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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:02:32 AM   
cpK69


Posts: 1593
Joined: 5/9/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bipolarber

Hummm.... how to choose? How to choose?


e. None of the above
 
Kim

(in reply to bipolarber)
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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:02:39 AM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline 		a person that does not value that little life will NOT get my vote. 

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:05:31 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		I recant, here's a possible explanation for her seemingly pushing her religious agenda off the timetable: I hope the guy's wrong.

"That Palin hasn't yet pushed a religious conservative agenda isn't surprising, said state Rep. Beth Kerttula, a Juneau Democrat and House Minority Leader. So far the governor has been consumed with the complex and contentious legislation involving oil taxes and a proposed natural gas pipeline.
"She really didn't have much opportunity" to push a social agenda, Kerttula said. Should Palin return to Juneau and not go to Washington, Kerttula said, she expects the governor to focus on cultural and religious issues, like creationism and abortion."

There's more here: Anchorage Daily News .

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:07:40 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
~ Fast Reply ~
  • Emails from disgruntled loser citizens
  • Church discussions concerning matters of faith (yeah - I know how much people having faith bother some folk)
  • Alluding to Book Banning

VERY Damaging!

And here I thought that this level of desperation wouldn't be seen for at least another month...

Meanwhile from the issue side, a ticket head who disagrees with the pullout, but won't stipulate

And the very best when it comes to policy, both the Presidential and Vice-Presidential candidate answering with a "That's above my pay grade!" as opposed to taking a position.

Senator Obama on Abortion: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRswgN-Wf6g
Senator Biden on why the Presidential Candidate doesn't think it would be in his best interest to participate in open 'Town Meetings': http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26590488/

Meanwhile today, the good Senator was complaining about the minor (8,000) troop withdraw in the face of the fact that Billions are still being spent in Iraq by the USA while Iraq has a budget surplus.

Should someone remind the good Senator and his running mate both voted FOR (as apposed to the 150 times he voted 'present') continuing to fund the Iraq debacle?
quote:

Senator Barack Obama, the Democratic presidential nominee, was the first of the candidates to discuss Mr. Bush’s announcement earlier today. Our colleague Jeff Zeleny reports from a press availability in Riverside, Ohio, that Mr. Obama mentioned that even with the reduction, the level of troops in Iraq would remain at “pre-surge levels” and said:

We will continue to spend $10 billion a month in Iraq while the Iraqi government sits on a $79 billion surplus. In the absence of a timetable to remove our combat brigades, we will continue to give Iraq’s leaders a blank check instead of pressing them to reconcile their differences. So the President’s talk of “return on success” is a new name for continuing the same strategic mistakes that have dominated our foreign policy for over 5 years.


Source:  http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/09/war-at-home-bushs-iraq-troops-drawdown/ 


YUP - Talking about Church, discredited librarians, and personal emails sure is better for those desiring a change to the party in control of the White House. Talking on issues and integrity would seem a losing proposition.

< Message edited by Mercnbeth -- 9/9/2008 11:25:21 AM >

(in reply to bestbabync)
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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:10:15 AM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline 		i am pro life not pro choice.  that is the one issue that Palin and  i agree on.  that is the one issue Obama and i disagree on.

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:17:03 AM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline 		i posted in this thread saying just that 

vote for /support the candidate based on their political record not the church or organization they pay allegiance too. 

i agree with you Merc, but i do get off topic too much.  sorry!

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:22:14 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: corysub

Your words "The one thing about Christian fundementalists is that they don't give a shit what Jesus is purported to have said, they are more interested in what they wish he had said" bear no resemblence and display a total lack of understand of the driver of Fundamentalism, namely the WORD of Jesus. A visit or a couple of visits as an observer might be helpful. 



There is no primary evidence of anything Jesus said, that is why it is so easy to interpret what Jesus might have said to what one wishes he had said. Everything that Jesus is supposed to ahve said is reported to us second hand by vested interests. Every Christian who tries to be a Christian should know that. Even secondhand, nothing that he was reported to have said suggested he was against gays or promiscuous women, in fact the opposite is true, he never judged people. He never suggested he or god would reward people materially for being good Christians, in fact his reported statements were agaisnt people chasing material rewards. The one thing fundementalist Christians do, is judge people and chase material reward at the expense of others! They are not the only Christians to do that but they lead the field.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 9/9/2008 11:25:25 AM >

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:27:39 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		So you turn a thread about Palin's church into yet another diatribe against Obama. Bravo.

Didn't you kick and scream for weeks over Reverend Wright though? Why not over this? It's equally trivial, isn't it? Or is it just as worrying for you?

"Palin reached into her own church when she filled the seat vacated last winter by Rep. Vic Kohring, R-Wasilla, who's now serving three and a half years in prison for bribery, conspiracy and attempted extortion as part of the federal crackdown on Alaska political corruption.

His replacement is Wes Keller, one of 10 elders in the Wasilla Bible Church and one of three candidates on a short list that was submitted to Palin by state Republicans. Another of the three finalists, Keller said, was also a member of the church.

Keller said he got to know Palin when she and her husband, Todd, joined the Wasilla Bible Church in 2002. [...]

But his track record so far has pleased the religious right. In the recent legislative session, Keller sponsored a bill to make performing late-term "partial birth abortions" a felony. He also introduced legislation sought by the Alaska Family Council that requires all state-funded public libraries to install filters to protect kids from "inappropriate" material. "

Anchorage Daily News (link as above).

This is the kind of company she keeps? God, prayer, abstinence (something she's not that good at teaching, obviously), no choice for women, interference of the State in medical decisions, and the 'filtering' of books in library? Well, goodbye beloved freedom  . Surprising you're not blowing a fuse over this agenda.



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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:28:41 AM   
IamElise


Posts: 40
Joined: 8/23/2008
Status: offline 		I have to agree with you bestbabync. I do support Obama, but it's relunctant because I am also pro-life. I'm a devout Catholic and it's difficult for me to support someone who is pro-choice. But...my other choice would to support a candidate who supports killing kids after they're born by sending them off to useless, wealthy people sponsored wars. Also, I find it odd that Palin, being so pro-life, vetoed an opportunity and finance for unwed mothers in Alaska to have safe houseing. I don't know why conservative pro-lifers are also against assisting women once they make the choice to continue and nurture an unplanned pregnancy.

And it is scary that she wants to ban Harry Potter. A book that has given countless children a love and excitement for reading. Many fundamentalist do believe that if you're not like them, you're not of God.

So I'd prefer a candidate who is more sensitive and compassionate towards those who are not as fortunate as themselves. And can relate to everyone.

(in reply to bestbabync)
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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:31:27 AM   
Thadius


Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline 		Filtering the internet in public libraries is not so far out of the mainstream... Sen. Obama did the same thing with a vote in Illinois.

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When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:33:59 AM   
meatcleaver


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Joined: 3/13/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: IamElise

I don't know why conservative pro-lifers are also against assisting women once they make the choice to continue and nurture an unplanned pregnancy.



Because they are bitter judgemental people.

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There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:37:41 AM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

quote:

ORIGINAL: IamElise

I don't know why conservative pro-lifers are also against assisting women once they make the choice to continue and nurture an unplanned pregnancy.



Because they are bitter judgemental people.

Don't forget the bit about clinging to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.....

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:41:14 AM   
MissIsis


Posts: 473
Joined: 1/1/2005
Status: offline 		As one who remembers the young girls maimed, hurt & worse from basement abortions, I cannot support the stance of holy rollers in wolves clothing, who would turn back the clock & go back to allowing women to go through this again.  

Although, Obama is not my first choice for who gets my vote, in all likelihood, I see no other choice if we want to undo the damage of the past eight years to our great country.

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:41:36 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		You said it CL and to me you've hit the nail on the head even though I whiff a note of scarcasm.

_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:45:29 AM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IamElise

I have to agree with you bestbabync. I do support Obama, but it's relunctant because I am also pro-life. I'm a devout Catholic and it's difficult for me to support someone who is pro-choice. But...my other choice would to support a candidate who supports killing kids after they're born by sending them off to useless, wealthy people sponsored wars. Also, I find it odd that Palin, being so pro-life, vetoed an opportunity and finance for unwed mothers in Alaska to have safe houseing. I don't know why conservative pro-lifers are also against assisting women once they make the choice to continue and nurture an unplanned pregnancy.

And it is scary that she wants to ban Harry Potter. A book that has given countless children a love and excitement for reading. Many fundamentalist do believe that if you're not like them, you're not of God.

So I'd prefer a candidate who is more sensitive and compassionate towards those who are not as fortunate as themselves. And can relate to everyone.


i will address the most obvious!  the book banning is a rumor.  she did have a conversation about book banning at the library with the librarian, but she did not banned any books or fire the librarian. 

the soldiers in Iraq are volunteers, not drafted.  they took an oath to serve, no matter where they are sent.  we/they may not agree with the war but they are not being forced to serve their country. 

also...i am pro life but that does not mean that i want my tax dollars to pay for the homes for unwed mothers.  sorry, but i don't.  that is why service & giving is so important.  we all have a civic responsibility but i do not agree with being forced/taxed to fund charity organizations or pay for abortions.

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to IamElise)
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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:45:40 AM   
MissIsis


Posts: 473
Joined: 1/1/2005
Status: offline 		Quite frankly, I resent the implication that I am not pro-life because I am for allowing a woman to make the most personal of choices between her & her higher power.   I have a reverence for all life. 

Those that consider themselves pro-life, are some of the very people who voted not just once, but twice for a man who caused the death of countless of our sons & daughters by starting a war under false pretenses that we should never have entered into.  These hippocrates should be ashamed of themselves.

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:45:45 AM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

You said it CL and to me you've hit the nail on the head even though I whiff a note of scarcasm.

Fortunately for me, as there was considerably more than a note of sarcasm, there will be no need for me to retract those words and apologize for them, as did Obama.

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RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:46:23 AM   
cpK69


Posts: 1593
Joined: 5/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

u missed what i was saying. 


No, I didn't.

quote:

have you not heard of the Holy Trinity?  The Father (God), The Son (Jesus) and The Holy Spirit.


I have.
 
Kim

(in reply to bestbabync)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:50:23 AM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline 		but i cannot get behind a politician that would allow a gasping baby (outside the mother's body) to die in a rag pile to protect a woman's right to choose....sorry but i can't.

that is just one issue, which is not at the top of my list, but always in the back of my mind.

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to MissIsis)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Palins church. - 9/9/2008 11:53:21 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MissIsis

As one who remembers the young girls maimed, hurt & worse from basement abortions, I cannot support the stance of holy rollers in wolves clothing, who would turn back the clock & go back to allowing women to go through this again.  



Women died having abortions before they were legal which shows how desperate women were for them whatever reason. It is about time people accepted it was the right of teh individual woman concerned. They can still think it right or wrong but the decision is the woman's.

Interesting interview about abortion.... 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/the_interview.shtml

Carrie Gracie talks to American abortion doctor Susan Wicklund on The Interview
Susan Wicklund has been providing abortions in the United States for the past twenty years.
In the course of that time she has faced protests, death threats and attacks on her own daughter.
Today, abortion may be available in America but, as she tells Carrie Gracie, that right is under threat.
What's more, women are often still ashamed to talk about their own experiences of abortion.
So how does she deal with the ethical issues involved?

_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

(in reply to MissIsis)
Profile   Post #: 80
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