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Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 9:24:29 PM   
candystripper


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I've been aware of lawyer hatred all my adult life, and have always shrugged it off, even had my own collection of lawyer jokes, etc.  However, as a stray thought, I do wonder what incites such hatred in people.  In an era in which we are being raped by pharm companies, HMOs, oil speculators, and many other evil doers, lawyer hatred remains rampant.
 
Maybe people don't seem to appreciate the full scope of what it is lawyers do...but without them there would be no criminal justice system, no family court system (broken as that is), no juvenile court system...I could go on.  No one to probate your estate....no one to establish a guardianship for your dependent...no one to defend you if you were charged with a crime...
 
It is fun to poke at the profession I guess, and Lord knows it has its bad apples and excesses, but the purpose of the profession as a whole is to deliver order and justice to society and its members....is there any alternative?
 
candystripper
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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 9:32:25 PM   
Alumbrado


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quote:

Maybe people don't seem to appreciate the full scope of what it is lawyers do...but without them there would be no criminal justice system, no family court system (broken as that is), no juvenile court system...I could go on.  No one to probate your estate....no one to establish a guardianship for your dependent...no one to defend you if you were charged with a crime...



Do you know where the profession came from?

< Message edited by Alumbrado -- 8/11/2008 9:33:47 PM >

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 9:37:36 PM   
candystripper


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Is that a trick question?
 
candystripper

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 9:59:03 PM   
Demspotis


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I suppose the problem is things like the lawyers who work for all those "evil doers" you mention and many others, and help them get away with hurting people and society; and others of the "ambulance chaser" variety. I think that they are who people really dislike, but they stereotype the entire profession, paint them all with the same brush. A tar brush, in particular. But as in the OP, the reality is that there are many other lawyers who do great and good things. For example, I know a number of civil rights lawyers who are at the forefront of fighting religious discrimination by governments in the US, as well as by employers; those particular lawyers are some of the best humans of any sort that I know or have heard of. Then there are lawyers who contribute their services free for good causes or for people unable to afford paid legal help. On the other end of the spectrum, in the course of jury selections, I've seen defense lawyers try to use the most despicable tactics, and that's just in jury selection. Anyway, I say: Let's blame evil-doers for doing evil, and not blame innocent members of their professions, whatever they may be.


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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 10:23:30 PM   
TheUtopian


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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

I've been aware of lawyer hatred all my adult life, and have always shrugged it off, even had my own collection of lawyer jokes, etc.  However, as a stray thought, I do wonder what incites such hatred in people.  In an era in which we are being raped by pharm companies, HMOs, oil speculators, and many other evil doers, lawyer hatred remains rampant.
 
Maybe people don't seem to appreciate the full scope of what it is lawyers do...but without them there would be no criminal justice system, no family court system (broken as that is), no juvenile court system...I could go on.  No one to probate your estate....no one to establish a guardianship for your dependent...no one to defend you if you were charged with a crime...
 
It is fun to poke at the profession I guess, and Lord knows it has its bad apples and excesses, but the purpose of the profession as a whole is to deliver order and justice to society and its members....is there any alternative?
 
candystripper



I came to the conclusion many moons ago that those who demagogue lawyers and cast them as scapegoats for the ills of society, are truly the ignorant…..

Now those who have set up and control ''Usury'' - We’re talking a whole different ballgame….




- R





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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 11:07:19 PM   
candystripper


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Funny you should mention usury....there is an ad campaign going here in Ohio by payroll lenders to defeat a piece of legislation that would curtail their activities.  Without having done the necessary research I would predict what has happened is some lawyer successfully sued to get his client out from under a really onerous agreement and won, then won again on appeal.  This spurred the legislature to action, and now the industry is fighting back.
 
IMO, the lenders who target the desperate and poor who have such bad credit they can't even get a bank account are truely evil; it's like the lottery.  They KNEW when they passed that legislation that many poor people would begin to gamble for the first time and they also KNEW they would take a dollar from education's general revenues for every dollar kicked in by the lottery...yet they passed it anyway.  A voluntary, regressive tax on the poor.
 
There are now and always have been lawyers with great skill who've dedicated their professional lives to advancing the interests of those society tends to forget or marginalize...they are self-sacrificing and add greatly to our society.
 
candystripper

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 11:11:29 PM   
popeye1250


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Ninety nine percent of lawyers give the other one percent a bad name.

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 11:20:52 PM   
TheUtopian


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quote:

 
IMO, the lenders who target the desperate and poor who have such bad credit they can't even get a bank account are truely evil; it's like the lottery.  They KNEW when they passed that legislation that many poor people would begin to gamble for the first time and they also KNEW they would take a dollar from education's general revenues for every dollar kicked in by the lottery...yet they passed it anyway.  A voluntary, regressive tax on the poor.



Very well stated.....And just a side note - '' Payday Lenders '' have all but been eradicated here in Oregon. A true pox on society....




- R


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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 11:27:01 PM   
candystripper


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I really don't think that's true Popeye.  I think part of what happens is that 99% of people come into close contact with a lawyer only during times of great stress and loss....mainly through the experience of divorce.  While I will grant you that some family lawyers are vile creatures, it is also true that people getting divorced are sometimes not at their best and insist on litigating stupid shit, then later are shocked that they've driven their lawyer fees through the roof or lost a ridiculous motion they tend to forget they were advised to abandon in the first place.
 
The other thing that I think that feeds lawyer hatred is lawyer advertising, which was just being approved by the Bar Association in Ohio as I was graduating.  You never see advertisements by civil rights attorneys, criminal lawyers who take death row cases for free, public defenders, prosecutors, etc.  All you do see is the benighted plantiffs' bar, constantly at you to sue, sue, sue....leaving the public with the impression that all lawyers want is money regardless of what they have to do to get it.
 
Do you remember the crash of the airplane in Florida Everglades some years ago?  Lawyers were on the ground trying to solicit families for suits against the airlines faster than anyone imagined possible...lawyers from all over the country...all completely unnecessary as the airline involved was more than willing to treat the families with great dignity and compensate them very fairly for their losses.  It was one of the only times I know of that the Florida Bar actually took action and sanctioned the lawyers involved for solicitation.
 
Perhaps, like some other professions I could think of, we'd do better if, instead of Bar Associations, we had civilian review boards to impose sanctions on lawyers....but still in all...I think most lawyers are well meaning, hard working, fair minded people.  It is, at its most distilled, a 'helping profession' after all...one does not bring suit without at least a token client.
 
candystripper

< Message edited by candystripper -- 8/11/2008 11:29:15 PM >

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 11:35:01 PM   
Honsoku


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1: Because no one ever wants to need a lawyer.

2: The effective ones tend to exemplify personality traits that people hate. The most effective ones are nitpicking, anal-retentive, argumentative, stubborn, weaselly buggers.

3: The ones that get the most attention get it for all the wrong reasons. I don't know of many (if any) lawyers who are famous for their work in law, just infamous.

4: They are horrendously expensive.

5: They profit off the misfortune of others.

< Message edited by Honsoku -- 8/11/2008 11:39:08 PM >

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/11/2008 11:41:40 PM   
CalifChick


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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper
but the purpose of the profession as a whole is to deliver order and justice to society and its members...


That may be a stated purpose, but not so much in practice.  Now if their purpose had any passing resemblance to "proving the truth", they wouldn't be so maligned.


Cali


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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 12:13:50 AM   
candystripper


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Honsoku

1: Because no one ever wants to need a lawyer.

My family and friends have had free access to my services since I first graduated, though some have foregone the offer.  Many have been delighted to tell some annoying person that unless the were made whole rather quickly they'd get their lawyer involved.  It can be empowering to feel that among your arsenal of problem-solving techniques, you have free and high quality legal services at your disposal, at all times. When I sent my UM away to college, my friend who lived in the city she was moving to gave her his card, with all his numbers on it and permission to call any of them 24/7....I knew she'd never, ever be left by the side of the road facing police wihout that card in her wallet. 
 
I agree...no one wishes to be in distress...but most of realise that our lives or the lives of those we love may be at some point.  It is a source of comfort to know someone will fight for you, if ever you need it.

2: The effective ones tend to exemplify personality traits that people hate. The most effective ones are nitpicking, anal-retentive, argumentative, stubborn, weaselly buggers.

I was highly effective, and so were my friends.  Some are highly successful, opening their own firms or rising to great heights within an organization.  It is a myth that a bad personality will aid a lawyer in succeeding....getting along with people is actually quite necessary.

3: The ones that get the most attention get it for all the wrong reasons. I don't know of many (if any) lawyers who are famous for their work in law, just infamous.

What about Morris Dees, founder of the Southern Povery Law Center?
 
Clarence Darrow, defender of the teacher who dared teach evolution in the 1920's?
 
But in the main you are right...television has made stars of lawyers who represent defendants like O. J. Simpson.  It is very hard not to demonize the lawyer who successfully defends such a repugnant and obviously guilty man.

4: They are horrendously expensive.

I never charged more than $75 an hour to make myself more accessible to the general public.  A great deal of my work was done for free...and what was done on salary was very poorly compensated if you factor in the 70 to 80 hour weeks I actually worked.  Most bar associations require lawyers to either work a certain number of hours free of charge or else contribute funds towards the Legal Aid Society.  Addiitionally, client funds in all states I'm familiar with must be kept in special accounts in which any interest paid is sent to the Bar Association for funding the Legal Aid Society.
 
Show me another profession with a similiar requirement.
 
The fact is, most people are unfamilar with legal matters and are taken aback at the price of legal services.....but the market is fierce and costs are commensurate with what a lawyer can 'command' by dint of his proficiency and reputation. 
 
It is no more ridiculous to pay a lawyer $150 an hour than it is to pay $150 for a visit to the family MD or dentist.

5: They profit off the misfortune of others.

Not neessarialy.  Many lawyers have what are known as 'office practices' and never make court appearances.  They draw up wills, provide tax planning advice, rearrange assets to protect an elderly person from having to 'spend down' all their assets before becoming eligible for Medicaid, etc.  In short, they enhance a client's security and well-being.
 
As for those who do litigate....they are not the CAUSE of the misfortune...and traumatic as it may be to be arrested...it would certainly be much more traumatic to be imprisioned because you were unable to obtain legal counsel.

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 12:51:13 AM   
NeedToUseYou


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Politicians if you haven't noticed are disproportionately lawyers(that's enough right there to distrust lawyers).

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 12:54:38 AM   
DomDolf


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Lawyers...

There are great and there are horrible. This is true in almost any occupation. Not many professions are involved in such emotionally charged situations as those that require the advice or representation of an attorney. I am not impressed by any chosen occupation that requires you to stretch or bend the truth or find loop holes for personal or professional gain. There are attorneys that are in positions of more acceptable areas of representation and their efforts must be recognized.

Dolf



< Message edited by DomDolf -- 8/12/2008 12:56:11 AM >

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 12:55:01 AM   
candystripper


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Many MDs are also scientists, public health workers, policy wanks......your argument that the training one receives in law school renders one undesirable is specious.
 
candystripper

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 1:20:59 AM   
meatcleaver


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Lawyers are parasites. Charles Dickens illustrates this quite often in his books, much of which is still relevent today.

As someone pointed out, most politicians are lawyers and there is no greater group of self serving people on this planet, they throw a bright light over all the other self serving professionals in the law profession.

I have to admit, that every time I've come into contact with the law profession, my already low opinion of them invariably gets lower.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 8/12/2008 1:22:26 AM >


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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 1:26:17 AM   
NeedToUseYou


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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

Many MDs are also scientists, public health workers, policy wanks......your argument that the training one receives in law school renders one undesirable is specious.
 
candystripper


Of course that would depend on what the definition of is is.

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 1:46:08 AM   
seeksfemslave


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Why are lawyers disliked ? Well one reason in the UK is the ridiculous fees they charge for mundane work.Things like probate, deed transfer of property, power of attorney.
Strictly speaking this work is done by soliciters in the UK. Everybody despises them. Its not yet illegal.
Rob ya they do. lol

< Message edited by seeksfemslave -- 8/12/2008 1:48:27 AM >

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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 2:08:23 AM   
Vendaval


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Mayhem, chaos and anarchy? 


quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper
....is there any alternative?
 
candystripper


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RE: Lawyer Hatred - 8/12/2008 2:34:28 AM   
lusciouslips19


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Lawyers are some of the finest people I know. Caring about social injustice and actually doing something about it.

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