RE: What makes a great warrior?

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: What makes a great warrior?

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: What makes a great warrior?

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 next > >>

Login

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/3/2008 7:14:11 AM

hardbodysub

Posts: 1654
Joined: 8/7/2005
Status: offline

I thought I had my answer, but after reading many of the other posts, I realize I need to rethink this a little. A lot of people have made very insightful comments. Here are some of my thoughts, generated in part by the previous excellent replies:

- Winning isn't a prerequisite. Although a great warrior will probably win a lot, at least when facing reasonable odds, it's possible to be a great warrior and never win a war, or even a battle. Greatness can be defined by one's fight against seemingly insurmountable odds.

- Morality isn't an absolute prerequisite. A great warrior can fight on the side of either good or evil. Often it's hard to say which side is which.

- This may seem to contradict my prior comment, but I feel that there is a moral line (perhaps blurry) which one cannot cross and still be considered a great warrior. Call it honor, humanity, whatever. Brutal and compassionless methods are employed to win wars, but some methods, even though effective, make one a war criminal rather than a great warrior. I'm referring to things like slaughter and rape of innocents. On the other hand, some very terrible methods might be appropriate at times. For example, the indiscriminate use of biological weapons doesn't seem very honorable, and doesn't define greatness in a warrior, but if it's the only way to prevent imminent destruction, wouldn't a great warrior use them? Maybe the crux of the matter does have something to do with the motive, and not just the methods.

(in reply to MissIsis)

Post #: 21

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/3/2008 10:41:07 PM

hlen5

Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
Status: offline

I think one must win to be a great warrior. One doesn't need to win to be a HERO. Heroism is to be admired regardless of the outcome.
Concerning awful methods - There is huge school of thought that dropping the atom bomb in Japan saved many lives. Casualties on both sides would have been massive. In Japan the civilian population as a whole would have suffered even more immense losses. Only an overwhelming show of force enabled Hirohito to surrender.

(in reply to hardbodysub)

Post #: 22

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/3/2008 11:06:00 PM

heartcream

Posts: 3044
Joined: 5/9/2007
From: Psychoalphadiscobetabioaquadoloop
Status: offline

This thread is cool, thanks MissIsis.

That guys profile comes off unreadable, like he is basically insane and he feels like someone to stay well away from, that is me though.

I feel the kind of warrior I admire is born out of consciousness seeking to bring attention/help to where there is none or not enough.

_____________________________

"Exaggerate the essential, leave the obvious vague." Vincent Van Gogh

I'd Rather Be With You

Every single line means something.
Jean-Michel Basquiat

(in reply to hlen5)

Post #: 23

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/3/2008 11:11:38 PM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hlen5

I think one must win to be a great warrior. One doesn't need to win to be a HERO. Heroism is to be admired regardless of the outcome.
Concerning awful methods - There is huge school of thought that dropping the atom bomb in Japan saved many lives. Casualties on both sides would have been massive. In Japan the civilian population as a whole would have suffered even more immense losses. Only an overwhelming show of force enabled Hirohito to surrender.

I found dropping it to be very evil-but they killed 100,000 in tokyo with fire bombing,and they still would not give in. I guess they needed to stare into the face of total annhihilation to be able to save enough face to give in,in the end.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to hlen5)

Post #: 24

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/4/2008 1:35:02 AM

Prinsexx

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

My question is this: I understand about being a great warrior. I don't quite understand how a warrior can be so great if he goes to other people's lands & conquers them, & steals their land, & steals or destroys someone elses property.

Thoughts anyone?

Well i don't understand why someone would go abroad and try to scne with someone elses's slave? whilst professing t own poperty here but then i'm having a bad day.

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to MissIsis)

Post #: 25

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/4/2008 9:39:53 AM

hardbodysub

Posts: 1654
Joined: 8/7/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hlen5

I think one must win to be a great warrior. One doesn't need to win to be a HERO. Heroism is to be admired regardless of the outcome.
Concerning awful methods - There is huge school of thought that dropping the atom bomb in Japan saved many lives. Casualties on both sides would have been massive. In Japan the civilian population as a whole would have suffered even more immense losses. Only an overwhelming show of force enabled Hirohito to surrender.

We'll have to agree to disagree on the winning issue. I'd say that the 300 Spartans and their commander were not only heros, but great warriors to persevere for so long against insurmountable odds. The Persians overran them in the end, but that doesn't change a thing in my mind. You can't really say they won the battle, since they were all killed, can you? But they delayed the enemy long enough to allow their allies to rally the defense behind them.

I considered Hiroshima and Nagasaki while writing my post, and I agree with what you wrote about that. But does any of that make "great warriors" out of the people who dropped the bomb, or ordered it to be dropped? Not in my opinion. I'm not saying anything negative about them, just can't give the title "great warrior" to them. To me, simply using an overwhelming weapon that you happen to have doesn't qualify.

(in reply to hlen5)

Post #: 26

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/6/2008 12:42:15 PM

hlen5

Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
Status: offline

I see your point re the Spartans and am willing to concede that. When I was talking about warriors needing to win to be great, I was thinking that they at least have to be seasoned and had to have won at some point. You can't call someone who has fought and NEVER won a great warrior (think about that poor schmuck in the movie Gladiator that buys it from a swinging mace as they enter the arena). Also, I wasn't trying to imply I thought dropping the bomb was "great". It was pragmatic and necessary, I think. I was talking about the awful methods you mentioned.
Like you, I think intent is key. Knowing Japan was willing to fight conventionally to the last citizen, the bomb was a horrible necessity. I see that poles apart from gassing an internal faction of your own countrymen who are considered political rivals a la Hussein gassing the Kurds.

(in reply to hardbodysub)

Post #: 27

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/6/2008 1:29:44 PM

MasterHermes

Posts: 136
Joined: 5/23/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

Part of it read, "My father taught me to become a great warrior and the King of my people. We would conquer our enemies on their own land. On lands far away across treacherous seas. We would pillage and plunder. And take their women back to our land and make them our slaves. We would have our way with them on beds made of furs from wild animal hides next to our fires."

My question is this: I understand about being a great warrior. I don't quite understand how a warrior can be so great if he goes to other people's lands & conquers them, & steals their land, & steals or destroys someone elses property. Where is the honor in forcing women to become slaves, and in forcing them to have sex with their captors?

Isn't it much more honorable & worthy of the title of warrior, if he protects what is his, & the innocent? Isn't it much more honorable if he gets the woman to go to his bed willingly, rather than forcibly? Aren't these the traits of a warrior?

If not, what are the traits of a great warrior?

Thoughts anyone?

You should re-read it with the mindset of historical tribe warriors , if you can. You can find the hints in the text: beds made of furs from wild animal hides next to our fires.

While not all tribes were living in hostality, some sure did live as warrior tribes. The text you posted here comes from the fictional imagery of these cultures.

Hermes

(in reply to MissIsis)

Post #: 28

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/6/2008 5:44:05 PM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

I supose it is to be expected that most replies thus far are based on the society in which the wrtiters live and grew up in. Mostly anglosaxon derived societies with a strong judeochristian background (USA, UK etc). However, as it has been alluded to. many great warriors were either barbarian or bloody minded people whose civilizations of their time fought war after war. After all a warrior is one who fights a war of one kind ot another and in the purest sence they wouyld fight hand to hand where their greatness was detrermined by the amount of kills, land, property (booty and slaves/prisoners taken. In this so called enlightened age we could of course look at the armed forces and (being biased) especially my beloved Spec Forces. How do we rate them as warriors? By their deeds on for field of combat and instead of rewarding them houses and property as well as gold we give them medals which the general non military population too often forget and don't care about. (In my circle of friends, some have indeed been awarded their country's highent decoration for bravery and steadfast courage under fire). In our recent history many brave, couragious, peace loving and gentle men and women who on the fields of conflict have been veritable lions and proven excelent leaders of troops have been treated like outcasts by their own people upon returning home. There is no one definition of a great warrior for each such person will be seen differently by history and be different readers. However I would suggest that Bodicia, Marc Antony, Hannable, Gengus Khan, Ghandi as well as many civil rights peacefull warriors and others of whom history has recorded would fill the role as Great Warriors. Just remember that not every warrior fights a bloody battle but fights to change social orders for justice and many loose their lives in such battles.

IB
(The incorrigible, irrepressible and irreverent Bear)

< Message edited by IronBear -- 8/6/2008 5:47:42 PM >

(in reply to Lashra)

Post #: 29

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/6/2008 6:13:51 PM

MasterHermes

Posts: 136
Joined: 5/23/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

My question is this: I understand about being a great warrior. I don't quite understand how a warrior can be so great if he goes to other people's lands & conquers them, & steals their land, & steals or destroys someone elses property.

Thoughts anyone?

Well i don't understand why someone would go abroad and try to scne with someone elses's slave? whilst professing t own poperty here but then i'm having a bad day.

Because vinegar outside tastes sweeter than honey at home

So they say :)

Hermes

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 30

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/7/2008 10:51:31 AM

hlen5

Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
Status: offline

IronBear,

Could you give your deifinition of what are the defining characteristics of a great warrior?

(in reply to MasterHermes)

Post #: 31

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 10:15:21 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

A greart warrior is first of all a person dedicated to their cause, has courage to make hard decisions even though it may be at great personal cost, will stand the line of whart they believe and if needs be die for it. Winning is not important but making a statement is. (jamanese history is filled with heroic acts in which the "hero" dies for something they believed in. Ghandi was always prepared to die for his beliefs and such courage and dedication will more likely to attract followers who can try to win the day. Leadership is another aspoect of a great warrior. Some gemerals or leaders prefer to lead from the rear in relitive safety but I was taught and prefered to lead from the front (first off a chopper and last on). On a military view, in many of the spec forces and other elite military organizations such as the USMC develop leadership and other abilities which are required in a warrior. The difference between a well trained good warrior and a great warrior is the melding of heart and brain (in my opinion). As far as great non violent warriors goes I look with awe at Mohandas Karamchand (Mahatma) Gandhi (2 October 1869 – 30 January 1948) and Martin Luther King, Jr. (January 15, 1929 – April 4, 1968), both of these men I see as the ultimate peacefull non violent warriors Still this just my view in responce to a question as to what I look for in a Great Warrior.. I never consider myself as a Great anything but I believe I was an adequate warriuor and leadxer to be able to gather some excelent warriors, both male and female, about me to form my merc company and my bodyguard team based in the Middle East. hat we satyed together for many years and a number live not far from me now, says something about them as good professionals, perhaps even great ones.

IB
(The incorrigible, irrepressible and irreverent Bear)

(in reply to hlen5)

Post #: 32

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 10:25:01 AM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
Status: offline

In this ol' masters humble opinion the key to becoming a great warrior is knowing your and others limitations,Knowing when to live to fight another day..Many give the Norsemen or Vikings as an example,This I take exception to,they were Vandals who over whelmed with sheer forces killing every thing they came accross,..I will get flack from this but the noble warriors that followed Mohammad many years ago and the great plains native american warriors were the best ever.. my prime example as great warriors..

_____________________________

US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 33

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 10:35:00 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

I have to disagree with you mate regarding the Norsemen. Admittedly I am biased in as much as I am half Celt and half Norse. There are some fine examples in the written nhistoiry of the Norsemen, especially in their settling of parts of the UK showing some fine Great Warriors. However I agree with the rest of your post especially regarding the Plains Indians. I regard my blood brother who is Lakota as a good example of both a Great warrior and a bloody good Master Sgt.

IB
(The incorrigible, irrepressible and irreverent Bear)

(in reply to BOUNTYHUNTER)

Post #: 34

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 10:43:15 AM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
Status: offline

I have served my country well over a 25 year period in every little jungle fart and in the sand,I have froze, starved and yes bleed in several of them and like you I consider my self a good solider based on good training not a great warrior but a good one and yes the Norsemen did make some cultural inroads in Europe..

_____________________________

US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 35

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 10:46:03 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

Tosses Bountyhunter a can of iced Fosters and raises one in salute to a comrade

IB
(The incorrigible, irrepressible and irreverent Bear)

(in reply to BOUNTYHUNTER)

Post #: 36

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 11:10:24 AM

chaos9071

Posts: 38
Joined: 5/8/2006
Status: offline

I can say that Sun Tzu said it best. The best way to wage war is to not fight at all. That being said can't we move on to talking about something more sexual... War isn't a particularly fun thing, moreover it is even less fun to talk about.

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 37

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 12:17:30 PM

hlen5

Posts: 5890
Joined: 3/2/2008
Status: offline

Then perhaps you could be someone's private dancer on another thread?

(in reply to chaos9071)

Post #: 38

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 1:00:09 PM

cmatrix4761

Posts: 73
Joined: 6/28/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

Ok, I admit, I do occasionally read the parts of people profiles that come up on the home page of this site. Today, I came across one that told a story. I hope the person doesn't mind me copying & pasting a part of it. I actually enjoyed most of it. It was creative & told a little about the person.

Part of it read, "My father taught me to become a great warrior and the King of my people. We would conquer our enemies on their own land. On lands far away across treacherous seas. We would pillage and plunder. And take their women back to our land and make them our slaves. We would have our way with them on beds made of furs from wild animal hides next to our fires."

My question is this: I understand about being a great warrior. I don't quite understand how a warrior can be so great if he goes to other people's lands & conquers them, & steals their land, & steals or destroys someone elses property. Where is the honor in forcing women to become slaves, and in forcing them to have sex with their captors?

Isn't it much more honorable & worthy of the title of warrior, if he protects what is his, & the innocent? Isn't it much more honorable if he gets the woman to go to his bed willingly, rather than forcibly? Aren't these the traits of a warrior?

If not, what are the traits of a great warrior?

Thoughts anyone?

The concept of the warrior varies by culture; vikings, for instance, saw a warrior as a man of physical strength (thus their brute nature), while Shaolin philosophy sees a warrior as a man willing to put himself at great risk to protect someone who can't protect himself (thus the Shaolin Warrior Oath). I think the point I'm trying to make is that 'warrior' is a contextual term, like 'recession' -- it doesn't hold any real meaning without context.

_____________________________

-- CM, "Nosce te ipsum."

(in reply to MissIsis)

Post #: 39

RE: What makes a great warrior? - 8/8/2008 1:46:17 PM

GentlemanAxel

Posts: 5
Joined: 3/2/2005
Status: offline

I'd say that a lot of folks have covered the highlights of what makes a warrior. Courage (both physical and moral), skill (presumably in the martial arts*), dedication (to accomplishing the short term and long term goals they assign or have been assigned), discipline (physical, mental, emotional), strength (again, physical, mental, and emotional, as well as strength of character), and intelligence (the ability to determine when to act, when not to act, and what action needs to be taken to acheive victory).

*"Martial arts" in this context would not be restricted simply to unarmed hand-to-hand fighting, but training in melee weapons from knives to two-handed weapons such as zweihander swords and halberds, ranged weapons from chucking rocks to bows to pistols to rifles to artillery pieces, tactical and strategic theory, logistics, survival training, and protocol both military and civilian.

I think one quality has been brushed upon, but perhaps not precisely defined. The quality of service. The concept of a warrior as a servant. Somebody who labors tirelessly and at great expense (physical, mental, emotional, even financial or political in some situations), not for their personal ambitions, but for something greater than themselves. Country, God, honor, even a principle. A warrior doesn't fight for the hell of it (though they may derive a certain satisfaction that their skills are superior or employed more effectively than their opponent's), nor for the big paycheck (though the money is a nice bonus), but for "the cause." The big thing that means everything to them, more important than money, more important than power, more important than life itself. At the end of the day, when the battle is over and the troops are heading back for some well earned sack time, a warrior should be able to say to themselves that they served their cause well. The cause doesn't have to be great in the grand scheme of things. A person running their own business, one they've dreamed about for years and have sacrificed damned near everything to get started, has a great cause: keeping the doors open another day. Profit would be nice, but break even is acceptable if it means that they get another day to produce the product they believe in or perform the services they provide with distinction. I know this may seem to have drifted more towards a business angle, but as the Japanese say, "Business is war." A warrior must be a leader, a genuine leader, not just some empty uniform/armor/suit sitting in an office somewhere writing memos and making pronouncements, but somebody who's out there with his people, working with them, fighting with them, sweating and bleeding and laughing and crying with them. Not because it will make him happy. Not because it will score "points" with his people. Because it serves the cause.

A few books for those who would be warriors:
Sun Tzu - The Art of War
Plato - The Republic
Aristotle - Nicomachean Ethics
Miyamoto Musashi - The Book of Five Rings
Carl von Clausewitz - On War
Niccolo Machiavelli - The Prince, The Art of War

(in reply to cmatrix4761)

Post #: 40

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 next > >>

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: What makes a great warrior?

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.094