quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Recently, I was having a private discussion with a fellow CM poster I respect very much who has a few decades on me as far as life experience.

One of his opinions that really caught my eye was something that I had reflected upon a couple of times in the past.

That it would be increadingly harder and harder for someone of my generation to find a female submissive for the kind of male dominated relationship that I wanted in comparision to 20 years ago, because society teaches women more and more that what we want isn't right.

Now...don't get me wrong. I am not saying this is a BAD thing or that I wish feminism wasn't around. I would much rather spent more time looking for a partner than live in a society where one group of people were indirectly taught they HAD to do what I wanted, because of their gender.

I'm curious as to whether or not you find this perception grounded in reality.

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ORIGINAL: Jeffff

Ok... doomed may be a bit, melodramatic...:). I for one would not want a woman who felt submissive all the time, or, to just anyone

Jeff

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ORIGINAL: scarlethiney

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

Recently, I was having a private discussion with a fellow CM poster I respect very much who has a few decades on me as far as life experience.

One of his opinions that really caught my eye was something that I had reflected upon a couple of times in the past.

That it would be increadingly harder and harder for someone of my generation to find a female submissive for the kind of male dominated relationship that I wanted in comparision to 20 years ago, because society teaches women more and more that what we want isn't right.

Now...don't get me wrong. I am not saying this is a BAD thing or that I wish feminism wasn't around. I would much rather spent more time looking for a partner than live in a society where one group of people were indirectly taught they HAD to do what I wanted, because of their gender.

I'm curious as to whether or not you find this perception grounded in reality.

I believe society now teaches woman that it's acceptable to choose. Women historically did not have the choices we do now. I think strong women choose to be submissive instead of doing what is or was expected of them.
I grew up in a very southern, very submissive household without a father present for much of my young adult life. I emulated what my mother did and what she expected. Men and their needs were more important and came first always. I believe my mother did what  her mother taught her with my father and with us. But my mother was also a single mother, the bread winner, aggressive at work and forced to be "strong" outside our home.
I wonder had I grown up with a father figure if I would have developed differently.
I have always been submissive at home and like my mother aggressive and strong at work. I often feel in conflict after being at work and coming home and trying to transition to my submissive, caregiver, figure from my stronger personality at work.
As much as I would love to have someone take over the day to day responsibilities of my life (sometimes I long for it) I struggle giving up control. 
Is that a product of my job? society, my childhood environment, or my inner struggle? I wonder.

scarlet

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ORIGINAL: catize

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  ...it was completely natural.

It wasn’t, nor will it ever be, ‘natural’ for all.  How would you explain the feminist movement otherwise?  A percentage of people were unhappy because they were expected to be what they were not.  They were forced into a role which did not fit well.  Hence, the concept of choices regardless of gender.   

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ORIGINAL: impishlilhellcat

I routinely get hit on by men that are considerably older than the age of my mother and father. I even often times get hit on incessantly by men old enough to be my grandfather or let's say give or take five years younger than he would be today. I like older men I love older men, but come on now that's excessive. On the flip side a lot of younger dominants are either completely disrespectful, clueless, or dumber than a box of rocks. The concept of rushing things we must do this now right now, I don't care about you or your likes, we will be compatible because I own you, and the concept that there is nothing outside of BDSM and the person interested in me is going to bombard me with 50 questions is something that happens often.

I'm a switch I actually have a very submissive side, but I have to say I haven't been impressed in quite a long time with the crop of Dominants out there or the on your knees bitch emails, or you will serve me, or I own you.

Now I know I'm just lil ol me and a lot of men approach the issue that I don't need or deserve any sort of respect, one line emails, or your boobs like nice, email me on yahoo now jut don't work for me and anything of that nature is explicitly ignored. Yes in a way I'm done. Done looking for Dominants, done with the games and the (for lack of a better word) stupid emails... As someone's sig line says you aren't as great as you think you are.

I don't think it's extinction after I've written all that :P I think it's lack of a good choice or lack of interest in the Bs.

JMHO

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ORIGINAL: Simpleslave101
They all could stand on their own two feet and certainly didn't need me to prop them up. Due to their independent nature, their submission was that much sweeter. It came to me as a choice.

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ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

If the effect is not actively visual, it definitely pervades underneath, particularly for the more newly experienced. Even the more naturally submissive fight between myriad concepts of self and expected self (from outer sources...family, society, friends...). Even on community sites as these, you can see occasions of reverse oppression by women towards others of their gender who would otherwise feel content and comfortable in complete submission. There is a subtle air of "your total subservience speaks ill of the self-reliance of our gender" and I can imagine it's an uncomfortable expectation to have to balance.

And then, along that line of self-discovery, everything can get so muddled with being pulled in directions, that the actual sense of self (or even what she herself wishes) changes. So many of the traits that abound for us could as easily be shuffled under the "this is a flaw in my persona, and I should work to change it" box as they could "this is part of who I am and I should embrace it" box and though the individual has the final say on which it gets shoved into, mental peer pressure can easily morph the individual and their self-image.

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ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

If the effect is not actively visual, it definitely pervades underneath, particularly for the more newly experienced. Even the more naturally submissive fight between myriad concepts of self and expected self (from outer sources...family, society, friends...). Even on community sites as these, you can see occasions of reverse oppression by women towards others of their gender who would otherwise feel content and comfortable in complete submission. There is a subtle air of "your total subservience speaks ill of the self-reliance of our gender" and I can imagine it's an uncomfortable expectation to have to balance.

And then, along that line of self-discovery, everything can get so muddled with being pulled in directions, that the actual sense of self (or even what she herself wishes) changes. So many of the traits that abound for us could as easily be shuffled under the "this is a flaw in my persona, and I should work to change it" box as they could "this is part of who I am and I should embrace it" box and though the individual has the final say on which it gets shoved into, mental peer pressure can easily morph the individual and their self-image.

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ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

A lot of what you say in your post rings true and relates to my personal experiences, especially the part about the two boxes. I was rather disapointed to see someone I really liked choose to go the path of "flaw in persona".

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ORIGINAL: scarlethiney

Excellent point! You described the scope of my feelings exactly. Perhaps it is about a balancing of opposing self  images. The one we naturally gravitate toward and the one we allow others to make us feel pressured to be in public. And yes ultimately the choice can only be ours. Thank you for your insight.

scarlet

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ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

How many women (or subs in general, though the OP refers specifically to women) do we suppose are naturally fully submissive but feel the need to fight/change that aspect of themselves because they presume it to be a weakness (because of what they've heard or been told)?

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ORIGINAL: Lashra
A lot of women are just getting plain sick and tired of being looked at as the "weaker" sex or chattel (though I know some love that, not all do).  Perhaps when women are viewed as equals then they can feel comfortable embracing their submissive personalities (if that is their personality type) rather than feeling that they have been forced into it.

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ORIGINAL: scarlethiney
In my opinion I do believe it's a significant number. I know for me personally I am much less submissive with some male co-workers than others.  I know immediately who I can be submissive with and who would "eat me alive" (nice thought though) if I showed the slightest submissiveness which they would read as vulnerability and weakness.

How about in the case of self protection- online it could be necessary for a woman to first come across as strong and perhaps unwilling to put up with demands from strangers that might seem unrealistic or even dangerous and therefore seem less submissive initially??
If we agree this a choice forced on us by society or peer pressure or ourselves then it makes perfect sense that with certain individuals even individuals in this community we might need that persona to weed out unsuitable suitors/partners. After doing so and with the right individual we can then feel comfortable enough to be our fully submissive selves.

scarlet