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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 8:14:45 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		Jealous? No way. Fighting for fairness? You fucking betcha. 

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 8:18:27 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		Welcome to Newspeak.

The word thievery shall from here on cease to exist, and shall be replaced with the word "fairness" when discussing the possessions of others who are perceived to be more well off than the voting majority.

Thank you, and have a nice day.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Jealous? No way. Fighting for fairness? You fucking betcha. 


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Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 10:43:01 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The word thievery shall from here on cease to exist, and shall be replaced with the word "fairness" when discussing the possessions of others who are perceived to be more well off than the voting majority.

Politicians never accuse you of "greed" for wanting other people's money -- only for wanting to keep your own money. ~Joseph Sobran
 
K.






(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 10:51:48 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline 		"Men in power are more criminal than people in general, not only because power corrupts but also because most people who seek power are already corrupt." also Joseph Sobran

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"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:06:42 PM   
subfever


Posts: 2895
Joined: 5/22/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

"Men in power are more criminal than people in general, not only because power corrupts but also because most people who seek power are already corrupt." also Joseph Sobran


Those who agree with this shouldn't want government at all then, it seems.

(in reply to BitaTruble)
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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:14:07 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline 		Also Joseph Sobran...
 
Voters who live off taxpayers are the Democrats' ace in the hole. The Democrats created big programs and never let the recipients forget it. This gives them an initial advantage of tens of millions of votes in any presidential election.

"Need" now means wanting someone else's money. "Greed" means wanting to keep your own. "Compassion" is when a politician arranges the transfer. 

When a politician wrestles with his conscience, he usually wins.
 
K.

 
 

< Message edited by Kirata -- 10/22/2008 11:18:14 PM >

(in reply to BitaTruble)
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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:22:29 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline 		"Conservatives are wasting their time, energy and votes if they stay in the Republican Party. No more than the Democrats do the Republicans honor the Constitution. They merely violate it at a slower pace." js

I love being an Independent!


_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:24:01 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

Those who agree with this shouldn't want government at all then, it seems.


I would agree if I didn't believe that there are plenty of folks in government who seek to do good works rather than try to grab power.

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to subfever)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:27:22 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

"Conservatives are wasting their time, energy and votes if they stay in the Republican Party. No more than the Democrats do the Republicans honor the Constitution. They merely violate it at a slower pace." js

I love being an Independent!

I'd like to vote for Ron Paul, but I'll settle for slower.
 
If you want government to intervene domestically, you're a liberal. If you want government to intervene overseas, you're a conservative. If you want government to intervene everywhere, you're a moderate. If you don't want government to intervene anywhere, you're an extremist. ~(guess who)
 
K.

 
 
 

< Message edited by Kirata -- 10/22/2008 11:28:35 PM >

(in reply to BitaTruble)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:29:55 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Okay, I'll bite. If you'd like to vote for Ron Paul, why don't you?

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/22/2008 11:41:34 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

If you'd like to vote for Ron Paul, why don't you?

Will you put ice-cream and a cherry on top?
 
K.
 
 
 
 
 

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 3:48:07 AM   
MmeGigs


Posts: 706
Joined: 1/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
The poor (or the bottom 40%) don't pay taxes,


You've said this before.  It's not true - not even close to true.  The bottom 12% or so of us don't pay income taxes.  Single people start pay income tax when their income is over $8,355.  A family of 4 starts paying taxes when their income is over about $21,000.

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 4:01:15 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Welcome to Newspeak.

The word thievery shall from here on cease to exist, and shall be replaced with the word "fairness" when discussing the possessions of others who are perceived to be more well off than the voting majority.

Thank you, and have a nice day.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Jealous? No way. Fighting for fairness? You fucking betcha. 



Since there was no god allocating land and resources, all property was originally claimed through power so one could argue that Marx was right, all property (and by implication, wealth) is theft.

However, let's get into a more realistic world and say that a democratic government represents the social consensus in a country. That democratic consensus allows the accummulation of wealth by individuals, it also allows the levying of taxes on individuals for the upkeep of the consensus that allows individuals to accummulate wealth. If someone is avoiding their contribution towards the social consensus, it is duty bound on the government to sanction those individuals that see themselves beyond the consensus. A democratic country and its wealth belongs to the people (or should), not the rich and powerful. Break the consensus and take your chances but don't cry theft when you are forced to pay your taxes and are thrown in prison for trying to shirk your social duty.

I suppose the rich and powerful could always go and live in China where a social consensus doesn't exist if they find a social consensus so abhorent.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 10/23/2008 4:05:15 AM >

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 4:52:06 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Welcome to Newspeak.

The word thievery shall from here on cease to exist, and shall be replaced with the word "fairness" when discussing the possessions of others who are perceived to be more well off than the voting majority.



Here's some more for you;

invasion is replaced with liberation
WMD is replaced with LOS (lots of sand)
allies and friends are replaced with those not against us
sovereign nation is replaced with asset to be liberated
and the phrase waging a war of aggression is replaced with regime change
 
Its your guys that seem to have come up with all the spin for a good while - that you demonstrate an aptness to do the same shows perhaps its more endemic than first thought.

The best thing the Republican party can do right now is lose and lose heavily - only that way will it be forced to look at itself and change.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 5:12:22 AM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline 		I owned a rental home a few years back in an area that was all low income rental homes.  I can tell you that I was paid cash every month for the rent and that the tenants didn't work and weren't married to each other.  They all collected welfare and all kinds of monies.  They never got married because if they did they'd loose half of what they received.  They also did have jobs.  Jobs that paid cash.  So, not only were they receiving funds from the state, they didn't pay any taxes whatsoever.  Who's cheating here?  We were not the only ones with tenants like this.  It was much more the norm than the exception.  There is a whole underground network of lower income people who do not pay any taxes in this country and who receive funds.  I'd guarantee that amount adds up to quite a bit.  The poor cheat too.   

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 5:19:03 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		But is it worth them working Aileen? Could they get a job that yielded income equal to or in excess of that they claim in welfare?

Its the same over here - we call it the benefits trap; its not worth working for many people unless theyre going to get at least somewhere near average wage. This doesnt mean theyre lazy - it means theyve worked it out. Yes, theyre scamming the system, but what choice do they have?

The only answer to all this is to reorganise the system such that there are sufficient jobs that pay well enough that the benefits trap does not apply to so many, if any at all. But that would require a total socio-economic overhaul that few would support.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 5:19:29 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		And you collected rent from those cheaters and knowingly profited from their cheating?  

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 5:20:21 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

I owned a rental home a few years back in an area that was all low income rental homes.  I can tell you that I was paid cash every month for the rent and that the tenants didn't work and weren't married to each other.  They all collected welfare and all kinds of monies.  They never got married because if they did they'd loose half of what they received.  They also did have jobs.  Jobs that paid cash.  So, not only were they receiving funds from the state, they didn't pay any taxes whatsoever.  Who's cheating here?  We were not the only ones with tenants like this.  It was much more the norm than the exception.  There is a whole underground network of lower income people who do not pay any taxes in this country and who receive funds.  I'd guarantee that amount adds up to quite a bit.  The poor cheat too.   


Are you saying that the American economy is so so bad and soooo third world that a small minority of poor taking advantage of the system this way are really the norm?

There have been many many reports on who cheats states (countries) more, the rich or the poor and they always come to the same conclusion. The rich cheat states by far far far far (how many fars do you want?) more than any poor, yet states invariably spend far far far (again, how many fars do you want?) more money pursuing the poor that cheat than the rich that cheat. Maybe this state of affairs exists because states are invariably run by the rich?

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 10/23/2008 5:21:40 AM >

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There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 5:26:39 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		When you're loaded you can pay an accountant to help you 'diminish' your tax burden. That's morally laudable  . 

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RE: Rich cheat on their taxes more, study shows - 10/23/2008 6:00:45 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

If you'd like to vote for Ron Paul, why don't you?

Will you put ice-cream and a cherry on top?
 
K.
 
 
 
 
 


I feel strongly that Ron Paul is the only choice.  I still have my Ron Paul sign up. [which I made myself]  He would abolish the IRS. So for people who want less taxes he is your man. As for writing him in- how do you do that? The machine is electronic.

The grid should not have been afraid of Paul.  There would be a transition period on much of it.

It so sucks that the fake left right paradime exists.

I truly am not looking forward to voting.

Even Obama is a dummy for the "man".  Obama is a pretty face, but a yes man to the power that pulls the strings.

Consider to that technically a president cant raise taxes.  THAT is up to the congress.

The masses have been nueterred and bastardised.  Our voice is an impotent voice on election.

The past 8 years have been such a mess that it will take more then the cookie cutter Dems to fix it.

I am so angry about the bail out- that I am starting to want blood.

(in reply to Kirata)
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