RE: Any atheists here? (Full Version)

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Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:16:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
When people talk about god they usually mean a super natural being. I'm waiting for the evidence.
There are various supernatural beings, like vampires, werewolves, cynocephali, Bigfoot, pooka, and such. None of them are human. If you are talking about the Divine, it is not in our universe, though our universe is a small part of it, so by definition it is not a being. Or do you refer to one of the incarnate gods?
 
As long as you refuse to define what supernatural being matches your idea of God and define its characteristics, your demand for evidence is frivolous.



kittinSol -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:18:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

There are various supernatural beings, like vampires, werewolves, cynocephali, Bigfoot, pooka, and such. None of them are human.



[sm=afraid.gif]



NihilusZero -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:21:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

As long as you refuse to define what supernatural being matches your idea of God and define its characteristics, your demand for evidence is frivolous.

Not really. He trotted out a basic likely outline of what is mean when people use the word "god", but it's not necessary.

It is the theists that need to provide a concept of their deity if they are at all concerned with empirically verifying its reality.



Raechard -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:27:12 PM)

Rule those beliefs are perfectly valid and I respect them 100%

is this what I am supposed to say to avoid the projecting of my psyche onto others, I'd rather say something else thanks. Why is it people feel they must walk on egg shells all the time and say things they probably don't mean to further delude the already delusional?



LaTigresse -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:28:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

There are various supernatural beings, like vampires, werewolves, cynocephali, Bigfoot, pooka, and such. None of them are human.



[sm=afraid.gif]


There are a few posters on here I sincerely doubt their humanity also. However, I have to believe they exist. Or it's some sort of cyborg (however that is spelled) computer thing-a-ma-jiggy.



RCdc -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:30:15 PM)

I apologise for not responding to everyone at once.
Phil - you are right in a sense it is a trap - but as I said one I am aware of (as I stated, I was being generalistic) there are always people on both sides trying to 'convert' I do get that.  But I don't get the insistance of proof.
 
Peach -  I get the burden of proof analagy and it rocks, I agree with Nihilus.  I dont know is I am being dense or nt clear though.  See, if someone is prooving because they are attempting to convert - I get where the burden of proof comes into it.  But if you are simply stating a personal experience, then it doesnt work out as a viable thang for me.  It's a bit like the whole - 'Im submissive' / 'No your not, proove it' arguement.
 
Nihilus - *It doesn't "work both ways" because one is a statement, and the other is a critical question about the statement. *  Ok - I can see that logic but I guess I only see it as viable when someone wants to be converted - does that make sense?Because if a person proved it, then there would have to be a change of belief.
 
the.dark.



Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:30:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
Not really. He trotted out a basic likely outline of what is mean when people use the word "god", but it's not necessary.
Go on please. I am listening. [sm=popcorn.gif]

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
It is the theists that need to provide a concept of their deity if they are at all concerned with empirically verifying its reality.
Oh, that is easy: it is my pillow. It is just lying there beneath my head and doing nothing at all. Do you doubt me? Want evidence that my pillow exists and does nothing at all?
 



bipolarber -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:33:44 PM)

And the tiny bacterium, lying on the sidewalk, shouted up at the pedestrians walking by: "You didn't answer any of my prayers! Therefore, you obviously don't exist! I turn away from you, and refuse to believe in your existance!"  Never realizing the gulf between it, and God, was far, far bigger than merely the gulf between the single celled organisim, and us.

We humans can't even grasp the full scope of the universe as we know it. As such, I see plenty of room for the possibility... of something being responsible for it's existence.

Pure atheisim is it's own religion, in a way. And, like all other religions, it seeks comfort in absolute certainty about a single train of thought. Yet, that train of thought may not reflect the reality of our situation than any other religion based on "making shit up."

They believe that there is no possibility...  I just can't subscribe to such an absolute point of view without all the information being available.




Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:35:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard
Rule those beliefs are perfectly valid and I respect them 100%
Eh, what are you talking about?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard
is this what I am supposed to say to avoid the projecting of my psyche onto others, I'd rather say something else thanks. Why is it people feel they must walk on egg shells all the time and say things they probably don't mean to further delude the already delusional?
Is this in reply to kittinsol? Why do you reply to her when you address me? (We have an understanding, at her request, that I do not read her posts, so I am a bit lost now.)



Raechard -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:37:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
Want evidence that my pillow exists and does nothing at all?


Light head? 



Raechard -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:41:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
Is this in reply to kittinsol? Why do you reply to her when you address me? (We have an understanding, at her request, that I do not read her posts, so I am a bit lost now.)


She just happened to be above me and the response was directed at the person that said to me more or less "we should accept all beliefs without ridiculing them." I tend to think not.



Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:42:32 PM)

Perhaps. I feel a bit of an itch in my throat, so maybe I will soon be very ill from a cold.



Raechard -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:45:28 PM)

Sorry to hear that Rule, colds can be avoided by not taking public transport and always wearing a mask. Them people never put their hands over their mouths anymore when they sneeze, no manners.[8|]



Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:45:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard
She just happened to be above me

Ah so.
 
quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard
the response was directed at the person that said to me more or less "we should accept all beliefs without ridiculing them." I tend to think not.
Was that the dark? I am loosing track.



Raechard -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:48:52 PM)

No someone else.



Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:49:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
Want evidence that my pillow exists and does nothing at all?


Light head? 

[:D] It was an easy score. He was setting himself up and it was simply a matter of nudging the ball into the goal. I guess he is still wondering about that.



NihilusZero -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:53:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

Nihilus - *It doesn't "work both ways" because one is a statement, and the other is a critical question about the statement. *  Ok - I can see that logic but I guess I only see it as viable when someone wants to be converted - does that make sense?Because if a person proved it, then there would have to be a change of belief.

I try to avoid the matter of "conversion". I will address someone making a point about the logical reality of a superstitious notice, but I don't try to convert anyone. Even if it's an illusion, I respect everyone's right to keep whatever illusions please them.

Some people, however, just want to eat their cake and have it too (by having their illusion while demanding that it be considered real too)...and I don't readily avoid debates with them when they feel free to make statements publicly.



NihilusZero -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 2:56:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

Oh, that is easy: it is my pillow. It is just lying there beneath my head and doing nothing at all. Do you doubt me? Want evidence that my pillow exists and does nothing at all?
 

If it is one of those memory-foam pillow, then yes...I want proof. After which I will steal...er..."borrow" your deity for...um...tests. [:)]



Rule -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 3:09:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
If it is one of those memory-foam pillow, then yes...I want proof.
It isn't made from memory foam.
 
quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
After which I will steal...er..."borrow" your deity for...um...tests. [:)]

[:D] Are you sure? It is old and smelly. (Being drenched with my sweat and hair fat.)



philosophy -> RE: Any atheists here? (10/2/2008 3:11:09 PM)

i think we have two seperate phenomena here. On the one hand is simple personal belief. i would argue here that no proof is either desireable or necessary in such cases. What happens in ones heart or head is up to them.
On the other hand are those who seek to convert, or have society accept their beliefs as truths. In the latter case then proof is necessary. In much the same way as science requires proof. If someone wants me to act as if their version of Godhood is irrefutably true then they damn well do have to prove it.



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