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ORIGINAL: tweedydaddy

We am very old school. I don't think this lifestyle is about shaggathons. If people want to screw in public etc, brilliant, whatever works for them and bravo, bit it's not what I'm about. LadyLove  has four very loyal male slaves and a fuck is never part of that equation. I don't rule out us ever having sex with people we play with, who can? But it's not a primary goal. You can get a shag anywhere, any time, isn't that what Vanilla people do?

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ORIGINAL: tweedydaddy
You can get a shag anywhere, any time, isn't that what Vanilla people do?

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ORIGINAL: MissIsis

But then he began to talk about how the old guard lifestyle never focused on sex, & how the new generation of lifestylers were all about sex. The conversation made me realize just why it is that sometimes we have so many misunderstandings about the lifestyle between each other. It may also be why we have so many people coming on to lists like this, thinking that being sexual on cam is part of our lifestyle.

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ORIGINAL: Kindandcruel

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ORIGINAL: colouredin

The problem is that different people take different words/terms to mean different things. This means people judge others and stick their noses in the air.

Shitting on something because they aren’t what you are is pretty bad, mind you accepting that everyone finds their own way to do things can be hard too.

 
Words have specific meaning... look that up in the dictionary. I have been living this way of life before the so called young ones came on the scene and I have watched the total disintegration of the basis of this life. You speak of shitting on something... that is exactly what the liberals and the younger group has done. Since they were so selfish and self oriented to the point that they did not want to merge themselves into the established norm, they decided to change the meaning of everything so they can call themselves "slaves" or Dom/mes because that is the current FAD. These people have never taken a day to be serious in BDSM... they would read some fiction and then the little girls would think that is soooo cool or Rad or whatever... but they also found out that to really live this way of life then they really had to change their attitude and make somebody else more important then themselves. Since this is not going to happen because the universe is mobilized totally around them... the simple solution is to just shit on those that have trained for years and have put in the time just so they can call themselves slaves and be cool (emo).
 
It is not the older more experienced people that is shitting on the younger selfish ones, it is the reverse. You are welcome to have all the kink and self absorption that you want and you can call it anything you want... just don't call it BDSM or S/M unless that is exactly what it is... and I am not saying by your definition. Don't insult those of us that have spent our lives living this way by saying that you are a slave when you can;'t even spell the word let along having never been a submissive.
 
You spout your disrespect for people that are real because you have no real experience and you want instant gratification like a child, being a slave comes after years of experience and training and after being a submissive for a good amount of time. People that disagree are the jokes, the wanna be's and the pretenders. I have a Masters degree in Information Systems (as well as psychology), and I see the same thing happen in IT. Suddenly you have these young morons that were gamers and think they know everything come in to a department and expect to be paid the same as the more experienced people. They don't really know anything outside of their own egotistical self importance. They don't have the maturity to understand the intricacies of the most simple functions or processes yet they want to be managers and highly paid.
 
This is the same for what I see here... they liberals did the same in the school system by trying to make everybody equal... nobody fails, so nobody earns or learns... you just end up with a bunch of kids that expect to get and have what they don't deserve or earned. Just take a look on the pages here... 18 and 19 year olds claiming to be Masters or slaves... hell they haven't even gotten to the point of understanding how to balance a check register... how can they have the experience and maturity of being responsible for another human beings life? But then since they are only playing at it, meaning they for them it is just a game... sex and doing scenes and maybe bossing somebody around; then it is being real... to that I say BULL SHIT! Don't call it real when it is only pretending and play acting... because that is shitting on those of us that are real... slaves and Masters alike. This is nothing more than children playing cops and robbers or Cowboys and Indians... and no more real then the play.
 
I know a lot of you will get pissed off for what I am saying because you disagree with me... but then liberals are the most intolerant people around... not to mention selfish and lazy. You are anything BUT LIBERAL! Anybody that grew up ion the 60's understand what I am talking about... because I was a liberal when being liberal meant something.
 
There are a lot of people that are serious about trying to learn the reality of this way of life... unfortunately there is so much bull crap being spread within these forums by these wanna-be liberals and FAD chasers and swingers that want kink who all have to redefine everything to suit their own narcissistic nature that new people think that what they say is real. They don't have any truth or background to understand the perpetual lies and dis-information here.
 
It takes years to deprogram a person from the cultural dysfunction they pick up from whatever culture they are raised in. It also takes substantial knowledge to train a slave psychologically as well as physically to be a slave... and it takes years of work. YOU DO NOT TRAIN A SLAVE IN 2 OR 3 WEEKS, YOU DO NOT BECOME A SLAVE BECAUSE YOU PLAYED ONLINE FOR A FEW YEARS PRETENDING YOU ARE A SLAVE, YOU DO NOT BECOME A SLAVE BY GOING THROUGH A SLAVE TRAINING CLASS OR SEMINAIR. THE SAME WITH BEING A DOMINANT OR A MASTER!!!
 
A Master has an in-depth understanding of psychology, physiology of the human body, understands responsibility and integrity, understands who he is, has an extensive amount of life experience, does not have temper tantrums, thinks before he administers any punishment, knows when to stop the play, knows the difference between childish behavior and internal resistance, know there is more to training than just beating and punishing a slave, and that sex is only a small part of the whole.
 
Things have gotten so lame and diluted that I have recently read a book written by a woman that took a week-end class and claims to be an expert Master now. She was writing on many subjects that she had admittedly no experience with (multiple slaves), she spent more time talking about her own fears and inhibitions... yet because she took a class she thought of herself to be an expert.... what a joke!!! 
 
That is what I am talking about...  So don’t talk to me about how those younger people “feel” like they are being shit upon by those who are experienced and have earned our title (including those that are working hard to earn their title currently)…. Be it slave or Master.
 

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ORIGINAL: Rover

Fast Reply to no one in particular....
 
Gawd, not another one of these threads.
 
1.  No, it wasn't deeper, more meaningful and purer "back then". 
 
2.  No, people are not more obsessed with sex now than they were "back then".
 
3.  No, those recollections aren't consistent with documented historical facts.
 
I now return you to your regular programming.
 
John

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being a slave comes after years of experience and training and after being a submissive for a good amount of time.

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ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Is someone really trying to say that original homosexual old guard stuff really was not about sex? 

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ORIGINAL: MissIsis

But then he began to talk about how the old guard lifestyle never focused on sex, & how the new generation of lifestylers were all about sex.  The conversation made me realize just why it is that sometimes we have so many misunderstandings about the lifestyle between each other. 

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ORIGINAL: Padriag
Was it?  I am no expert on the Leathermen and / or so-called "old guard", however, from what I do know of them much of their original membership was ex-military, and more specifically war veterans.  I am given to wonder if it were not so much about sex as it was an intimate bond they could not find outside of those who had not shared similar experiences.