughts and opinions, for what they are worth.

You asked "Should his marital status matter?" ~~ if the spouse has no clue, then absolutely. i'll play with married folks if the SO (significant other) knows about it. if they don't, the one i'm with is cheating on and lying to the SO. if he will lie and cheat with the SO, he'll lie and cheat with me. don't need that in my life.

You asked, "Should his lying matter?" ~~ ummm, i'm sorry, but what about lying is ok ever????? if you're doing something you have to lie about, you shouldn't be doing it. how can you trust him when he tells you anything???? includng "don't worry, if you hurt me i won't tell the cops and have you arrested." i know, seems like an exaggeration, and maybe it is, but it's a valid point.

You asked, "Should the book thing matter?" to me? not so much. i don't have to tell anyone that kind of personal stuff at the beginning. if the relationship is going to move forward, however, somewhere down the road i have to tell all.

You know, anything that bothers you is your business. married? most definitely your business. lying, more than most definitely your business. his writing a book? *shrugs* only if it's important to you.

remember, only my opinions. and good luck.

well wishes,
gemmie

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Post #: 9

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:25:52 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

What evidence is there to suggest he is lying? Have you asked him outright?
Being married and his partner knowing is not cheating. Marriage is only an issue if you feel that he cannot make or keep to a commitment with you because he has to tend to his wife first.
Lying would be a different issue and for me, unacceptable.
His religious status is not relevant unless you are bigoted.

If he has written a book and is out there, it would be pretty easy to trace him and check marital status.
I would suggest that it is your business if he has already involved you - but that is about as far as it goes once you have found out. You haven;t become involved with the guy, so really it just comes down to you telling him he is a liar and lost his chance if it doesn't fit well with your ethics.
I am not really into tit for tat retaliation, not very mature and is equal to the lying.

the.dark.

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Post #: 10

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:26:40 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

First off, welcome. I hope you enjoy your time here.

The questions that you raise are good ones. My opinion on your post isn't going to be the most popular one. Please understand from the beginning that My comments come from My particular view. It stems from being a married person who has collared a married submissive.

That being said, I am probably one of the harshest on the forums for any married person doing something behind the spouses back. The marital status does matter, if for nothing else than the question of how honest can a person be about it. No matter what the state of the actual marriage is, that's an important thing in someone's life. It has an impact. How many people do you know who have said, "oh, I was married, but it had no impression on life"?

Due to the fact that I do not know you, or him, I can not say if you have a responsibility not to damage his marriage. I can only tell you how I see My own situation. For Me, yes, I have a responsibility there. I know that My sub's marriage to his wife is for his greater good. That means in My responsibility to him, I have a responsibility to it. There is a lot tied up in that. Probably too much for a message board.

As to outright lying/omissions of the truth, I can tell you that I've dismissed a sub on the basis of lying about his living situation. The fact that it was a lie that never needed to be told made Me even more sure in the courage of My convictions. If any person, sub or Dom, will lie about things unnecessary, what will happen when it is important and they are taken to the mat? Don't kid yourself about this one. I think you know yourself better than that.

The book writing? Well, I see that as another thing as a major part of a person's life. The topic doesn't have much to do with it. More the fact that it was a serious time investment to someone. If you want to know a person, shouldn't the things they have invested themselves in matter? No, it might not come up in the first conversation, but if it's something that was years in the making, the subject should come up.

If I have not expressed Myself well here, please, feel free to contact Me on the other side. My best of luck to you.

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Post #: 11

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:36:24 AM

thetammyjo

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I think you need to talk to him more and express your concerns with him.

For me personally the first lie he's caught in is the last cause I won't see him after that.

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RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:36:42 AM

TwoDommeDivas

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Joined: 7/7/2008
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Thanks, so far. To answer the question, yes, we have asked him outright if he is married, several times, giving him every chance in the world to come clean on his own.

And it's not the book, per se, that's my problem. It's that he is concealing what is obviously a huge and important part of his life, a thing that makes him who he is. And that matters to our approach to play, and to whether or not he is someone we would want to collar, among other things.

I'm pissed that he has wasted our time and deceived us, and he also has something of ours that I want returned.

Who knows, maybe he'll see this thread and take the opportunity to come clean.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 13

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:42:31 AM

YourhandMyAss

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From: Sacramento
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You obviously didn't see where they said with an eye for it becoming a full time submission position, did you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedingMore220

You're not entering into a relationship with him - you're getting to know him and have a playdate with him. I'm not sure that entitles you to full disclosure about his life. You do deserve to know if he's married if you have an issue with that.

(in reply to NeedingMore220)

Post #: 14

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:49:05 AM

angelikaJ

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Joined: 6/22/2007
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It is possible that he is married and lied to you AND it is possible he is telling the truth...in which case your lack of belief is a betrayal of trust as well...
bottom line there is a breach of trust.

As for the book, perhaps he does not like to brag or be pigeonholed...

if I were him, I would take a pass.

(in reply to TwoDommeDivas)

Post #: 15

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:51:33 AM

accipitres

Posts: 70
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I don't do married becasue they don't have enough time to devote to me; I want a full time relationship, not leftovers. But the "I don't want to interfer with his relationship"? Nah. His relationship is in trouble already, and it is not my problem

You don't KNOW that he is lying. You are assuming that he is. To get bent out of shape over an assumption is a waste of time.

Not telling you about his book? He hardly knows you. Getting outted would ruin his reputatyion. I don't tell strangers what I do

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Post #: 16

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 8:54:19 AM

NeedingMore220

Posts: 615
Joined: 6/5/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

You obviously didn't see where they said with an eye for it becoming a full time submission position, did you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedingMore220

You're not entering into a relationship with him - you're getting to know him and have a playdate with him. I'm not sure that entitles you to full disclosure about his life. You do deserve to know if he's married if you have an issue with that.

Nope, I must have missed that. My bad!

(in reply to YourhandMyAss)

Post #: 17

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 9:03:24 AM

Lucylastic

Posts: 40310
Status: offline

I will suggest again to find out how reliable your "evidence" is, and if its good , show him it and watch and listen to his response. My bdsm partner still doesnt know everything about me, and Ive known him ten years, hell even my hubby doesnt know everything and weve been married 23 years.......so not mentioning something work/ hobby related , isnt lying, even by omission, it takes time to get thru layers...

good luck
Lucy

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Post #: 18

RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 9:06:10 AM

defiantbadgirl

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OP could you be more specific on the evidence that points to him being married? Do you know for a fact that he's married? What proof do you have? Here's an easy way to find out for sure. Meet him in a public place. If he wants to play, insist on going to his place. Then see if there is any women's clothing in his bedroom closet, wedding pictures on the walls, etc. It's pretty easy to tell a bachelor pad from a home with a female occupant. Good luck.

< Message edited by defiantbadgirl -- 7/10/2008 9:12:09 AM >

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RE: Should marital status matter? - 7/10/2008 9:29:12 AM

Anoush

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If he makes you uncomfortable in any way, don't have anything further to do with him (duh). As for "teaching him a lesson" -- why do you feel you should do so? Doesn't he have the right to seek his adventures on his own terms, and deal with any resulting fallout for himself? Keep in mind that unless you *do* take him on as a submissive, you're not the boss of him.

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Post #: 20

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