RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / s types.

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RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 8:35:03 AM

colouredin

Posts: 4279
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My dad loves that show but anyways to answer, the problem is that because people have so much to say about these jobs i guess it does become a bit about empowerment, I know many escorts who adore their job and its empowerment for some because its a way that they can work and do all the houswife stuff too, but i think its more about reclaiming it, having pride in what they do and not seeing it as exploitation. I dont think it matters if sex i involved, its just selling a service whether thats dancing without clothes on or fucking someones brains out

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Post #: 21

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 8:45:39 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
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Never mind Darias - honestly - you really won;t miss much if you don;t know it's there... Promise, if you saw the women who present it - you would be scared.

the.dark.

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RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to Darias)

Post #: 22

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 8:49:08 AM

Darias

Posts: 1757
Joined: 1/17/2006
From: midlands ireland
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well see now i gotta watch out for the rerun just to prove i don't scare easily

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**Perving or perusing... it gets me the same place.**

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** may you live in interesting times**

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 23

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 8:52:52 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
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What is right or fair never enters into a human opinion...The bottom line... people in general will always look down on that type of profession...sex or not. If it was my daughter I would not like it only because of what others thought of her.

Many say it is not important what others think....that is dead wrong because how others think of you WILL make a difference in your life like it or not.

Butch

(in reply to Darias)

Post #: 24

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 9:02:30 AM

Darias

Posts: 1757
Joined: 1/17/2006
From: midlands ireland
Status: offline

perhaps if your daughter was in that profession having her neighbors look down on her and her family would effect her life yes ...

and were she in that profession people would have a very different opinion of you too im sure

however it would be up to your daughter and you how much effect those opinions had on your life .

Eleanor Roosevelt said * no one can make you feel negative about yourself unless you allow them ( paraphrasing ) *

but since you and your daughter would be letting those opinionated neighbors choose your job for you why not hand over you bank cards .. so they can choose how to spend your money ? ask their advice before dressing in the morning so as not to offend them with bright colors . show them your daughter or grandchilds report card and ask what they suggest you do about it ..

unless you yourself choose to give up control of your choices in life , then you have a responsibility to make those choices based on what YOU think is right and accept those consequences yourself

after all if your daughter chooses pverty rather than offend her neighbors .. will the neighbors pay her rent ?

_____________________________

**Perving or perusing... it gets me the same place.**

**May Gods come between you and harm in all the empty places you must walk**

** may you live in interesting times**

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 25

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 9:17:35 AM

joanus

Posts: 527
Joined: 2/28/2007
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We all have to make money some how. Weather its dancing on a pole or shooting up the less civil parts of Africa. Hey its a living. And it could always be worse, you could be doing it for free.

(in reply to Darias)

Post #: 26

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 9:22:12 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
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I totally agree with this. If someone is earning good money and not drawing benefit or being supported by the 'state' then I don't see why people can grumble.
After all, what about those working in banks and people who work in industries which are basically manipulating and taking money from others instead of giving a service?

the.dark.

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RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to Darias)

Post #: 27

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 9:28:16 AM

Darias

Posts: 1757
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From: midlands ireland
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it hits a little close to home dark .... the dancer friend i mentioned earlier ... got alot of crap from her dad about her previous profession .. while her wastoid drug addicted brother lived with the same dad and robbed him blind ... the fathers attitude was her previous work had shamed him publicly ... whereas at least the son was a screwup in private .. i was never mad enough to ruin the semi peace they had by asking him why he gives a crap what people who hang out in strip clubs think

personally i was proud of the fact that at the time she raised two kids supported an unemplyed fiance and paid her rent / mortgage without outside help from people who cared far to much about the opinions of others and far to little about the welfare of her and her children

_____________________________

**Perving or perusing... it gets me the same place.**

**May Gods come between you and harm in all the empty places you must walk**

** may you live in interesting times**

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 28

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 9:42:35 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
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quote:

If lap dancers, escorts, and pro d types and s types are definately NOT having sex with their customers is it an ok career choice?

it depends on the club/management/individual, just like any other career choice.

quote:

Do you think WITHOUT sex being involved it empowers women or exploits them?

it would solely depend on the perception of the individual doing the job, if they felt exploited, empowered or anything else from their performance/career choice.

quote:

Why?

this slave can't possibly infer how an entire group of people all doing the same profession would feel about it, regardless of the profession. there are too many variables to consider to be able to make any accurate generalizations.

quote:

Does your answer change if sex becomes involved?

no.

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 29

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 10:36:21 AM

theobserver

Posts: 456
Joined: 8/18/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

Watching tv today and there was a debate about whether lap / pole dancing exploited or empowered women. The common belief was it exploited them because of the seedy background most people believe exists in the clubs where the women work. Amazingly drugs were only mentioned once, a lot of the decision seemed to rest on the fact that the women in the clubs were probably having sex with the customers.
It appeared that if you took the sex out of the equation the people in the debate would be perfectly ok with women being lap dancers. So now i'm curious as always as to what you think.
If lap dancers, escorts, and pro d types and s types are definately NOT having sex with their customers is it an ok career choice?
Do you think WITHOUT sex being involved it empowers women or exploits them?
Why?
Does your answer change if sex becomes involved?

I have a job in adult entertainment and I once knew a woman who was employed as an exotic dancer. That old stereotype of "I'm working my way through college" was a fact in her case.

She saw it as a job, albeit challenging, but it paid the bills, got her through college and the purchase of a new home.

As I've said in other threads, to each their own. I consider my work business, I am paid to act a part, I do it and move along. It's not personal and the scenarios I act out may not be things I would do or say in my everyday life.

Just as a mainstream actress has a role to play that does not have anything to do with who they are or what they are ... so do I.

I'm not saying it's an avenue or choice that every woman should make, but for those that do make it, as long as they go about it with as much understanding as to what it entails and the potential consequences ... well who am I to say it's wrong?

Consenting adults making a business transaction whether it be in the form of sex or an exotic dance, makes no difference to me.

Although I do not work in that segment of the industry, what I do is still considered on the fringe by overall society. It's a booming business and the same people that claim the loudest indignation are sometimes the main ones seeking these services.

It's not about empowering or exploiting. Because if we were to use those examples, I believe most of the entertainment industry mainstream or otherwise would be guilty.

However, I will say this ... women who enter these businesses should have a goal of being their own boss and branching off into other enterprises. In addition, staying away from the damaging party lifestyles that sometimes go along with these professions is a must.

I think that so many young women get involved in these professions not thinking about the broader picture. We won't look young and perky forever. So having a plan will help prevent some of the tragic fates that some adult industry workers fall prey to.

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It is left up to the reader to decipher & determine this post's validity.

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 30

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 10:51:08 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

~ Fast Reply ~

Can someone identify one job or one occupation for that matter, that does not "exploit" the employee?

The most brilliant and intellectual position has their mental abilities exploited as an employee. No matter how much money they are making, what they are making the company exceeds their personal income and therefore "exploits" them.

People should try to "exploit" their 'assets' whenever possible to take advantage income opportunities if their goal or need is income. Every job, even those of us self employed or in ownership positions, is exploitation of some skill or some ability used in trade for currency or to maintain a desired lifestyle.

It may be difficult to consider, but Alex Rodriquez is "exploited" by the NY Yankees, even though his compensation exceeds $25 Million per year. His ability to miss hitting a baseball 70% is exploited and is no different than a woman's ability to titillate 90% of men in a gentleman's club. The distinction is compensation.

Although you can turn it around and say that Alex is exploiting the desperation of the NY Yankees to win while the woman performing at the club is exploiting the desperation of the men. It's all about perspective and trade off.

< Message edited by Mercnbeth -- 11/17/2008 11:33:46 AM >

(in reply to theobserver)

Post #: 31

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 11:21:47 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

If lap dancers, escorts, and pro d types and s types are definately NOT having sex with their customers is it an ok career choice?

it depends on the club/management/individual, just like any other career choice.

quote:

Do you think WITHOUT sex being involved it empowers women or exploits them?

it would solely depend on the perception of the individual doing the job, if they felt exploited, empowered or anything else from their performance/career choice.

quote:

Why?

this slave can't possibly infer how an entire group of people all doing the same profession would feel about it, regardless of the profession. there are too many variables to consider to be able to make any accurate generalizations.

quote:

Does your answer change if sex becomes involved?

no.

Beth answered the questions the way I wanted to, but with much better wording.

Years ago I was dating a young woman, still in college earning her teaching degree. She was working two jobs and struggling. Then she began working as a stripper, then dabbled in porn, then at a massage parlour where the massages included handjobs.

None of the above changed how I felt about her. The end of that relationship had nothing at all to do with her work.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 32

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 11:23:54 AM

awmslave

Posts: 599
Joined: 3/31/2006
Status: offline

I do not believe anybody takes these jobs purely because they have no other choices to survive. These jobs empower women, degrade women or have no effect. It depends on character and moral belief system a person has. During Middle ages for instance any kind of acting had similar social consequences and was considered outcast. Now times have changed, we flush mainstream actresses with cash and treat them like royalty. I admire also "small atresses guild" in sex industry: many of them do really nice job. They need no justification; exibitionism and sexual expression is part of human nature. The need and right for women to be "empowered" is kind of PC bullcrap invention.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 33

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 12:47:43 PM

Lashra

Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline

I think if a woman is doing it of her own free will then she is not being exploited. If she is being forced into it that is indeed another matter. Many of these women enjoy working as strippers/dancers, they can be creative and it can empower them. I mean many of them know if they dance just the right way that many men will part with their money and that is what they are there for. Also I believe that prostitution should be legalized, if a woman enjoys and consents to do that type of work why not?

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 34

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 2:40:13 PM

OrionTheWolf

Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline

In the nicer clubs it happens less than some of the dives. My property is a dancer, and only goes to VIP with certain individuals, as she does not want to deal with an aggressive customer that expects sex. She has several regulars that come in, spend a few hundred and then go home to their wives, horny happy and hopefully able to have sex with them. My girl does not feel exploited, and the power she feels is due to the desire the Men have for her. She enjoys dancing and being desired, though the assholes that want to be too grabby or touchy feely piss her off, as well as those that come in and get one beer and sit for an hour never tipping or getting a dance.

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

Watching tv today and there was a debate about whether lap / pole dancing exploited or empowered women. The common belief was it exploited them because of the seedy background most people believe exists in the clubs where the women work. Amazingly drugs were only mentioned once, a lot of the decision seemed to rest on the fact that the women in the clubs were probably having sex with the customers.
It appeared that if you took the sex out of the equation the people in the debate would be perfectly ok with women being lap dancers. So now i'm curious as always as to what you think.
If lap dancers, escorts, and pro d types and s types are definately NOT having sex with their customers is it an ok career choice?
Do you think WITHOUT sex being involved it empowers women or exploits them?
Why?
Does your answer change if sex becomes involved?

_____________________________

When speaking of slaves people always tend to ignore this definition "One who is abjectly subservient to a specified person or influence."

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 35

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 3:47:51 PM

StrictnSaucy

Posts: 363
Joined: 1/6/2005
Status: offline

As long as they are not part of the disgusting sex trade that is going on and that it is a choice they made for themselves I see it as empowerment.

(in reply to OrionTheWolf)

Post #: 36

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 3:55:31 PM

IAMChristine

Posts: 588
Joined: 11/4/2008
From: Salt Lake City
Status: offline

who the fuck cares? wow, if they are supporting themselves then great. shut the fuck up and mind your own business. "to each their own" ever heard that phrase?

no harm, no foul. whatever comes their way comes their way. don't mind your pretty "little" mind about it. holy shit..i can't believe the attitudes of some people around here.

_____________________________

formerly christine1. now i'm better, stronger, faster.

yes i'm pro gun...i'm not going to sit around with a fucking rolling pin and hope for the best.

(in reply to StrictnSaucy)

Post #: 37

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 4:09:47 PM

StrictnSaucy

Posts: 363
Joined: 1/6/2005
Status: offline

Christine, not sure if your comment was directed at me or not - but to clarify what I mean by sex trade here is an example www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2008/0910/1220919678635.html

(in reply to IAMChristine)

Post #: 38

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 4:10:31 PM

UncleNasty

Posts: 1108
Joined: 3/20/2004
Status: offline

The mention of Puritans always make me think of this about them:

A puritans worst fear is that somewhere, someone is having a good time.

As for the exploitation or empowerment I look at it from this perspective - if all parties are consenting then how can it be illegal/immoral? No victim no crime.

Uncle Nasty

(in reply to Darias)

Post #: 39

RE: Lap dancing, strippers, escorts and Pro D types / ... - 11/17/2008 4:13:47 PM

IAMChristine

Posts: 588
Joined: 11/4/2008
From: Salt Lake City
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: StrictnSaucy

Christine, not sure if your comment was directed at me or not - but to clarify what I mean by sex trade here is an example www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2008/0910/1220919678635.html

nope, not directed toward you...sorry if i gave that impression. just a general venting reply on my part.

_____________________________

formerly christine1. now i'm better, stronger, faster.

yes i'm pro gun...i'm not going to sit around with a fucking rolling pin and hope for the best.

(in reply to StrictnSaucy)

Post #: 40

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