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RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 11:02:17 AM

dawntreader

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Do we have to draw a line ? Interesting.

I think the point is I have no problem with art, but I do have a problem with the commercialization of art. I also have such a large problem with the commercialization of Christmas that I don't have Christmas and haven't for over a decade. I will actually go visiting, but I will not accept gifts on that day. A rebellion in a way.

T

Greeting T,

i would agree with you here to a point. i mean one who makes their living from art must market themselves. However, it seems you are talking about blatant commercialism, something i too have issues with. As to Christmas...it bothered me more when i was a christian than it does now. Now i see it as exactly what it is and i ignore it. It is surprisingly easy.

i would say here, it all goes back to what we chose to see. i prefer to live in a positive world so i let that create my perception. Art, to me, is "soul work" and whether it is ever seen, sold, or displayed in a museum really doesn't matter. The fact that it was created does matter~

j

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Post #: 41

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 11:17:10 AM

colouredin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

but some are just soooo much better than the rest. I hope they appreciate how lucky and blessed they are.

Butch

Ahh but the problem is no one can agree on who is good and who isnt, my dad thinks the kind of art that i have an affinity for is a pile of crap.

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Post #: 42

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 12:20:10 PM

MadAxeman

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Sometimes I'll improvise upon a scale or phrase. This may or not develop into a solo or full piece. It's there for a moment, only heard by myself and perhaps discarded. Not sure where this stands with those looking for precise definitions of art. All I know is that my senses are heightened, my mind, body and soul receive some exercise and I can't live without it.

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Post #: 43

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 12:24:22 PM

colouredin

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Art is art when someone says it is, it really is that broad

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Post #: 44

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 12:38:22 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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Not to me it isn't. My definition of art is something that evokes some emotional reaction when you observe it. People can have their own definition sure but I never personally classed a urinal as art.

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Post #: 45

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 12:45:01 PM

kdsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SL4V3M4YB3

Not to me it isn't. My definition of art is something that evokes some emotional reaction when you observe it. People can have their own definition sure but I never personally classed a urinal as art.

I don't know but some would say this is art.

http://gargles.net/urinal-sculptures/

Butch

(in reply to SL4V3M4YB3)

Post #: 46

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 12:47:13 PM

colouredin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SL4V3M4YB3

Not to me it isn't. My definition of art is something that evokes some emotional reaction when you observe it. People can have their own definition sure but I never personally classed a urinal as art.

http://locus.cwrl.utexas.edu/jbrown/files/Marcel%20Duchamp.jpg

some do

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Post #: 47

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 12:51:11 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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That was my point that to me it isn't, hence why I chose urinal and not say a fire extinguisher. If someone thinks something is art no matter how misguided they are it doesn’t make it so. What you have to remember is since photographs were invented people have been bending over backwards trying to define what makes art art. You have to shield yourself from the elite and side with the common sense populists sometimes because only they know what art is.

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Post #: 48

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:10:02 PM

candystripper

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

Artists, those people who seem to spend oodles of time creating nothing more than a visual something as an expression of their soul, do they have a place in the modern world, or is art a complete waste of time and resources ? Should artists give up dreaming and get a job ? Or is it we need artists as an example that people no matter who they are can create in a world where destruction seems the favourite subject.

What are your thoughts on art and artists ?

I postively worship artists and artisans. I have a Dom friend who makes his living as a composer. We have plans to work together -- I will write the lyrics, while he writes the music. He lives quite well; I fully expect when we are done, the song/hymn/whatnot will be published.

I myself used to do tons of artsy-fartsy stuff, like sewing and knitting, but my eyesight is not as good as it once was, and 'close-in work' is just too difficult anymore. I used to do calligraphy -- people actually hired me to things like wedding invites.

Then, I went to law school, During my career I felt a strong sense of obligation to my clients. The need to 'think like a lawyer' squeezed out everything else.

Now I'm semi-retired. I feel much more connected-up inside, sexuality is more important to me, and I have the time to play. That's how it's supposed to be, at my age.

Aneirin, I always enjoy your Ops. You ask the most interesting questions. To answer your question, yes, there's a place in the world for art. Folks have a craving for beauty, and recognize it in a dance move, a well-turned phrase, or a piece of jewelry.

candystripper

(in reply to Aneirin)

Post #: 49

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:20:56 PM

colouredin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SL4V3M4YB3

That was my point that to me it isn't, hence why I chose urinal and not say a fire extinguisher. If someone thinks something is art no matter how misguided they are it doesn’t make it so. What you have to remember is since photographs were invented people have been bending over backwards trying to define what makes art art. You have to shield yourself from the elite and side with the common sense populists sometimes because only they know what art is.

Well I think Duchamp was an artist, and the fountain is one of my fave pieces of art, i dont think that art has to be popuist, as you said it has to make you feel something and differant things make diferant people feel. Where for example rap music does nothing for me others find it empowering, who is right?

Also your not liking something doesnt make it elite. Often people call art elite because they dont get anything from it and certain 'critics' and whatnot speak in a way that is alianating, and its sad that people side with that rather than actually looking for themselves.

The amount of people that I have taken to a modern art gallery with them assuming they will hate it and coming out rambling about a specific artist or piece they like.

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Post #: 50

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:31:04 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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Okay it made me feel angry so I class it as art too perhaps but now it's been done and can't be done again. I like going to the Tate Modern, I didn't say I don't have an appreciation for some modern art. The difference is I don't accept something is art just because I personally think it could be or because someone else tells me it is, I look for popular consensus. I think somethings are art and other people think I am mad but when we find majority agreement, it's art because it has an effect on the majority that view it. If you put a Urinal in a toilet it’s a urinal, if you put a classic piece of art or some clever new street art in a toilet it changes the whole mood of the toilet. Maybe I just don’t get it but I’m a simple person.

< Message edited by SL4V3M4YB3 -- 11/12/2008 1:33:03 PM >

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Post #: 51

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:39:28 PM

colouredin

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Well i kinda see art as being more fluid than that, i dont have to like it for it to be art, it doesnt have to be somewhere specific to be art, and it doesnt have to be celebrated to be art, van gough wasnt liked in his time you know (duchamp is classed as art by a consensus by the way, if that helps you)

The time that i do question art is with intent, emin and hirst are so commercial that they make me cringe.

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Post #: 52

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:42:55 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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I hate the sun flower pictures they are drab but what do I know? I wouldn't have bought one while he was alive and I'd only sell one today if I had one. I wouldn't be displaying it in my living room.

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Post #: 53

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:45:06 PM

colouredin

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so its not consensus or populist then, so what makes art art?

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Post #: 54

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:53:50 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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I didn't say I was always right about what art is:

Q) is the urinal art
A) So they tell me

Q)Is van gough an artist
A) So they tell me

Them = the majority that may be misinformed sometimes (in my view). Ask yourself though if you had that sun flowers picture wouldn’t it be worth more to you if could put it on your wall, if it could be worth more to you than any monetary value, that would be art then. It would change your life for the better and everyone else that viewed it, it would be priceless and worthless at the same time.

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Post #: 55

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 1:57:35 PM

colouredin

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im not sure I get what you mean?

Is it worth more when its on my wall or is the question whether it would b worth more than money?

I wouldnt want an original piece of art on my wall, I have many prints and stuff, but i think art is more benificial when accessible to the public.

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Post #: 56

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 2:02:53 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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I'm saying true art would have no price, it could be the smile on someone’s face you love and you'd never want to part with it for any amount of money in return. This definition though would be limited to what it is to an individual. What you then have to do as an artist IMO is find something that will have that same effect on the majority. You can't please everyone though so it has to be the majority only.

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Post #: 57

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 2:05:32 PM

Aneirin

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I thank you all for your inputs so far, it is food for thought. But I have another thought, based upon my art 'experience' today ;

Should, or can art be provocative, can it's application be used to stimulate feelings or a response which some may find as an afront to their sensibilities ?

I ask this, as a project I am working on, so far has met with some concern from my peers. I quested why it causes concern and met with the response that what I was attempting to do was very much on the edge of my peer's comfort zone and perhaps even moving into territories outside of their comfort zone. I explained that comfort zones like people are different and what I consider as acceptable may very well differ from many, but that is not an indication that I am wrong. The past is with me, I have always self censored my work, thinking about the response from others, as it is not my wish to insult, but , as a result I have found my work to be lack lustre and not a true interpretation of what I had in mind, I have in the quest to moderate actually dissapointed myself. This current project, it is my aim to not self censor, but to just do and bugger the consequences, as I need to do what I need to do for myself to be true to myself.

The current project encompasses such subjects as the duality of sex and death all wrapped up in freudian psychology, a visceral interpretation on what I see as something human kind cannot live without. Perhaps what I do is psychological, even political, but is there anything wrong in that, is it wrong to challenge sensibilities and attempt to let the spirit soar free ?

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Post #: 58

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 2:23:58 PM

stagerle

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Tell us some more about your project Aneirin, is it a visual thing?

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Post #: 59

RE: Artists - 11/12/2008 2:36:59 PM

colouredin

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Sometimes Aneirin I love art which disgusts me, it tends to be the violent responses that teach me most about what i think of the world. I remember the first painting I had a really dramatic response to was Wine Crucifix i saw it at the tate modern and I really couldnt understand my reaction to it. I actually gasped at it, I had never been a particularly religious person but the strength of feeling that I had for that made me understand that I probably hold the church in higher regard than I assumed

THe duality of sex and death is a subject covered by a piece closest to my heart, it was the first painting that I analysed myself Dumas' stern, it was that painting that got me interested in modern art, i love the juxtapositon of death and climax

http://www.fogless.net/artreview/041125_fs_md/stern.jpg

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Post #: 60

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