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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:19:13 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline 		And Aynne...

Don't act as if this pig with lipstick wasn't a direct play on the pitbull line,

Both Biden aand Obama used it on the same day, it was red meat for their base and it was clear that the pig was Palin.

If a Republican discribed of Hillary Clinton's platform as a pig with lip stick you would have roasted them in oil.

Would you let McCain get away with "calling a spade a spade" when talking about Obama's tax plans?

Of course not!

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:19:23 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		The Democrats have made two gigantic mistakes in just the last 3 weeks that may cost them the election...
1) Obama didnt pick Hillary. Picking her would have unified the party and would have kept women behind the Democratic ticket. Hillary is also more popular and polarizing than Biden could ever dream of being.
2) They allowed the GOP to turn this election into Obama vs Palin while McCain sneaks in the backdoor and steals Obama voters.

Have you checked out the Democrat and left-wing blogs? It's Palin this and Palin that. No negative news about McCain at all!!! The Dems are stuck in this hole. And instead of trying to find a way out of it, they are digging it deeper. They are nervous. They are scared. They see their own internal polls pointing to McCain. And they have been shell-shocked. Now maybe they will wake up in the coming weeks and get back on track. But, being the Obama campaign is not a good position to be in right now. They are now obviously behind in this race.

I read an NBC news poll that shows that there is a 23 point swing in favor of McCain in women aged 18 to 49. That is a very critical loss for Obama if that number is true and holds because young women are one of Obama's biggest strengths. So it certainly isnt a good time to cracking any type of joke that can even be twisted as being a sexist joke. The GOP is listening to every single word Obama and Biden say and if they say anything sexist at all, the GOP will run with it and create a dozen ads with it.

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:20:28 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		How about a subject that counts in people`s lives?

Like how she wanted to charge rape victims for their "Rape Kits",used by police to gather evidence?

Where she`ll lead us.....That`s what we must talk about.

It distraction, McCain`s only strong point?


< Message edited by Owner59 -- 9/9/2008 7:21:22 PM >

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:20:56 PM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
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Status: offline 		i bet the "Walmart Moms" heard it!.......LOL!

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:21:12 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		And as I pointed out earlier, the raucous applause and laughter should have give Senator Obama his first clue that he'd just called Governor Palin a pig.


quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

Sanity anyone and everyone has heard that saying that is over the frigging age of 15. You haven't? When pigs fly...

Aynne, won't you at least concede that, regardless of how old the saying is ( and it is old), Obama chose the worst moment to pull that hoary chestnut out of the rhetorical treasure chest?  The comparisons to Palin's "lipstic" riff at the RNC are almost inevitable.

The only thing worse than making a sexist/racist/[insert other form of bigotry] remark, is being made to seem as if one has made a sexist/racist/[insert other form of bigotry] remark.  The first makes on a bigot; the second makes one stupid.



< Message edited by Sanity -- 9/9/2008 7:48:14 PM >

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:21:15 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

On the other hand, why should a Democrat inherit the devastation left behind by Bush and his cohorts?

What an interesting political logic.  President Bush and the Republicans were so awful in their stewardship of the Executive Branch that the only fair thing to do now is elect another Republican.

Ummm.....how is this helpful to Obama?



It's not... Though it is aid and comfort to Hilliary!

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:26:17 PM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
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quote:

Just because you asked so nicely, yep. Of course he did, but for god's sake CL, it fits. She left herself wide open with her snarky speech and her lipstick/pitbull comment. I don't know if he meant it that way, but yes, the timing is interesting.

Rhetorically it does fit--fits rather nicely.

Politically, however, it was just dumb.  Obama is campaigning for the highest office in the land by playing the dozens with Governor Palin?  How in the hell is that even in the same time zone as "winning strategy"?

Give John McCain credit.  He found Obama's Achilles heel:  Obama's own ego.  And Obama is unwilling or unable to put that ego in check.


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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:29:36 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
Know what the other side is "way more experienced" in doing? Winning the Presidency. If they pull it off after the last 8 years - incredible!


No.

"Incredible" is not the word I'd choose.

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:30:21 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		 

So FDD and CL...still think Obama was wrong? McCain said it first. About Hillary. OOPS.


Last October McCain used the phrase to describe Hillary's health care plan. Now he whines that Obama uses the same phrase.

McCain criticized Democratic contenders for offering what he called costly universal health care proposals that require too much government regulation. While he said he had not studied Democratic candidate Hillary Clinton's health-care plan, he said it was "eerily reminiscent" of the failed plan she offered as first lady in the early 1990s.

"I think they put some lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig," he said of her proposal."

OBAMA'S ENTIRE 'COMMENT' "We've been talking about change when we were up in the polls and when we were down in the polls," Obama told a rally here as surveys suggested John McCain and Sarah Palin have overhauled his lead for the November 4 election.

"The other side, suddenly, they're saying 'we're for change too.' Now think about it, these are the same folks that have been in charge for the last eight years," the Illinois senator said to a crowd of 2,400 people.

"You can put lipstick on a pig. It's still a pig. You can wrap up an old fish in a piece of paper and call it change. It's still going to stink after eight years. We've had enough," he exclaimed to a standing ovation.

"Boy, we've really screwed things up, but it could get worse. That's their argument. What John McCain's offering is the same old tired slogans that (President) George Bush offered."

*******************
The Barack Obama campaign accused their Republican opponents of a "pathetic attempt to play the gender card" tonight with the McCain campaign's demand that Obama apologize for a remark made earlier in the evening.

Obama used a "lipstick on a pig" metaphor this evening as he tried to tell voters why they shouldn't believe John McCain and Sarah Palin when they say they represent change.

"Enough is enough," Obama senior adviser Anita Dunn said in a statement e-mailed to reporters

"The Mc Cain campaign's attack tonight is a pathetic attempt to play the gender card about the use of a common analogy - the same analogy that Senator McCain himself used about Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton's health care plan just last year," she continued. "This phony lecture on gender sensitivity is the height of cynicism and lays bare the increasingly dishonorable campaign John McCain has chosen to run." 
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/


< Message edited by Aynne88 -- 9/9/2008 7:33:45 PM >

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:35:47 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		Life isn't a game at the casino, Merc. I'll leave it at that: see if you get it :-) .

Edited, because of something trivial :-) .

< Message edited by kittinSol -- 9/9/2008 7:41:18 PM >

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:39:30 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		Please.

Everyone in the crowd obviously got it, got the fact that Senator Obama had just called Governor Palin a pig, but Senator Obama didn't get it?

Is he unintelligent, or is he untruthful, or is he just two-faced.

According to your article McCain was clearly referring to hillarycare, the plan - not Hillary herself, so that DNC talking point is going nowhere.




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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:43:58 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		I think you have shit in your eyes if you truly see that everybody means to be a bastard to everybody else. If you want to flee to the defence of a pit bull disguised as a chick, it's your prerogative, but I thought the pit bull could stand its own? It's pathetic: you choose to be offended by what isn't an insult.

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:44:24 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline 		So you are saying McCain's use of the metaphor was inappropriate but Obama's was use was OK because Palin "brought it on herself"? If you were outraged when McCain used it, you should be equally so that Obama and Biden used that same tired allusion to a pig as a woman. Instead you are looking for ways to condone Obama's use it!  

< Message edited by FatDomDaddy -- 9/9/2008 7:45:23 PM >

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:45:41 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		That was weak Sanity.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Please.

Everyone in the crowd obviously got it, got the fact that Senator Obama had just called Governor Palin a pig, but Senator Obama didn't get it?

Is he unintelligent, or is he untruthful, or is he just two-faced.

According to your article McCain was clearly referring to hillarycare, the plan - not Hillary herself, so that DNC talking point is going nowhere.





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As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:55:52 PM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
Status: offline
quote:

So FDD and CL...still think Obama was wrong? McCain said it first. About Hillary. OOPS.

Yeah McCain said it first.  So what?  I don't recall Hillary riffing about hockey moms and lipstick to set up the inevitable comparison.

You're missing the point.  It doesn't matter if Obama intended it, or even if McCain said it first.  It doesn't matter because Obama stepped into a seeming sexist slam on Palin that McCain didn't step into with Hillary.  Palin's RNC "lipstick" riff should have tipped Obama that any reference to "lipstick"--joking or otherwise--was a perception landmine.

Political rhetoric necessarily involves creative ways to slam and insult your opponent--for better or worse, that is the way the game is played.  But the overarching rule of those creative slams is to avoid the appearance of "tit for tat"; for a Presidential candidate, this is especially true of the political rhetoric of the opposing team's Vice Presidential candidate.

Obama has a full on case of Palinsanity and he will not win this election if it continues.


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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:58:08 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
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From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

So you are saying McCain's use of the metaphor was inappropriate but Obama's was use was OK because Palin "brought it on herself"? If you were outraged when McCain used it, you should be equally so that Obama and Biden used that same tired allusion to a pig as a woman. Instead you are looking for ways to condone Obama's use it!  


I read Obama's remark as referring to McCain's policy.. not VP pick. Obviously, it's a matter of perception.


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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:58:10 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
What do you think the crowd's raucous laughter meant to Senator Obama as he delivered that line.

Do you think he's truly that clueless? Even now he could apologize, but all I hear is crickets.


quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

I think you have shit in your eyes if you truly see that everybody means to be a bastard to everybody else. If you want to flee to the defence of a pit bull disguised as a chick, it's your prerogative, but I thought the pit bull could stand its own? It's pathetic: you choose to be offended by what isn't an insult.


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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 7:58:31 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		I never said that. I was not outraged either time. I have actual issues to be outraged about, you know, Bush is still in office, those things happen on a daily basis.


quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

So you are saying McCain's use of the metaphor was inappropriate but Obama's was use was OK because Palin "brought it on herself"? If you were outraged when McCain used it, you should be equally so that Obama and Biden used that same tired allusion to a pig as a woman. Instead you are looking for ways to condone Obama's use it!  


_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 8:01:42 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		It's all in the eye of the beholder, Sanity. Perhaps you truly enjoy getting riled up, but here, let me help you... there... a little frothing... at the mouth. *dab dab dab*, and hey presto! All better now  .

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RE: Does Lipstick on a Pig Now Equal Hockey Mom? - 9/9/2008 8:03:01 PM   
faithandImpulse


Posts: 2
Joined: 7/8/2008
Status: offline 		FatDomDaddy--I'm sure there would be a bunch of overly sensitive Obama fans making fools of themselves ranting if 'call a spade a spade' was used, but that doesn't make the overly sensitive McCain fans look any less ridiculous for having fits over Obama's use of another stupid, tired old saying that they've heard a thousand times before.

And Thadius--I'm an advocate for special needs and ESOL kids. I reviewed the transcript of Obama's remarks, and he obviously doesn't know much about special ed kids and was bluffing his way through that answer, but there was no 'cheap shot' there whatsoever.

For the record, I'm a proud pit bull owner, a white woman, a mother to two autistic kids, and I am without question voting for Obama. McCain's flip-flopping on issues, his obvious pandering to Hillary supporters in naming Palin, and virtually everything I've read about Palin herself, has ensured it. 


~faith

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