RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern.

RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (Full Version)

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LaTigresse -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:02:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus I love LeeAnn. That is all. Ahem. You told me on my cock thread that you loved me. I see how you are now. No cheeseballs for you this weekend!!! (apologies to you LaT...but I just couldn't let that one slip by) Well I love you both. And I know Erin, I just wanted to keep my thoughts more generic rather than allow myself to get into a snarky passive aggresive mode. Quite simply because it would be counter productive to what I was trying to get across, not to mention make a HUGE hypocrite out of me. I go there enough and am trying to behave myself.

mistoferin -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:11:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse Regardless of M or s, D or s, most people want to be looked up to in some way, at some point in life. For their knowledge and abilities, along with many other qualities. I just get frustrated when I see a D or M type person that begins to demand it, especially of a s type person and most especially of a younger s type. Someone said sense of entitlement. In some cases though it reaches a level that looks a lot more like delusions of grandeur. I'm not sure why there are some who think that because they identify as an M or a D that it will be a given that all of the s's....whether they be younger or not....will bow before them. As a side note to LadyH: Whoever would have thought that it would be so easy for me to get a Domme to shake her boobies at me? Behold the power of cheese!!![:D]

mistoferin -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:14:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse And I know Erin, I just wanted to keep my thoughts more generic rather than allow myself to get into a snarky passive aggresive mode. I totally got where you were coming from and I didn't mean to contribute to any specificity (is that a word???). I really do believe that your message is one that can benefit many....IF they can hear you.

IvyMorgan -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:19:21 AM)
I used to get a lot of memos on the other side from 21-25 year old "Lord Uber Dom Masterly One of Pain and Fear" stating all about their 4-8 years experience on the scene, and informing me that "that was a lot, yanno" and so I should respect em. I have a "young tawttish dom" filter that anyone under 29, or with the LUDMOoPaF type name or proclaiming their experience as if it were spectacular, or all of the above, has to work hard to get through. I've found mentioning that I've been practicing BDSM, particularly the SM part for coming up to 20 odd years now, gets them to shut up and run away. I get a weird pleasure from seeing this happen. Which is probably wrong. Do I want respect for those years? Only in so far as it happened, I got through it, and I think you respect most people who went through something like that. Do you respect my amazing kinky ways becuase of it? Hell no. Respect my amazing kinky ways cos you find a good reason to, be that you like my baking, think I look stunning in a hogtie, or wonder how I can twirl two crops in either hand/both hands at the same time, or something else.

MasterHermes -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:24:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse Something has been bugging me. All the time we see the age card played, and then we see the "years in the lifestyle" card played, and one would think that the two together would created a magnificent dominant/master/mistress. Someone that had some small measure of respect due them. Kinda like the whole, career military service, line of thinking. However, human nature being what it is, and me being the avid observer of human nature, I've come to the conclusion that is it certainly no guarantee. At least not from where I sit. A more serious answer: When being a great domminat becomes a social thing, instead of personal, people want to prove themselves in the society they are in. Many people use these forums as a social medium. Not for just exchanging ideas, reading, writing, learning but having a position, being admired, respected. So when the image they have in mind about themselves depends on social approval , it is only normal for them to try maintaining it with the methods LaTigresse described. I think you can find it in any community and not just online. "I am senior, I have been here for a long time, I have learned from this or that," etc.. Maybe it comes from greed, maybe comes from loneliness. But no matter what the source is, its not suprissing. Once people stays out of this cast system and from the ones whom trying to establish it for the benefit of their ego, their effort become meaningless. Be well Hermes

sublizzie -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:31:19 AM)
~FR~ There is something amusing about a Dominant or Master/Mistress who whines about how long they've been in the lifestyle, how many groups they've started, how good they are at (pick your favorite implement). It's amusing but not respect producing. An occasion bad day with a slip into whinyness is one thing. When it becomes strident it's obnoxious. It happens on-line and it happens in real-life. Either way I lose any respect I have for that person when I see it.

velvetears -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:40:51 AM)
What people admire and resepct is subjective and reflects on their personal values. Many people admire actors and actresses, i don't, i admire people who work hard to make a difference in this world - animal activists, environmentalists, researchers, scientists, teachers, artists (i suppose actors can be in this category). There is respecting a person and there is respecting their abilities. i can respect a person's ability to create beautiful pottery and the time it took them to learn it, their creativity and skill but have little respect for the person if they are a jerk. Flip said as well. i can have respect for a person even if i percieve them to have no skills at all, simply because they are wonderful and uplifting to be around.

thetammyjo -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:48:54 AM)
Maybe it's just me... but the OP suggests otherwise. If someone has to say "give me respect" or "call me by this title" or anything else, it generally makes me think they aren't able to simply get that by being themselves. Perhaps they aren't patient enough to wait for others to respect or feel they have earned a title? It is sort like the person who has to repeatedly say "I'm X religious group" -- I have to wonder who they are trying to convince more... me, themselves, the Divine?

KnightofMists -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 9:52:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse All the time we see the age card played, and then we see the "years in the lifestyle" card played, and one would think that the two together would created a magnificent dominant/master/mistress. Someone that had some small measure of respect due them. Kinda like the whole, career military service, line of thinking. However, human nature being what it is, and me being the avid observer of human nature, I've come to the conclusion that is it certainly no guarantee. At least not from where I sit. Nods.... we do see that alot... and is some cases... respect is given to those that happen to have age and experience going for them... however... I think if one goes alittle deeper.. we will find that age and experience is actually irrelevant to the respect that is given. I think there is some other variables in the equation that have more weight to the end result. quote: Now, some of you well sit there and think "Well DUHHHHH, you dense broad!! You just NOW figured that out?!?!?" Well no, I am a pessimestic bitch and never assume anyone is worthy of respect. What I am talking about is the overall collective persepction that if someone says "I am 55 years old, I've been swinging a paddle/crop/whatever for 35 years and had a dozen slaves. I am a great and skilled Master/Mistress, so I am OWED respect!!" ...there is a certain perceived validity in the first part of that statement so we (collectively) tend to agree with the respect part. (even if it annoys some of us pessimistic bitches....) mmmmmm it's been my experience that those that don't seek it... seem to find it more than those that do. quote: But here's the thing, when I see or hear someone say, in some way, to a general population that they are "owed" something I tend to get my back up a bit. I am reminding of a tagline that, I think, MissTress has. (forgive me I am sure I am going to mutilate it) "If they have to tell you they are a lady, chances are they are not." And I love that, because it really is pretty accurate. I agree with this. quote: So, when I hear someone toot their own horn by saying "I am a Great Master/Mistress!!!" I kinda think,"yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhh riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight....." And if I see/hear someone getting their ass up because they are not getting respect and they "deserve" it because of their age or experience, I have to wonder why they are not getting it and do they really deserve it.........hmmmmmm? I mean, if you are so great, experienced, and respect worthy, odds are, you'd be getting it from the greater percentile of people around you. And if you are not getting it and are so wonderful, you'd probably be a mature enough person to not throw a tantrum about it. I agree to a point... However, One also must assume that everyone around them are reasonable secure individuals and are comfortable in giveing respect where it is due. I have found that alot of people are polite but actually giving of respect that is deserved and earned by another is not so easily given. I amazed at the insecurities that people have in general and it has a huge impact on the interactions between people. Sadly... I think there are those in the communities don't get the respect they deserve and earn. In fact, alot of people seem to be giving respect for selfish interests or to people that can get them what they want. I find respect given selflessly to be very sweet. quote: For myself, I don't see alot of value in having anything of that sort that I got, simply because I demanded it. I kinda want to earn it, and keep earning it based upon my actions. Not because I built up muscles swinging a flogger and a whip or gave myself a title then demanded the world respect me because of it. There is indeed a pride of earning what you have... quote: The online indication of this issue yesterday was watching, through words, another dominant/master/mistress, lose control and mastery of themself. They behaved again and again in a very immature and emotional way rather than taking a high road that, to me, would have shown maturity and self control. Yet stated that they were not given the respect they were due. Then proclaimed themself later on, to be a great master/mistress/dominant. I was really kind of sad and disappointed. mmmmmmmmm did I fuck up again???? grin quote: If you want to be a great master/mistress/dominant and be respected, then do so by actions and deeds, in addition to your words. Don't try to weasel out of taking responsibility, don't let your over inflated ego get in the way of seeing that you may be less than perfect. If you want to be a mentor, an example to young people, they behave like it. The problem is that one's actions or deeds must meet the standards of others to earn that respect. I have always been of the mindset that my actions and deeds must meet my standards.. for in the end.. the only respect that matters to me... Is My Own! If others happen to respect me for who I am... then all the sweeter... but I live to my standards.. not someone elses...... I suppose that is why only a very few have expressed any sort of respect towards me. quote: Lord knows I am not there, I would never say I am a Great Mistress because I know I am human and fallible. Most of my years of experience, are not in BDSM practices, just life and living. I fall off the snark wagon and make a fool of myself a good bit of the time. I am glad that I get an occasional love letter from Madame Eleven to remind me I really am not "All That" (at least not all the time......) But I do feel I need to be always aware of how I am perceived, not because I really care what the world thinks of me personally, but because I am beginning to realized that I have qualities, like my advanced age of, FREAKIN FORTY SIX!! (too weird to think of) that might lead some of these adorable youngsters to assume I might have a clue. if you respect who you see in the mirror... I am thinking you are already there.... That doesn't mean your perfect or that I am perfect... ok maybe I am... but you definitely are not! grin As far as that love letter from Bitch 11......... well honestly... sometimes I am surprized that I don 't see more. I look back at my posts from time to time and am dissappointed in the manner that I came across. I am overly blunt most times but over the past few years I have been trying to take some of the edge off... being alittle more tactful I suppose. quote: I am reminded of a bit of stink a famous basket ball player caused, some years back, when he stated he was not a role model for kids just because he was famous. Like he didn't have to behave in a certain way just because he was an over payed, skilled professional athlete. People were pissed because they feel that kinda goes with the territory. I actually agree with that... just because he is famous doesn't and shouldn't make him a role model. I think people should be more careful on who they respect and admire. Some people might have alot of skill with a flogger or whip.... but as a person.. they are shallow beyond belief and more likely to use you than help you.

CruelDesires -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 10:01:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sublizzie ~FR~ There is something amusing about a Dominant or Master/Mistress who whines about how long they've been in the lifestyle, how many groups they've started, how good they are at (pick your favorite implement). It's amusing but not respect producing. An occasion bad day with a slip into whinyness is one thing. When it becomes strident it's obnoxious. It happens on-line and it happens in real-life. Either way I lose any respect I have for that person when I see it. Starting groups is usually just a by-product of doing what one does to have fun with their hobbies , pastimes or kinks. Then when others step into that "group" and try to take over or try to impose their "will" upon the group for validation purposes, is when things usually go wrong or when one has to look at that person with a jaundiced eye. I've seen it happen numerous times and just shake my head sadly and move on. C-D

RCdc -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 10:32:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse As I, and others, stated in a thread yesterday....all of us that are less experienced can learn alot from people that are on either side of the whip. Regardless of age. Regardless of M or s, D or s, most people want to be looked up to in some way, at some point in life. For their knowledge and abilities, along with many other qualities. I just get frustrated when I see a D or M type person that begins to demand it, especially of a s type person and most especially of a younger s type. Thank you for such kind words Lady T. I loved this part... made me think and realise that something that also grates to a certain extent to me, when people come in and make a statement (and yes this is a generalisation - it usually is dominants, although s-types and switches aren't immune) to an OP or anyone reading must believe that 'insertpostersnamehere' must be listened to because they know them personally/have interacted with them on a personal level via emails, meets etc, or that they are always right because they happen to agree with them. A case of, 'I know them so they must be respected' - kind of thing. Nothing irks me more than misleading nepotism... it sucks for new posters, munch and group attenders and I believe it says a lot about the people wafting around the favouritism card. the.dark.

Missokyst -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 10:49:29 AM)
I have thought that way for years. Only I carry over your thoughts into my regular people life and not just the bdsm one. Age does not equate to wisdom, does not merit my respect, neither does experience in my observation. I don't take it as a given right that any or all of those qualities demands any more respect due someone else. My mother for instance, at 88, still believes the Enquirer. I see political types who are so set in their ways of "MY party is right, yours is BS", based not on knowlege, but on stubborn refusal to do some research on their own. Elderly get perks. Lower prices on given days, discounts, and even though the insurance is crap, at least they have the option for something. They see things as their right. Based on what.. Longevity? This respect stuff is not just a bdsm thing. It is a whole over life deal that is based on taking care of our elderly. Which is fine. But, it should not mean that they deserve any more respect than the next Joe. Life changes. So does experience and the need to know more than how things used to be. I have been doing the bdsm stuff for ages. But I tell people don't follow my lead, I am a dyslexic with control issues and my self esteem is iffy. I don't want to lead, and I am not meant to be a sheeple either. Find your own way as I did. Not so much for you, but because I don't want to be blamed for someones ill-chosen path. Kyst

masterforRT -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 10:57:09 AM)
Here's my take on it: I dislike George W. Bush. I think he's the worst President in 100 years. That said, he DID get elected the most powerful man in the world-twice. Though I don't like or respect the MAN, I DO respect his POSITION. Do you see the difference? The POSITION of President has to be respected. Same for D/s. You might not know or like a person, but if they ARE a Dom, then they deserve a certain respect for their POSITION! Sometimes you just have to give people the benefit of the doubt. If you can't do that, how can D/s work? And, YES experience, time and wisdom factor into the equation. Look, I don't care what anyone says-for the most part if you take a group of people, the ones that have put the most time into something simply know the most about it. This applies over the gamut from D/s to auto mechanics. Are there exceptions? Of course! A musical prodigy would be one. There are people who have relatively little musical experience that can play music better then those with 50 years experience. But these are an EXCEPTION to the rule-the rule still holds sound. Does the reverse hold true as well? Of course. I've seen people here who have posted 3500+ times-and (obviously) don't have a single clue what BDSM is about. But again, this is an exeption to the rule.

ShieldWolf -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:04:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KnightofMists The problem is that one's actions or deeds must meet the standards of others to earn that respect. I have always been of the mindset that my actions and deeds must meet my standards.. for in the end.. the only respect that matters to me... Is My Own! If others happen to respect me for who I am... then all the sweeter... but I live to my standards.. not someone elses...... I suppose that is why only a very few have expressed any sort of respect towards me. I look back at my posts from time to time and am dissappointed in the manner that I came across. I am overly blunt most times but over the past few years I have been trying to take some of the edge off... being alittle more tactful I suppose. I certainly agree that wanting or waiting around for someone's respect is at a detriment to yourself and your own self-respect. If someone doesn't then I guess I will have to acknowledge that there are greater tragedies in life and move on.

RCdc -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:04:45 AM)
You respect a person because they are a person, not because of their position. You respect their self achievements and how they got there but not their position. You only respect their position if you follow and belong. the.dark.

darchChylde -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:07:56 AM)
I treat everyone with respect until they prove they deserve otherwise. The best way to earn my respect is to treat me with respect.

masterforRT -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:11:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: darchChylde I treat everyone with respect until they prove they deserve otherwise. The best way to earn my respect is to treat me with respect. EXACTLY! Like I said-sometimes you just have to give people the benefit of the doubt.

sublizzie -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:11:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: masterforRT And, YES experience, time and wisdom factor into the equation. Look, I don't care what anyone says-for the most part if you take a group of people, the ones that have put the most time into something simply know the most about it. But sometimes those people who know a lot about something think they know EVERYthing about EVERYthing and they don't. Then when they constantly, shrilly, demand respect for their position it just doesn't come off as being very Dominant or knowledgeable. I know people who have been in "the lifestyle" for many years who say little about how dominant they are yet I would do anything they told me because they clearly know what they are talking about. Others I would turn my back on if they asked me to do something simply because their behavior tells me that they are unsure of themselves as Dominants, regardless of their experience and age. On-line it's more difficult to see sometimes but in real-life, given enough time watching, listening, and evaluating, makes things pretty clear.

RCdc -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:14:06 AM)
I find, that which people relate as respect, most of the time is politeness and common courtesy. the.dark.

masterforRT -> RE: Age + Experience = Respect??? No...I don't think so Vern. (8/12/2008 11:19:25 AM)
(reply to sublizzie) People who claim to know everything are showing how little they do know-and letting their insecurity show. No one knows everything about anything. But again, sometimes you have to give people-especially ones you don't know-the benefit of the doubt. If I had to prove myself to everyone I met, I wouldn't have much time left over for anything else! Sometimes you have to make the leap of faith-and take what someone says at face value. Are there bull$hitter$ out here? Of course-just as there are in real life. But I believe that most people do tell the truth about themselves.

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