RE: McCain/______

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bluepanda -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 6:23:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: barelynangel Okay, people need to figure out what they want. They bitch and moan that politicians won't admit their mistakes and yet people are saying if McCain stood up today and said hey folks, i really screwed up with my choice here, i am changing my VP so in the event i DO get elected i won't be stuck with a VP who i feel is now a bad choice -- it would hurt him and they would see it as something he shouldn't do. Sure, but the issue is, the fact that he made such a poor choice for VP in the first place calls into question his judgment. Picking Palin is turning out to be an enormous blunder, and even if he did admit it and try to correct it now, it raises serious questions about whether anyone who would have made such a hasty, poorly considered, and just plain wacky decision on a matter of such enormous importance can be trusted to make safe, sound, rational decisions as President.

DarkSteven -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 6:23:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: seeksfemslave I sense a rush to judgement here. Lets find out what that Trooper was up to. If a politician may be held to account for impropriety why not a state trooper.[image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m28.gif[/image] Remember the market knows best ! Huh? The Troopergate issue was dissected in detail an a report that exceeded 200 pages. There is no question whatever that Wooten was guilty, and that he received punishment on his job. I'm also not sure that you mean by a rush to judgment. Her credibility is dropping every day. She's a massive punch line on SNL, she refuses to speak to reporters or answer questions, she held onto the Bridge to Nowhere money although she claims to be against earmarks, and she's found guilty in the report just issues of breaking state law to pursue a personal vendetta.

barelynangel -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 9:18:04 AM)
FR to a couple people who have responded to my post == As i said, you all bitch when they don't and then bitch when they do (as you did in your responses), it seems the American people can't figure out what they want a candidate to do. i am saying people are saying he SHOULDN'T admit to and correct the mistake instead he should stand by his decision even when he probably realized how bad of a screw up it is because he then may hurt his campaign even more which tells me the American people are more concerned about win or lose than a President admitting openly what we all know and then correcting the error because hell they casterize a candidate for same and believe he shouldn't admit his mistake BEFORE the bloody election but allow to remain the possibility she may still be VP. Seems to me the Presidents are the creation of the people and what the people want to see and hear. You can't say well he shouldn't tell the truth and try and correct things NOW, and then bitch and moan when they don't do it in office. My point was never about people electing him (i never even said i would vote for him - as this isn't about voting as Sarah Palin shouldn't be the only reason you aren't voting for him or are voting for him, i said i would respect him doing so), but imstead a Man choosing to admit his mistake and try and correct it and see what the outcome brings on election day. From the responses my statement got lol you all don't even listen to what is being said you just want to say ohhhh look at the mistake -- instead of perhaps saying well damn look at how me fix it. No wonder Presidents don't admit things to the public for the public wants to simply ridicule and bitch and moan instead of saying okay you fucked up now fix it. Its the way the public works, its the way campaigns now work because that's what people like (negative ads) and that's the way the offices work -- never admit a mistake its more important to try and save face. I guess i am more willing to look closer at a Man who admits a mistake even if it may cost him the election to fix that error in judgment, than a Man who is more concerned with saving face and keeping an error in judgment by his side. His major error in judgment hasn't caused any damage to the country by being his VP as she still is only the governor of Alaska, he found out about his error a month after making it, i see no reason he couldn't admit and make a change that the people respect and find that boost his campaign enough to win the respect for the people he lost by his choice of VP. Hell i would rather he make his mistake and recognize it NOW than when he is in office. But i guess everyone else would rather it happen whilehe is president. But i guess to many people are sooo eager to say ohhhhhhh you made what you believe to be a mistake. Good grief people no wonder our choices of president suck, who wants to run for a group of people who are more interested in mistakes than the fix of same. The people of this country work against the President and not with him. They are more concerned about pointing fingers at the President than standing together saying hey we are a country and will face troubles as one. No wonder we get the president candidates we do. Which for most people are the lesser of the two evils instead of a firm YES he is my leader. Perhaps if the people of this country were more concerned with being the caliber of people someone would be proud to lead who want to work with the president instead of bitcher and moaners, we may get a different type of candidates who then choose to run. angel

slvemike4u -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 9:26:28 AM)
First off Barelyanangel,he isn't a President he is a candidate....and what others and myself are alluding to is that in this case admitting that he made the wrong choice in a hasty and ill advised manner by picking this train wreck of a running mate would be akin to telling the American people his judgement can not be trusted......As a consequence he is stuck with her for bettor or for worse....in other words,he has made his bed now he shall lie in it...

Musicmystery -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 9:48:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver Choosing her was stupid. McCain getting rid of her would be an admission of his own stupidity. He's flying on a wing and a prayer and hopefully he will crash. Well, he barely passed the Academy and then went on to crash five Navy planes.... ...crash is "shoot from the hip and hope"'s middle name.

barelynangel -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 9:50:50 AM)
slavemike4u, Actually i never said he WAS President -- go back and reread instead of brushing off what i am saying for your own convenience of bashing him. You are making a political statement, i am making a character statement. To me, i would rather have the Man risk his winning the office by admitting his mistake and attempting to CORRECT IT, than trying to save face because people like you want to hang him for a choice that hasn't cost you anything YET. You are more concerned with saying omg you made this decision you now want to change???? How dare you???? You SUCK, you don't know how to make decisions. I see his admitting his mistake and trying to correct it BEFORE the election more honorable and character building than worrying that the people more concerned with seeing him as a Saint who never will make a mistake or that he should be super Saint and never make a mistake. Good grief he is a human being. He isn't perfect. HE WILL make mistakes and admitting and FIXING them i think should be more important than castrating him becuase he decides to change his VP BEFORE the election. Even Obama has and does and will. This isn't about the candidate perse` its about what the American people expect of them when it comes to mistakes. What you are getting at is he should either keep his mistake and possibly go to the WH with her, or he should what withdraw from the race instead of admitting his mistake choosing someone new who people may actually want as VP and going on to allow the people to decide. You instead want to say ohhhhhhhhhhhh looking you made a blunder big huge.... and stamp your foot going but but loook........ Maybe just maybe this mistake an admitting it and receiving positive feedback for the fix may make him a better president if he becomes same. He IS still in the running you know. I would rather he go into the election with a better choice for VP IN CASE he actually does win. But you'd rather just say ohhhhhhhhh you made a mistake!!! rolls my eyes as i said, no wonder this country gets the candidates it does, angel

slvemike4u -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 9:59:32 AM)
Barelyanangel,didn't mean to imply you thought he was the President and if I gave that impression I apologise....That being said ,his picking of the running mate goes directly to character....it was a cynical political decision from a candidate who's campaign motto is "Country First"...so my question is this ...how does he possibly walk that cat back.What admission can he possibly make ,what error in judgement can he admit ,that doesn't include "I made a poor and cynical political decision that blew up in my face...and I would like a do-over"....It is the way he went about the decision in the first place that would be called into question ...and IMO disqualifies him for the office he seeks.....all that is known about Sarah could have been found out before he selected her,but he was looking for a political bump...he got it ,it was short lived and now it is costing him....there is no way,for him, to correct this and still retain credibility...

barelynangel -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:12:06 AM)
Mike, you aren't getting what i am saying. I am saying YOUR way of thinking has the Man keeping his mistake, keeping his agenda that should be changing. Instead of BEING A MAN, and standing up saying, I HAVE MADE A MISTAKE AND AM CORRECTING IT. His reasonings he will have to explain etc. And then on election day, PEOPLE WILL CHOOSE. His mistake doesn't disqualify him from office -- the election is 24 days away. We have a choice as people, bitch because he made a mistake and focus on that and run the risk he won't change and he becomes president with her as his VP OR as people, we give him the respect of recognizing and changing his mistake knowing he may well lose the election because people think as you do, i don't think his choice of VP is a concept of his character, i wasn't there when he made the decision so i can't tell you if he was being sinster or wrong in his motives for choosing her, were you? Or are you just assuming because you want the negative to be more important than the change? IF he believes he has made a mistake, i would rather have a President who CAN do so even if it could have caused him the election, than a President who kept a mistake unacknowledged because it was safer to his election campaign. Its all about how you look at it. If his second choice was a hell of a lot better than his first, then its a good thing IF he becomes president. So yeah, i'd rather he change now. You obviously think he should keep the mistake and risk becomeing president with her at his side. My concern is about what happens after the election and if he has a chance at winning, which he does if he is in the election, i'd rather that chance be with a new VP choice -- to me THAT would be his looking for the good of the country and Country First, instead of his own agenda.. Making a mistake is human, not correcting that mistake before it can harm to me is what is at issue. angel

kdsub -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:21:00 AM)
Has anyone noticed how impulsive McCain is? He acts before he thinks things through...he says the first thing that enters his mind then always claims he was misquoted, taken out of context or he was trying to say something else. For a long time I thought we had two good choices and could not go wrong with either....Not any more...I've seen too much of the real McCain. Butch

slvemike4u -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:23:45 AM)
And you are missing what I am saying...The office he aspires to requires at times he make decisions quickly under pressure...and with-out benifit of 20/20 hindsight.....if given weeks to reach this decision,the process he used to arrive at it is basically flawed and politically cynical...how does that not disqualify him from the office to which he aspires.....in my mind it most certainly does disqualify him and gives the lie to his Country first mantra....Admitiing now that he made that mistake and chose poorly calls into question his judgement and ability to make good decisions...how than does he gain my vote....Do I than vote for him because I admire a man that can admit his errors....while personally laudable...not what I am lookin for in a candidate,I would rather a candidate that makes judicous decisions in the 1st place....thank you very much!

dcnovice -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:26:13 AM)
quote: Has anyone noticed how impulsive McCain is? He acts before he thinks things through...he says the first thing that enters his mind then always claims he was misquoted, taken out of context or he was trying to say something else. The New Yorker has: "The longer the campaign goes on, the more the issues of personality and character have reflected badly on McCain. Unless appearances are very deceiving, he is impulsive, impatient, self-dramatizing, erratic, and a compulsive risk-taker. These qualities may have contributed to his usefulness as a “maverick” senator. But in a President they would be a menace."

slvemike4u -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:29:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice quote: Has anyone noticed how impulsive McCain is? He acts before he thinks things through...he says the first thing that enters his mind then always claims he was misquoted, taken out of context or he was trying to say something else. The New Yorker has: "The longer the campaign goes on, the more the issues of personality and character have reflected badly on McCain. Unless appearances are very deceiving, he is impulsive, impatient, self-dramatizing, erratic, and a compulsive risk-taker. These qualities may have contributed to his usefulness as a “maverick” senator. But in a President they would be a menace." As Sarah might say AMEN!

NumberSix -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:30:17 AM)
Maverick? Or bull in the china shop? Let's go to ringside..............................

Raechard -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:33:20 AM)
A ring has no sides that be madness 6. Ahh

barelynangel -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:35:08 AM)
Mike, have i said ANYTHING about VOTING for the Man???? NO, i haven't. But the TRUTH of the matter is -- HE IS STILL IN THE ELECTION. Would you rather the Man worry about your stamping your foot saying how dare you McCain, you fucked up royally and NOT change his VP choice and by chance BECOME president with her in tow, or would you rather a candidate have enough honor and character to ADMIT A MISTAKE prior to the election, change his VP choice and if he wins it is with someone OTHER than Palin? Again, you are making a political don't vote for McCain because of this statement-- i have not indicated whether people should vote for him or not, i am speaking of the very real possibility he may become the President, am simply saying the Man should admit his mistake and change BEFORE the election. I am not campaigning for him here Mike, you on the otherhand are campaigning against him. I said i personally would respect a decision like that because to me that is a leader, that is a Man with honor and understanding that his choices MEAN something and if he fucks it up, admitting it and fixing it is more important than saving face -- i have not indicated whether or not he would be my choice of President. I hold Men to a high standard, i would rather have a Man be strong and admit the mistakes and attempt to fix it amongst the questions and anger than a Man be weak and keep the status quo because people will be angry with him and question him. Perhaps if Bush did that, things may have been different in the last 8 years. You are doing a campaign ad, i am simply stating i hope he own up and changes before the election because he may well become the next president. angel

NihilusZero -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:35:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: barelynangel Even if it loses him the election because people are more concerned with holding mistakes against people in office than working with them or giving them credit to try to correct a mistake, i would have respect for his doing so. Have you ever heard a politically oriented person use the phrase "wishy washy"? That's them saying they don't want a candidate that could possibly be swayed by sensible discussion/reflection. Some prefer stability, even if the stability involves the candidate being firm in the choice of a mistake (I suppose it's safer to desire someone who may never change a stance after exposure to new thinking and logical evidence).

slvemike4u -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:44:39 AM)
Barelyanangel,we seem to be going round and round here.You would give him credit for admitting his mistake and correcting it....all well and good....I on the other hand would look at his original decision and the way he made it and that would,as I said disqualify him in my mind from the office he aspires too Now your way of looking at it is cool and I have no problem with your thinking,but I have my way of looking at it and it is fundamentally different than yours.I am looking at the lack of foresight,the cynical pandering to the Republican base and fringe religious right that led to his selecting her.....and in my mind he can not ,at this point, un-ring that bell.It goes ,again I will say this.to repudiating his "country first" mantra....I believe he made a dangerous and cynical political decision in selecting his running mate....I will ask you how admitting that this isn't working out for him and selecting someone else would change how I feel about that?

servantheart -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:45:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: barelynangel To me, i would rather have the Man risk his winning the office by admitting his mistake and attempting to CORRECT IT, than trying to save face because people...want to hang him for a choice that hasn't cost...anything YET. I see his admitting his mistake and trying to correct it BEFORE the election more honorable and character building than worrying that the people more concerned with seeing him as a Saint who never will make a mistake or that he should be super Saint and never make a mistake. Good grief he is a human being. He isn't perfect. HE WILL make mistakes and admitting and FIXING them i think should be more important than castrating him becuase he decides to change his VP BEFORE the election. Even Obama has and does and will. This isn't about the candidate perse` its about what the American people expect of them when it comes to mistakes. ..... Maybe just maybe this mistake an admitting it and receiving positive feedback for the fix may make him a better president if he becomes same.... ....as i said, no wonder this country gets the candidates it does, angel [sm=goodpost.gif] [sm=applause.gif]

Daddysredhead -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:47:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: barelynangel I hold Men to a high standard, i would rather have a Man be strong and admit the mistakes and attempt to fix it amongst the questions and anger than a Man be weak and keep the status quo because people will be angry with him and question him. I agree with this statement 100%. I don't care if it's politics, business, personal matters, etc. If a man can't be strong enough to stand firm in the midst of a firestorm and admit he's human and made a mistake, I have little to no respect for him. Personal integrity is important, honesty is key... saying "I messed up or I didn't have all the information when I made my decision" doesn't mean a person is weak... just human.

Daddysredhead -> RE: McCain/______ (10/11/2008 10:49:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u how admitting that this isn't working out for him and selecting someone else would change how I feel about that? It may not change how you feel about it.

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