RE: Slave Tendencies?

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: Slave Tendencies?

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Slave Tendencies?

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 5 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:01:23 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fyreredsub
and you are concerned for my best interests aren't you....?????

dont you think there exists better ways to handle asking personal questions?

The more a person knows about the context, the better the advice and responses can be framed and molded to the situation.

The golden rule of online- don't bring someone to the boards unless you want it brought up again, because it will be.

(in reply to fyreredsub)

Profile

Post #: 21

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:04:27 AM

Theslavetrainer

Posts: 75
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

It means the person has little to no real life experience and wants to believe that they're a slave because they read in a chat room that slaves have deper submission and more trust than a submissive and that slaves are better.

That was a rather narrow minded view, oside. Kind of like this one as well:

quote:

2. Based upon meaningless platitudes like "slaves have no rights, no limits" that are always proven false factually (though may continue as an enjoyable fantasy).

There are people that live as no limit slaves. Some become this way over time. As the trust grows between the Master and the slave, limits begine to fall away or in line with one another. My first slave has no limits with me, we've been together for over a year now. She also knows that I have certain dark places in my soul that I won't take her to like scat, waterspoarts and furry animals. Just because you don't believe it happens or have never seen it, does not mean it's not true. As for a slave with no rights, well, I suggest you visit a Gorean household for a weekend. It's a real eye opening experience and puts a whole new perspective on Master/slave relationships.
As for the original question: I used to think that it meant the person felt theat they were a slave but were too scared or shy to give in to their true nature. But I've since then seen that their are submissives that unquestioning and obediant to their Dominant as a slave is thier Master but retain their veiws and opinions so on and so forth. Truely, you must ask the one stating that they are submissive with slave tendencies to be sure what it meant by that statement.

(in reply to OsideGirl)

Profile

Post #: 22

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:06:59 AM

fyreredsub

Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

the context explained was quite clear.to get responses. rover had no problem w/ my explanationwhich was aswering. its not as if it was a thread i started asking for help on something where the context...is so important

golden rule of online,lol...........whatever............

still rofl......your a hoot LA

< Message edited by fyreredsub -- 11/22/2005 6:25:29 AM >

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Profile

Post #: 23

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:11:48 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

Flush the bushes and eventually one takes flight....

My first slave has no limits with me, we've been together for over a year now. She also knows that I have certain dark places in my soul that I won't take her to like scat, waterspoarts and furry animals.

If scat, watersports and furry animals are limits for her, then having an agreement not to go there (even an unspoken understanding) does not cause those limits to magically disappear. It simply means you aren't going there.

Tell her that you're going to include scat, watersports and furry animals in this coming weekend's fun, and see how instantly she "rediscovers" those limits again.

John

(in reply to Theslavetrainer)

Profile

Post #: 24

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:14:09 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

P.S. - Sleep is also a limit... even if you tell them not to.[/b]

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 25

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:27:23 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

quote:

As for a slave with no rights, well, I suggest you visit a Gorean household for a weekend.

Everyone, including Gorean slaves, have the ultimate right to decide no longer to consent to the relationship (ie: to leave). Just try and stop one that has made that decision.

I suggest you visit your local jail for a weekend (or that will be arranged for you after you forceably prevent her from leaving).

John

(in reply to Theslavetrainer)

Profile

Post #: 26

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:51:31 AM

Theslavetrainer

Posts: 75
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

Flush the bushes and eventually one takes flight....

My first slave has no limits with me, we've been together for over a year now. She also knows that I have certain dark places in my soul that I won't take her to like scat, waterspoarts and furry animals.

If scat, watersports and furry animals are limits for her, then having an agreement not to go there (even an unspoken understanding) does not cause those limits to magically disappear. It simply means you aren't going there.

Tell her that you're going to include scat, watersports and furry animals in this coming weekend's fun, and see how instantly she "rediscovers" those limits again.

John

Of course you did not read what I have written about limits coming in line with one another, john. The limits set are the limits I set and I set them for good reason. Her "limits" that were not the same have fallen away and she is now in line with the limits I have set. That is how we built the trust to be an M/s relationship. Why would I turn around and tell her we will do something that goes against my logic? It would show inconsistentcy. How can one trust another that is inconsistant? So. lets keep the trite comments to ones own relationship (or lack there of) and let others be, as was the meaning of my first post, shall we? Thats a good boy.

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 27

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 6:59:22 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

So are you now revising your assertion to say that sharing limits means "no limits"? After all, your post was quite clear in stating:

There are people that live as no limit slaves.

Forgive me if you consider it trite if I try to grasp a moving target. Stand still and this will be a lot easier.

John

(in reply to Theslavetrainer)

Profile

Post #: 28

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 7:01:06 AM

Theslavetrainer

Posts: 75
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

I suggest you visit your local jail for a weekend (or that will be arranged for you after you forceably prevent her from leaving).

John[/font]

Well well johny, a little testy on the Gorean subject are we? Anyone can run away. Running away is not a right, it's an act of cowardice. It's a test of ones true self to stay on that path which ones has started and see it to its end. Of course, that is the old military man in me coming out.

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 29

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 7:03:34 AM

Theslavetrainer

Posts: 75
Joined: 9/23/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

So are you now revising your assertion to say that sharing limits means "no limits"? After all, your post was quite clear in stating:

There are people that live as no limit slaves.

Forgive me if you consider it trite if I try to grasp a moving target. Stand still and this will be a lot easier.

John

Maybe you just need to have someone read my post to you, john. Since you can't seem to finish it yourself. In my post I said "Some become this way over time. As the trust grows between the Master and the slave, limits begine to fall away or in line with one another." Nice try on twisting the words tho.

< Message edited by Theslavetrainer -- 11/22/2005 7:07:02 AM >

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 30

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 7:06:53 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

I'm not touchy about Gorean subjects at all. In fact, I wasn't aware that this was a Gorean subject (it's been floating about the internet long before Gor became even moderately known).

Who said anything about running away? I'm talking about an adult looking you in the eye and saying "this isn't working for me and I'm leaving". Or do you naturally assume that a slave/submissive would have to act cowardly in order to end a relationship?

John

(in reply to Theslavetrainer)

Profile

Post #: 31

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 7:18:57 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

Twisting your words? Not in the least. Just having difficulty making sense out of several contradictory (and mutually exclusive) assertions you have made.

"No limits slaves" are not the same as slaves who have the same limits as their Master. If you don't understand the difference, I'd be pleased to illustrate for you (evidently this was not covered in the online website you read).

John

(in reply to Theslavetrainer)

Profile

Post #: 32

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 7:33:46 AM

JohnWarren

Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Theslavetrainer

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

I suggest you visit your local jail for a weekend (or that will be arranged for you after you forceably prevent her from leaving).

John[/font]

Well well johny, a little testy on the Gorean subject are we? Anyone can run away. Running away is not a right, it's an act of cowardice. It's a test of ones true self to stay on that path which ones has started and see it to its end. Of course, that is the old military man in me coming out.

Since the "military aspect" has been brought out, I'll mention that most of the major disasters have occured when someone was either to stupid to notice the "objective circumstances " (old Soviet term used to shut up poltical officers) and changed or allowed a stupid pride silence all mention of "running away."

The velts were made Boer by "running away." Tet taught the Viet Cong the value of running away and what happens when one doesn't. Mao spent much of his career running away. It won him a country of a billion people.

Moving it back to a scene venue, the idea somehow that a relationship can stay right without a lot of effort on the part of both people reduced it to something out of a comic book or bad novel. When things go bad and one person's efforts are insufficient to bring them back, retreat is a sensible thing to do.

Of course, when the one hearing this is the one from whom others have run, that can smart a bit.

_____________________________

www.lovingdominant.org

(in reply to Theslavetrainer)

Profile

Post #: 33

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:02:12 AM

starshineowned

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

"No limits slaves" are not the same as slaves who have the same limits as their Master.

Greetings..~smiles~

Sorry Rover Sir..but I beg to differ. That is soley your interpretation of "no limits". Many slaves do use the term "no limits" to indicate that they themselves have none out of their own thought process any longer, and only remain with the "limits" of their Owner.

You can take this a couple of ways. I had no limits that differed from that of my Owner before begging collar. You have a few mentality's here after begging that collar regarding those limits..1. The slave that truely feels no matter what that since she begged that collar..she is now fully property of said Owner, and if the Owner decides to go ahead and try those limits then they truely feel they have no choice but to be obedient.
It doesn't matter that in reality yes anyone can up and leave..it's a deep seeded feeling inside. If it were limits that caused permanent physical/mental harm or death..then those slaves might be referred to as the doormats so often heard about. The physical/mental harm aspect of it though is only important in the sense that it did cause, and not "may cause" or "is likely to cause".
2. You have slaves that have the same limits as their owners before collar, and may have a few that the Owner didn't have but in time and work and trust loose those others to arrive at just the same one's the Owner has that are really hardfast to both. Even this can go both ways. The slave might over time feel different about a hard limit and want to try but the Owner says hell no..slave can accept or can ask to be let go..or visa versa the Owner might want to try, and slave says no way can't do, and the Owner can say okay we'll forget that or say okay I'm letting you go.

It is my understanding that these labels are only here to help in getting a better understanding of some minor differences that are more commonly seen.

One can just as easily say there is no such thing as a "Dom" or "submissive" when people try to use this as a noun..which is slung around this lifestyle all the time. Point is..it is acceptable because it helps others to get a little glimpse of where that person may be coming from or the basic dynamics of their relationship in the lifestyle.

subs..tend to have more power in the exchange..hell they say so themselves and that is how they like and want it. COOL BEANS
slaves..tend to have little to no power in the exchange..hell they say so themselves and that is how they like and want it. COOL BEANS

Nothing is definitive as people aren't..but it's the averages of the total sum I think that were enough to warrent some trite seperation of terms.

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 34

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:13:44 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

Seriously, either someone has limits or they don't. The easiest way to tell is to ask them to do something they won't do, and the limit magically appears.

On the west coast there is a small, but existent, "amputee fetish". What does the "no limits" slave do when their Dominant discovers a compelling fascination with this fetish, and decides that their slave should become the instrument of their greatest desire?

I find it curious, humorous and sad all at the same time, that people of (ostensibly) sound mind will on the one hand state that they will not have anything to do with death, dismemberment, children, animals, scat, illegal activities, (add whatever you want to the list) and on the other hand claim that those are not limits. Well, if they're not limits then you'll engage in the activities.

Using your logic, although your Master's profile says he's "straight", he does not have a limit for engaging in homosexual activity. He simply has a partner with whom he shares a limit (ie: you are female).

Fact is, every mentally healthy human being has limits whether they are slaves, submissives, Dominants, switches, vanillas, etc.

John

(in reply to starshineowned)

Profile

Post #: 35

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:24:43 AM

starshineowned

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

Well Rover Sir..not sure how to explain it any differently to you for the sole purpose of showing nothing more than ..in this realm..some do use the term "no limits" to mean exactly what I stated previously just as some view it just exactly the way you are. I'm sure still yet others will see the term to mean something completely different.

Whole point is ..it is no different than any other label/term/definition of anything else used by those in wiitwd. It's all subjective and opinionated plain and simple.

There are no rights or wrongs here. Best way I can see is that if a slave says they have no limits..then simply ask them what they mean by that. Save a whole lot of hoopla and ill feelings of someone else trying to shove their idea down anothers throat as if to say they are wrong simply because they view and mean it this way or that.

When I say I have no limits..I mean I no longer have any of my own and only those of my Owner. You going to sit there on your side of your screen and tell me I'm wrong or not a slave because my idea of it's meaning is different than yours?...Well yes probably you are..lol but it matters not in the end no?

I respect your view of it..I live with my view of it..and I accept anyone else's view of it should another view come along. It's really simple.

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 36

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:24:54 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

I think the big thing is to remember that communication is absolutely everything.

I am no limits - but thats because I see limits as consensual acts. So things like 'the three unmentionables'... and we all know what they are - is NOT consensual in any sense. (Well, except for a person whom has already permitted before their death).

Peace and Love

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to Rover)

Profile

Post #: 37

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:28:32 AM

starshineowned

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

I think the big thing is to remember that communication is absolutely everything.

Completely agree..but adding onto that..is Understanding. They both should go together.

starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin

(in reply to darkinshadows)

Profile

Post #: 38

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:31:12 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

Actually, I believe that this issue is substantially different than other labels associated with WIITWD. And the reason is safety. The whole "no limits slave" (that really isn't no limits) is frequently used to manipulate and exploit others.

Now, you may know enough not to be taken advantage of. And your Master may be sufficiently scrupulous not to want to take advantage of you. But let's both agree, that's not the case everywhere and for everyone. There are, in point of fact, quite a number of people prowling around (particularly on the internet) hoping to take advantage of those who don't know any better for financial gain or otherwise (take a peek at the "slave acadamy" thread).

All you're doing is perpetuating a myth that puts other (granted, less experienced and perhaps with less common sense) folks in danger. Personally, I choose not to. I can live with that.

John

(in reply to starshineowned)

Profile

Post #: 39

RE: Slave Tendencies? - 11/22/2005 8:42:15 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

Ok, let me simplify this whole issue. Please reply with a yes or no to the following questions:

Is death a limit for you?

Is dismemberment a limit for you?

Is bank robbery a limit for you?

Are activities that violate the TOS (don't wanna list them and get in trouble) a limit for you?

Are ANY of these limits relative to who your Master is?

Either you have those limits or you don't. I don't understand all the fuss in admitting reality.

John

(in reply to starshineowned)

Profile

Post #: 40