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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 4:56:43 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

Just curious, is this the first time ever that a ticket has been made up without a veteran and/or an executive?



A veteran of what?  The military?  You must be joking...


Actually, I was being serious in my question. Is this the first time that there hasn't been a member that wasn't in the military or an elected executive?

Why would I joke about that?  It seems like a valid question, I am curious to know.


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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 4:58:52 PM   
Alumbrado


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Status: offline 		I thought you had been saying that there was nothing about this ticket that represented change in any way shape or form.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 4:59:52 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		This was something that had just occured to me when I wrote the question... hence there is something possibly different about this ticket.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:20:33 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

Just curious, is this the first time ever that a ticket has been made up without a veteran and/or an executive?

No. 
  1. James Monroe and Daniel D. Tompkins (1816)
  2. James Polk and George M. Dallas (1844)
  3. Abraham Lincoln and Hannibal Hamlin (1860)
  4. Grover Cleveland and Thomas Hendricks (1884)
  5. Grover Cleveland and Adlai E. Stevenson (1892)
  6. William McKinley and Garret A. Hobart (1896)
  7. Woodrow Wilson and Thomas R. Marshall (1912)
  8. FDR and John Nance Garner (1932)
Note:  these are the winning tickets.  Have to look up the losing tickets also if you want the complete list.  Also, prior to 1860, the qualification of "executive" gets rather specious, given the pre-industrial nature of the American economy at the time.

Interestingly enough, every winning Presidential ticket since WWII has had a military veteran on it (technically, GWB is a veteran having served in the reserves), and the only President since WWII to never have served in any capacity is Bill Clinton.

< Message edited by celticlord2112 -- 8/24/2008 5:22:21 PM >

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:22:04 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		Clinton was an executive though.

Thanks for the info.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:24:06 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

Clinton was an executive though.

Thanks for the info.


He had prior gubenatorial experience.  I took "executive" to mean "business executive."


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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:26:37 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		That is why I clarified as elected executive.

Does that change the list any?  I was just going to go through and look at the pairings you listed.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:28:00 PM   
Alumbrado


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Status: offline 		Lincoln as a Captain in the regular militia in active service during the Black Hawk wars,was as much a veteran as LBJ, or GWB.

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Profile   Post #: 168
RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:34:10 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		Monroe was a governor of Virginia
Polk was governor of Tennessee
Hamlin was governor of Maine
Cleveland was governor of New York
McKinley was a governor of Ohio and a veteran
Wilson was governor of New Jersey
FDR was also a governor of New York


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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:37:37 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

That is why I clarified as elected executive.

Does that change the list any?  I was just going to go through and look at the pairings you listed.

Yeah, that changes the list a whole lot.


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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 5:41:12 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		How would they have made the list if not for the "elected" part?  All of those tickets had either an executive (governor or mayor) and or a veteran on them.

I think the same could be said true for the losing tickets... unless I am missing something this is the first ticket ever to not fit that mold.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 7:38:18 PM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

I think the same could be said true for the losing tickets... unless I am missing something this is the first ticket ever to not fit that mold.

If we broaden the definitions to encompass some form of "executive leadership" (i.e., mayor, governor, business executive, military commander, et cetera), then you may very well be correct.

Which would set up an interesting contrast should McCain somehow persuade Colin Powell to be his VP:  No "executive leadership" vs. an abundance of it (McCain was a successful unit commander in the Navy prior to his embarking on a legislative career).

One of those interesting bits of intellection that makes election years a most guilty pleasure!


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Profile   Post #: 172
RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/24/2008 7:46:09 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		There is a reason he hasn't been tapped for that type of role in the past... a certain young major and a certain massacre that occured on Mar 16,1968.... and the coverup of said incident as "relations are excellent".

Just sayin,
Thadius

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 6:15:15 AM   
defiantbadgirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

With this pick, do you think Obama is going to stop talking about the number of houses somebody owns?


Let's hope not.  Amazing how anyone can call Obama an elitist when you have a man so accustomed to wealth and power he can't even remember how many homes he has.


Or maybe McCain is in the beginning stages of Alzheimers?

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Profile   Post #: 174
RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 6:48:22 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

There is a reason he hasn't been tapped for that type of role in the past... a certain young major and a certain massacre that occured on Mar 16,1968.... and the coverup of said incident as "relations are excellent".

Just sayin,
Thadius

Powell certainly did not do a proper investigation of SPC4 Glenn's accusations against the Americal Division, but if the issue was not a bar to him being either Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff or Secretary of State (both requiring Senate confirmation), it is difficult to see how much baggage it would create for him as a political candidate.


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Profile   Post #: 175
RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 7:38:43 AM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		There is a huge difference between being confirmed and vetted for those positions and one of the seats on the big ticket.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 8:38:23 AM   
celticlord2112


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

There is a huge difference between being confirmed and vetted for those positions and one of the seats on the big ticket.

Perhaps.  I am not persuaded the difference is as great as that.  Particularly in being vetted for Secretary of State; something like covering up a war crime would be a decided disqualifier for that office, arguably even more so than the #2 position on a Presidential ticket..


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Profile   Post #: 177
RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 8:54:13 AM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		Aye, but at the time of his confirmation, it wasn't such a hot ticket item.  The American populace and politic are hyper sensitive to such issues now, compared to 8 years ago, with all the claims that have been tossed around.  That's why I think a better choice if he wanted to tap a military leader, would be Gen Petraeus.  Or really throw a curve ball and go with Rear Adm. Nancy E. Brown , Gen. Mary Ann Krusa-Dossin, or Vice Adm. Ann E. Rondeau.

If he want's to put a pure counter to Joe Biden, perhaps former Gov. Michael Steele from Maryland. 

Of course there are calls for the mainstream names of Mitt or Whitman.

It will be interesting to see.

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 8:56:39 AM   
ElectraGlide


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Status: offline 		Hey my home state of Delaware is on the map now. Thanks to Joe. It is funny how many people have to scratch their heads and say where is Delaware, is it a city in Philadelphia ? lol....

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RE: It`s Joe Biden - 8/25/2008 9:40:54 AM   
celticlord2112


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Status: offline 		Personally, if not Powell, I'd like to see Lieberman. He's not so odious to the Republican base as to drive them to Obama (or even merely away from the polls), and there's not a more dramatic show of bipartisianship imaginable.

Reaching across the aisle that way would take a lot of the wind out of Obama's "change" sails--and he has nothing else in his arsenal to campaign on.

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