RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy?

RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (Full Version)

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DavanKael -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 3:15:41 PM)
What everyone else said. Intent is huge. There still exists, within the counseling community at large, the idea that 'self-harm' is 'self-harm' (And a Borderline-esque manifestation which it sometimes is; example: cutting) but as body modification and the like become more acceptable, the lines blur further and hopefully more practitioners look at the long history of masochism that is manifestin self-inflicted ways and don't flip their lids. I did a big post-grad paper on this, lol! I'm a huge believer in pragmatism. If you're needing to get something out and you need a physical manifestation to do that and you, for example, go get a body part pierced rather than slitting your wrists, for example, I'm going to say kudos to you for choosing a less damaging way to play out what you needed to. Might I think that some other coping skills and certainly a safety contract may be in order, yeppers. Physical pain as a way to transmute psychological pain or numbness (Or being all 'backed up' emotionally) is something that's been manifest probably as long as there have been people. Mindfulness of why we're doing what we're doing supercedes action as long as the action doesn't eclipse a particular severity, imo. Davan

LadyConstanze -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 4:17:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: softness I work with a lot of teen girls who cut because they want to hurt themselves (I work with a lot that need release as well but I pass their cases on elsewhere - hardly being the best person to guide them) the girls that cut to hurt are punishing themselves, hurting themselves because they think they deserve. The are what I consider true self harmers because they are actively seeking to damage and cause harm to their bodies. I make a choice not to work with people who "self harm" for physical emotional or psychological release because that is exactly what I do when I engage in sado-masoschistic play. It would be like being lecturing against the evils of drugs and then going home and doing a line of charlie off the kitchen counter. There is a world of difference between self harm and what Missturbation is talking about ... just as there is between an abusive home and a D/s one Self masochism is as risky and dangerous as when someone else does it you.. and has similar if not identical risks and dangers to what can happen inside a relationship. Now obviously there are health and safety issues of not having another pair of hands available .. I think everyone can accept that its as stupid and dangerous as all the other stupid dangerous stuff we do in the comfort of our own homes. I will admit that occassionally I cause myself pain in order to intensify the physical release I get from masturbation; nothing serious, particularly dangerous or even remotely harmful. I am not doing it with negative reasons or out of control emotions, my aim is not to harm or damage myself. Therefore I think it is as healthy/unhealthy as my reasons for engaging in sado-masochistic play .... and lets face it .. the law in the UK says that I must be criminally insane or somesuch to be consenting to that. I found that a lot of the self harmers use the physical pain to deal with the pain they carry inside of them, that their internal pain or psychological pain is often so strong, that a physical pain helps them to deal with it, it's something that is less vague for them. Self harming is not an illness, it's often a symptom of something else, abusive childhood, sexual abuse, etc. For them the physical pain helps them to deal with their inner pain without committing suicide, quite a lot of girls who self harm also have eating disorders.

missturbation -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 4:45:53 PM)
My intent when i am a self masochist is to bring on a mind blowing orgasm. Don't get me wrong i can come through just plain ole masturbation, but i find it so much better when it hurts. I'm not doing anything extreme or not to me anyway. Last night involved the use of a butt plug, nipple clamps and a pin wheel. Admittedly i wasn't using the pin wheel much in the normal way, i prefer the way it scratches when on its side and dragged along my breasts. Yes today i have rather sore scratches which bled a little, but i have done myself no permanent harm.

WinsomeDefiance -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 4:47:40 PM)
Woahhh...wait a minute....you mean ALL women don't masterbate that way? Crap...maybe I HAVE been self-harming....

missturbation -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:01:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WinsomeDefiance Woahhh...wait a minute....you mean ALL women don't masterbate that way? Crap...maybe I HAVE been self-harming.... Lol no they don't and believe it or not because i occasionally mark myself with scratches, slight cuts etc i have been accused of self harming in a bad way. No not all women masturbate in this way [;)]

catize -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:29:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael There are some really vile and disgusting things some women do. Any woman who would be sick enough that when she is alone and in the dark to put clothespins on her cunt and clit, clamp them down on her tongue and nipples, who would rape her ass with a dildo, shove an inflatible ball gag into her mouth and god knows what other fucked up obscene stuff just for foreplay is exactly the sort I that drives me insane with lust. I am going to have to add all that to my application form because any woman who wouldn't, well why bother? Not that I'd know about any of that cough but you forgot the thin leather belt and the clip earrings...........

ThundersCry -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:34:47 PM)
Ask a cutter...

missturbation -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:36:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThundersCry Ask a cutter... Sorry?

ExSteelAgain -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:39:10 PM)
We've had lots of threads by cutters and they appear safe enough. It is an outlet for them and it is their kink. Nothing wrong with that. I don't look down on them anymore than I would think poorly of a woman who wants to be beaten. It's their thing as mine is being sadistic.

teensub -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:39:22 PM)
I have self harmed for years, and i am learning to deal with things in a different way. For me it is never sexual it is just a release from things i cant deal with. I have never used self harm in a way of heightening sexual arousal as for me it means something else. However when i play with my master it is sexual and i get a great buzz when he inflicts pain on me in a sexual way, for me this isnt about punishment on myself and the same feelings i get from self harm. As for me the two aren't in any way connected.

MSPERFECTION2U -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:40:08 PM)
Thanks for that Davan I've always been a masochist, sometimes pain becomes an addiction in itself.

ThundersCry -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:44:46 PM)
A cutter is one who cuts themselves...a form of deadly masochism... I did all sorts of absurd things* in my past to feed the beast...* BDSM actually...gave me a way out from doing things* that were unhealthy to doing things...healthy...* Thx, missturbation...a great question.

Missokyst -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:45:58 PM)
I say anything that keeps you from expressing rage upon the general public AND does not kill you, is a more civilized way to go. If you ask me, too many people express their frustrations by letting it build till they explode. I cut. I cut me. I cut me when I have no other avenue open to me. I am sure people would rather see someone like me, deal with anxiety and frustration that way. Rather than going out and doing harm to others. I see nothing wrong with self masochism. Think of it as a reset button. Kyst

teensub -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 5:49:49 PM)
For me it is an easy way to deal with things. It never used to harm anyone but me, but now i am with M it harms him when i do it..so that is why i am trying to overcome it. It becomes more than self masochism and becomes something much more harm full to those around me that i care and love

OneMoreWaste -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 6:06:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: missturbation So my questions are do you equate a physical masochist who self harms as the same as a stereo typical self harmer? Can self masochism be healthy? If so why / If not why? Anyone any experience of self masochism, not stereo typical self harm? I wouldn't use the term "self harm" in the context of self-masochism. As softness brought up, with "harm" you suggest that the intent is to cause damage, and by extension, to punish or destroy. I wouldn't call it healthy or unhealthy, just practical. I've got quite a bit of experience with self-masochism (and self-bondage), and some experience with self-harm. The mindset is totally different, from the setup through the conclusion- for me, they also tend to involve different tools/techniques. quote: ORIGINAL: FRSguy Unhealthy, What happens when you get bored with yourself and the thrill is gone? Do you just go into something bigger, riskier more painful? How do you know your not just fooling yourself saying something is healthy and you have a healthy attitude towards it when in reality you could be justifing self destructive behavior and what not. I think you really need another person to create and maintain a ballance because there is a tendency for people to go overboard on shit when they do it by themselves... kind of like drinking or any other self indulgent thing shit gets out of hand way to easy. That's such a bizarre generalization that I'm not even sure where to start [&:] If we assume that the individual is actually the person least capable of judging the safety of their own actions, you can end up with a very strange society...

teensub -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 6:08:43 PM)
It is a tricky one to detach from one another. As i think most people would probably assume that, if you are slapping yourself, pinching biting whatever..that you are still causing harm to yourself , so in the end it is still self harm, but in a different context

LadyConstanze -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 6:10:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: teensub For me it is an easy way to deal with things. It never used to harm anyone but me, but now i am with M it harms him when i do it..so that is why i am trying to overcome it. It becomes more than self masochism and becomes something much more harm full to those around me that i care and love I think it is great that you are trying to overcome it and kudos for that, it's terribly hard! That you don't do it because it harms M works right now, but please also consider it long term, you might (I'm not saying you will but you are in your teens, the whole world is open) both find other partners, at one point you should switch to not harming yourself because you are precious, not only to somebody else but also to yourself.

teensub -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 6:19:30 PM)
Thank you for the advice. Altho it is not all to do with M. Terribly hard is not the word, it is certainly an addiction, which is something i find people often dont understand. Some people light a fag,take drugs or drink to much to forget there stress and emotions but for some self harm is the only release that truly satisfy's

tweedydaddy -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 6:20:58 PM)
Self harm of any description cannot possibly be healthy and the desire to do so is symptomatic of a serious need for help.

Missokyst -> RE: Self masochism, unhealthy or healthy? (10/27/2008 6:21:00 PM)
See now.. I see that as one more person viewing masochism as nuts. Plenty of people enjoy being hurt, but they use the rationalization of sensuality. A masochist is a masochist whether or not they are aware of what they do to get that fix. Self masochists do not need that illusion. We know what we need, we have adapted to getting that need met in a fashion that does not harm society. People smoke, drink, take drugs, or drive race cars, and society will see this as normal. But these things are potentially bad or dangerous. Being aware of who you are and accepting it and learning to adapt to it safely is a better choice in my view than the people who just don't acknowlege another way of coping. Kyst quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze at one point you should switch to not harming yourself because you are precious, not only to somebody else but also to yourself.

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