RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (Full Version)

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LaTigresse -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 12:23:32 PM)

In reading Marc's "Do I have to worry?" thread something came to me.

My greatest hope is that Barack Obama greatest legacy is that we could not imagine having any other president during the upcoming difficult times.




rexrgisformidoni -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 12:30:38 PM)

I just hope a comet hits the earth and ends these discussions. 




sirsholly -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 12:31:51 PM)

My wish: work his ass off to ensure that no ones child EVER goes to war.




slvemike4u -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 12:52:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni

I just hope a comet hits the earth and ends these discussions. 
An Obama Presidency is so scary to you Rex,that you would wish for armeggedon rather than it come to pass....




LaTigresse -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:03:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni

I just hope a comet hits the earth and ends these discussions. 


I assume you are here, reading and participating of your own free will?




jlf1961 -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:13:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

My wish: work his ass off to ensure that no ones child EVER goes to war.


Sirsholly,
While I agree with your hope, I am afraid that human nature would prevent this, at least in my opinion.  Having been around the globe a few times, I have seen people fight for some pretty stupid reasons, religion, land, water, a spot in a shanty town. 

I even saw a riot start over some poor cab driver hitting a cow.

In other words, mankind has not evolved enough to know that war is the most stupid of enterprises.

Now, as for the feeling of disenfranchisement, the starter of this thread said "a predominately white world."

In truth, whites are a minority on this planet.  Look at the number of Asians, (China, Mongolia, Siberia, etc,) add to that the population of India, along with the Middle east and Africa, plus Latin America, you would see that the Caucasian population is outnumbered at close to 20 to one.

Currently, the feelings of disenfranchisement stem from an economic prospective rather than an ethnic one.  With the majority of the world population living at or below the poverty line, there is little hope for a future.

Strangely enough, some of these third world countries should not even be on that list, simply because of the mineral wealth within the borders.  It is estimated that 80% of raw diamonds are in third world countries, 90% of emeralds are in third world countries, which, means that those countries have untapped wealth in the billions.

The problem is the people who have the resources to tap that wealth have no reason to pass on the profits, or they are using the profits to finance wars.

Now as for a comet striking the planet and ending all these discussions, the odds are pretty slim for that one, an estimated 1 in 7 billion chance of a large enough strike.

But, the odds of one of the known Supervolcanoes erupting is 1 in 526,895, an accidentally started nuclear war falls into a 1 and 12000 chance, a pandemic with a 50% or higher mortality rate is 1 in 800 chance.

Now personally, I would prefer the supervolcanoe eruption, considering the pre boom warning signs, there would be enough time to evacuate the people in immediate danger and the human race is reseliant enough to survive the following mini ice age.   




rexrgisformidoni -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:16:17 PM)

Lol of course I am here on my own will. and no an obama presidency doesn't scare me so much I'd rather that happen...its called sarcasm and my own sick humor. 




LaTigresse -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:28:42 PM)

As yes, well as you can see by one of my tag lines, I can appreciate warped humour.




BitaTruble -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:28:43 PM)

I have more than one hope for an Obama presidency. I believe that we will be enriched socially, culturally, economically, ethically, intellectually and globally. That's why he's getting my vote.




Musicmystery -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:30:44 PM)

*stands beside Bita*




slvemike4u -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:35:47 PM)

Make room for me there Music Man....better times are coming,though we will have to shovel out a lot of shit left over from the former administration...sort of a fixer upper.




LadyEllen -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:41:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
Now, as for the feeling of disenfranchisement, the starter of this thread said "a predominately white world."



In the context of the OP, it is a predominantly white world when talking about our societies.

In wider context, it is a predominantly white world too, regardless of the numbers of the respective ethnic groups that inhabit the Earth.

It is our laws, our customs, our practices and our ideas - both the noblest and the most prejudiced, that dominate the world. It is by playing to our rules that the rest of the world might prosper, and by breaking those rules that they might not - not because our rules are right and true, but because we decide who prospers and who is on the "axis of evil" and all that crap.

The remainder of your post confirms and subscribes to that exact understanding.

Our real problem is the socio-economic sense of our own superiority, derived from our economic, territorial and technological supremacy at this time in history, but rather more accurately perhaps our innate social sense that others are not as worthy - and our communication of that sense to those others within our own nations whom however westernised they might be, derive from those parts of the world whose cultures we see as lesser.

E




LaTigresse -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:43:56 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

*stands beside Bita*


Yes, she states it all so well doesn't she.




Musicmystery -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 1:48:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

*stands beside Bita*


Yes, she states it all so well doesn't she.


And does her homework---and quite well, at that.




OrionTheWolf -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 2:53:26 PM)

Oh there was irony in that statement, just not one you would know about. The irony is in implying or suggesting there may be a problem, when my mixed son is playing ten feet away from me when I typed the question. The other irony is in seeing people post how they don't believe in things such as mind reading, yet their statements can only be supported with such nonsense.

See the irony yet?


quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Yeah there is irony going on but you wouldn't have a clue about it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Ah yes, sarcasm... the thing most Americans achieve when they're striving for irony [8D] .



Am I missing out on the irony that you're trying to imply there was any irony when, blatantly, there was none whatsoever [:D] ?




OrionTheWolf -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 3:03:15 PM)

Have you ever looked at some of your own comments and thought they may self perpetuate things?

"For years, I've argued that most of the problems many black Americans face today have little or nothing to do with racial discrimination. For the most part, the most devastating problems encountered by a large segment of the black community are self-inflicted." Walter Williams

"I wasn't always black... there was this freckle, and it got bigger and bigger. " Bill Cosby


quote:

ORIGINAL: Blaakmaan

So, I will take my leave and allow white superiority to resume its rightful place upon the throne, undisturbed...





MadRabbit -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 3:24:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Blaakmaan

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Because they're stupid and ignorant.


Absolutely! They are so stupid and ignorant that we need affirmative action and ethic based grants and scholorships to make things fair.

You can't expect the darkies to be able to meet the same bar we have for white people.

Gotta knock some crumbs off the table for them to feed off of while we delude ourselves with "white privilege". The next level of evolution of self delusion is moving from having a superiority complex to feeling guilty for having a superiority complex.

Edited to Add : And you can't be fully convinced of your superiority complex without accusing people who don't have that superiority complex of being "racist" by opposing lowered expectactions, because obviously there is something "wrong" with them.



Is this supposed to be sarcastic?

I gotta know before I call up my homeboys and head over there...



Nothing is more racist than lowered expectactions.

Nothing lowers one to the level of an inferior more than pity.

Lowered expectactions is for the mentally handicapped guy who can't tie his shoes that we give a job to bagging groceries that he can barely do correctly out of pity and "feeling sorry" for him while being extra nice to, but never really making any effort to have anything to do with on a personal level.

I don't view any minority in that way. I view them as capable and fully functioning human beings with talents and abilities that can far exceed my own. I don't see them as any different than me and I respect them as equals. So, given that viewpoint, I can't say they aren't capable of walking on their own two feet in the world. And if Barrack Obama wins, he will be a shining example of that.

Now, based on your opinions and personal experiences, apparently you see things different then me. Now in my personal experiences and what I have seen, I disagree. I happen to know a lot of African Americans who I respect for what they have accomplished in the world who strongly disagree with you. Given some of the ignorant and offensive posts you have made here in the past, I am going to take their input over yours so my opinion still stands.

They might even to want to show up at your door with their homeboys for your opinions here.

Nor am I going to tiptoe around and mince my words on this issue just because we have different skin tones, because that would make me a hypocrit.




bipolarber -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 4:08:48 PM)

I'll be happy if (whomever gets in) will bring back habeas corpus, and swear off those odeious "signing statements."

As I understand it, only about 600 of those were ever done in the entire history of the US... until Bush slimed his way into office. He's more than doubled that number. More evidence of "Bad King George."




Blaakmaan -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 4:38:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Have you ever looked at some of your own comments and thought they may self perpetuate things?

"For years, I've argued that most of the problems many black Americans face today have little or nothing to do with racial discrimination. For the most part, the most devastating problems encountered by a large segment of the black community are self-inflicted." Walter Williams

"I wasn't always black... there was this freckle, and it got bigger and bigger. " Bill Cosby


quote:

ORIGINAL: Blaakmaan

So, I will take my leave and allow white superiority to resume its rightful place upon the throne, undisturbed...




No, I haven't, because they don't.  Whatever I say or don't say here has pretty much no effect on America's oppressor-oppressed dynamic.

I've had enough of this.  You can't make someone see what he's determined not to see.  And I won't bother to quote the 100's of people I could quote to counter Bill Cosby and Walter Williams.  But, I will cite a couple: (can't help it--it's the Virgo in me!):

I think whites are carefully taught not to recognize white privilege, as males are taught not to recognize male privilege. So I have begun in an untutored way to ask what it is like to have white privilege. I have come to see white privilege as an invisible package of unearned assets that I can count on cashing in each day, but about which I was "meant" to remain oblivious. White privilege is like an invisible weightless knapsack of special provisions, maps, passports, codebooks, visas, clothes, tools , and blank checks.
--Peggy McIntosh, Ph.D., associate director of the Wellesley Centers for Women

For those who still can’t grasp the concept of white privilege, or who are looking for some easy-to-understand examples of it, perhaps this list will help.

White privilege is when you can get pregnant at seventeen like Bristol Palin and everyone is quick to insist that your life and that of your family is a personal matter, and that no one has a right to judge you or your parents, because “every family has challenges,” even as black and Latino families with similar “challenges” are regularly typified as irresponsible, pathological and arbiters of social decay.

White privilege is when you can call yourself a “fuckin’ redneck,” like Bristol Palin’s boyfriend does, and talk about how if anyone messes with you, you'll “kick their fuckin' ass,” and talk about how you like to “shoot shit” for fun, and still be viewed as a responsible, all-American boy (and a great son-in-law to be) rather than a thug.

White privilege is when you can attend five different colleges in six years like Sarah Palin did (one of which you basically failed out of, then returned to after making up some coursework at a community college), and no one questions your intelligence or commitment to achievement, whereas a person of color who did this would be viewed as unfit for college, and probably someone who only got in in the first place because of affirmative action.

--Tim Wise, "This is Your Nation on White Privilege"
http://www.opednews.com/articles/This-is-Your-Nation-on-Whi-by-Tim-Wise-080916-307.html

In other words, it is hardly an exaggeration to say that white America is the biggest collective recipient of racial preference in the history of the cosmos. It has skewed our laws, shaped our public policy and helped create the glaring inequalities with which we still live. White families, on average, have a net worth that is 11 times the net worth of black families, according to a recent study; and this gap remains substantial even when only comparing families of like size, composition, education and income status. A full-time black male worker in 2003 makes less in real dollar terms than similar white men were earning in 1967. Such realities are not merely indicative of the disadvantages faced by blacks, but indeed are evidence of the preferences afforded whites -- a demarcation of privilege that is the necessary flipside of discrimination. Indeed, the value of preferences to whites over the years is so enormous that the current baby-boomer generation of whites is currently in the process of inheriting between $7-10 trillion in assets from their parents and grandparents -- property handed down by those who were able to accumulate assets at a time when people of color by and large could not. To place this in the proper perspective, we should note that this amount of money is more than all the outstanding mortgage debt, all the credit card debt, all the savings account assets, all the money in IRAs and 401k retirement plans, all the annual profits for U.S. manufacturers, and our entire merchandise trade deficit combined. Yet few whites have ever thought of our position as resulting from racial preferences. Indeed, we pride ourselves on our hard work and ambition, as if somehow we invented the concepts.--Tim Wise, "Whites Swim in Racial Privilege"http://academic.udayton.edu/race/04needs/affirm20.htm




rexrgisformidoni -> RE: one of my hopes for an Obama Presidency (10/19/2008 5:40:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Blaakmaan

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Have you ever looked at some of your own comments and thought they may self perpetuate things?

"For years, I've argued that most of the problems many black Americans face today have little or nothing to do with racial discrimination. For the most part, the most devastating problems encountered by a large segment of the black community are self-inflicted." Walter Williams

"I wasn't always black... there was this freckle, and it got bigger and bigger. " Bill Cosby


quote:

ORIGINAL: Blaakmaan

So, I will take my leave and allow white superiority to resume its rightful place upon the throne, undisturbed...




No, I haven't, because they don't.  Whatever I say or don't say here has pretty much no effect on America's oppressor-oppressed dynamic.

I've had enough of this.  You can't make someone see what he's determined not to see.  And I won't bother to quote the 100's of people I could quote to counter Bill Cosby and Walter Williams.  But, I will cite a couple: (can't help it--it's the Virgo in me!):

I think whites are carefully taught not to recognize white privilege, as males are taught not to recognize male privilege. So I have begun in an untutored way to ask what it is like to have white privilege. I have come to see white privilege as an invisible package of unearned assets that I can count on cashing in each day, but about which I was "meant" to remain oblivious. White privilege is like an invisible weightless knapsack of special provisions, maps, passports, codebooks, visas, clothes, tools , and blank checks.
--Peggy McIntosh, Ph.D., associate director of the Wellesley Centers for Women

For those who still can’t grasp the concept of white privilege, or who are looking for some easy-to-understand examples of it, perhaps this list will help.

White privilege is when you can get pregnant at seventeen like Bristol Palin and everyone is quick to insist that your life and that of your family is a personal matter, and that no one has a right to judge you or your parents, because “every family has challenges,” even as black and Latino families with similar “challenges” are regularly typified as irresponsible, pathological and arbiters of social decay.

White privilege is when you can call yourself a “fuckin’ redneck,” like Bristol Palin’s boyfriend does, and talk about how if anyone messes with you, you'll “kick their fuckin' ass,” and talk about how you like to “shoot shit” for fun, and still be viewed as a responsible, all-American boy (and a great son-in-law to be) rather than a thug.

White privilege is when you can attend five different colleges in six years like Sarah Palin did (one of which you basically failed out of, then returned to after making up some coursework at a community college), and no one questions your intelligence or commitment to achievement, whereas a person of color who did this would be viewed as unfit for college, and probably someone who only got in in the first place because of affirmative action.

--Tim Wise, "This is Your Nation on White Privilege"
http://www.opednews.com/articles/This-is-Your-Nation-on-Whi-by-Tim-Wise-080916-307.html

In other words, it is hardly an exaggeration to say that white America is the biggest collective recipient of racial preference in the history of the cosmos. It has skewed our laws, shaped our public policy and helped create the glaring inequalities with which we still live. White families, on average, have a net worth that is 11 times the net worth of black families, according to a recent study; and this gap remains substantial even when only comparing families of like size, composition, education and income status. A full-time black male worker in 2003 makes less in real dollar terms than similar white men were earning in 1967. Such realities are not merely indicative of the disadvantages faced by blacks, but indeed are evidence of the preferences afforded whites -- a demarcation of privilege that is the necessary flipside of discrimination. Indeed, the value of preferences to whites over the years is so enormous that the current baby-boomer generation of whites is currently in the process of inheriting between $7-10 trillion in assets from their parents and grandparents -- property handed down by those who were able to accumulate assets at a time when people of color by and large could not. To place this in the proper perspective, we should note that this amount of money is more than all the outstanding mortgage debt, all the credit card debt, all the savings account assets, all the money in IRAs and 401k retirement plans, all the annual profits for U.S. manufacturers, and our entire merchandise trade deficit combined. Yet few whites have ever thought of our position as resulting from racial preferences. Indeed, we pride ourselves on our hard work and ambition, as if somehow we invented the concepts.--Tim Wise, "Whites Swim in Racial Privilege"http://academic.udayton.edu/race/04needs/affirm20.htm



Why don't you cry about it some more? College professors who have an agenda, and most do, tilt things in their theories favor. I know personally african americans who would read the drivel you post and be disgusted. I am disgusted. But then again, you will say I am because of my "white privilege". Please. Affirmative action has screwed this entire nation, its made being a victim acceptable and people who have zero applicable job qualifactions get jobs ahead of others. Don't belive me, go to any dmv or local government office. Anyhow, I am not racist, I think there are bad apples in every bunch.




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